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Not all have changed their mind from unbelief to belief. so not all are saved, itis a matter ofputting ones faith in God and God onlym God the Son God the Father and God the Holly Ghost notice all three are singular one God in three parts. Like an egg has three parts yet it is one egg. Anyway Yes you do work out your salvation in fear and trembling but it is not you that is working it out it is God in and through you, via your putting yourself in God's pathway to do with you whatever God sees fit. This is where most have problems especially with the experiences they have had with others harming them. Have you ever put yourself in the hands of others and believed whatever they say? Have you been harmed by this? Well with God there are things that happen that look bad and not right, but God we are talking about is the creator of this world and the Father of Jesus Christ. Since God is the creator I would if I were you, you, or you I would put my trust in the one that knows all instead of this world and it's ways of deception. We are called to LOVE but befroe one can love God's way one needs to see the full love of God first, we love back because God loved us first
T
When the Holy Ghost is spoken of, people get the wrong perception of what the Holy Ghost does and how the Holy Ghost works. There are event that have to take place in one life before the Holy Ghost can enter and become a part of you. Just become you say you believe in Jesus does not mean the Holy Ghost is with you. You must become a doer of the word of God. But be ye doers of the word, and not hearers only, deceiving your own selves. (James 1:22) Let us take a look and see how one gets the Holy Ghost in ones life. First, step is to give up a lifestyle where sin has dominion, (ruler ship) over you. Sin according to 1 John 3:4, Whosoever committeth sin transgresseth also the law: for sin is the transgression (breaking) of the law. You must be taught "The Word", before you can adhere to God's commandments (judgments\statues). These laws are found in the Holy Bible; beginning with Genesis and ending with Revelation.
You must believe what the bible says and finally, you must confess that Jesus is Lord. Once this has been accomplished, you are qualified to be baptized in the name of Jesus. Now when they heard this, they were pricked in their heart, and said unto Peter and to the rest of the apostles, men and brethren, what shall we do? Then Peter said unto them, "repent and be baptized every one of you in the name of Jesus Christ for the remission of sins, and ye shall receive the gift of the Holy Ghost." (Acts1:36-38).
Now Jesus said in John 14: 26 But the Comforter, which is the Holy Ghost, whom the Father will send in my name, he shall teach you all things, and bring all things to your remembrance, whatsoever I have said unto you. Some people will not read the New Testament or the Old Testament; will not keep the Sabbath day on the seventh day of the week (Saturday). Will not take heed to the Dietary Law, get Baptize in the name of Jesus, Adhere to the Lord’s High Holy Days Outline in Leviticus 23 Chapter instead of Holidays and Jesus the Apostles and the Prophets did all these things with faith and people believe the Holy Ghost is just going to fill them up teach them for doing nothing! But the bible says; (Rom. 1:16) "for it is the power of God unto salvation to every one that believeth. (Acts 10:44) While Peter yet spake these words, the Holy Ghost fell on all them which heard the word. So whosoever hear and believe and do the words of the Lord the Holy Ghost shall also visit them.
Because people understand the law, they understand working to earn. The carnal mind we can all relate to and understand. The Law is expressly for all people who are still under the carnal workings of their own mind.
It takes the Lord Jesus Christ to save us and cause us to be born of the spirit to understand spiritual things, such as His Peace that surpasses all understanding. This is liberty, being free from the carnal mind and the law that governs it.
That's why it is so difficult to show people OSAS because it is spiritually discerned and not necessarily something that can be understood by the carnal mind.
It takes the Lord Jesus Christ to save us and cause us to be born of the spirit to understand spiritual things, such as His Peace that surpasses all understanding. This is liberty, being free from the carnal mind and the law that governs it.
That's why it is so difficult to show people OSAS because it is spiritually discerned and not necessarily something that can be understood by the carnal mind.
That's your answer?
Maybe this protestant convert may explain it in a way you understand it, because you are way off on what catholics believe, you do not get it!
Click on the listen icon. I doubt you would listen because you always say you will never listen to men, but I post it none the less.
Faith and Works | Catholic Answers
Maybe this protestant convert may explain it in a way you understand it, because you are way off on what catholics believe, you do not get it!
Click on the listen icon. I doubt you would listen because you always say you will never listen to men, but I post it none the less.
Faith and Works | Catholic Answers
P
Do you think it's a choice we make?
Hmm...*pondering*
In my own case, it was deception. (I hope?)
The moment the Holy Spirit showed me I was trusting my intellect
(and again, @ my intellect...lol)
it was like shackles falling away.
