Rapture

Look again at the question the disciples ask Jesus Christ at Matthew 24:3,
Tell us, when will these things be, (these words refer bact to vs2) then the disciples ask, "and what will be th3e sing of Your coming, AND THE END OF THE AGE or "THE COMPLETION OF THE WORLD."

What we find in the Olivet Discourse (Mt 24, Mk 13, Lk 21) is a summation of all the major developments which will take place on earth from 70 AD to the Second Coming of Christ (which would indeed be the end of the age but not the end of the world). This also corresponds to the seven seals of Revelation in outline.

At this time the apostles were not clear about the Church consisting of all redeemed Jews and Gentiles in one Body, neither had Paul received the revelation about the *mystery* of the Church or the Rapture. Indeed Peter had to be seriously convinced about Gentiles receiving the gift of the Holy Spirit. And it was only just before the crucifixion that Christ first spoke about the Rapture.

What we find in the Olivet Discourse (Mt 24, Mk 13, Lk 21) is a summation of all the major developments which will take place on earth from 70 AD to the Second Coming of Christ (which would indeed be the end of the age but not the end of the world). This also corresponds to the seven seals of Revelation in outline.

At this time the apostles were not clear about the Church consisting of all redeemed Jews and Gentiles in one Body, neither had Paul received the revelation about the *mystery* of the Church or the Rapture. Indeed Peter had to be seriously convinced about Gentiles receiving the gift of the Holy Spirit. And it was only just before the crucifixion that Christ first spoke about the Rapture.

Quite possibly.

Rapture

And here is something else to think about and never made any sense to me. According to the pre-trib rapture (and years and years ago I believed in this pre-trib rapture business.). Anyway after were raptured we will be having the Lambs supper at Revelation 19:6-9. It does not make sense that we will all be rejoicing and eating while all hell is breaking loose here on earth.

What we find in the Olivet Discourse (Mt 24, Mk 13, Lk 21) is a summation of all the major developments which will take place on earth from 70 AD to the Second Coming of Christ (which would indeed be the end of the age but not the end of the world). This also corresponds to the seven seals of Revelation in outline.

At this time the apostles were not clear about the Church consisting of all redeemed Jews and Gentiles in one Body, neither had Paul received the revelation about the *mystery* of the Church or the Rapture. Indeed Peter had to be seriously convinced about Gentiles receiving the gift of the Holy Spirit. And it was only just before the crucifixion that Christ first spoke about the Rapture.

Correct.

At the time of the Olivet Discourse, Jesus had already spoken with His disciples about "the end [singular] of the age [singular]" in Matt13:30,39,40,49-50 (when, it says, the angels will REAP), and that is the basis of their question(s) in Matt24:3 (which He is answering in the rest of the two chapters, 24-25, the Olivet Discourse). As of that moment, He had not yet spoken of anything related to our Rapture (in the air). The topic He is covering in the Olivet Discourse is His Second Coming to the earth, and the circumstances surrounding THAT (i.e. who will enter the promised and prophesied earthly Millennial Kingdom upon His "return" there, per context).

There will be no pre/mid/post trib rapture and even rapture as being described here is not going to happen at all. There will be no such thing as Christ second coming either, for Christ has always been coming as the Holy spirit since the disciples time- the reason He told them they won't finish moving through all the towns in Jerusalem before He comes back.

Mass rapture is a lie, two or three people surviving a car crush is their rapture, it happens every day.
No one is leaving this earth but the kingdom of God will rule over this earth forever and ever. The earth itself will change but believers will still be here.

Hey! JP... PTL!
Now regarding the evil one's revealing of himself to the world, we see in 2 Thes 2:3-8 "Let no man deceive you by any means: for that day shall not come, except there come a falling away first, and that man of sin be revealed, the son of perdition; Who opposeth and exalteth himself above all that is called God, or that is worshiped; so that he as God sitteth in the temple of God, shewing himself that he is God. Remember ye not, that, when I was yet with you I told you these things? And now ye know what withholdeth that he might be revealed in his time. For the mystery of iniquity doth already work: only he who now letteth will let, until he be taken out of the way. And then shall that wicked one be revealed, whom the Lord shall consume with the spirit of his mouth, and shall destroy with the brightness of his coming."

Matt 16:16-19 "And Simon Peter answered and said, thou art the Christ, the Son of the living God. And Jesus answered and said unto him, blessed art thou Simon Barjona: for flesh and blood hath not revealed it unto thee, but my Father which is in heaven. And I say also unto thee, Thou art Peter and upon this rock I will build my church; and the gates of hell shall not prevail against it. And I will give unto thee the keys of the kingdom of heaven: and whatsoever thou shalt bind upon earth shall be bound in heaven: and whatsoever thou shall loose on earth shall be loosed in heaven."That this includes all of the body of Christ and not just Peter is seen in Matt 18:18,19 " Verily I say unto you, Whatsoever ye bind upon the earth shall be bound in heaven. And whatsoever ye loose upon the earth shall be loosed in heaven. Again I say unto you, That if two of you shall agree on earth as touching any thing that they shall ask, it shall be done for them of my Father which is in heaven."

