An atheist's testimony

[Timofree]

Don't worry about mentioning taking drugs on here. Sometimes the church rejects and condemns people that Jesus would have hung out with!

Indeed chemicals and drugs can produce that effect, and I'd say a counterfeit of the genuine. But once you've experienced God.......well after 8 years of getting drunk at least once a week, it's been over 3 years since I've done so now, since asking Jesus to save me. And the thought of getting drunk on the counterfeit is nauseous to me!

I was so scared of trying drugs most of my life, as I had bad asthma...........then I tried ketamine one night, a horse tranquilizer......and that certainly messed up my mind that night! I remember thinking I was in the 1920's..........anyway the next day I thought, forget that, if I'm gonna have to do drugs every time I want a good time, it might be an early grave for me! And I didn't realise that if I'd just come to God, I could experience true joy, without the hangover and death!

Following Jesus hasn't been all joy, but for me it's been intense and very exciting!

 

[HappyLuke]

Don't worry about mentioning taking drugs on here. Sometimes the church rejects and condemns people that Jesus would have hung out with!

Indeed chemicals and drugs can produce that effect, and I'd say a counterfeit of the genuine. But once you've experienced God.......well after 8 years of getting drunk at least once a week, it's been over 3 years since I've done so now, since asking Jesus to save me. And the thought of getting drunk on the counterfeit is nauseous to me!

I was so scared of trying drugs most of my life, as I had bad asthma...........then I tried ketamine one night, a horse tranquilizer......and that certainly messed up my mind that night! I remember thinking I was in the 1920's..........anyway the next day I thought, forget that, if I'm gonna have to do drugs every time I want a good time, it might be an early grave for me! And I didn't realise that if I'd just come to God, I could experience true joy, without the hangover and death!

Following Jesus hasn't been all joy, but for me it's been intense and very exciting!

Cool
So, you've kind of traded one addiction for another, healthier addiction
Do you think it's (even vaguely) possible that your Christianity-generated spiritual feelings are another counterfeit and not the genuine?

I heard a testimony of a man who lost his faith after a therapist taught him a confidence technique called the 'resource', you basically invent an imaginary friend who you connect lots of positive, strong, fatherly emotions to and summon it when you need help (like before an interview to relieve anxiety). This man reported it inducing the same feelings he had been calling the holy spirit his whole life, and could no longer believe those feelings were evidence of God.

This was very similar, using subconscious suggestion to induce an atheist scientist to have an intense emotional experience that she mistook for the mighty presence of God and converted on the spot.
How To Convert An Atheist! - YouTube

 

[HappyLuke]

I see. Well I will always be here if you want to ask me any questions. I wish you luck in your endeavors truly.

If you have any more questions about science or atheism, do throw them my way

 

[Timofree]

Cool
So, you've kind of traded one addiction for another, healthier addiction
Do you think it's (even vaguely) possible that your Christianity-generated spiritual feelings are another counterfeit and not the genuine?

I heard a testimony of a man who lost his faith after a therapist taught him a confidence technique called the 'resource', you basically invent an imaginary friend who you connect lots of positive, strong, fatherly emotions to and summon it when you need help (like before an interview to relieve anxiety). This man reported it inducing the same feelings he had been calling the holy spirit his whole life, and could no longer believe those feelings were evidence of God.

This was very similar, using subconscious suggestion to induce an atheist scientist to have an intense emotional experience that she mistook for the mighty presence of God and converted on the spot.
How To Convert An Atheist! - YouTube

I have no doubt God exists and lives inside of me, but if I and every Christian, when we died found out God was a lie.........wow what a ride it's been, I wouldn't want to change Jesus for anyone or thing!

I remember thinking when I was feeling the peace and joy of being (what God calls) baptised in the Holy Spirit. That wow, even though I can feel God, if God doesn't exist, I would quite happily live and if needs be die for Him!
And now I'm in Japan for 6 weeks, spending money I shouldn't naturally have (I haven't worked full time for almost 2 years), to tell people about Jesus!

When I eventually repented, which led to the experience of the baptism of the Spirit. I didn't expect anything to happen, I prayed and then just sat on my bed, and then all of a sudden I felt a wind come inside my mouth, and I felt so filled with peace and joy.......God is good

 

[Hungry]

HappyLuke, I've got some advice that might help you find some answers you are looking for. You said you like debate well how about you debate yourself. Any proof or science that anybody else brings to you you just dismiss. You probably trust yourself to be intelligent enough to offer a challenge. Nobody is going to convince you but you. Why don't you start with the many flaws in evolution, the fossil record and radioactive decay dating. There is a wealth of scientific proof against. As well search sites for creationism from scientific perspectives. If you want to examine science go to scientists unless you are afraid of being wrong. This is a chat Site. There are many scientists who are top of their fields who are Christians because of their education not in spite of it. Cant wait to hear what you discover. Please keep in touch.

