LOGIC
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L
So we totally ignore what Jesus said in John 6? What is with you people and your refusal to acknowledge or discuss what jesus said in John 6? Ar4e you afraid?
Everyones name is written in the book of life. It is erased only when we pass on, Depending on if we have accepted Christ's offer of salvation or rejected it.
No one goes to hell because of sin, Jesus paid the price for sin, But one act will never be forgiven, Rejection, or blaspheming the spirit by rejecting what he came to teach, the gospel of Christ.
E
Rev_21:8But the fearful, and unbelieving, and the abominable, and murderers, and whoremongers, and sorcerers, and idolaters, and all liars, shall have their part in the lake which burneth with fire and brimstone: which is the second death.
Yes they will, but think about it, that would be ALL OF US WOULD IT NOT?
E
my mouth is still gapped open
You were born dead to God, did you not even know that? because you commited your first sin you were already condemned to hell. don;t you know why God did that?
L
Awww, Lao. I think you are trying to read your doctrine into those scriptures. Here's an easy one that doesn't need interpretation or doctrine;
Hebrews 3:5 Let your conversation be without covetousness; and be content with such things as ye have: for he hath said, I will never leave thee, nor forsake thee.
Here's some more while you're letting that sink in...
Romans 8:27-39
27 And he that searcheth the hearts knoweth what is the mind of the Spirit, because he maketh intercession for the saints according to the will of God.
28 And we know that all things work together for good to them that love God, to them who are the called according to his purpose.
29 For whom he did foreknow, he also did predestinate to be conformed to the image of his Son, that he might be the firstborn among many brethren.
30 Moreover whom he did predestinate, them he also called: and whom he called, them he also justified: and whom he justified, them he also glorified.
31 What shall we then say to these things? If God be for us, who can be against us?
32 He that spared not his own Son, but delivered him up for us all, how shall he not with him also freely give us all things?
33Who shall lay any thing to the charge of God's elect? It is God that justifieth.
34 Who is he that condemneth? It is Christ that died, yea rather, that is risen again, who is even at the right hand of God, who also maketh intercession for us.
35 Who shall separate us from the love of Christ? shall tribulation, or distress, or persecution, or famine, or nakedness, or peril, or sword?
36 As it is written, For thy sake we are killed all the day long; we are accounted as sheep for the slaughter.
37Nay, in all these things we are more than conquerors through him that loved us.
38 For I am persuaded, that neither death, nor life, nor angels, nor principalities, nor powers, nor things present, nor things to come,
39 Nor height, nor depth, nor any other creature, shall be able to separate us from the love of God, which is in Christ Jesus our Lord.
Hebrews 3:5 Let your conversation be without covetousness; and be content with such things as ye have: for he hath said, I will never leave thee, nor forsake thee.
Here's some more while you're letting that sink in...
Romans 8:27-39
27 And he that searcheth the hearts knoweth what is the mind of the Spirit, because he maketh intercession for the saints according to the will of God.
28 And we know that all things work together for good to them that love God, to them who are the called according to his purpose.
29 For whom he did foreknow, he also did predestinate to be conformed to the image of his Son, that he might be the firstborn among many brethren.
30 Moreover whom he did predestinate, them he also called: and whom he called, them he also justified: and whom he justified, them he also glorified.
31 What shall we then say to these things? If God be for us, who can be against us?
32 He that spared not his own Son, but delivered him up for us all, how shall he not with him also freely give us all things?
33Who shall lay any thing to the charge of God's elect? It is God that justifieth.
34 Who is he that condemneth? It is Christ that died, yea rather, that is risen again, who is even at the right hand of God, who also maketh intercession for us.
35 Who shall separate us from the love of Christ? shall tribulation, or distress, or persecution, or famine, or nakedness, or peril, or sword?
36 As it is written, For thy sake we are killed all the day long; we are accounted as sheep for the slaughter.
37Nay, in all these things we are more than conquerors through him that loved us.
38 For I am persuaded, that neither death, nor life, nor angels, nor principalities, nor powers, nor things present, nor things to come,
39 Nor height, nor depth, nor any other creature, shall be able to separate us from the love of God, which is in Christ Jesus our Lord.