The Church has authority over all the power of the enemy and the Holy Spirit ministers judgment to the evil spirits that are in the world. So that between the Church and the Holy Spirit; the evil one will be hindered from revealing himself to the world until its time for the abomination of desolation, which will occur during the middle of the great tribulation. Then the Church will be caught up into the air, to be with the Lord Jesus; and then the evil one will reveal himself as God to the world.

Maranatha!

I have to ask you this noose, what planet are your from? I mean where do you come up with this stuff that is in direct contradiction of what Jesus said at Matthew 24. Who is teaching you this, and what church do you attend that agrees with what your saying? Actually, I'll bet you don't even attend a church.

IN GOD THE SON,
bluto

You said this: "He had not yet spoken of anything related to our Rapture (in the air)." Well if that's the case, where did Jesus "EVER" speak about "our" (your word) rapture? Or to put it another way since the disciples specifically ask Him at Matthew 24:3, "what will be the sign of Your coming, AND THE END OF THE AGE?" The word "age" can be translated "world" according to Greek Scholar A.T.Robertson. I do not see any "wiggle" room in the question they are asking Jesus. In short, you can't just "assume" there will be a rapture so why did Jesus not mention it?

IN GOD THE SON,
bluto

Good post gif1! However, I would have to disagree with the One who is restraining being taken out of the way at the setting up of the abomination which takes place in the middle of the seven years. The antichrist will been revealed at the beginning of the seven years when he establishes his seven year covenant. Otherwise, you would have the church going through the seals and most of the trumpets, which are the wrath of God and which believers are not appointed to suffer - Rom.5:9, I Thes.1:10, 5:9 and Rev.3:10. Surely because of scripture, when the antichrist makes his seven year covenant, those who come to Christ at that time will know who he is because of that covenant.

Good post gif1! However, I would have to disagree with the One who is restraining being taken out of the way at the setting up of the abomination which takes place in the middle of the seven years. The antichrist will been revealed at the beginning of the seven years when he establishes his seven year covenant. Otherwise, you would have the church going through the seals and most of the trumpets, which are the wrath of God and which believers are not appointed to suffer - Rom.5:9, I Thes.1:10, 5:9 and Rev.3:10. Surely because of scripture, when the antichrist makes his seven year covenant, those who come to Christ at that time will know who he is because of that covenant.

I have to ask you this noose, what planet are your from? I mean where do you come up with this stuff that is in direct contradiction of what Jesus said at Matthew 24. Who is teaching you this, and what church do you attend that agrees with what your saying? Actually, I'll bet you don't even attend a church.

IN GOD THE SON,
bluto

... I would have to disagree with the One who is restraining being taken out of the way at the setting up of the abomination which takes place in the middle of the seven years. The antichrist will been revealed at the beginning of the seven years when...

Hey! Ahwatukee... PTL! (btw is you nick an Indian word?)

In the following scriptures, I can see what you mean; but you know how we all resist changing our long held opinions; as well we should, so as not to be tossed to and fro with every wind of doctrine!

Rom 5:9 "Much more then, being now justified by his blood, we shall be saved from wrath through him."
1 Thes 1:10 "And to wait for his Son from heaven, whom he raised from the dead, even Jesus, which delivered us from the wrath to come."
1 Thes 5:9 "For God hath not appointed us to wrath, but to obtain salvation by our Lord Jesus Christ."

The above is a typical attempt to discredit the truth. What I have shared with you is not an opinion, but is scriptural.

I've heard this false apologetic before from others. However, believers in Christ are not appointed to suffer either the wrath to come, which will be carried out via the seals, trumpets and bowl judgments leading up to Christ's return to the earth to end the age, nor the wrath of being cast into the lake of fire at the great white throne judgment. Believers are not appointed to suffer any of God's wrath and that because Jesus already experienced it for all believers, satisfying it completely. Believers have been credited with righteousness and reconciled to God through faith in the shed blood of Christ. Why would you think that believers are not appointed to suffer wrath at the great white throne judgment, but are to suffer God's coming wrath on this earth?

Regarding the above scripture, the church will have been resurrected and the living changed immortal and glorified and caught up way before that event takes place.

The judgment spoken of for believers is not for sin, but will be at the Bema seat of Christ where believers will receive rewards or loss of reward. It is not speaking about the judgment at the great white throne judgment, because the church is not judged at that judgment, but will be a judgment for the unrighteous dead throughout all of history. These are those of whom the second death will have power over.

All you're doing is repeating the false apologetics of what others have already said. It was not God's intention to remove Noah and his family from the earth, but to save them in the midst of God's plague in order for them to repopulate the earth once the waters receded. Once Christ descends to the atmosphere, according to His promise, He will gather the entire church (John 14:1-3, I Thes.4:13-17) and will take us back to the Father's house, that where He is we may be also.

Matthew 24 has nothing to say about the Rapture. It is all about the temple, Jerusalem, Judea, the Jews, as well as how things would develop on earth until the Second Coming of Christ. The "elect" in this chapter is a reference to the believing Jewish remnant on earth.

It makes perfect sense to God. God's children are meant to rejoice with Him even while He pours out His judgments on the wicked, the unbelieving, and the ungodly. The whole purpose of the Gospel is to bring all men to repentance so that they do not have to face the wrath of God.