oh yes....the burning bosom...
subjective feelings is the hallmark of methodism.
there's that second blessing
deception.
your refusal to seek out the root and foundation of your own belief system is on your head.
you've been given notice: if you continue to uphold the false system invented by Wesley, that's your own doing. you can assured, this always leads in one direction.
look forward in time to the Charismatic movement - this is the fruit of subjectivity and measuring according to self.
ever-increasing need to experience something...no faith...
it's so unbiblical Wesley had to invent new doctrine.
you can face it, like we all have, or not - your freewill choice.
here's what will happen - later on you will blaming the church for whatever befalls you.
standard o.p.
i care for you raul. i hope you examine where your own foundation came from.
without question. but fruit is inevitable.
if anyone is in Christ he will bring forth fruit.
anyone not in Christ is none of His.
it's not a bell curve. it's one or the other.
here's what Jesus said:
John 15
2. He cuts off every branch in me that bears no fruit, while every branch that does bear fruit he prunes so that it will be even more fruitful.
9. As the Father has loved me, so have I loved you. Abide in my love. 10If you keep my commandments, you will abide in my love, just as I have kept my Father’s commandments and abide in his love. 11These things I have spoken to you, that my joy may be in you, and that your joy may be full.
what did Jesus mean in verse 9?
absolutely. and i'm so grateful you're careful and honest enough to express what is actually said:
"no longer practices sin"
i don't understand where the idea of "no longer practices sin" cancels out "practicing righteousness".
we are born form above and now learn/practice to do one and not the other.
we're told in the epistles to christians - the church- to stop presenting ourselves to serve sin rather to serve the Lord. how will the new believer EVER learn this if he is taught there's an easy out?? a second blessing....a warm feeling that will indicate he has arrived?
our faith is in Christ's Work and the evidence of His Mercy is His work in our new lives.
the only issue i have with any of this is when we have people crossing over into Jesus being an example haning on the Cross and nothing more....that's where hyper-methodism goes - abstractions and subjectivity.
no longer practicing sin is every converts new goal - WE HATE IT!
are you trying to tell us it is easy?
who is calling for cheap grace?
you said your best friend was a cheap gracer - for 17 years! what took
you so long?
do you see what i'm saying?
if we think at any time there is an instant sinlessness outside Christ's, i do not know what to say.
raul, do you believe Christ's Righteousness is credited to the one baptised into His death and raised with Him?
i am not asking "do you believe now that we are in Christ can we keep practicing sin" i am asking "how were you ever righteous enough to be baptised into Christ?" you've already declared it is not your standing.
it's a fine line having this discussion with you; because i don't see you over the top denying Christ's Finished Work. i just see a christian who wants to live a clean life.
and who disagrees with that? not one single christian i know...not one raul.
i don't know thousands in person, but i do know about 70 at my church.
no one claims they are perfect, but they are such oddballs (as we all are now in the eyes of those among whom we once lived) because of their conviction to be separate.
not from going into the world, but from being defiled by it.
i don't know how gruesome to get with my own testimony, but put 2 and 2 together.
okay....i agree with this simple statement.
with the adjustment.
love zone.