Beast with Two Horns Like a Lamb

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Therapon

Guest
#42
#42
eternally-gratefull said:
You can't use this. Using it the way your trying to use it, No one should even listen to you, because no one could know.
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The Bible says what it says and I take it at face value, Daniel 12:9 "Go thy way, Daniel: for the words are closed up and sealed till the time of the end." Therefore, prophetic views imagined out of Daniel prior to "the time of the end" are in error. If you don't want to believe it, mark it out of your Bible, but it stays in mine.

Now EG, I'm finished. I hate being drawn into meaningless debates so I will discuss nothing more with you.
 
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Therapon

Guest
#43
#43
shrimp said:
Nevermind then. I have lost interest and will therefor bow out of this thread. Good day, gentlemen.
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I'm sorry I couldn't get around to you in time. <sigh>
 
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drjshow

Guest
#44
#44
For instance, it can now be proven that the beasts in Revelation, the Two Witnesses, the Seven Seals, and the Seven Trumpets are not events in our future! In fact, all have been fulfilled during the Christian era and we are just moments away from King Jesus appearing in the sky! There isn’t going to be a seven-year tribulation in our future and no waiting for a final Antichrist, either. Just ever increasing natural disasters and unrest among peoples, particularly around Israel and the rest of the Middle East, until the last trumpet sounds and we’re in the eternal kingdom of God. Difficult realities to accept, perhaps, but true all the same.

Therapon,

I am not asking out of disagreement, but genuine curiosity. The beasts, wintesses, et. al. When were all fulfilled? What events, people, etc? Thanks.
 
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Enow

Banned
#45
Dec 21, 2012
2,901
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#45
Therapon said:
[QUOTE=Enow;920280]What about the prophesy involving that dream of that statue in Danile 2nd chapter? How does that fit in? Doesn't that prophesy refers to more kingdoms than just the three that you mentioned? Isn't the going teaching of the general consensus in christian circles that the former Roman Empire will be the the rise of the NWO with those nations you have mentioned?
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1. Yes, there are four kingdoms in the Great Image, the last being the two legs of iron, universally accepted as Rome. However, after the fall of the Roman empire, the next power to take control in the Holy Land was Islam, the Leopard-Bear-Lion beast of Revelation 13, so I was focusing on them.

2. Yes, the general consesus among Christian eschatologists is that a New World Order under Antichrist will be the final government on the planet before Jesus returns. The events in the Holy Land of 1948 and 1967 opened prophetic Sctiptures in a new way so I no longer believe that popular scenario to be correct.
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Well.... if what you had believed to be correct before, and yet no longer, how do you know you are correct now?
For instance, it can now be proven that the beasts in Revelation, the Two Witnesses, the Seven Seals, and the Seven Trumpets are not events in our future! In fact, all have been fulfilled during the Christian era and we are just moments away from King Jesus appearing in the sky! There isn’t going to be a seven-year tribulation in our future and no waiting for a final Antichrist, either. Just ever increasing natural disasters and unrest among peoples, particularly around Israel and the rest of the Middle East, until the last trumpet sounds and we’re in the eternal kingdom of God. Difficult realities to accept, perhaps, but true all the same.
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If it can be proven so, I fail to see why you are having such oppositions. Obviously, it is not so easily proven as you would like it to be. That being, just because God has enabled you to see, doesn't mean others will see also.

I believe otherwise and what I believe is not in line with what most believers accept today and that is I believe that God will be judging His House first at the pre tribulational rapture event so that means believers not found abiding in Him will be left behind to face the coming great tribulation. That has not happened yet: the firstfruits of the resurrection nor are we going through the great tribulation now where His return will signal those that are Christ's at His coming... and certainly.. the milleniel reign of Christ wherein afterwards, Satan will be released from the pit to stage that last rebeelion for a small season before he is defeated by the King od kings for the last time... and then from those three harvests that makes up the whole of the kingdom of heaven, the Son of God will give it back to the Father.

1 Corinthians 15:[SUP]22 [/SUP]For as in Adam all die, even so in Christ shall all be made alive. [SUP]23 [/SUP]But every man in his own order: Christ the firstfruits; afterward they that are Christ's at his coming. [SUP]24 [/SUP]Then cometh the end, when he shall have delivered up the kingdom to God, even the Father; when he shall have put down all rule and all authority and power. [SUP]25 [/SUP]For he must reign, till he hath put all enemies under his feet. [SUP]26 [/SUP]The last enemy that shall be destroyed is death. [SUP]27 [/SUP]For he hath put all things under his feet. But when he saith all things are put under him, it is manifest that he is excepted, which did put all things under him. [SUP]28 [/SUP]And when all things shall be subdued unto him, then shall the Son also himself be subject unto him that put all things under him, that God may be all in all.