It was like a 'get out of jail free' card.
It was 'as if' knowing the Truth set me free. ♥
I believe with my whole heart that God will make the Lord Jesus known to His own,
and as He does this, little by little all the chains fall away.
(experientially, that is. positionally, it's done! )
-ellie
Hmm...*pondering*
In my own case, it was deception. (I hope?)
The moment the Holy Spirit showed me I was trusting my intellect
(and again,
@ my intellect...lol)it was like shackles falling away.
It was like a 'get out of jail free' card.
It was 'as if' knowing the Truth set me free. ♥
I believe with my whole heart that God will make the Lord Jesus known to His own,
and as He does this, little by little all the chains fall away.
(experientially, that is. positionally, it's done!
)-ellie
E
why don't you get off your pride. News flash my friend. The crap that someone who does not believe as you do is ONLY because we do not understand is old. It has been used for to long now.
I already proved to you what your church did to expose to you the fact the arguments your church uses is based on false premesis, and all you did was come at me saying I am a hypocrite. so your churhc commited a little sin. Your churches sin has effected millions over centuries, and you can't even see it!
well I could listen,
But I have listened to catholics for 30 years now. I have went to the catholic website to read what they had to say. I have done many other things. and they ALL say the same thing.
face it. You claim you can not know you are saved, you can only hope. Thus your working to earn your salvation.
God wants to give you a gift of eternal life. He does nt want you to try to earn it. He proved to you by giving you the law you can NEVER EARN IT. so why do you keep trying?
it is on you! you can deny things all you want, your only hurting yourself!
I already proved to you what your church did to expose to you the fact the arguments your church uses is based on false premesis, and all you did was come at me saying I am a hypocrite. so your churhc commited a little sin. Your churches sin has effected millions over centuries, and you can't even see it!
well I could listen,
But I have listened to catholics for 30 years now. I have went to the catholic website to read what they had to say. I have done many other things. and they ALL say the same thing.
face it. You claim you can not know you are saved, you can only hope. Thus your working to earn your salvation.
God wants to give you a gift of eternal life. He does nt want you to try to earn it. He proved to you by giving you the law you can NEVER EARN IT. so why do you keep trying?
it is on you! you can deny things all you want, your only hurting yourself!
We receive the Holy Ghost that day of belief, (Eph. 1:13) we have changed our minds from unbelief to belief and swear to God as well as the people in front of us that we will obey, go and do right, but just as the Jewish first chosen did not and swore they would, and never did, not conpletely. Then Jesus came on the scene while the first covenant was still in effect mind you and showed the first chosen their completee frailities in not being able to make it to Heaven by their works even to the point of if your eye causes you to sin pluck it out. He even told a rich man what he must do to get to heaven and that was obey the law. The rich man told Jesus he had obeyed the Law from birth. THen Jesus said that he lacked one thing to give up his riches give it to the poor and come and follow him. And that man walked away very sad he chose earthly riches over God the creator of all. Then Jesus went on for the model prayer our Father who art in heaven, hollowed be thy name. They hear in this prayer delver me from temptation and forgive us our debt as we forgive others their debt.
Okay now the disciples get very concerned about being saved themselves after the rich man and concerned about their treasures that they gave up. Then they heard this model prayer and heard about forgiving in order to get forgiven. so they ask Jesus how can anyone get to heaven they heard also about plucking out their eye, cutting off their hand(s)
What did Jesus say to them after them knowing and seeing that there was no way for them to get to heaven under the conditions layed out for them and also for us
Matthew 19:26But Jesus looked at them and said to them, “With men this is impossible, but with God all things are possible.”
Now again I want to point that this scenario was still before the death of Christ and Christ has succeded in showing the disciples that there is no way for anyone to get to heaven by works of the law. As a matter of fact at this point the only way is to become a Torso all limbs cut off, eyes gouged out and tongue cut off, better for part of you to go to heaven than all of you go to hell.
So what was Jesus meaning about being imposible for man but possible with God? Why could this prayer been meant for him to make it to the cross and take away all sin? John 1:29 says so at the end of the verse. Well sin has not disappeared has it? No!!!! So in who's sight was the sin taken away from at the cross? Yes God the Father? Why? So God the Father could live in you not seeing the sin in you as he saw the sin in the Old Testament in all those that did not believe.
