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Fromdomlove
Guest
Hello brothers, this is my first reply. I cant understand how some christians behave like Adventist or Jewish in the sense of being under the letter's law. First at all, im not saying we should break the law, but we must live by faith. If you think you can obey all laws in the bible, be sure you must obey all. There is another way and this way is not impossible because that's why Jesús came, he came to save us from sin and eternal death. how can we be saved ? And how jesus answered " it's impossible for men" but thanks God he says " but Everything is possible for God". If you think that for your strength wiil be saved, remember for human is impossible, but if you really wants to be saved let God works in you, let his holy spirit guides you.
The theme of your last few posts seems to be that we need not walk in the letter of the law because we now walk in the spirit of the law. According to the scriptures Jesus did not do away with thelaw but made the law greater. He magnified the law to a spiritual level. Hemade the 10 commandments even harder to keep.
2 COR. 3 [6] WHO ALSO HATH MADE US ABLE MINISTERS OF THE NEWTESTAMENT; NOT OF THE LETTER, BUT OF THE SPIRIT: FOR THE LETTER KILLETH, BUTTHE SPIRIT GIVETH LIFE. [7] But if the ministration of death, written andengraven in stones, was glorious, so that the children of Israel could notstedfastly behold the face of Moses for the glory of his countenance; whichglory was to be done away: [8] How shall not the ministration of the spirit berather glorious?
ROMANS 7 [6] But now we are DELIVERED FROM THE LAW, thatbeing dead wherein we were held; that we should SERVE IN NEWNESS OF SPIRIT, ANDNOT IN THE OLDNESS OF THE LETTER.
As we can see in above scriptures we are now to walk in thespirit of the law. If we walk only in the letter of the law this will lead todeath, but if we walk in the spirit of the law this leads to life.
MATTHEW 5 [20] For I say unto you, That except yourrighteousness shall exceed the righteousness of the scribes and Pharisees, yeshall in no case enter into the kingdom of heaven. [21] Ye have heard that itwas said by them of old time, THOU SHALT NOT KILL; and whosoever shall killshall be in danger of the judgment: [22] BUT I SAY UNTO YOU, THAT WHOSOEVER ISANGRY WITH HIS BROTHER WITHOUT A CAUSE SHALL BE IN DANGER OF THE JUDGMENT: andwhosoever shall say to his brother, Raca, shall be in danger of the council:but whosoever shall say, Thou fool, shall be in danger of hell fire.
OLD LETTER- Thou shalt not kill
NEW SPIRIT- Don’t even get angry. Call no man a fool. Loveone another in thought, word and deed.
MATTHEW 5 [27] Ye have heard that it was said by them of oldtime, thou shalt not commit adultery: [28] But i say unto you, that WHOSOEVERLOOKETH ON A WOMAN TO LUST AFTER HER HATH COMMITTED ADULTERY with her alreadyin his heart.
OLD LETTER- Thou shalt not commit adultery
NEW SPIRIT- Do not look on a woman to lust. Keep the law inour mind and spirit. Even in our eyes.
So you can see that Jesus did not do away with the letter ofthe law. Common sense will tell ya in order to walk in the spirit of the lawyou must also be walking in the letter. Jesus made the commandments even harderto keep and more honorable.
ISAIAH 42 [20] Seeing many things, but thou observest not;opening the ears, but he heareth not.[21] The LORD is well pleased for hisrighteousness' sake; HE WILL MAGNIFY THE LAW, and make it honourable.
Yes, Jesus magnified the law. He took the letter of the law(which leads to death) and magnified the law to a spiritual level (which leadsto life).
ROMANS 7 [14] For we know that THE LAW IS SPIRITUAL: but I am carnal, sold under sin.
In Romans 7 we see that the law is spiritual
ROMANS 15 [25] But now I go unto Jerusalem to ministerunto the saints.[26] For it hath pleased them of Macedonia and Achaia to make acertain contribution for the poor saints which are at Jerusalem.[27] It hath pleased them verily; and their debtors they are. FOR IF THE GENTILES HAVE BEEN MADE PARTAKERS OF THEIR SPIRITUAL THINGS, their duty is also to minister untothem in carnal things.
The gentiles have been made partakers of Gods law.
JOHN 4 [23] But the hour cometh, and now is, when the true worshippers shall worship the Father in spirit and in truth: for the Father seeketh such to worship him. [24] GOD IS A SPIRIT: AND THEY THAT WORSHIP HIM MUST WORSHIP HIM IN SPIRIT AND IN TRUTH.
