What does "limited atonement" mean?

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A

Abiding

Guest
#181
#181
zone said:
Jesus said few there be that find it.
that means few.
God used the words election, and choosing.
i don't know why christians of all people who know the scriptures are offended by these things.
if they are...i don't know.

ttyl.
Click to expand...

isnt few that find it in the context of the wide and the narrow road? "they" choose to walk on
 
L

loveme1

Senior Member
#182
Oct 30, 2011
8,137
216
63
#182
Abiding said:
Think how much the church is divided over philosophically driven doctrines.
Your right there is alot we dont know....thats why we live by faith.
We are not told to come up with answers where the bibles silent

We are on a need to know basis. And alot of stuff we dont need to know.

Abraham pack up and go over there......maybe ill tell you when you get there.
Kill your son.....do we really think we are supposed to know everything?
Its counter/faith and without faith its impossible to please God...right?

I think heaven will be cool...because i have a hunch the thoughts we have now
that bug us out we are going to find out He made them into the coolest things.
Click to expand...
You know i often have to google words and terms...... just to get a little insight :)

The line i draw is when i have to read others books to be on the same page of beliefs.
 
zone

zone

Senior Member
#183
Jun 13, 2010
27,214
164
63
#183
Abiding said:
isnt few that find it in the context of the wide and the narrow road? "they" choose to walk on
Click to expand...
sure, if you like. my post to Chris was about ....oh...n.m.
 
A

Abiding

Guest
#184
#184
1still_waters said:
even when we were dead in our trespasses, made us alive together with Christ

For by grace you have been saved through faith. And this is not your own doing;

He made us alive.
It is by his grace.
It is not of our doing.

This is why i have absolute peace, and I'm fine with sovereignty even if the ramifications get the dander up on the "fleshly" parts of my mind that may find offense that God is actually sovereign in his own universe.
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God would be just as Sovereign whether He elected those that received and believed the gospel
as He would be zapping folk

He is and has made the plan of redemption His way...the way it pleased Him.
Even trying to help hold up the ark from falling was a death penalty..that much.
Limited atonement to me comes from the fleshy mind. I can bring up posts to prove it.:p
 
crossnote

crossnote

Senior Member
#185
Nov 24, 2012
30,742
3,670
113
#185
Sages through the ages ...
And we'll solve this in so many pages.
 
A

Abiding

Guest
#186
#186
Why do people think Gods glory is so fragil that to let men decide their fate
would shatter it.
 
zone

zone

Senior Member
#190
Jun 13, 2010
27,214
164
63
#190
a-a-a-a-anyways.....off to listen to a Lutheran podcast. *love it*

this thread is just all about calvinism when it didn't need to be.
maybe tomorrow:confused:
 
T

tdrew777

Guest
#191
#191
If God judges men (elects some, does not elect others) in eternity future, everyone sees that men have a choice in history.

But if God judges men (elects some, does not elect others) in eternity past, that is seen by many to remove human choice from the table.

Yet are not "past' and "future" temporal markers? They denote linear, sequential order (one dimensional). When we step into eternity we are not limited to a sequential time line. What do "past" and "future" mean? What is done anywhere in eternity is done once and for all - i.e. for all time. Eternal sequencing is not necessarily linear.

That is the background for this question: Does scripture distinguish eternity past and eternity future? If so, what does the distinction mean? If not, how does God choosing the elect from eternity limit free choice in history?
 
1

1still_waters

Guest
#193
#193
Abiding said:
God would be just as Sovereign whether He elected those that received and believed the gospel
as He would be zapping folk

He is and has made the plan of redemption His way...the way it pleased Him.
Even trying to help hold up the ark from falling was a death penalty..that much.
Limited atonement to me comes from the fleshy mind. I can bring up posts to prove it.:p
Click to expand...
You believe in limited atonement dude.


I mean you do believe his atonement is limited to those who are in Jesus?
If one isn't in Jesus it doesn't cover ya..right?
 
T

tdrew777

Guest
#194
#194
Tired of being ignored, so I bought, "Eternal God: A study of God Without Time" by Paul Helm. Its on my kindle now. Bye, thread!
 