Now this is not excusing sin by any means this grace was meant for appreciation (good news) it is not by works when one gets saved through belief, then works start from belief not your old flesh works new works God's he begins living in you by your free will and then starts to live through you as you grow in understanding this love lavished on you while you were still a sinner from the worlds point of view, and our own fleshly attitudes, but not from God the Father's point of view he sees you the day you first believed as perfect as his Son for he sees through his Son unto you the believer now as perfect, If Father did not look through his Son at anyone of us we all would be dead. Now Father since Father has done this through his Son and made you forever Holy and Perfect from his point of view through his Son's finished work at the cross upon your belief. Tell me what more does one need? Please do not use anything of this world. You now have everything you need for life and Godliness, you have transferred from death to life, your conscience through this final sacrifice and last shedding of blood payment for all sin is done. You are free, nothing more for you to do it is done for you by God. Now at the death of Christ a new covenant came into play Hebrews 9:15-17 and Hebrews 10:17 So therefore everything you quote in Matthew, mark, luke and John before the death of Christ is under the Old law (Covenant) not the new covenant
Let us see what Paul has to say about his own works.
[h=3]Philippians 3[/h]New King James Version (NKJV)
[h=3]All for Christ[/h]3 Finally, my brethren, rejoice in the Lord. For me to write the same things to you is not tedious, but for you it is safe.
[SUP]2 [/SUP]Beware of dogs, beware of evil workers, beware of the mutilation! [SUP]3 [/SUP]For we are the circumcision, who worship God in the Spirit,rejoice in Christ Jesus, and have no confidence in the flesh, [SUP]4 [/SUP]though I also might have confidence in the flesh. If anyone else thinks he may have confidence in the flesh, I more so: [SUP]5 [/SUP]circumcised the eighth day, of the stock of Israel, of the tribe of Benjamin, a Hebrew of the Hebrews; concerning the law, a Pharisee; [SUP]6 [/SUP]concerning zeal, persecuting the church; concerning the righteousness which is in the law, blameless.
[SUP]7 [/SUP]But what things were gain to me, these I have counted loss for Christ. [SUP]8 [/SUP]Yet indeed I also count all things loss for the excellence of the knowledge of Christ Jesus my Lord, for whom I have suffered the loss of all things, and count them as rubbish, that I may gain Christ [SUP]9 [/SUP]and be found in Him, not having my own righteousness, which is from the law, but that which is through faith in Christ, the righteousness which is from God by faith; [SUP]10 [/SUP]that I may know Him and the power of His resurrection, and the fellowship of His sufferings, being conformed to His death, [SUP]11 [/SUP]if, by any means, I may attain to the resurrection from the dead.
Now did Paul say it was by works or by Faith in Christ Jesus? You can go on having yourown righteousnesscomes from the Law and be proud and boastful but Paul said this was all rubbish being righteous from obeying the law it is now all rubbish, garbage to him and has given it up. Let us move on to what he told to the Galatians about works
[SUP]Galatians 2:16-21
16 [/SUP]knowing that a man is not justified by the works of the law but by faith in Jesus Christ, even we have believed in Christ Jesus, that we might be justified by faith in Christ and not by the works of the law; for by the works of the law no flesh shall be justified.
[SUP]17 [/SUP]“But if, while we seek to be justified by Christ, we ourselves also are found sinners, is Christ therefore a minister of sin? Certainly not! [SUP]18 [/SUP]For if I build again those things which I destroyed, I make myself a transgressor. [SUP]19[/SUP]For I through the law died to the law that I might live to God. [SUP]20 [/SUP]I have been crucified with Christ; it is no longer I who live, but Christ lives in me; and the life which I now live in the flesh I live by faith in the Son of God, who loved me and gave Himself for me. [SUP]21 [/SUP]I do not set aside the grace of God; for if righteousness comes through the law, then Christ died in vain.”
Again we are to believe and and not be under the law as you keep writing for Christ fullfilled the Law and Prophets then brought in a new covenant for allthose that believe and will appreciate this that they will do the will of my Fatherbeing in agreement with now their Father as well through belief. While we were yet sinners Christ died for us.
Let us go on in this proof that we are saved by Faith and made perfect through Faith in Christ Jesus.
[h=3]Galatians 3[/h]New King James Version (NKJV)
[h=3]Justification by Faith[/h]3 O foolish Galatians! Who has bewitched you that you should not obey the truth, before whose eyes Jesus Christ was clearly portrayed among you as crucified? [SUP]2 [/SUP]This only I want to learn from you: Did you receive the Spirit by the works of the law, or by the hearing of faith? [SUP]3 [/SUP]Are you so foolish? Having begun in the Spirit, are you now being made perfect by the flesh? [SUP]4 [/SUP]Have you suffered so many things in vain—if indeed it was in vain?
