Is Prosperity For The Present Church?

Yes, the time frame for Eze. 36 is during the millennial reign. The New Heaven and New earth are yet future. Once we are all spirits why will the land need to be cultivated. Do spirits eat?

I'm not sure about the "once we are all spirits" part. Jesus's ate while in His resurrected body. Revelation 22 mentions fruit; normally, fruit is eaten. There is also the marriage feast of the Lamb. I don't believe the Bible teaches that we will become disembodied spirits in our final state.

well Jesus ate

I don't know. do spirits eat?

but Jesus ate. I want to be like Jesus.

haha Dino...we must have posted at the same time

Mat 6:25 Therefore I say unto you, Take no thought for your life, what ye shall eat, or what ye shall drink; nor yet for your body, what ye shall put on. Is not the life more than meat, and the body than raiment?
Mat 6:31 Therefore take no thought, saying, What shall we eat? or, What shall we drink? or, Wherewithal shall we be clothed?
Mat 6:32 (For after all these things do the Gentiles seek for your heavenly Father knoweth that ye have need of all these things.
Mat 6:33 But seek ye first the kingdom of God, and his righteousness; and all these things shall be added unto you( food, clothing, your needs).

If we follow God and His righteousness He will supply our needs according to the flesh, food, and clothing.

In the New Testament God only supplies our needs, and not our wants, which some people believe God will supply them with money, and material things, for their wants, but it is not true.

Rom 13:10 Love worketh no ill to his neighbour: therefore love is the fulfilling of the law.

Mat 22:36 Master, which is the great commandment in the law?
Mat 22:37 Jesus said unto him, Thou shalt love the Lord thy God with all thy heart, and with all thy soul, and with all thy mind.
Mat 22:38 This is the first and great commandment.
Mat 22:39 And the second is like unto it, Thou shalt love thy neighbour as thyself.
Mat 22:40 On these two commandments hang all the law and the prophets.

Joh 13:34 A new commandment I give unto you, That ye love one another; as I have loved you, that ye also love one another.
Joh 13:35 By this shall all men know that ye are my disciples, if ye have love one to another.

Rom 13:8 Owe no man any thing, but to love one another: for he that loveth another hath fulfilled the law.

Love is the fulfilling of the law, which helping people with their needs is part of loving people.

God loves people not giving the saints money, and material things, for their wants, but God only supplies our needs physically and spiritually.

Act 2:44 And all that believed were together, and had all things common;
Act 2:45 And sold their possessions and goods, and parted them to all men, as every man had need.

Act 4:32 And the multitude of them that believed were of one heart and of one soul: neither said any of them that ought of the things which he possessed was his own; but they had all things common.
Act 4:33 And with great power gave the apostles witness of the resurrection of the Lord Jesus: and great grace was upon them all.
Act 4:34 Neither was there any among them that lacked: for as many as were possessors of lands or houses sold them, and brought the prices of the things that were sold,
Act 4:35 And laid them down at the apostles' feet: and distribution was made unto every man according as he had need.

The Church had all things common which they shared everything, and sold their things that were not a necessity and the money was distributed to the saints for their needs.

1Co 13:2 And though I have the gift of prophecy, and understand all mysteries, and all knowledge; and though I have all faith, so that I could remove mountains, and have not charity, I am nothing.

Paul said if he does not have charity, love in action, then he is nothing.

Jas 2:14 What doth it profit, my brethren, though a man say he hath faith, and have not works? can faith save him?
Jas 2:15 If a brother or sister be naked, and destitute of daily food,
Jas 2:16 And one of you say unto them, Depart in peace, be ye warmed and filled; notwithstanding ye give them not those things which are needful to the body; what doth it profit?
Jas 2:17 Even so faith, if it hath not works, is dead, being alone.

James said if they do not have charity, love in action, then their faith is dead.

1Jn 3:17 But whoso hath this world's good, and seeth his brother have need, and shutteth up his bowels of compassion from him, how dwelleth the love of God in him?
1Jn 3:18 My little children, let us not love in word, neither in tongue; but in deed and in truth.

John said if they do not have charity, love in action, then the love of God does not dwell in them.