Matthew 13:[SUP]33 [/SUP]Another parable spake he unto them; The kingdom of heaven is like unto leaven, which a woman took, and hid in three measures of meal, till the whole was leavened.

There are three harvests that makes up the whole of the kingdom of heaven as I am led by Him to provide meat in due season for the believers to discern good and evil by to depart from iniquity with the help of the Good Shepherd in getting ready before the Bridegroom comes.

So there is cause to keep discerning in seeking the truth in prophesies.

1 Corinthians 13:[SUP]9 [/SUP]For we know in part, and we prophesy in part. [SUP]10 [/SUP]But when that which is perfect is come, then that which is in part shall be done away. [SUP]11 [/SUP]When I was a child, I spake as a child, I understood as a child, I thought as a child: but when I became a man, I put away childish things. [SUP]12 [/SUP]For now we see through a glass, darkly; but then face to face: now I know in part; but then shall I know even as also I am known. [SUP]13 [/SUP]And now abideth faith, hope, charity, these three; but the greatest of these is charity.
 
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eternally-gratefull

Guest
#46
#46
Therapon said:
The Bible says what it says and I take it at face value, Daniel 12:9 "Go thy way, Daniel: for the words are closed up and sealed till the time of the end." Therefore, prophetic views imagined out of Daniel prior to "the time of the end" are in error. If you don't want to believe it, mark it out of your Bible, but it stays in mine.

Now EG, I'm finished. I hate being drawn into meaningless debates so I will discuss nothing more with you.
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Typical..

You ignored half I said
You made comments which were not true
You refuse to acknowledge half I said and claim I did not say it

and now you say your done..

Thanks for proving you have no desire whatsoever to discuss this, Just push your own theories down peoples throats.

PS. Your own debate is meaningless and not founded on scripture.. SO why are you even trying to push it down everyone's throat?

If ya do not wish to discuss scripture why are you even here?
 
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cfultz3

Guest
#47
#47
Don'tcha just feel the brotherly love in here. Civility: the new four letter word.
 
shrimp

shrimp

Senior Member
#48
Aug 28, 2011
1,188
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#48
Therapon said:
I'm truly sorry, my dear, I'm a Bible teacher who hates debate. I don't ask people to come on a thread I began just to disagree with what I post. Got any suggestions?
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Maybe instead of debating or arguing or saying that the other is wrong, state as clearly as you can what you believe and your proof and then ask sincerely for the other person to do the same, without the intent of belittling that person or their belief. When they, hopefully, respond in kind, ask relevant questions that would cause someone to genuinely think and study and search and report their findings.
Of course, when I say "you" I don't mean just you Thereapon, but the general population of this site. Too often, I see people trying to rip others apart because they disagree with each other. It gets confusing and sends the wrong message. Nobody likes being disagreed with, but it happens. We can't control it but we can hope to change their minds through wisdom, knowledge, grace, and love.
 
shrimp

shrimp

Senior Member
#49
Aug 28, 2011
1,188
39
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#49
and prayer. First: that we are not the ones being misled. Second: that we can be tactful. And third: that they have an open heart.
 
shrimp

shrimp

Senior Member
#50
Aug 28, 2011
1,188
39
48
#50
I almost forgot that we need to pray that we be open to what He says as well, so prayer for an open ear for yourself first then for others.
 
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eternally-gratefull

Guest
#51
#51
shrimp said:
Maybe instead of debating or arguing or saying that the other is wrong, state as clearly as you can what you believe and your proof and then ask sincerely for the other person to do the same, without the intent of belittling that person or their belief. When they, hopefully, respond in kind, ask relevant questions that would cause someone to genuinely think and study and search and report their findings.
Of course, when I say "you" I don't mean just you Thereapon, but the general population of this site. Too often, I see people trying to rip others apart because they disagree with each other. It gets confusing and sends the wrong message. Nobody likes being disagreed with, but it happens. We can't control it but we can hope to change their minds through wisdom, knowledge, grace, and love.
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or maybe if our hearts are open. we can change our minds based on what is being said. and not be so stuck in our belief
 
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eternally-gratefull

Guest
#52
#52
cfultz3 said:
Don'tcha just feel the brotherly love in here. Civility: the new four letter word.
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lol.. I know I get nuts sometimes. But I get so sick of being told i did not say something, or be told I said something i did not say.
 