E
What makes you think I ignore John 6? Read my posts and you will see me quote John 6. Where do you get the idea that everyone has there name written in the book of life? A study of the sanctuary will reveal that only those who give their life to Christ have their name written in the book of life.
Study of the sanctuary? only those who give their life to Christ? Can you show me in rev were people are judged for sin at the great white throne?
C
Thats because your stuck on the law, your stuck on sin. John said jesus came to take away the sin of the world. Not like some believe and just the sin of the saved or chosen. He took ALL sin on his body.
You were born dead to God, did you not even know that? because you commited your first sin you were already condemned to hell. don;t you know why God did that?
You were born dead to God, did you not even know that? because you commited your first sin you were already condemned to hell. don;t you know why God did that?
No one goes to hell because of sin?
Seriously EG?
E
You are only giving part of the picture not the full picture. What these texts and the ones that I have quoted reveal is that God has done everything He can for our salvation. If a person does not go to heaven it will be their own fault, if a person loses their salvation it will be their own fault. Study the sanctuary will reveal OSAS to be false.
wow!!
E
I am still in shock over that statement.
No one goes to hell because of sin?
Seriously EG?
No one goes to hell because of sin?
Seriously EG?
Now my mouth is wide open!!!
Who is condemned? Sinners? if this is the case, then we are all condemned.
John 3
18 “He who believes in Him is not condemned; but he who does not believe is condemned
already, because he has not believed in the name of the only begotten Son of God
Who is condemned? Those who do not place their trust in Christ. Who goes to hell? Those who are condemned.
C
So your going to ignore what Jesus said?
Now my mouth is wide open!!!
Who is condemned? Sinners? if this is the case, then we are all condemned.
John 3
18 “He who believes in Him is not condemned; but he who does not believe is condemned
already, because he has not believed in the name of the only begotten Son of God
Who is condemned? Those who do not place their trust in Christ. Who goes to hell? Those who are condemned.
Now my mouth is wide open!!!
Who is condemned? Sinners? if this is the case, then we are all condemned.
John 3
18 “He who believes in Him is not condemned; but he who does not believe is condemned
already, because he has not believed in the name of the only begotten Son of God
Who is condemned? Those who do not place their trust in Christ. Who goes to hell? Those who are condemned.
E
and what does it say about those unrepentant brothers and sisters?
Did jesus lie? he did not say he who has not stopped sin is condemned already, he said he who does not believe.
G
So our salvation is dependant on us, And not God? Us who can do NOTHING?
wow!!
wow!!
Hebrews 6:4-6 (KJV)
4For it is impossible for those who were once enlightened, and have tasted of the heavenly gift, and were made partakers of the Holy Ghost,
5 And have tasted the good word of God, and the powers of the world to come,
6 If they shall fall away, to renew them again unto repentance; seeing they crucify to themselves the Son of God afresh, and put him to an open shame.
C
Unrepentant brothers and sisters? They would not be brothers and sisters. Because they have not yet believed in the only name of Jesus, why do you think the people in john 6 left? Because they did not believe, Why do you think the people in james were called impostors? because they did not believe.
Did jesus lie? he did not say he who has not stopped sin is condemned already, he said he who does not believe.
Did jesus lie? he did not say he who has not stopped sin is condemned already, he said he who does not believe.
Jas 5:20 Let him know, that he which converteth the sinner from the error of his way shall save a soul from death, and shall hide a multitude of sins.
E
Jas 5:19Brethren, if any of you do err from the truth, and one convert him;
Jas 5:20 Let him know, that he which converteth the sinner from the error of his way shall save a soul from death, and shall hide a multitude of sins.
Jas 5:20 Let him know, that he which converteth the sinner from the error of his way shall save a soul from death, and shall hide a multitude of sins.
second, literally it says if anyone among you. we already know from the beginning of james many among them were not brothers and sisters but impostors, because they had not yet trusted in christ. so you should not assume he is talking about people who are saved.
thirdly, He called themn sinners. this should point out the fact they were not saved, but still dead in sin, b ecause they have yet to be converted.. why? they had mere believe, and not faith.
why? He who does not believe is condemned already,
why?