[SUP]5 [/SUP]Therefore He who supplies the Spirit to you and works miracles among you, does He do it by the works of the law, or by the hearing of faith?— [SUP]6 [/SUP]just as Abraham “believed God, and it was accounted to him for righteousness.” [SUP]7 [/SUP]Therefore know that only those who are of faith are sons of Abraham. [SUP]8 [/SUP]And the Scripture, foreseeing that God would justify the Gentiles by faith, preached the gospel to Abraham beforehand, saying, “In you all the nations shall be blessed.” [SUP]9 [/SUP]So then those who are of faith are blessed with believing Abraham.
Tan I hope you are listening along with all of you that are caught under the Law and trying to be righteous under it. Paul is very clear to the people and yes it is clear that by belief that very day and through belief one does repent and want to change their ways and unfortunately try to do it under the Law and be righteous before God and never ever can by the Law
That is why he said to the Galatians oh foolish Galatians who has bewitched you? Now If Paul was present here today he would say to you Oh foolish Tan, Cobus, and anyone else saying you do not receive the Spirit at belief, you must become a doer of the law first perfect before you can be born again.
AT Pentecost they did not get cleaned up and walk perfect before belief or the Holy Ghost did not wait to live in them after belief waiting for them to go and be perfect of the Law, before entering them. The Holy Ghost came upon them as they believed and comes upon anyone who actually believes that instant and then the good work starts in them to become as Jesus was here on earth in total dependancy on Father, doing whatever the will is of the Father it is a growing in grace process, and one is made perfect from Father's vantage point that very first day of belief because of Jesus taking away the sin of the world for you. This is not received until you believe then one moves on into the new life dead to sin and alive to God forever more my brothers and sisters in Christ.
Praying for you and all others deceived by the curse of the Law that when it flows through the flesh it kills that person for they cannot ever be perfect in and of the Law even though the Law is Just, Holy perfect anf correct.
Love you all
Homwardbound
Okay now the disciples get very concerned about being saved themselves after the rich man and concerned about their treasures that they gave up. Then they heard this model prayer and heard about forgiving in order to get forgiven. so they ask Jesus how can anyone get to heaven they heard also about plucking out their eye, cutting off their hand(s)
What did Jesus say to them after them knowing and seeing that there was no way for them to get to heaven under the conditions layed out for them and also for us
Matthew 19:26But Jesus looked at them and said to them, “With men this is impossible, but with God all things are possible.”
Now again I want to point that this scenario was still before the death of Christ and Christ has succeded in showing the disciples that there is no way for anyone to get to heaven by works of the law. As a matter of fact at this point the only way is to become a Torso all limbs cut off, eyes gouged out and tongue cut off, better for part of you to go to heaven than all of you go to hell.
So what was Jesus meaning about being imposible for man but possible with God? Why could this prayer been meant for him to make it to the cross and take away all sin? John 1:29 says so at the end of the verse. Well sin has not disappeared has it? No!!!! So in who's sight was the sin taken away from at the cross? Yes God the Father? Why? So God the Father could live in you not seeing the sin in you as he saw the sin in the Old Testament in all those that did not believe.
Now this is not excusing sin by any means this grace was meant for appreciation (good news) it is not by works when one gets saved through belief, then works start from belief not your old flesh works new works God's he begins living in you by your free will and then starts to live through you as you grow in understanding this love lavished on you while you were still a sinner from the worlds point of view, and our own fleshly attitudes, but not from God the Father's point of view he sees you the day you first believed as perfect as his Son for he sees through his Son unto you the believer now as perfect, If Father did not look through his Son at anyone of us we all would be dead. Now Father since Father has done this through his Son and made you forever Holy and Perfect from his point of view through his Son's finished work at the cross upon your belief. Tell me what more does one need? Please do not use anything of this world. You now have everything you need for life and Godliness, you have transferred from death to life, your conscience through this final sacrifice and last shedding of blood payment for all sin is done. You are free, nothing more for you to do it is done for you by God. Now at the death of Christ a new covenant came into play Hebrews 9:15-17 and Hebrews 10:17 So therefore everything you quote in Matthew, mark, luke and John before the death of Christ is under the Old law (Covenant) not the new covenant
Let us see what Paul has to say about his own works.