True worshipers will worship in SPIRIT AND TRUTH
JOHN 14 [15] IF YE LOVE ME, KEEP MY COMMANDMENTS. [16] AND I WILL PRAY THE FATHER, AND HE SHALL GIVE YOU ANOTHER COMFORTER, that he may abide with you for ever; [17] EVEN THE SPIRIT OF TRUTH;
How are we to recieve this Spirit of truth? Keeping Gods 10 commandments
Many folks here are telling believers that because they are so familiar with the deeper things, those too profound things for normal mortals that choosing to obey the Ten Commandments is contrary to Jesus Christ, Who, incidentally, observed the Sabbath and taught the manner we may also observe it.
These same folks insist we follow how they interpret Paul because they are well in touch with the most profound learnings, yet Paul teaches as long as we observe a day or not observe a day with a clear conscience towards God there is no sin.
These are the same who will tell you suicide is unforgiveable or a very bad sin because we are not supposed to kill, this is a law within the commandments, and we should not kill, but are not these knowledgeable folks a bit confused here?.
If a person says he follows the Ten Commandments because it is a pleasure, these same super gifted folks say they must follow all of the law if they obey the commandments, not even beginning to understand the laws that fall within the two great laws of love will will never be out of the realm of following while there is an earth, moon and sun.
People who are gifted from above love Jesus so much, they will do all they can to please Him, knowing they will stumble now and then, but also know the Lord, God, Himself will be there to pick us up and forgive us.
To all those who understand those profundities they pass on as new laws not even from God, cease this practice and stop judging another man's servant. If you have a clear conscience toward the Father, good, do not destroy what God has built elsewhere, not that it could be done.
These same folks insist we follow how they interpret Paul because they are well in touch with the most profound learnings, yet Paul teaches as long as we observe a day or not observe a day with a clear conscience towards God there is no sin.
These are the same who will tell you suicide is unforgiveable or a very bad sin because we are not supposed to kill, this is a law within the commandments, and we should not kill, but are not these knowledgeable folks a bit confused here?.
If a person says he follows the Ten Commandments because it is a pleasure, these same super gifted folks say they must follow all of the law if they obey the commandments, not even beginning to understand the laws that fall within the two great laws of love will will never be out of the realm of following while there is an earth, moon and sun.
People who are gifted from above love Jesus so much, they will do all they can to please Him, knowing they will stumble now and then, but also know the Lord, God, Himself will be there to pick us up and forgive us.
To all those who understand those profundities they pass on as new laws not even from God, cease this practice and stop judging another man's servant. If you have a clear conscience toward the Father, good, do not destroy what God has built elsewhere, not that it could be done.
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hermanodaniel
Guest
I am glad you follow that way of thinking because the Sabbath is no different we must see that now in the same lense which is spiritual hence why it's eternal and the letter is based on a physical rest bound by the 7th day. The The true rest of God is out of time.
The Spirit of God has paved the way for us to understand that which is truly spiritual to begin with and not physical or of the letter. You are right in saying that the Law of God hasn't been abolished for the Law continues to lead people to Christ to this day but now those born of God have died to it which is a huge difference and we are not under it anymore but that is in respect to the letter! We have died to the law that we may belong to Christ and follow after His commands the Law of Christ which fulfill the Law of God. God's entire Word is deep and profound! We are now revealed that adultery committed in the heart is the same as the physical act, thoughts of stealing as stealing in itself, thoughts of coveting as coveting in itself, offering lip service is taking God's name in vain, having anything before God in our hearts which is idolatry is the same as the physical act that can be observed literally, hating our brothers is the same as murder etc. The Sabbath is no different it has always pointed to a more glorious rest we would have in Christ, in fact, even from the beginning (Genesis 1) it has done this! All these profound truths were revealed by Christ through the Spirit of God comparing spiritual things with spiritual things. Obedience is of the heart Romans 6:17 we are circumcised inwardly not outwardly which is of the letter Romans 2:29.
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hermanodaniel
Guest
WRONG, the commands Christ refer to was His John 13:34-35 Context is key. Please go back and reread what I posted previously this is the common mistake made by many. John defined what those commands here and here John 6:28-29 John 13:34-35 and 1 John 3:23 shows exactly that.
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hermanodaniel
Guest
Jaume, my whole point is this thread along with others just like it are trying to revert and yoke believers to the bondage of fear and death if they do not obey the entire law which is not the Gospel. If you or any other wants to observe the physical Sabbath praise God because what you do for God is accepted by faith. But when these observances are imposed on others it is no longer the Gospel but a counterfeit similar to what happen to the Galatians and the Gentile believers in Acts 15. The truth of God will always make our flesh feel uncomfortable and rightly so because it judges our attitudes hence why we must continually mortify it with the truth of God's Word which is spirit and life.
Now the theme seems to be we need not keep the 10 commandments but we are to love one another
1 JOHN 3 [23] And this is his commandment, That we should believe on the name of his Son Jesus Christ, and love one another, as he gave us commandment. [24] And he that keepeth his commandments dwelleth in him, and he in him. And hereby we know that he abideth in us, by the Spirit which he hath given us.