10 and with all unrighteous deception among those who perish, because they did not receive the love of the truth, that they might be saved. 11 And for this reason God will send them strong delusion, that they should believe the lie, 12 that they all may be condemned who did not believe the truth but had pleasure in unrighteousness.
Because they did not believe in truth, because they loved their sin more than they loved god.
C
first off. what translation is that?
second, literally it says if anyone among you. we already know from the beginning of james many among them were not brothers and sisters but impostors, because they had not yet trusted in christ. so you should not assume he is talking about people who are saved.
thirdly, He called themn sinners. this should point out the fact they were not saved, but still dead in sin, b ecause they have yet to be converted.. why? they had mere believe, and not faith.
why? He who does not believe is condemned already,
why?
10 and with all unrighteous deception among those who perish, because they did not receive the love of the truth, that they might be saved. 11 And for this reason God will send them strong delusion, that they should believe the lie, 12 that they all may be condemned who did not believe the truth but had pleasure in unrighteousness.
Because they did not believe in truth, because they loved their sin more than they loved god.
second, literally it says if anyone among you. we already know from the beginning of james many among them were not brothers and sisters but impostors, because they had not yet trusted in christ. so you should not assume he is talking about people who are saved.
thirdly, He called themn sinners. this should point out the fact they were not saved, but still dead in sin, b ecause they have yet to be converted.. why? they had mere believe, and not faith.
why? He who does not believe is condemned already,
why?
10 and with all unrighteous deception among those who perish, because they did not receive the love of the truth, that they might be saved. 11 And for this reason God will send them strong delusion, that they should believe the lie, 12 that they all may be condemned who did not believe the truth but had pleasure in unrighteousness.
Because they did not believe in truth, because they loved their sin more than they loved god.
E
Christ died on the cross to pay a penalty on our behalf we can eather except it and trun from the wickedness he freed us from, we can walk out of the prison cell of sin we have been in but now the door is open. You have a choice here stay in the prison cell of sin or walk out a free man never desiring to go back to that cell again. If we choose to recommit the crime of sin after being set free guess what, we find ourselves right back in the prison cell with no hope of parole. We taisted the freedom Christ gave us when he payed for our penalty but desided to go back. Not his fault. It would be of our own choosing.
Hebrews 6:4-6 (KJV)
4For it is impossible for those who were once enlightened, and have tasted of the heavenly gift, and were made partakers of the Holy Ghost,
5 And have tasted the good word of God, and the powers of the world to come,
6 If they shall fall away, to renew them again unto repentance; seeing they crucify to themselves the Son of God afresh, and put him to an open shame.
Hebrews 6:4-6 (KJV)
4For it is impossible for those who were once enlightened, and have tasted of the heavenly gift, and were made partakers of the Holy Ghost,
5 And have tasted the good word of God, and the powers of the world to come,
6 If they shall fall away, to renew them again unto repentance; seeing they crucify to themselves the Son of God afresh, and put him to an open shame.
He who believes has passed from death to life.
Jesus said, whoever believes in him will NEVER DIE, NEVER HUNGER OR THIRST, LIVE FOREVER.
Did Jesus lie? Come on, did Jesus lie?
Hebrews 6 is talking to people trying to return to law. Who thought every time you sinned you had to have that sin reforgiven, as per the law. He is telling them, If it were possible for one to fall away, they could never be renewed (thus cancelling out the thought of returning to law) We know this by what followed.
7 For the earth which drinks in the rain that often comes upon it, and bears herbs useful for those by whom it is cultivated, receives blessing from God; 8 but if it bears thorns and briers, it is rejected and near to being cursed, whose end is to be burned.
It is talking about producing fruit. What happens when you produce fruit? You recieve reward.
What happens if it does not produce fruit? it is NEAR to being cursed.
Do you understand what NEAR TO BEING CURSED MEANS?