A

Abiding

Guest
#195
#195
zone said:
a-a-a-a-anyways.....off to listen to a Lutheran podcast. *love it*

this thread is just all about calvinism when it didn't need to be.
maybe tomorrow:confused:
Click to expand...
cya:) tomorrow
 
A

Abiding

Guest
#196
#196
1still_waters said:
You believe in limited atonement dude.


I mean you do believe his atonement is limited to those who are in Jesus?
If one isn't in Jesus it doesn't cover ya..right?
Click to expand...
Exactly everything concerning the elect the chosen etc are in context with "in Christ"
So atonement you could say is limited to those "In Christ"
 
A

Abiding

Guest
#197
#197
tdrew777 said:
If God judges men (elects some, does not elect others) in eternity future, everyone sees that men have a choice in history.

But if God judges men (elects some, does not elect others) in eternity past, that is seen by many to remove human choice from the table.

Yet are not "past' and "future" temporal markers? They denote linear, sequential order (one dimensional). When we step into eternity we are not limited to a sequential time line. What do "past" and "future" mean? What is done anywhere in eternity is done once and for all - i.e. for all time. Eternal sequencing is not necessarily linear.

That is the background for this question: Does scripture distinguish eternity past and eternity future? If so, what does the distinction mean? If not, how does God choosing the elect from eternity limit free choice in history?
Click to expand...

Time is cool and it takes time to think about a God who created it and isnt in it.
I think that it helps understand How the elect were the ones who assented to the work
of God in their lives.

If they didnt have to spin a yarn and take so much scripture out of context to make
themselves a pleasing answer id like that better.

I mean we are told that the Lamb was slain from before the foundations of the world.
If they could wrap their mind around that I think they could understand election better.
especially when its mostly used with the context of "In Christ" or "In the beloved" etc
 
P

psychomom

Guest
#198
#198
I'm wondering...does this idea boil right down to the difference between those who believe in monergism and those who believe in synergism?

If you believe that all of salvation and sanctification is God's work, it seems you believe in a limited atonement...i.e that the atonement is limited to those whom God chooses.

If you believe you have some say in whether or not you are saved, and/or believe you have some say in whether or not you remain in Christ, you would tend to believe that man decides these things.

And yes, Chris, that was I who said 'few', yet not I--the Lord Jesus said it. :)

Is it simply that we cannot comprehend, in human terms, our God? :rolleyes:

I love you guys. ♥
 
C

cfultz3

Guest
#199
#199
psychomom said:


Is it simply that we cannot comprehend, in human terms, our God? :rolleyes:

I love you guys. ♥
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Absolutely. God is beyond comprehension. Even in eternity, we will have just begun to even understand "why?". We should all praise God that He chose us to be His elect through His Son's work which brought about God's salvation. Can you imagine if that election was still through the Law, as it was for the Hebrews? I could not imagine having to find justification in the Law, just happy that now those in Jesus' faith are the elect, God's chosen people.
 
A

Abiding

Guest
#200
#200
psychomom said:
I'm wondering...does this idea boil right down to the difference between those who believe in monergism and those who believe in synergism?

If you believe that all of salvation and sanctification is God's work, it seems you believe in a limited atonement...i.e that the atonement is limited to those whom God chooses.

If you believe you have some say in whether or not you are saved, and/or believe you have some say in whether or not you remain in Christ, you would tend to believe that man decides these things.

And yes, Chris, that was I who said 'few', yet not I--the Lord Jesus said it. :)

Is it simply that we cannot comprehend, in human terms, our God? :rolleyes:

I love you guys. ♥
Click to expand...
I consider myself a synergist. And yes that means i believe i assented to the gospel.(scripture commands that)
After im saved i believe we work together with God. Co laborers

1 Cor 3:9 For we are labourers together with God: ye are God's husbandry, ye are God's building.
2 Cor 6:1 We then, as workers together with him, beseech you also that you receive not the grace of God in vain.

synergy doesnt mean i can save myself or keep myself. but the job is synergistic. which simply means
we work together.

the cliche:
without Him we cant
without us He wont.

I have tons of saved up writing on monergism and synergism.
But i believe there couldnt be a saved but as of by fire when our works are reviewed
if God alone did our sanctifying. John 15 i think and 2 Peter 1:1-11 bring that out.
 
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