 

[HappyLuke]

HappyLuke, I've got some advice that might help you find some answers you are looking for. You said you like debate well how about you debate yourself. Any proof or science that anybody else brings to you you just dismiss. You probably trust yourself to be intelligent enough to offer a challenge. Nobody is going to convince you but you. Why don't you start with the many flaws in evolution, the fossil record and radioactive decay dating. There is a wealth of scientific proof against. As well search sites for creationism from scientific perspectives. If you want to examine science go to scientists unless you are afraid of being wrong. This is a chat Site. There are many scientists who are top of their fields who are Christians because of their education not in spite of it. Cant wait to hear what you discover. Please keep in touch.

I'm sorry but you have been mislead by creationist sites sir
I'm intimately familiar with what creationist websites claim are flaws in evolution, the fossil record, and radioactive decay - and why the creationists are wrong.
Would you like to talk about it?
For example, you'll find they always list bad results from dating methods used in places where we understand they shouldn't be, like C-14 dating on marine life or fossils.

 

[HappyLuke]

You said you like debate well how about you debate yourself. Any proof or science that anybody else brings to you you just dismiss..

I'm not here to debate, I'm here to try and learn if God exists, and to socialize.
I don't dismiss any evidence anyone brings to me, I dismiss fallacious claims of evidence!
Are you saying something someone has said here in this thread is valid scientific evidence of God?

 

[HappyLuke]

And so far it's been great socializing, everyone except you has been really nice

 

[Samohito]

Thanks for the reply I'll honestly say I can't just take your word for that, I think it's impossible for you to know that we will never find scientifically valid evidence of God unless you are yourself omniscient. I just can't see how the existence of God can be 'not scientific', if the idea is that he manifests in reality in some way. The alternative you're suggesting seems to be that God intentionally hides himself, and has designed reality to look entirely natural, as if he doesn't exist. Science is just 'every method of investigating reality that has been demonstrated to work' to me. But you're totally right that I don't understand faith yet

I only can tell you that you will understand it if you already have faith in God. for sure ! God is not hiding, He is there for everyone who believe in HIM, and HE is there for you also, even though you never believe that HE is real. these are the same questions that i heard from most of my atheist friends. They always asked " Does God exist..? Can you prove it with some evidence ? How He is look like, how you can say He is God ? As human being, We will never understand without Faith. Once you have faith, Holy spirit will guide you to understand it. God is good to you, God is really exist, God is taking care of your whole life. I will never force people to understand it, cause I dont have an authorized on it. God is the only one who will change your mindset and make you understand. If I can to suggest, try to pray and ask direct to God whether He is exist or not ? Seek Him and let your heart and mind to be filled by Holy Spirit. I think you will understand and prove that God is real. He is not hiding.

 

[HappyLuke]

I only can tell you that you will understand it if you already have faith in God. for sure ! God is not hiding, He is there for everyone who believe in HIM, and HE is there for you also, even though you never believe that HE is real. these are the same questions that i heard from most of my atheist friends. They always asked " Does God exist..? Can you prove it with some evidence ? How He is look like, how you can say He is God ? As human being, We will never understand without Faith. Once you have faith, Holy spirit will guide you to understand it. God is good to you, God is really exist, God is taking care of your whole life. I will never force people to understand it, cause I dont have an authorized on it. God is the only one who will change your mindset and make you understand. If I can to suggest, try to pray and ask direct to God whether He is exist or not ? Seek Him and let your heart and mind to be filled by Holy Spirit. I think you will understand and prove that God is real. He is not hiding.

I often do try to reach out in prayer to be communicated by God, I've gotten nothing yet
But I'll keep trying and staying open to the possibility
He is hiding, from my current position. Perhaps he wont always be though (and you say he's not from you)

 

[Brighthouse]

LOl Dot!! And you can't shake His faith either!!! LOLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLL we would all be in a heep of trouble if that would happen!! LOL It is sometimes so difficult to see anyone as being perfect in everyway,we have never seen this from anyone in our lifetime!! LOL Never having a bad thought!! Never doing anything sinful in thought word or deed!!I mean really!! because this was indeed so hard to wrap my brain around this,God said let us start with my perfect love for you I have,from there he said my son,everything will fall into place! It has!Perfect love from a perfect God leads to the perfect way,and truth and yes life in him!( john 14:6) AMEN!!