Think of wood hay and straw. The end is burned. But what did paul say?? he himself will still be saved, even though as through fire?? (near to being cursed)
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E
Directly copied and pasted from KJV. That 'of' means 'in' and mplies 'in your church (calling out)'
James already said people among them were not saved, they had no faith. Just because people are among a church or a group of people in church does not mean they were ever saved, this is a dangerous presupposition.
Not to mention, It causes Jesus to be contradicted. You do understand the bible can not contradict do you not?
The people jesus spoke of in John 3. They were sinners. They lives in sin, They were evil. Did jesus say they were condemned be3cause they lived in sin? No. He said they were condemned because THEY DID NOT BELIEVE
G
Unrepentant brothers and sisters? They would not be brothers and sisters. Because they have not yet believed in the only name of Jesus, why do you think the people in john 6 left? Because they did not believe, Why do you think the people in james were called impostors? because they did not believe.
Did jesus lie? he did not say he who has not stopped sin is condemned already, he said he who does not believe.
Did jesus lie? he did not say he who has not stopped sin is condemned already, he said he who does not believe.
If you are not in or on something can you fall from it. If I am already on the floor can I fall from the floor? But if I am on a stool I can fall from the stool. If I am in the Grace of God, I can also fall from the Grace of God. If I am already in condemnation can I fall into it. NO, I can't fall into something I am already in.
Hebrews 4:11 (KJV)
11 Let us labour therefore to enter into that rest, lest any man fall after the same example of unbelief.
2 Peter 3:17-18 (KJV)
17 Ye therefore, beloved, seeing ye know these things before, beware lest ye also, being led away with the error of the wicked, fall from your own stedfastness.
18 But grow in grace, and in the knowledge of our Lord and Saviour Jesus Christ. To him be glory both now and for ever. Amen.
James 5:12 (KJV)
12 But above all things, my brethren, swear not, neither by heaven, neither by the earth, neither by any other oath: but let your yea be yea; and your nay, nay; lest ye fall into condemnation.
2 Peter 1:5-10 (KJV)
5 And beside this, giving all diligence, add to your faith virtue; and to virtue knowledge;
6 And to knowledge temperance; and to temperance patience; and to patience godliness;
7 And to godliness brotherly kindness; and to brotherly kindness charity.
8 For if these things be in you, and abound, they make you that ye shall neither be barren nor unfruitful in the knowledge of our Lord Jesus Christ.
9 But he that lacketh these things is blind, and cannot see afar off, and hath forgotten that he was purged from his old sins.
10 Wherefore the rather, brethren, give diligence to make your calling and election sure: for if ye do these things, ye shall never fall:
2 Peter1:10 ....if ye do these things, ye shall never fall:
Must mean we are somewhere we can fall from if we don't do these things. So if we are purged from sin and enter into the election of Christ through faith but do not keep these things God tells us to keep we can fall from the election we entered into as we turn from the faith given us.
C
not always, it can mean means among, near, within.
James already said people among them were not saved, they had no faith. Just because people are among a church or a group of people in church does not mean they were ever saved, this is a dangerous presupposition.
Not to mention, It causes Jesus to be contradicted. You do understand the bible can not contradict do you not?
The people jesus spoke of in John 3. They were sinners. They lives in sin, They were evil. Did jesus say they were condemned be3cause they lived in sin? No. He said they were condemned because THEY DID NOT BELIEVE
James already said people among them were not saved, they had no faith. Just because people are among a church or a group of people in church does not mean they were ever saved, this is a dangerous presupposition.
Not to mention, It causes Jesus to be contradicted. You do understand the bible can not contradict do you not?
The people jesus spoke of in John 3. They were sinners. They lives in sin, They were evil. Did jesus say they were condemned be3cause they lived in sin? No. He said they were condemned because THEY DID NOT BELIEVE
Jas 5:20 Let him know, that he which converteth the sinner from the error of his way shall save a soul from death, and shall hide a multitude of sins.
E
Is unbelief unrighteousness? It is in the eyes of God.
