OSAS= House Built on Sand

I can list hundreds of verses of scripture to support our preaching, Christ said the road that leads to life in narrow and only a few find it. If a person is not seeking God, you may as well preach to a brick wall, only those who seek shall find and those who knock it will be opened to.

The whole Bible supports Calvinism, he just became famous because he had the courage to proclaim the awful truth. 95% of preaches will never proclaim the truth, because it would put them out of business very quickly. "Christians" hate the true Christ, they only love the one who affirms their wicked lifestyle.

Our pastor yells very loudly when he preaches on sin, like homosexuality, abortion, sex outside of marriage, divorce and those living together outside of wedlock. The veins in his neck pop out when he gets excited, that's when some visitors walk out in disgust.

We all encourage him to preach against these wicked things, it keeps the reprobate out. We get a lot of reprobate coming in so they can enjoy a good meal during our fellowship lunch, many visitors come for the wrong reasons. They come looking for entertainment, socializing and some are looking for a girl friend. We don't want any of these people, we only want true believers.

So now the true gospel has been changed from placing your faith in Christ as your redeemer and saviour to........... believe in election and predestination otherwise you are in grave danger of condemnation.

I really think you need to be more careful how you state things, I really do not think your infalliable preacher would support this statement.

I do not believe people are selected by God to be saved and others are denied salvation, however, I do know that the saved person is saved.

Can you please tell me the name of your Church? Do they have a website? I am seeing some pretty bad stuff here and I'd like to see if you are representing their beliefs correctly. Thank you.

I rejoice because my name is written in the Lamb's book of life. lol! My IQ is really not that high - but I do believe in the simple gospel of Jesus Christ. Many others in our world have heard and understood the gospel, but have knowingly rejected it!

Others have never heard the Gospel -- and one of my passions is that they might hear and understand and also respond and be saved!

That was all well and good for Jesus to do, but we are not Jesus. We can't save anyone, all we are seeking is true believers to join our Church. A person needs to conform to our vigorous Church policies, before they can be considered for membership.

They put me through a lot before they accepted my application, the elders came to my house several times and questioned my wife and children to make sure that I am a good husband and father.

Our members must contribute money and labor in a sacrificial way, the Church needs a lot of money to support all of our ministries and the pastors salary. We won't accept people if they are not willing to sacrifice their time, money and labor for the Church.

All we can do is proclaim the truth of the Gospel, but Jesus is the living Gospel. He was able to save people by pronouncing them as healed and saved, we don't have that power. Our Church provides the facilities for believers to gather and worship the Lord, we can't save anyone and we aren't trying to attract people by providing entertainment and affirming sinners lifestyles.

Oh my you want to keep out sinners? Who needs Christ more than those who are sinners? Even Jesus said that those who were not sick had no need of a physician.

By the way yelling does not make the message more effective. Preaching the word of God and allowing the Holy Spirit to minister through the word is far more effective than yelling and brow beating those in attendance. No wonder people leave in disgust.

For the cause of Christ
Roger

I don't want anyone to contact my pastor to hassle him, he is always busy so i will copy and paste as much info as you like but I will not disclose our website. Her's just a snippet out of this weeks bulletin. I put or confession up next.

Church bulletin:
It has been a great joy in recent weeks to receive a number of people into church membership. God willing there will be more added later in the year. It reminds us of the significance of the local church in the purposes of God.
While all believers from every age and in every place belong to the invisible and universal church, we are called to commit ourselves to local assemblies. Joining a church and having one’s name on the membership role is not an end in itself. It brings with it a host of privileges and responsibilities
We are to love one another (1Peter 1:22) ; We are to be patient with one another (Eph 4:2); We are to pray for one another (Eph 6:18); We are to bear one another’s burdens (Gal 6:2); We are to enter into one another’s joys and sorrows (Rom 14:15);

We are to challenge one another (Gal 6:1); We are to stir one another up in love and good works (Heb 10:24); We are to forgive one another (Col 3:13); We are to be kind to one another (Eph 4:32). The list could go on.

John F. Kennedy famously said, “ask not what your country can do for you, ask what you can do for your country” It is not a bad ethos to bring into church life. So many people approach the church with the expectation of having their needs met.