 

[HappyLuke]

LOl Dot!! And you can't shake His faith either!!! LOLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLL we would all be in a heep of trouble if that would happen!! LOL It is sometimes so difficult to see anyone as being perfect in everyway,we have never seen this from anyone in our lifetime!! LOL Never having a bad thought!! Never doing anything sinful in thought word or deed!!I mean really!! because this was indeed so hard to wrap my brain around this,God said let us start with my perfect love for you I have,from there he said my son,everything will fall into place! It has!Perfect love from a perfect God leads to the perfect way,and truth and yes life in him!( john 14:6) AMEN!!

I love kindhearted people as if they are perfect, I don't mind that they have had a few jealous thoughts, that doesn't stop me loving people and make me think that they are inherently bad and deserve hell, I'm sort of all loving myself, like God

 

[leelee]

I apologise in advance as I haven't read through the entire thread I just wanted to share something.

I don't want to share my personal testimony as it wont help but I do want to tell you about when I made my decision. I felt God. He wanted me to put up my hand. I was shaking, my heart was racing and I was all sweaty but I was resisiting. Then the pastor said somthing along the lines of "this is the final call" and my hand shot up, I didn't want it to. I tried to get it down before he saw but I wasn't fast enough. That was 4 years ago.

Anyhow, I have a friend. She has a scientific mind but decided to come to church. During her first alter call I saw her react, I knew God had his hand on her but she did manage to resist. She didn't enjoy the feeling but kept coming back to church, she would make excuses to run out before alter call. This went on for some time until I reminded her that it was disturbing other worshippers so could she please just sit still. She stayed and again reacted but resisted. I asked her why she kept leaving and she said it was because of panic attacks and described the feeling. I told her my story and the week after she made a decision. The "panic attacks" stopped.

The point of my little tale is this: not everything can be rationalised. Don't make excuses for God.

 

[Dotann]

I love kindhearted people as if they are perfect, I don't mind that they have had a few jealous thoughts, that doesn't stop me loving people and make me think that they are inherently bad and deserve hell, I'm sort of all loving myself, like God

Happyluke, you just contradicted your self there didn't you? I mean, since you really don't believe God exist and then you said you are loving like him, (comparing yourself to him) then aren't you really comparing yourself in your own mind to nothing) ? Meaning you love like nothing? You cant have it both ways buddy, pleasing your own convictions on one hand and then trying to satisfy others likings on the other? Truth doesn't work like that.

Stay on one side of the fence!

Beside, Let me ask you... Have you ever had a car run for over 25 miles on 3 tires with the 4th tire on only 1 bolt that was held together on its last thread and the ta-rain was so windy and so many hills that it fell off in a persons hand? ...Have your gas gauge on your car run beyond complete empty before you started on the journey and knowing the Lord was taking you somewhere to help someone in the middle of the night, yet it never ran out, not even knowing why you where going, only to find it was to save someone from burning in their home from a house fire, and being able to get back home on the same tank of gas a total of over 20 miles? ...Have you ever had a truck fall on your husband and had over 30 men combined from the 911 dispatch and fire team as well as police dept, tell you there was no hope for survival trying to prepare you for the worse, then that at least there would be severe internal damage only to find the Dr so amazed that NOTHING was wrong and when i prayed for immediate help, there was a voice saying He was already here and help was there at my driveway ready to assist me who just happened to be the volunteer chief of the fire dept who never even got the call yet to come as his car just stopped there! ...
Have you ever been hospitalized for months and near death so many times due to pregnancy with a BP of 205/203 that when on the table and only 8 months went into shock and found yourself floating above the table and seen above all the attendants who were working on you and zoomed off to a bright light and found such a great love and talked with people and never wanted to leave, yet was told it was not your time and had to go, then found yourself back in your body, only to find out later you died? ...Have you ever knew something about someone as the Spirit tells you something to pray for and later on find out that it was true and there's no way you could have known the intricate details of that person path without it being a revealed through divine intervention... Have you ever prayed for a person you didn't know as been told to by the Holy Spirit and later find out that person found the Lord and is now serving Him? Have you ever prayed for a person who had inoperable terminal cancer with only months survival expectancy from specialist only to find that they have been healed and those same specialist claimed it to be a miracle and have spread the word throughout the whole hospital and there colleagues?