[h=3]Philippians 3[/h]New King James Version (NKJV)
[h=3]All for Christ[/h]3 Finally, my brethren, rejoice in the Lord. For me to write the same things to you is not tedious, but for you it is safe.
[SUP]2 [/SUP]Beware of dogs, beware of evil workers, beware of the mutilation! [SUP]3 [/SUP]For we are the circumcision, who worship God in the Spirit,rejoice in Christ Jesus, and have no confidence in the flesh, [SUP]4 [/SUP]though I also might have confidence in the flesh. If anyone else thinks he may have confidence in the flesh, I more so: [SUP]5 [/SUP]circumcised the eighth day, of the stock of Israel, of the tribe of Benjamin, a Hebrew of the Hebrews; concerning the law, a Pharisee; [SUP]6 [/SUP]concerning zeal, persecuting the church; concerning the righteousness which is in the law, blameless.
[SUP]7 [/SUP]But what things were gain to me, these I have counted loss for Christ. [SUP]8 [/SUP]Yet indeed I also count all things loss for the excellence of the knowledge of Christ Jesus my Lord, for whom I have suffered the loss of all things, and count them as rubbish, that I may gain Christ [SUP]9 [/SUP]and be found in Him, not having my own righteousness, which is from the law, but that which is through faith in Christ, the righteousness which is from God by faith; [SUP]10 [/SUP]that I may know Him and the power of His resurrection, and the fellowship of His sufferings, being conformed to His death, [SUP]11 [/SUP]if, by any means, I may attain to the resurrection from the dead.
Now did Paul say it was by works or by Faith in Christ Jesus? You can go on having yourown righteousnesscomes from the Law and be proud and boastful but Paul said this was all rubbish being righteous from obeying the law it is now all rubbish, garbage to him and has given it up. Let us move on to what he told to the Galatians about works
[SUP]Galatians 2:16-21
16 [/SUP]knowing that a man is not justified by the works of the law but by faith in Jesus Christ, even we have believed in Christ Jesus, that we might be justified by faith in Christ and not by the works of the law; for by the works of the law no flesh shall be justified.
[SUP]17 [/SUP]“But if, while we seek to be justified by Christ, we ourselves also are found sinners, is Christ therefore a minister of sin? Certainly not! [SUP]18 [/SUP]For if I build again those things which I destroyed, I make myself a transgressor. [SUP]19[/SUP]For I through the law died to the law that I might live to God. [SUP]20 [/SUP]I have been crucified with Christ; it is no longer I who live, but Christ lives in me; and the life which I now live in the flesh I live by faith in the Son of God, who loved me and gave Himself for me. [SUP]21 [/SUP]I do not set aside the grace of God; for if righteousness comes through the law, then Christ died in vain.”
Again we are to believe and and not be under the law as you keep writing for Christ fullfilled the Law and Prophets then brought in a new covenant for allthose that believe and will appreciate this that they will do the will of my Fatherbeing in agreement with now their Father as well through belief. While we were yet sinners Christ died for us.
Let us go on in this proof that we are saved by Faith and made perfect through Faith in Christ Jesus.
[h=3]Galatians 3[/h]New King James Version (NKJV)
[h=3]Justification by Faith[/h]3 O foolish Galatians! Who has bewitched you that you should not obey the truth, before whose eyes Jesus Christ was clearly portrayed among you as crucified? [SUP]2 [/SUP]This only I want to learn from you: Did you receive the Spirit by the works of the law, or by the hearing of faith? [SUP]3 [/SUP]Are you so foolish? Having begun in the Spirit, are you now being made perfect by the flesh? [SUP]4 [/SUP]Have you suffered so many things in vain—if indeed it was in vain?
[SUP]5 [/SUP]Therefore He who supplies the Spirit to you and works miracles among you, does He do it by the works of the law, or by the hearing of faith?— [SUP]6 [/SUP]just as Abraham “believed God, and it was accounted to him for righteousness.” [SUP]7 [/SUP]Therefore know that only those who are of faith are sons of Abraham. [SUP]8 [/SUP]And the Scripture, foreseeing that God would justify the Gentiles by faith, preached the gospel to Abraham beforehand, saying, “In you all the nations shall be blessed.” [SUP]9 [/SUP]So then those who are of faith are blessed with believing Abraham.