In one sense that is not necessarily wrong. If we belong to a healthy church, legitimate and realistic needs will be met. On the other hand this kind of thinking most often is lazy and selfish. We ought to have an outlook which embraces the attitude of a servant. I am here for the benefit of my fellow church members.

Take personal ownership of the list above – I am to love my brethren; I am to be patient with my brethren; I am to pray for my brethren, etc…………………… It is too easy for us to look at the church and see the responsibilities others have toward us, rather than the responsibilities we have toward them.
Let us function as the Body Christ; each member doing his / her bit for the good of the whole. When that is the case everyone is richly blessed – in giving and receiving.

We don't want the world to come into our Church, we only want those who have repented and are ready to commit their lives to serving the Lord.

What you ignore is there are Bible verses supporting both sides of the Quinquarticular Controversy. That is the 5 point list of the Calvinist and Armenian 5 points. The "Canons of Dort" give scripture for Calvinism.

https://www.gotquestions.org/Calvinism-vs-Arminianism.html

Here's what my Reformed Baptist Church believes.

The term “Reformed” has its origins in the 16th century. During this period a work of restoration was undertaken by God after many centuries of spiritual decline in the medieval church. Through men such as Martin Luther, John Calvin, John Knox and others, priority was given to the faithful proclamation of God’s Word. Scripture once again became the regulating principle of doctrine and practice rather than superstition or church tradition. These men have become known as ‘The Reformers’ and the result of their labours ‘The Reformation’.
It is often asked what it is that constitutes a Reformed church. The following points provide a brief summary.
Belief in a sovereign God
By sovereignty we mean that God controls every detail of the universe; He has a purpose in all things in order to bring glory to Himself. The sovereignty of God by no means violates the free choice of human beings nor does it diminish human responsibility.
Sufficiency of scripture
God communicates to us through His Word, the Bible. We do not rely on extra-Biblical revelation such as dreams, visions or words of knowledge to guide us. God has in time past used such means and could continue to do so, however He has chosen to reveal Himself and His purposes through scripture. By the enabling of the Holy Spirit the scriptures are a light to our path and a lamp for our feet.
The doctrine of salvation
The Bible teaches that God has appointed whom He will save and the method He will use. His people were elected to salvation before the foundation of the world and He calls them to Himself through the preaching of the Gospel. The Reformed view of salvation is often referred to as Covenant Theology. The various steps involved in salvation are outlined in the so called Doctrines of Grace:
Total depravity
Unconditional election
Limited atonement
Irresistible grace
Perseverance of the saints
Reverent worship
Most Reformed churches approach corporate worship according to God’s holy character. As such He is worshiped in a way that is reverent and orderly (this however does not mean joyless!). It is popular today to equate worship with creativity and self-expression, the Bible however doesn’t describe worship in these terms. The aim of our worship is to bring honour to God and to do this we are to worship Him in Spirit and in truth.
Creeds and confessions
While we maintain that the Bible is the only infallible rule for faith and practice we also acknowledge the importance of confessions and creeds. Many Christians find the use of these documents unnecessary and even uncharitable. This is unfortunate because they provide an excellent means of studying the Bible and clarifying doctrinal beliefs. The concept of confessional statements is actually found in scripture itself (see 1 Tim 3:16 as an example).
We use the 1689 Baptist Confession of Faith as a summary of belief.

It is remarkable to note that Jesus went not to the religious but to sinners.

You do not see that you are doing the opposite of Jesus.

For the cause of Christ
Roger

5 minute rule didn't allow me to look up a reference and update my post.

What you ignore is there are Bible verses supporting both sides of the Quinquarticular Controversy. That is the 5 point list of the Calvinist and Armenian 5 points. The "Canons of Dort" give scripture for Calvinism. There are also sites giving scripture references for Arminianism. Since this is outside the Apostles Creed it becomes one of the issues to agree to disagree about. There are several different views going from Calvinism to Armeniasm with in between views taking parts from each. Accept that this is an area that is not easily decided. Scripture taken as a whole doesn't define this issue. Live with it.

Yup, leading people to Christ is all about telling them to change their morality before they even know Him.

What I find interesting is that no other Calvinists on this message board are coming to your aid, I really think you are on some extreme, extreme edge of this dogma or maybe you revealing it for what it truly is, or your church is just out there, I am really not sure.

