Defecting back from the path they were being led on by the Spirit to whatever was contrary to what was being taught, is the moral of the story. We cannot go back to that which we have been delivered from.
having only knowledge of Christs finished work on the cross.. is like seeing the picture of a finished cake.. it looks really awesome but, if you want one to eat you have to do what it says.
Defecting back from the path they were being led on by the Spirit to whatever was contrary to what was being taught, is the moral of the story. We cannot go back to that which we have been delivered from.
abiding,
I still have the same point i been making since the very beginning of this thread.
This is my argument... We can not build doctrines off of verses and call them the gospel.. Jesus Christ Has come from God with the Authority of God and every Word He said is from God, binding all men in covenant with God and we must give the same credit and value to all of it (every Word Spoken). instead of picking and choosing the stuff that is easy on our ears and we can use to justify our flesh with.
Jesus Said in john 15 “I am the true vine, and my Father is the gardener. 2 He cuts off every branch in me that bears no fruit, while every branch that does bear fruit he prunes[a] so that it will be even more fruitful. 3 You are already clean because of the word I have spoken to you. 4 Remain in me, as I also remain in you. No branch can bear fruit by itself; it must remain in the vine. Neither can you bear fruit unless you remain in me.
5 “I am the vine; you are the branches. If you remain in me and I in you, you will bear much fruit; apart from me you can do nothing. 6 If you do not remain in me, you are like a branch that is thrown away and withers; such branches are picked up, thrown into the fire and burned. 7 If you remain in me and my words remain in you, ask whatever you wish, and it will be done for you. 8 This is to my Father’s glory, that you bear much fruit, showing yourselves to be my disciples.
9 “As the Father has loved me, so have I loved you. Now remain in my love. 10 If you keep my commands, you will remain in my love, just as I have kept my Father’s commands and remain in his love. 11 I have told you this so that my joy may be in you and that your joy may be complete. 12 My command is this: Love each other as I have loved you.
Romans 11:22
Therefore, consider God’s kindness and severity: severity toward those who have fallen but God’s kindness toward you—if you remain in His kindness. Otherwise you too will be cut off.
Colossians 1:23
if indeed you remain grounded and steadfast in the faith and are not shifted away from the hope of the gospel that you heard. This gospel has been proclaimed in all creation under heaven, and I, Paul, have become a servant of it.
1 John 2:6
The one who says he remains in Him should walk just as He walked.
1 John 2:10
The one who loves his brother remains in the light, and there is no cause for stumbling in him.
1 John 2:24
[ Remaining with God ] What you have heard from the beginning must remain in you. If what you have heard from the beginning remains in you, then you will remain in the Son and in the Father.
1 John 2:27
The anointing you received from Him remains in you, and you don’t need anyone to teach you. Instead, His anointing teaches you about all things and is true and is not a lie; just as He has taught you, remain in Him.
1 John 2:28
[ God’s Children ] So now, little children, remain in Him, so that when He appears we may have boldness and not be ashamed before Him at His coming.
1 John 2:28
[ God’s Children ] So now, little children, remain in Him, so that when He appears we may have boldness and not be ashamed before Him at His coming.
1 John 3:14
We know that we have passed from death to life because we love our brothers. The one who does not love remains in death.
1 John 4:12
No one has ever seen God. If we love one another, God .
remains in us and His love is perfected in us
2 John 1:9
Anyone who does not remain in Christ’s teaching but goes beyond it, does not have God. The one who remains in that teaching, this one has both the Father and the Son.
Bottom line my point is all his Words.Till our flesh dies. Our salvation is in Him. We must remain in him to receive it. What is remaining in him to me? doing what he says, falling? doing what he says, hurting? doing what he says, doubting? doing what he says, unforgiving? doing what he says, hating? doing what he says, Sinning? doing what he says, fearing? doing what he says.
Abiding,
You might not say that it is the finishing point for us.. But, there are many who have been taught it is.. I've seen it, I have heard it and I have been jumped all over when I say bologna..