Your tryin to tell me we need not keep Gods 10 commandments because we are givin new testament commandments that we are now to follow. In1John3 we find one of those new testament commandments. It tells us we are to love one another. Does the new testament tell us how we are to love one another?
1JOHN 5 [2] By this WE KNOW THAT WE LOVE THE CHILDREN OFGOD, when we love God, and keep his commandments. [3] For THIS IS THE LOVE OF GOD, THAT WE KEEP HIS COMMANDMENTS: and his commandments are not grievous.
2JOHN1 [5] And now I beseech thee, lady, not as though I wrote a new commandment unto thee, but that which we had from the beginning, that WE LOVE ONE ANOTHER.[6] And THIS IS LOVE,THAT WE WALK AFTER HIS COMMANDMENTS. This is the commandment, That, as ye have heard from the beginning, ye should walk in it.
JAMES 2 [8] If ye fulfil the royal law according to thescripture, THOU SHALT LOVE THY NEIGHBOUR AS THYSELF, ye do well: [9] But if yehave respect to persons, ye commit sin, and are convinced of the law as transgressors.[10] For whosoever shall keep the whole law, and yet offend in one point, he is guilty of all.[11] For he that said, DO NOT COMMIT ADULTERY,said also, DO NOT KILL. Now if thou commit no adultery, yet if thou kill, thou art become a transgressor of the law.
ROMANS 13 [8] Owe no man any thing, but to LOVE ONE ANOTHER:for he that loveth another hath fulfilled the law.[9] For this, Thou shalt not commit adultery, Thou shalt not kill, THOU SHALT NOT STEAL, Thou shalt not bearfalse witness, THOU SHALT NOT COVET; and if there be any other commandment, itis briefly comprehended in this saying, namely, Thou shalt love thy neighbour as thyself.[10] Love worketh no ill to his neighbour: therefore love is thefulfilling of the law.
I decided to show the scripture of James 2 and Romans 13 which explain to us how we are to show our love for one another because im sure ill hear next that it is not the 10 commandments being mentioned. But as you can see in these scriptures, adultry killing, stealing, bearing false witness, covetness are mentioned. And i suppose i will hear you say that since the “keeping of the sabbath” is not mentioned or “thou shalt have no other gods before me" is not mentioned these commandments can be ignored. YIKES
JOHN 15 [8] Herein is my Father glorified, that ye bear much fruit; so shall ye be my disciples.[9] As the Father hath loved me, so have I loved you: continue ye in my love.[10] IF YE KEEP MY COMMANDMENTS, ye shall abidein my love; even as I HAVE KEPT MY FATHER'S COMMANDMENTS, AND ABIDE IN HIS LOVE.
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hermanodaniel
Guest
And what commands is John referring to? Christ's commands! Cf. John 15:10 we are to obey Christ's commands as He obeyed perfectly His Father's providing us the redemption we needed. Our flesh is condemned Romans 8:1-4 it is our spirits that is justified in Christ Romans 8:10 Hence why we do not serve after the letter because are flesh is condemned we can only serve sin (Romans 7:25) that means that what we want to do we cannot do in our flesh because it is dominated by the letter Corinthians 15:58. Wretched man am I who will save me from this body of death? I thank God through Jesus Christ our Lord. So then with the mind I myself serve the law of God; but with the flesh the law of sin.
This is bad, replying to my own post, but this needs be. The post is not to any one individual but to any and all who maintain such a stance. These folks are usually not at a loss for words, no, they are quite wordy. I ahve been close to this myself, and I must remind myself and all that in a multitude of words, sin is not lacking...paraphrased from the Proverbs.
First of all the bible does not call them commands but commandments. Are they Jesus's commanments? Yes. The 4th commandment was MADE for man. Who made ALL things? Is Jesus the same yesterday, today and forever? Yes.
PROVERBS 24 [19] Fretnot thyself because of evil men, neither be thou envious at the wicked;[20] Forthere shall be no reward to the evil man; THE CANDLE OF THE WICKED SHALL BE PUT OUT.[21] My son, fear thou the LORD and the king: and MEDDLE NOT WITH THEM THAT ARE GIVEN TO CHANGE:[22] For their calamity shall rise suddenly; and who knoweth the ruin of them both?
PSALM 89 [30] IF HIS CHILDREN FORSAKE MY LAW, and walk not in my judgments; [31] If they break my statutes, AND KEEP NOT MY COMMANDMENTS;[32] Then will I visit their transgression with the rod, and their iniquity with stripes. [33] Nevertheless my lovingkindness will I not utterly take from him, nor suffer my faithfulness to fail. [34] MY COVENANT WILL I NOT BREAK, NOR ALTER the thing that is gone out of my lips.