Tan I hope you are listening along with all of you that are caught under the Law and trying to be righteous under it. Paul is very clear to the people and yes it is clear that by belief that very day and through belief one does repent and want to change their ways and unfortunately try to do it under the Law and be righteous before God and never ever can by the Law
That is why he said to the Galatians oh foolish Galatians who has bewitched you? Now If Paul was present here today he would say to you Oh foolish Tan, Cobus, and anyone else saying you do not receive the Spirit at belief, you must become a doer of the law first perfect before you can be born again.
AT Pentecost they did not get cleaned up and walk perfect before belief or the Holy Ghost did not wait to live in them after belief waiting for them to go and be perfect of the Law, before entering them. The Holy Ghost came upon them as they believed and comes upon anyone who actually believes that instant and then the good work starts in them to become as Jesus was here on earth in total dependancy on Father, doing whatever the will is of the Father it is a growing in grace process, and one is made perfect from Father's vantage point that very first day of belief because of Jesus taking away the sin of the world for you. This is not received until you believe then one moves on into the new life dead to sin and alive to God forever more my brothers and sisters in Christ.
Praying for you and all others deceived by the curse of the Law that when it flows through the flesh it kills that person for they cannot ever be perfect in and of the Law even though the Law is Just, Holy perfect anf correct.
Love you all
Homwardbound
E
No my friend, Your the one blinded by Pride. You still can't admit what your church did for hundreds of years. and the damage it did.. And they excuse which could not be used, and would be made invalid if they did not do that.
You don't think I have studied works and deeds?
I do not even need to study the bible. I can just study reality
If your trying to earn a payment (salary) reward, or prize.. Your works are for your own benefit, And glorify only you, because you are payed (if all things are equal) for the work you did.
Salvation is a gift. It is given by Gods mercy. It is not a reward, it is not a payment for working hard, or non payment for not working hard enough. And is given by grace (unearned). It was payed for by God himself, His son on the cross. Thus HE gets all the credit.
So which Gospel is right? the one which stated we can not know if we are saved until after we die, and our salvation is dependent on how hard we worked for God hear on earth, and how hard we worked to stop sin? (in other workds Salvation is a reward, a salary or a prize)
Or is it like God said, done by faith, Given as a gift, unearned merit (Grace)
we have not even spoken of what happens after a person is saved, we can;t because you can't get part down right!
Let me give you a start:
You defend something that has been proved time and time again it is a rule of men. If I was to post here every single place we are told to work, It will be too long. I will only post a few you search the rest.
Galatians 5:6 For in Christ Jesus neither circumcision nor uncircumcision counts for anything; the only thing that counts is faith working through love.
Ephesians 4: 12 to equip the saints for the work of ministry, for building up the body of Christ
16 from whom the whole body, joined and knit together by every ligament with which it is equipped, as each part is working properly, promotes the body’s growth in building itself up in love.
James 2
Faith without Works Is Dead
14 What good is it, my brothers and sisters, if you say you have faith but do not have works? Can faith save you? 15 If a brother or sister is naked and lacks daily food, 16 and one of you says to them, “Go in peace; keep warm and eat your fill,” and yet you do not supply their bodily needs, what is the good of that? 17 So faith by itself, if it has no works, is dead.18 But someone will say, “You have faith and I have works.” Show me your faith apart from your works, and I by my works will show you my faith. 19 You believe that God is one; you do well. Even the demons believe—and shudder. 20 Do you want to be shown, you senseless person, that faith apart from works is barren?21 Was not our ancestor Abraham justified by works when he offered his son Isaac on the altar? 22 You see that faith was active along with his works, and faith was brought to completion by the works. 23 Thus the scripture was fulfilled that says, “Abraham believed God, and it was reckoned to him as righteousness,” and he was called the friend of God. 24 You see that a person is justified by worksand not by faith alone. 25 Likewise, was not Rahab the prostitute also justified by works when she welcomed the messengers and sent them out by another road? 26 For just as the body without the spirit is dead, so faith without works is also dead.
How much work? It is never enough, Jesus gave his life. I already explained to you Catholics know we can not be saved with ought grace, for grace also saves us.
You defend something that has been proved time and time again it is a rule of men. If I was to post here every single place we are told to work, It will be too long. I will only post a few you search the rest.
Galatians 5:6 For in Christ Jesus neither circumcision nor uncircumcision counts for anything; the only thing that counts is faith working through love.
Ephesians 4: 12 to equip the saints for the work of ministry, for building up the body of Christ
16 from whom the whole body, joined and knit together by every ligament with which it is equipped, as each part is working properly, promotes the body’s growth in building itself up in love.
