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Lemme tell y'all something I can't find in the Hyp******e theology..... someone who can biblically explain how they can, or feel obliged to, grow up in their relationship.
Since after conversion:
- no more conviction - of sin leading to repentance, or of righteousness, the "positive" side of conviction, so never again will the christian feel bad for the sin they're committing, or know if they are sinning, or feel the urge to step up in maturity
- no more repentance of sin.
- All future sin forgiven automatically, so no conviction or repentance is necessary,
How then does one grow up? It's only the Holy Spirit's leading that we can realized we sinned or that we lack anything, only His leading that shows us the need by conviction to live righteously.
How then does a believer under Hyp******e get from point A to B? You cant say by hearing or reading the Word, for only the Holy Spirit can convict us to live righteously.
Sure, He could give knowledge & understanding, but what good is that when there's no will, no zeal, no drive to use it?
And why have zeal or drive at all to do better or more for God when "it's not about works", & you know you don't have to do anything else because you're future's already forgiven & your salvation is permanently secure?
Careful, now..... you can't say you can take this knowledge & wisdom & use it yourself..... that's self-righteousness.
So how does a Hyp******e believer grow at all? They do claim to be complete from day one of conversion..... so they don't need growth?
I've found no one able to tell me how they can.
Someone enlighten us, please.
F
God desires those who worship in Spirit and in Truth. Doctrines of men often fall short of the truth. I really don't always find it easy to squeeze myself and what I believe into doctrine. They may be helpful for some to figure out where they stand in relation to the Truth, or where others stand in relation to such, but Truth is identified as a person. It kind of reminds me of when I was going through the Alpha Course just before I was baptized over twelve years ago... I realized at some point that the gist of the course seemed geared toward convincing people of the Truth of Jesus Christ, and I realized I needed no more convincing. After having sat on the fence for a while following many years of open rebellion and running from God, it was a bit of a relief to come to that understanding 
I'm not of the opinion though, that it is intentional to do so. If we are deceived in an area...we really believe the deception don't we?
Like captive by wrong thinking.
Am thinking about the scripture of those sins that easily beset us. Isn't it a picture of having our foot ensnared in a trap? Somewhere I got that.
Like captive by wrong thinking.
Am thinking about the scripture of those sins that easily beset us. Isn't it a picture of having our foot ensnared in a trap? Somewhere I got that.
I get the impression for some knowing God is like glue,
Once stuck always stuck - it does not matter what you do or are that is it for eternity.
Now lets look at what Paul says.
To live in the world and be of the world is to be a slave to the passions of the heart.
To live in Christ is to be a slave of love, righteousness.
These are two different worlds driven by different sources and powers.
You are born into both, but can go from the second into the first.
As a baby born into the second you have to learn how to walk in its ways.
It creates a totally different experience. Without washing, cleansing, growing,
sanctification, the changes will not stick or be complete.
The whole basis is the first state is without communion with God, the second
state is about continual communion with God and working this through.
If one rejects the communion with God, you are back to the first state.
Once stuck always stuck - it does not matter what you do or are that is it for eternity.
Now lets look at what Paul says.
To live in the world and be of the world is to be a slave to the passions of the heart.
To live in Christ is to be a slave of love, righteousness.
These are two different worlds driven by different sources and powers.
You are born into both, but can go from the second into the first.
As a baby born into the second you have to learn how to walk in its ways.
It creates a totally different experience. Without washing, cleansing, growing,
sanctification, the changes will not stick or be complete.
The whole basis is the first state is without communion with God, the second
state is about continual communion with God and working this through.
If one rejects the communion with God, you are back to the first state.
A very odd phrase or idea was suggested by one contributor
"What do you want me to believe today?"
Why this is odd, is because belief is never arbitary, it always is referenced
back to a source or framework, because as individuals we are suseptable at
creating our own justifications that turn out to be totally imaginary.
This is why Jesus's words and intentions are so important in the heirarchy
of belief. He is the source of our authority and foundation.
"What do you want me to believe today?"
Why this is odd, is because belief is never arbitary, it always is referenced
back to a source or framework, because as individuals we are suseptable at
creating our own justifications that turn out to be totally imaginary.
This is why Jesus's words and intentions are so important in the heirarchy
of belief. He is the source of our authority and foundation.
E
Then i guess you will NEVER shut up. Because NO ONE HERE BELIEVES THE POINTS YOU ARE MAKING.
Do us all a favor will you?
1. Take your war against JP someplace else. we are getting sick of it. not to mention the mods have forbade it.
2. Answer wsblind's questions. or are his questions to hard for you?
Do us all a favor will you?
1. Take your war against JP someplace else. we are getting sick of it. not to mention the mods have forbade it.
2. Answer wsblind's questions. or are his questions to hard for you?
Actually, since growing in Christ covers bringing forth fruit, I'm on topic.
As far as taking it somewhere else, I'll do as I please.
Now, if you don't like that, you can leave. Nobody's twisting your arm to stay.
I'm not answering anybody's questions if I don't want to..... especially those steering off topic.
If you don't like that build a bridge & get over it.
As far as taking it somewhere else, I'll do as I please.
Now, if you don't like that, you can leave. Nobody's twisting your arm to stay.
I'm not answering anybody's questions if I don't want to..... especially those steering off topic.
If you don't like that build a bridge & get over it.