The List could go on and on as i told you,, I have had many experiences and this is over so many years i cant possibly tell you them all. I am 51 years old, and i have walked with the Lord since age 13. It all starts with faith and believing.

I don't need to hear about what you think of options. Your options are worthless to me. When you hear His voice, and are witness to these things, and have His presence within you, its unmistakable and there is no one, no power, no science, no human, nothing on earth or out of earth, under or over the earth that ever take that away. This is what standing on your faith means.

How can you know about such things, when you don't even know what you believe? You are trying to get me as well as others here to sway to other options, yet you don't yourself have anything to stand on yourself? What do you stand on this strong?

When you can stand on one faith this strong, then and only then i will listen to more of your options. I will not fall for them, but i will listen. But for you to say, "i am all loving like God" when you don't even believe in God is not standing on anything! For where the man goes the heart follows, and your mind clearly does not believe in God, and God is LOVE! He is the true unconditional love where all love stems from! This statement you made shows me you follow nothing!

 

[Powemm]

HappyLuke- your walking in a direction, THAT'S what matters..
picture yourself standing in the middle of a round room that has nothing but doors side by side on it's walls...
As you look at Each door there are
Two things... A sign above It, and a handle .. all the doors are the same color ...
The signs above these doors are each labeled with different things ... Both there is only "one" door that actually gives any of us access to God.. It's marked Jesus .. It's the only door that "God himself " not any other source," says" is the way to have direct access to Him... Now we can open all these other doors and believe someone else.. But those someone elses.. can't and will never be God directly... so let's say a person decides to do that and THEN opens all the other doors..
let's say the signs above them say
Science
metaphysics
Religion
art
music
Etc..

after we come to Believe God.. all these other avenues open up to what He is doing in and through them..
they are not to be discounted ... but putting them ahead of god is error...
our quest for God and knowing things of Him and about Him.. Is a very narrow door.. But it's actually the only Door "labeled jesus" that makes all the others open up by themselves..

going through other doors "first" leaves us blinded to seeing God in them ..We still experience a void and emptiness ..

I wish you the best of the best in your discoveries , walking it out, looking and seeking .. I hope you will share with us your discoveries and bless us with what your finding .. when we've walked through enough doors, not finding what we are really in search of ... we eventually come back to the door we should have walked through in the first place .. it will be a fun discovery for you ...

 

[AgeofKnowledge]

You are... just like the other account.

No, I've only got 1 account As if I'm trolling, read some of my posts, I'm interesting and polite

 

[Brighthouse]

Is our Brother luke coming around??? hehe Did he say what i saw???? I am sort of loving myself like who did he say??? LOL GOD!!!! Ah praise the Lord bro!! You just know i had to say something tothat one bro!! LOL

 

[HappyLuke]

I apologise in advance as I haven't read through the entire thread I just wanted to share something.

I don't want to share my personal testimony as it wont help but I do want to tell you about when I made my decision. I felt God. He wanted me to put up my hand. I was shaking, my heart was racing and I was all sweaty but I was resisiting. Then the pastor said somthing along the lines of "this is the final call" and my hand shot up, I didn't want it to. I tried to get it down before he saw but I wasn't fast enough. That was 4 years ago.

Anyhow, I have a friend. She has a scientific mind but decided to come to church. During her first alter call I saw her react, I knew God had his hand on her but she did manage to resist. She didn't enjoy the feeling but kept coming back to church, she would make excuses to run out before alter call. This went on for some time until I reminded her that it was disturbing other worshippers so could she please just sit still. She stayed and again reacted but resisted. I asked her why she kept leaving and she said it was because of panic attacks and described the feeling. I told her my story and the week after she made a decision. The "panic attacks" stopped.

The point of my little tale is this: not everything can be rationalised. Don't make excuses for God.

I really enjoyed your story But I don't think it proved your point, I think those sort of things are natural psychological events, since they happen in false religions and secular social situations too. People get stage fright People feel compelled to do things from social pressure, and subconsciously act to meet expectation Thinking an all powerful being is listening to your thoughts and watching you is about the most massive social pressure and expectational state of mind I could imagine! Exotic states of mind and involuntary acts are fascinating, but not proof of the supernatural Not lacking in rational explanations

 

[HappyLuke]

Happyluke, you just contradicted your self there didn't you? I mean, since you really don't believe God exist and then you said you are loving like him, (comparing yourself to him) then aren't you really comparing yourself in your own mind to nothing) ? Meaning you love like nothing? You cant have it both ways buddy, pleasing your own convictions on one hand and then trying to satisfy others likings on the other? Truth doesn't work like that.