James 2
Faith without Works Is Dead
14 What good is it, my brothers and sisters, if you say you have faith but do not have works? Can faith save you? 15 If a brother or sister is naked and lacks daily food, 16 and one of you says to them, “Go in peace; keep warm and eat your fill,” and yet you do not supply their bodily needs, what is the good of that? 17 So faith by itself, if it has no works, is dead.18 But someone will say, “You have faith and I have works.” Show me your faith apart from your works, and I by my works will show you my faith. 19 You believe that God is one; you do well. Even the demons believe—and shudder. 20 Do you want to be shown, you senseless person, that faith apart from works is barren?21 Was not our ancestor Abraham justified by works when he offered his son Isaac on the altar? 22 You see that faith was active along with his works, and faith was brought to completion by the works. 23 Thus the scripture was fulfilled that says, “Abraham believed God, and it was reckoned to him as righteousness,” and he was called the friend of God. 24 You see that a person is justified by worksand not by faith alone. 25 Likewise, was not Rahab the prostitute also justified by works when she welcomed the messengers and sent them out by another road? 26 For just as the body without the spirit is dead, so faith without works is also dead.
How much work? It is never enough, Jesus gave his life. I already explained to you Catholics know we can not be saved with ought grace, for grace also saves us.
You are wrong EG. There wouldn't be these warnings against backsliding if it couldn't happen, neither would the words backslide and apostasy exist. As I have said before you cannot depart from the faith if you are not one of the faithful. And if a righteous man turns from his righteousness and turns to evil, he will die for it.”
1 Timothy 4:1 Now the Spirit expressly says that in later times some will depart from the faith by devoting themselves to deceitful spirits and teachings of demons,
1 Timothy 1:19 Holding faith and a good conscience. By rejecting this, some have made shipwreck of their faith,
2 Peter 2:15 Forsaking the right way, they have gone astray. They have followed the way of Balaam,
2 Peter 2:20 If they have escaped the corruption of the world by knowing our Lord and Saviour Jesus Christ and are again entangled in it and overcome, they are worse off at the end than they were at the beginning.
2 Peter 2:21 It would have been better for them not to have known the way of righteousness, than to have known it and then to turn their backs on the sacred command that was passed on to them.
2 Timothy 4:3-4 For the time is coming when people will not endure sound teaching, but having itching ears they will accumulate for themselves teachers to suit their own passions, and will turn away from listening to the truth and wander off into myths.
Ezekiel 33:18 “If a righteous man turns from his righteousness and does evil, he will die for it.”
Galations 5:4-7 You are severed from Christ, you who would be justified by the law; you have fallen away from grace. For through the Spirit, by faith, we ourselves eagerly wait for the hope of righteousness. For in Christ Jesus neither circumcision nor uncircumcision counts for anything, but only faith working through love. You were running well. Who hindered you from obeying the truth?
Hebrews 6:4 “It is impossible for those who have once been enlightened, who have tasted the heavenly gift, who have shared in the Holy Spirit, who have tasted the goodness of the word of God and the powers of the coming age, if they fall away, to be brought back to repentance, because to their loss they are crucifying the Son of God all over again and subjecting him to public disgrace.”
Hebrews 10:26-29 For if we go on sinning deliberately after receiving the knowledge of the truth, there no longer remains a sacrifice for sins, but a fearful expectation of judgment, and a fury of fire that will consume the adversaries. Anyone who has set aside the law of Moses dies without mercy on the evidence of two or three witnesses. How much worse punishment, do you think, will be deserved by the one who has spurned the Son of God, and has profaned the blood of the covenant by which he was sanctified, and has outraged the Spirit of grace?
Hebrews 12:15-17 See to it that no one fails to obtain the grace of God; that no “root of bitterness” springs up and causes trouble, and by it many become defiled; that no one is sexually immoral or unholy like Esau, who sold his birthright for a single meal. For you know that afterward, when he desired to inherit the blessing, he was rejected, for he found no chance to repent, though he sought it with tears.
Hebrews 3:12-14,18 Take care, brothers, lest there be in any of you an evil, unbelieving heart, leading you to fall away from the living God. But exhort one another every day, as long as it is called “today,” that none of you may be hardened by the deceitfulness of sin. For we have come to share in Christ, if indeed we hold our original confidence firm to the end....And to whom did he swear that they would not enter his rest, but to those who were disobedient?
Luke 9:62 Jesus said to him, “No one who puts his hand to the plow and looks back is fit for the kingdom of God.”
Proverbs 21:16 “A man who strays from the path of understanding comes to rest in the company of the dead.”