The "many" believe that Gods 4th commandment has been altered
ECCLES. 3 [14] I know that, WHATSOEVER GOD DOETH, IT SHALL BE FOR EVER: nothing can be put to it, nor any thing taken from it: and Godd oeth it, that men should fear before him. [15] That which hath been is now;and that which is to be hath already been; and God requireth that which is past.
MALACHI 3 [2] BUT WHO MAY ABIDE THE DAY OF HIS COMING? AND WHO SHALL STAND WHEN HE APPEARETH? for he is like a refiner's fire, and like fullers' soap:[3] And he shall sit as a refiner and purifer of silver: and he shall purify the sons of Levi, and purge them as gold and silver, that they may offer unto the LORD an offering in righteousness.[4] Then shall the offering of Judah and Jerusalem be pleasant unto the LORD, as in the days of old, and as in former years.[5] And I will come near to you to judgment; and I will be a swiftwitness against the sorcerers, and against the adulterers, and against falseswearers, and against those that oppress the hireling in his wages, the widow,and the fatherless, and that turn aside the stranger from his right, and fearnot me, saith the LORD of hosts.[6] FOR I AM THE LORD, I CHANGE NOT;
HEBREWS 13 [8] Jesus Christ the same yesterday, and to day, and for ever.
So why do many believe that their god is a wishy washy God.Changing continually.
Old testament – keep the sabbath
New testament – dont bother
1000 yr rest (in the Kingdom) – Gotta keep the sabbath again(scripture below)
ISAIAH 66 [22] For as the NEW HEAVENS AND THE NEW EARTH,which I will make, shall remain before me, saith the Lord, so shall your seed and your name remain. [23] And it shall come to pass, that from one new moon toanother, and FROM ONE SABBATH TO ANOTHER, shall ALL FLESH COME TO WORSHIP BEFORE ME, saith the Lord.
So has the sabbath been changed or altered? Many make that claim. But i gotta believe that Jesus is the same yesterday, today and forever
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Laodicea
Guest
This now is from the Strong's concordance for the meaning of rest.
G4520
σαββατισμός
sabbatismos
sab-bat-is-mos'
From a derivative of G4521; a “sabbatism”, that is, (figuratively) the repose of Christianity (as a type of heaven): - rest.
G4521
σάββατον
sabbaton
sab'-bat-on
Of Hebrew origin [H7676]; the Sabbath (that is, Shabbath), or day of weekly repose from secular avocations (also the observance or institution itself); by extension a se'nnight, that is, the interval between two Sabbaths; likewise the plural in all the above applications: - sabbath (day), week.
H7676
שׁבּת
shabbâth
shab-bawth'
Intensive from H7673; intermission, that is, (specifically) the Sabbath: - (+ every) sabbath.
It is clear from all this evidence that the 7th day sabbath remains.
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Laodicea
Guest
No one on here is teaching we are saved by our own works. Keeping the commandments is the fruit. If God is working in us will that include keeping His sabbath holy or breaking His sabbath? Remember the Bible says God is the same yesterday, today and for ever.
Hi Laodicia
I found that also
In Heb 4:9 the Greek word,"sabbatismos" (Strong’s number 4520) is translated "rest"instead of the correct translation of "Sabbath rest"."There remaineth therefore a rest to the people of God." Instead of"There remains therefore a Sabbath rest for the people ofGod."
Someones tryin to hide somethin
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hermanodaniel
Guest
Wall stated: "So why do many believe that their god is a wishy washy God.Changing continually."
Old testament – keep the sabbath
New testament – dont bother
It's more like OT stipulated a physical rest that really was spiritual but was veiled until Christ came.
New Testament is not LIKE THE PREVIOUS COVENANT because its a far more glorious covenant.
As for God changing He didn't His Word was always spirit and life but it was veiled because of sin until the the time of the Messiah. Hence the letter and the spirit.
Old testament – keep the sabbath
New testament – dont bother
It's more like OT stipulated a physical rest that really was spiritual but was veiled until Christ came.
New Testament is not LIKE THE PREVIOUS COVENANT because its a far more glorious covenant.
As for God changing He didn't His Word was always spirit and life but it was veiled because of sin until the the time of the Messiah. Hence the letter and the spirit.
JOHN 6 [28] Then said they unto him, What shall we do, that we might work the works of God? [29] Jesus answered and said unto them, THIS IS THE WORK OFGOD, that ye believe on him whom he hath sent.
No doubt. We must believe what He says
PSALM 119 [126] IT IS TIME FOR THEE, LORD, TO WORK: for they have made void thy law. [127] Therefore I love thy commandments above gold; yea, above fine gold. [128] Therefore I esteem all thy precepts concerning all things to be right; and I hate every false way
No doubt. We must believe what He says
ROMANS 9 [28] For HE WILL FINISH THE WORK, and cut it short in righteousness:because A SHORT WORK will the Lord make upon the earth.
Itll be quick