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cfultz3

Guest
#53
#53
eternally-gratefull said:
or maybe if our hearts are open. we can change our minds based on what is being said. and not be so stuck in our belief
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Never a truer statement there were, If I must say so. - quoted from someone I forgot who
 
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cfultz3

Guest
#54
#54
eternally-gratefull said:
lol.. I know I get nuts sometimes. But I get so sick of being told i did not say something, or be told I said something i did not say.
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Love ya brother. Know that feelling all so well, it is called assuming......I am getting a little taste of it myself in another thread.....
 
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eternally-gratefull

Guest
#55
#55
cfultz3 said:
Love ya brother. Know that feelling all so well, it is called assuming......I am getting a little taste of it myself in another thread.....
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lol. Most of it comes from indoctrination. People are told what someone believes, and they look for keywords, and say yep. I know exactly what they believe. In doing so, they do not even stop to look at what the person is saying.
 
shrimp

shrimp

Senior Member
#56
Aug 28, 2011
1,188
39
48
#56
eternally-gratefull said:
or maybe if our hearts are open. we can change our minds based on what is being said. and not be so stuck in our belief
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I find what you said here very interesting, considering that, the entire discussion with Therapon, you come across as being very "stuck in your belief."
What I meant when I posted about our hearts and ears needing to be open is that we need to be open to what God says, be it through the Bible or through another person or both. What a person says should not be so nearly as important as what God has to say.
 
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eternally-gratefull

Guest
#57
#57
shrimp said:
I find what you said here very interesting, considering that, the entire discussion with Therapon, you come across as being very "stuck in your belief."
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Now why would you say something like this?

I said I believe it was rome, and showed him why I believed it

he said I did not prove it. then when I confronted him on it. he did not counter or respond to anything I did.

I then showed him why I believed it by paraphrasing scripture

He again said I did not do it.

then some other stuff.

The big thing is I have spoken with this guy in another thread and on another topic.. I know how he does things.. Like how he does not wish to discuss anything, So I confronted him on things, showed why I did not believe, instead of showing me where I was wrong, he once again did what he always does.

Before you go making false accusations. you should get to know people.
What I meant when I posted about our hearts and ears needing to be open is that we need to be open to what God says, be it through the Bible or through another person or both. What a person says should not be so nearly as important as what God has to say.
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And I greed with you. so again, what is your point?
 
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peterT

Guest
#58
#58
Therapon said:
So Islam is the Leopard-Bear-Lion beast of Revelation 13. But in the middle of the Islamic control of the Holy Land, a new and different kind of beast appears on the scene . . .

?
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Where does it say that Islam is the beast?

You see some devils up a tree and you say it’s the beast it’s the beast.

You’re barking up the wrong tree.

2 Corinthians 11:14And no marvel; for Satan himself is transformed into an angel of light.

15 Therefore it is no great thing if his ministers also be transformed as the ministers of righteousness; whose end shall be according to their works.


Satan himself is transformed into an angel of light.jpg

http://christianchat.com/album.php?albumid=6315&attachmentid=40887
 
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Therapon

Guest
#59
#59
Enow said:
Well.... if what you had believed to be correct before, and yet no longer, how do you know you are correct now?
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Because it can now be proven from both Scripture and history. Tell you what, go to ellisskolfield.com and download the Bible prophecy Study Guide. It's free. If you can disprove its major tenets from Scripture or history, I'll start a thread on here, title it "I REPENT," and openly admit my error, in sackcloth and ashes if you like, even send you a picture of my doing doing so. If you can't, you in all fairness, must admit that you guys are as eschatologically blind as bats (no additional grovelling, hand-wringing or scourging yourselves as a public penance for making my life miserable, necessary), LOL
 
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cfultz3

Guest
#60
#60
Therapon said:
Because it can now be proven from both Scripture and history. Tell you what, go to ellisskolfield.com and download the Bible prophecy Study Guide. It's free. If you can disprove its major tenets from Scripture or history, I'll start a thread on here, title it "I REPENT," and openly admit my error, in sackcloth and ashes if you like, even send you a picture of my doing doing so. If you can't, you in all fairness, must admit that you guys are as eschatologically blind as bats (no additional grovelling, hand-wringing or scourging yourselves as a public penance for making my life miserable, necessary), LOL
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you are funny Mr. Therapon....cheers
 
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