Yes in your hands it has become the awful truth and you cannot even see it.

This is all well and good. Today there is a "Reformed" view that is Calvinism. This is an outgrowth of the part of the reformation led by John Calvin. There is also Armenianism an outgrowth led by Jacobus Arminius. Both with opposing views with many taking parts of each view. ALL VIEWS have scriptures references. Back when the Apostles Creed was created there were many diverse views of the scripture. The creed was created to define the essential beliefs to be a Christian. Everything outside it is to agree to disagree. That is the reason for all of the different gospel preaching denominations and independent churches. Calvinism through Arminianism is just one of these issues.

After many years of careful Bible study, I arrived at the view that Calvin was right and Arminius got it wrong. They don't agree with each other, they are fundamentally opposed. They agree on some of the superficial points but they disagree on the main points.

Below is what we believe in the Reformed Baptist Church.

SUMMARY OF FAITH
For a fuller treatment please refer to the 1689 Baptist Confession of Faith

We believe that the Old and New Testament is the inspired and infallible Word of God, and the only authoritative rule for faith and practice.
• 2 Tim 3:15-17; Rom 15:4; 2 Peter 1:19-21.

We believe that the God of the Scriptures is the only true and living God. He is one God who co-exists in three persons, the Father, the Son and the Holy Spirit.
• Exodus 20:1-5; 1 Cor 8:4-6; 1 John 5:7-8; Matt 28:19.

We believe that in six days God created all things which exist and on the seventh He rested.
• Gen 1-2:2; Exodus 31:14.

We believe that God is sovereign in all things. In His infinite wisdom and power He directs the affairs of humanity.
• Ps 110:3; Prov 21:1; Is 45:7; Amos 3:6.

We believe that God created Adam and Eve without sin. He permitted sin to enter the world through a voluntary act of their disobedience.
• Gen 2:16,17; Rom 5:12.

We believe that God in eternity, before creation, determined to save His chosen people, to deliver them from the power and penalty of sin.
• Matt 25:34; Eph 1:4; Rom 8:29,30.

We believe that Jesus Christ is the mediator of God’s covenant. Being both fully God and fully man He was able to secure the redemption of God’s elect by dying on their behalf.
• Eph 1:22,23; 1 Tim 2:5,6; Heb 2:16-18; 4:14-16; 9:14,15.

We believe that the Church is made up of those who have exercised faith in Jesus Christ and repentance toward God.
• Acts 2:38; Acts 8:37; Acts 20:21.

We believe that baptism and the Lord’s Supper are the only two ordinances given by Christ to His Church.
• 1 Cor 11:23-31; Acts 20:7; Acts 2:41; Acts 16:31-34.

We believe that the mandate of the Church is to make disciples of all nations.
• Matt 28:19,20; 1 Cor 1:18-25; Col 1:28; 2 Tim 4:2.

We believe that God has appointed two offices in the Church, namely elders and deacons.
• Acts 6:1-7; 1 Tim 3:1-13; Titus 1:5-9.

We believe it is God’s will for Christians to assemble together in local congregations on the Lord’s Day (Sunday), to worship Him and encourage one another according to the Scriptural pattern.
• Is 58:13; Ecc 5:1,2; Acts 2:42; 20:7; Heb 10:24,25.

We believe that as the people of God we have a responsibility to show benevolence to all men, but especially to assist other Churches committed to the same Scriptural truths and principles.
• Acts 11:19-24; Gal 6:10; Phil 4:10,14.

We believe in the literal return of Jesus Christ at which time He will judge the nations. The redeemed will be with Him forever in the new heavens and the new earth, the ungodly cast into hell for eternity.
• Matt 25:31-46; Acts 1:11; 1Thes 4:18; 2 Peter 3:1-13

This is what we believe

SUMMARY OF FAITH
For a fuller treatment please refer to the 1689 Baptist Confession of Faith

We believe that the Old and New Testament is the inspired and infallible Word of God, and the only authoritative rule for faith and practice.
• 2 Tim 3:15-17; Rom 15:4; 2 Peter 1:19-21.