If you are not in or on something can you fall from it. If I am already on the floor can I fall from the floor? But if I am on a stool I can fall from the stool. If I am in the Grace of God, I can also fall from the Grace of God. If I am already in condemnation can I fall into it. NO, I can't fall into something I am already in.
Hebrews 4:11 (KJV)
11 Let us labour therefore to enter into that rest, lest any man fall after the same example of unbelief.
2 Peter 3:17-18 (KJV)
17 Ye therefore, beloved, seeing ye know these things before, beware lest ye also, being led away with the error of the wicked, fall from your own stedfastness.
18 But grow in grace, and in the knowledge of our Lord and Saviour Jesus Christ. To him be glory both now and for ever. Amen.
James 5:12 (KJV)
12 But above all things, my brethren, swear not, neither by heaven, neither by the earth, neither by any other oath: but let your yea be yea; and your nay, nay; lest ye fall into condemnation.
2 Peter 1:5-10 (KJV)
5 And beside this, giving all diligence, add to your faith virtue; and to virtue knowledge;
6 And to knowledge temperance; and to temperance patience; and to patience godliness;
7 And to godliness brotherly kindness; and to brotherly kindness charity.
8 For if these things be in you, and abound, they make you that ye shall neither be barren nor unfruitful in the knowledge of our Lord Jesus Christ.
9 But he that lacketh these things is blind, and cannot see afar off, and hath forgotten that he was purged from his old sins.
10 Wherefore the rather, brethren, give diligence to make your calling and election sure: for if ye do these things, ye shall never fall:
2 Peter1:10 ....if ye do these things, ye shall never fall:
Must mean we are somewhere we can fall from if we don't do these things. So if we are purged from sin and enter into the election of Christ through faith but do not keep these things God tells us to keep we can fall from the election we entered into as we turn from the faith given us.
If you are not in or on something can you fall from it. If I am already on the floor can I fall from the floor? But if I am on a stool I can fall from the stool. If I am in the Grace of God, I can also fall from the Grace of God. If I am already in condemnation can I fall into it. NO, I can't fall into something I am already in.
Hebrews 4:11 (KJV)
11 Let us labour therefore to enter into that rest, lest any man fall after the same example of unbelief.
2 Peter 3:17-18 (KJV)
17 Ye therefore, beloved, seeing ye know these things before, beware lest ye also, being led away with the error of the wicked, fall from your own stedfastness.
18 But grow in grace, and in the knowledge of our Lord and Saviour Jesus Christ. To him be glory both now and for ever. Amen.
James 5:12 (KJV)
12 But above all things, my brethren, swear not, neither by heaven, neither by the earth, neither by any other oath: but let your yea be yea; and your nay, nay; lest ye fall into condemnation.
2 Peter 1:5-10 (KJV)
5 And beside this, giving all diligence, add to your faith virtue; and to virtue knowledge;
6 And to knowledge temperance; and to temperance patience; and to patience godliness;
7 And to godliness brotherly kindness; and to brotherly kindness charity.
8 For if these things be in you, and abound, they make you that ye shall neither be barren nor unfruitful in the knowledge of our Lord Jesus Christ.
9 But he that lacketh these things is blind, and cannot see afar off, and hath forgotten that he was purged from his old sins.
10 Wherefore the rather, brethren, give diligence to make your calling and election sure: for if ye do these things, ye shall never fall:
2 Peter1:10 ....if ye do these things, ye shall never fall:
Must mean we are somewhere we can fall from if we don't do these things. So if we are purged from sin and enter into the election of Christ through faith but do not keep these things God tells us to keep we can fall from the election we entered into as we turn from the faith given us.
Jesus said
whoever believes in him will never die, but live forever.
Whoever asks, he will give them living water which will never stop flowing and the person will live forever.
Whoever believes in him will never hunger or thirst, never die, Live forever. Because the food he offers will endure forever, and never fade away
That all god gives him, which he promised before time began, he will lose no one
He will never leave nor forsake us.
So either God contradicted himself, thus is a fraud, por those people who are talking to were NEVER SAVED TO BEGIN WITH, as james says, they heard the word of truth, but they never had faith in that word.