.........................Your making it up as you go if your using Hebrews again -- Yes you have found me out. I am a storyteller, a twister of Truth. Telling people that a Christian can apostate was a story made up by this spin doctor. I should have told the the truth of the matter, obedience to God is a cosmic joke (said sarcastically). Telling people to hearken to God's Voice so that they can be led to perfection was a lie so that they would stay secured in their sins. Who would ever thought that we would have to fulfill God's will. Man, I was doing so good before you found me out to be the perfect spin doctor, fabicator of the Truth. Your apologies seems to be a deflector for a continuance in defaming my faith in God, seeing that you continue calling me things which is so unbecoming of you, a fellow brother in Christ and then apology and then repeat on and on. You call me a spinner (of Truth), now you are calling me a fabicator. You do not have to believe what I say. No sir, you do not. But if you are setting there calling me, a fellow servant of God, a liar, a liar, a spinner, a fabrator, then I advice you that by what you judge another by will be what you are judged by. Stop it with the fork tongue of saying sorry and then over and over making it seem I am set out to lie.
OK. ill continue to read after i ask you to go find where i said any of these
things...by the way i was sorry that you got hurt...i didnt want that...to tell someone they put a spin on something is just that...i didnt have your intent in view nor have i once considered it. So maybe you should cut down on the open public drama and keep this a bible forum.
ii think Hebrews is a great Book and much needed
especially for gentiles to understand the Old Covenant/New covenant.
And all the fullness. -- Ok. Let us forget Hebrews for now. What is your take of the great apostate which is to occur before the end? What do you say to a person who is in a test of their faith by God like Job was? Should he had remained obedient or should he have cursed God and died? What about Jesus Christ Himself? Should He have done His own will? Why did God punish the Hebrews over and over? Because of disobedience or did He say, "Don't worry, I am just having fun. You really do not have to obey me?" Come now, backsliding is backsliding. Do we loose freewill? NO! So then, how is it not possible for one to turn back upon the path? How is it not possible for one to leave Jesus? Are we held against our will once we beleive? Hello!!!!
But, this is not a text to use that way without care.
A person falling into sin(generically) can confess it..and be restored. -- "There is a sin which is into death, and I say that we should not pray about that sin." 1 John. My point is not that we cannot be restored, but that willful unhearkening to the Spirit's guidance, one who produces thorns and biers are set aside for a cursing, whose cursing is a burning. This disobedience to God's Voice is what kept the disbeleiving Hebews in the wilderness from entering into God's rest and it is what will keep us from entering into God's rest. Was it not willful unhearkening to God which caused Adam and Eve to be forced out of the Garden? Was it not willfull unhearkening to God which caused the rebellious angels to be thrown out of Heaven? Will it not be those who remain willfully unhearkening to God who will be told that He never knew them. Why? Because they never came to know God or to acknowledge God in their thinking? How do we come to know God and acknowledge Him in our thinking? By complying with the Spirit that God's ways are the only way to His rest. Do we not have Jesus' temptations telling us that yes God's ways are to be followed?
A Hebrew bringing shame openly to the cross and even go as far as to
say that His blood was unholy. This particular sin of returing to
the corrupt and finished old covenant would never find forgiveness
or salvation. --Any one of us at any given time have the choice to return under the Law, if one is not under grace, then they are under the Law, be it Jew or Gentile. The only logical conclusion to this matter is that as long as you are not a Jews, then you cannot lose salvation. Hello!!!
"Impossible" so to go through the Cross...which they
had left and also the Christian community forsaking them...where the
fullness and blessing were being poured out.
I encourage you to keep up on your studies. -- Yes. In those studies you will see a lot of actions which are commanded, even those which are performed by a human, and by which actions, having a consequence (IF you love me....Then you are a servant. IF any one loves the world...Then God's love is NOT in them). By disobedience to God, they did not enter. By disobedience to the tilling of the Spirit, we will not enter. One would be amazed at the verbs which are active on our part of a condition.
Yes we can fall back...in fact most people have. When they
do be sure to go tell them its impossible for them to return
and that their toast now. Because? tell them because its impossible. --- I am telling people that if they leave their first love, their candlestick will be removed. I am shinning the Light into Darkness and telling people to obey God in their walk with Him so that they can be made pefect by the Spirit. Will you do the same? Or is this too a fabication of my imgination!?
Abiding,
Are you trying to silence your oppositions by making them look foolish, as though they are so stupid that they cannot carry on a conversation correctly? Do you make it look like people are liars so that others will not beleive what that poster is saying is true? Not real questions and really not looking for an answer
I don't know, Abiding. I guess words like 'spin', 'you are making this up' can only lead one to conclude that what you said is what you meant. Spin= Spin Doctor. You are making this up = liar, storyteller, fabicator. But, if you cannot see this yourself, then nothing I can say will show you otherwise..........................
Now ill read the rest.