We believe that the God of the Scriptures is the only true and living God. He is one God who co-exists in three persons, the Father, the Son and the Holy Spirit.
• Exodus 20:1-5; 1 Cor 8:4-6; 1 John 5:7-8; Matt 28:19.

We believe that in six days God created all things which exist and on the seventh He rested.
• Gen 1-2:2; Exodus 31:14.

We believe that God is sovereign in all things. In His infinite wisdom and power He directs the affairs of humanity.
• Ps 110:3; Prov 21:1; Is 45:7; Amos 3:6.

We believe that God created Adam and Eve without sin. He permitted sin to enter the world through a voluntary act of their disobedience.
• Gen 2:16,17; Rom 5:12.

We believe that God in eternity, before creation, determined to save His chosen people, to deliver them from the power and penalty of sin.
• Matt 25:34; Eph 1:4; Rom 8:29,30.

We believe that Jesus Christ is the mediator of God’s covenant. Being both fully God and fully man He was able to secure the redemption of God’s elect by dying on their behalf.
• Eph 1:22,23; 1 Tim 2:5,6; Heb 2:16-18; 4:14-16; 9:14,15.

We believe that the Church is made up of those who have exercised faith in Jesus Christ and repentance toward God.
• Acts 2:38; Acts 8:37; Acts 20:21.

We believe that baptism and the Lord’s Supper are the only two ordinances given by Christ to His Church.
• 1 Cor 11:23-31; Acts 20:7; Acts 2:41; Acts 16:31-34.

We believe that the mandate of the Church is to make disciples of all nations.
• Matt 28:19,20; 1 Cor 1:18-25; Col 1:28; 2 Tim 4:2.

We believe that God has appointed two offices in the Church, namely elders and deacons.
• Acts 6:1-7; 1 Tim 3:1-13; Titus 1:5-9.

We believe it is God’s will for Christians to assemble together in local congregations on the Lord’s Day (Sunday), to worship Him and encourage one another according to the Scriptural pattern.
• Is 58:13; Ecc 5:1,2; Acts 2:42; 20:7; Heb 10:24,25.

We believe that as the people of God we have a responsibility to show benevolence to all men, but especially to assist other Churches committed to the same Scriptural truths and principles.
• Acts 11:19-24; Gal 6:10; Phil 4:10,14.

We believe in the literal return of Jesus Christ at which time He will judge the nations. The redeemed will be with Him forever in the new heavens and the new earth, the ungodly cast into hell for eternity.
• Matt 25:31-46; Acts 1:11; 1Thes 4:18; 2 Peter 3:1-13

Well your interpretation of showing benevolence to all men is to call them filthy sinners correct?

S...,

Reprobates?.......aren't they just un-repented sinners ...as you and I once were? Perhaps that is a reprobate.

The Bible says......the sick need a doctor...not the well. While we are not encouraged to socialize with them...we must invite them into G-d's house and be prayerful that something a witness or the minister says will get their attention.

I am thankful that there was no effort to stop me from coming into church where I repented of my sins..decades ago...otherwise I may not have made it to Christ from the outside...alone.

I urge further thought to the points here because, not only are we in church to worship G-d we are also there to witness for our Lord and Savior...Jesus Christ. If there is no sinner there we would not be able to witness for Him.

Yes and you have also said many times that dead faith means no salvation correct?

I have to tell you Slayer, and I mean NO condescension at all, that I am truly saddened for you. You have a marvelous testimony. And I think it can be used to heal those who might feel the condemnation of the enemy due to their straying.

But instead of proclaiming what Jesus has done for you, giving Him Glory and leading others to Him, through the joy and love of what He did, you have chosen to align yourself with this church that is the very epitome of the "loveless Church", at Ephesus. Ironic in that is one of the foundational Books establishing God's Sovereignty. Revelation 2:4 Nevertheless I have this against you, that you have left your first love. 5 Remember therefore from where you have fallen; repent and do the first works, or else I will come to you quickly and remove your lampstand from its place—unless you repent.

Come out of that church, and go back to your 1st love. Forget about the predestination stuff. Although I'm mostly in line with it, there is VERY little Fruit getting fixated on it. God didn't draw you back for what you are doing. He loves you, and wants YOU to spread that love.

Let God worry about who is the Elect and who aren't. Cmon brother. Please pray on it.