Revelation 2:4 But I have this against you, that you have abandoned the love you had at first.
Revelation 2:5 Remember therefore from where you have fallen; repent, and do the works you did at first. If not, I will come to you and remove your lampstand from its place, unless you repent.
Romans 11:21-22 For if God did not spare the natural branches, neither will he spare you. Note then the kindness and the severity of God: severity toward those who have fallen, but God’s kindness to you, provided you continue in his kindness. Otherwise you too will be cut off.
1 Timothy 4:1 Now the Spirit expressly says that in later times some will depart from the faith by devoting themselves to deceitful spirits and teachings of demons,
1 Timothy 1:19 Holding faith and a good conscience. By rejecting this, some have made shipwreck of their faith,
2 Peter 2:15 Forsaking the right way, they have gone astray. They have followed the way of Balaam,
2 Peter 2:20 If they have escaped the corruption of the world by knowing our Lord and Saviour Jesus Christ and are again entangled in it and overcome, they are worse off at the end than they were at the beginning.
2 Peter 2:21 It would have been better for them not to have known the way of righteousness, than to have known it and then to turn their backs on the sacred command that was passed on to them.
2 Timothy 4:3-4 For the time is coming when people will not endure sound teaching, but having itching ears they will accumulate for themselves teachers to suit their own passions, and will turn away from listening to the truth and wander off into myths.
Ezekiel 33:18 “If a righteous man turns from his righteousness and does evil, he will die for it.”
Galations 5:4-7 You are severed from Christ, you who would be justified by the law; you have fallen away from grace. For through the Spirit, by faith, we ourselves eagerly wait for the hope of righteousness. For in Christ Jesus neither circumcision nor uncircumcision counts for anything, but only faith working through love. You were running well. Who hindered you from obeying the truth?
Hebrews 6:4 “It is impossible for those who have once been enlightened, who have tasted the heavenly gift, who have shared in the Holy Spirit, who have tasted the goodness of the word of God and the powers of the coming age, if they fall away, to be brought back to repentance, because to their loss they are crucifying the Son of God all over again and subjecting him to public disgrace.”
Hebrews 10:26-29 For if we go on sinning deliberately after receiving the knowledge of the truth, there no longer remains a sacrifice for sins, but a fearful expectation of judgment, and a fury of fire that will consume the adversaries. Anyone who has set aside the law of Moses dies without mercy on the evidence of two or three witnesses. How much worse punishment, do you think, will be deserved by the one who has spurned the Son of God, and has profaned the blood of the covenant by which he was sanctified, and has outraged the Spirit of grace?
Hebrews 12:15-17 See to it that no one fails to obtain the grace of God; that no “root of bitterness” springs up and causes trouble, and by it many become defiled; that no one is sexually immoral or unholy like Esau, who sold his birthright for a single meal. For you know that afterward, when he desired to inherit the blessing, he was rejected, for he found no chance to repent, though he sought it with tears.
Hebrews 3:12-14,18 Take care, brothers, lest there be in any of you an evil, unbelieving heart, leading you to fall away from the living God. But exhort one another every day, as long as it is called “today,” that none of you may be hardened by the deceitfulness of sin. For we have come to share in Christ, if indeed we hold our original confidence firm to the end....And to whom did he swear that they would not enter his rest, but to those who were disobedient?
Luke 9:62 Jesus said to him, “No one who puts his hand to the plow and looks back is fit for the kingdom of God.”
Proverbs 21:16 “A man who strays from the path of understanding comes to rest in the company of the dead.”
Revelation 2:4 But I have this against you, that you have abandoned the love you had at first.
Revelation 2:5 Remember therefore from where you have fallen; repent, and do the works you did at first. If not, I will come to you and remove your lampstand from its place, unless you repent.
Romans 11:21-22 For if God did not spare the natural branches, neither will he spare you. Note then the kindness and the severity of God: severity toward those who have fallen, but God’s kindness to you, provided you continue in his kindness. Otherwise you too will be cut off.
the peace that Jesus gives is the assurance of sins forgiven and the assurance of eternal life...The Comforter comforts.
since when are were called to not use the brains he gave us?
is that the head knowledge bludgeon?
me thinks it is....tsk.
can the skin that loves sensation say to the mind "i have no need of you"?
apparently.
since when are were called to not use the brains he gave us?
is that the head knowledge bludgeon?
me thinks it is....tsk.
can the skin that loves sensation say to the mind "i have no need of you"?
apparently.