Stay on one side of the fence!

Beside, Let me ask you... Have you ever had a car run for over 25 miles on 3 tires with the 4th tire on only 1 bolt that was held together on its last thread and the ta-rain was so windy and so many hills that it fell off in a persons hand? ...Have your gas gauge on your car run beyond complete empty before you started on the journey and knowing the Lord was taking you somewhere to help someone in the middle of the night, yet it never ran out, not even knowing why you where going, only to find it was to save someone from burning in their home from a house fire, and being able to get back home on the same tank of gas a total of over 20 miles? ...Have you ever had a truck fall on your husband and had over 30 men combined from the 911 dispatch and fire team as well as police dept, tell you there was no hope for survival trying to prepare you for the worse, then that at least there would be severe internal damage only to find the Dr so amazed that NOTHING was wrong and when i prayed for immediate help, there was a voice saying He was already here and help was there at my driveway ready to assist me who just happened to be the volunteer chief of the fire dept who never even got the call yet to come as his car just stopped there! ...
Have you ever been hospitalized for months and near death so many times due to pregnancy with a BP of 205/203 that when on the table and only 8 months went into shock and found yourself floating above the table and seen above all the attendants who were working on you and zoomed off to a bright light and found such a great love and talked with people and never wanted to leave, yet was told it was not your time and had to go, then found yourself back in your body, only to find out later you died? ...Have you ever knew something about someone as the Spirit tells you something to pray for and later on find out that it was true and there's no way you could have known the intricate details of that person path without it being a revealed through divine intervention... Have you ever prayed for a person you didn't know as been told to by the Holy Spirit and later find out that person found the Lord and is now serving Him? Have you ever prayed for a person who had inoperable terminal cancer with only months survival expectancy from specialist only to find that they have been healed and those same specialist claimed it to be a miracle and have spread the word throughout the whole hospital and there colleagues?

The List could go on and on as i told you,, I have had many experiences and this is over so many years i cant possibly tell you them all. I am 51 years old, and i have walked with the Lord since age 13. It all starts with faith and believing.

I don't need to hear about what you think of options. Your options are worthless to me. When you hear His voice, and are witness to these things, and have His presence within you, its unmistakable and there is no one, no power, no science, no human, nothing on earth or out of earth, under or over the earth that ever take that away. This is what standing on your faith means.

How can you know about such things, when you don't even know what you believe? You are trying to get me as well as others here to sway to other options, yet you don't yourself have anything to stand on yourself? What do you stand on this strong?

When you can stand on one faith this strong, then and only then i will listen to more of your options. I will not fall for them, but i will listen. But for you to say, "i am all loving like God" when you don't even believe in God is not standing on anything! For where the man goes the heart follows, and your mind clearly does not believe in God, and God is LOVE! He is the true unconditional love where all love stems from! This statement you made shows me you follow nothing!

>"Happyluke, you just contradicted your self there didn't you? I mean, since you really don't believe God exist and then you said you are loving like him"
--- I don't thiiiiiink so, you can use references to the character of fictional characters, like... "That guy is as nasty as Darth Vader!" "He's as kind as Buddha" etc.


>"How can you know about such things, when you don't even know what you believe?"
-- What do you mean? I'm perfectly aware of things I believe, by definition- that's everything I consider myself to have confirmed to a reasonable, believable level of certainty.

>"You are trying to get me as well as others here to sway to other options, yet you don't yourself have anything to stand on yourself? What do you stand on this strong?" +
"When you can stand on one faith this strong, then and only then i will listen to more of your options. I will not fall for them, but i will listen."
-- Well that will never work, if you only listen open mindedly to me if I believe something on faith instead of evidence- what I'm 'standing strong' on, where I'm coming from, is that faith is a bad thing and evidence is a necessity for belief! lol. (IF you also care if your beliefs are true).
Why is my position strong? Because I can demonstrate it
I can experimentally prove, as every scientific experiment and prediction in history has proved, that taking the evidence into account always improves your ability to make accurate models of reality, and holding conclusions based not on evidence or even in the face of the evidence to the contrary is as good as random guessing, is a reliable path away from truth.
Scepticism is proven necessary for truth by the fact that science works, faith has proven itself ineffective in every scientific test (and there have been many tests of prayer for hospital patients, it doesn't have any effect.)

 

[HappyLuke]

You are... just like the other account.

Can I check it out? what's the name?