1Ti 6:5 Perverse disputings of men of corrupt minds, and destitute of the truth, supposing that gain is godliness( money, material, for their wants): from such withdraw thyself.
1Ti 6:6 But godliness with contentment is great gain.
1Ti 6:7 For we brought nothing into this world, and it is certain we can carry nothing out.
1Ti 6:8 And having food and raiment let us be therewith content.
1Ti 6:10 For the love of money is the root of all evil: which while some coveted after, they have erred from the faith, and pierced themselves through with many sorrows.

God created the earth to operate by the 2 greatest commandments, love God, and love people, and in the New Testament God only blesses with our needs, food, and clothing, and not our wants, and to help people with their needs for love is the fulfilling of the law.

Paul said if anybody teaches that God blesses with money for their wants withdraw yourselves from them, having food, and clothing, be content.

For the love of money is the root of all evil for it neglects the poor and needy which is what it is all about loving people, and they have erred from the faith.

There are many people that believe God will bless us with our wants with an abundance of money, and material things, but God loves people, and He only blesses us with our needs, not our wants.

It does not matter if we make 5 million dollars a year, or 20 thousand dollars a year, our lifestyle is the same, for we can only go by our needs, and the rest of the money is to help people with their needs, so a saint can never be rich in this world according to the flesh, money, and material things.

For love is the fulfilling of the law, and Paul, James, and John, point out if you do not love people to help them with their needs when you have the means to do so then you are not right with God.

So why would God bless a saint with an abundance of money, and material things, for their wants, and to keep, if they have to distribute all things above their necessities to the poor.

2Co 6:10 As sorrowful, yet alway rejoicing; as poor, yet making many rich; as having nothing, and yet possessing all things.

The world views riches as money, and material things, but the saints appear poor to the world, but making many rich, and that is spiritual, and having nothing, yet possessing all things to be given them when the saints inherit the earth, and rule with Christ on earth, and they belong to the kingdom of God.

So to the world the saints appear poor, and having nothing, because God only blesses them with their needs, and not their wants.

Jas 4:3 Ye ask, and receive not, because ye ask amiss, that ye may consume it upon your lusts.

Some people pray amiss for they pray for their wants.

Yes indeed we meet again Emekus..

Short answer:: No..

Long Answer:: No because believers recieve the Holy Spirit at the moment they believe Jesus and trust in the Atonement He secured for their salvation.. This first happened o the Day of penticost when the Apostles where gathered after the assention of Jesus.. So of course we recieve the Holy Spirit before the Second comming of the LORD Jesus back to earth.. Many people are greatly improved by recieving the Holy Spirit, Many are freed from some sins.. But we will not be perfected untill we take part in either the reasurection of the Saints which will happen on the day of the return of the LORD Jesus or we take part in the Rapture of the Saints that will happen upon the same Glorious Day of the LORD..

The Holy Spirit today works within us to change us for the better but His Holy Spirit does not transform us into sinless perfect beings today.. But we shall be transformed upon that glorius day,,, Same goes for physical prosperity and health.. Upon the reasurection/ rapture we will be given perfect healthy and eternal bodies and we shall never know death again nor pain or suffering.. But again these are future happenings which we wait for with great confidence because we trust that Gods Word is true and our confidence is based on the Character and ability of God to give.. Not on our ability to produce or create.. So our confidence is based on God not on ourselves..

Yeah, well that is another discussion. Maybe I'll start a thread on that soon.

But Brother Adstar,

if you believe believers already have changed hearts and the holy spirit in the present, why postpone the prosperity clause of the same covenant to the future?

What yardstick are you using to demarcate what gets fulfilled now and in the future?

Well I believe the words increase and multiply has to do with abundance.


And like you rightly said, the Lord gives if conditions. Suppose we fulfill the if conditions, do you still think its wrong for us to believe God for the increase and multiplication he promised with his own mouth?

Well canaan doesn't have to been in Israel. My Canaan can be in my Country or anywhere in the world.

Dear,

This scripture you quoted here actually refers to the rich not the poor. To know how to have plenty and sometime want is the lot of only the rich.

The poor never know how to abound they only know how to be in want

Dear Sister,

But am wondering why you are ignoring the keywords increase and multiply in your exegesis.

Everyone knows those two keywords refers to abundance not just adequacy. Or what do you say?

if i make metaphor out of the promise of return to the land, and redemption of the land, and abundance and restoration of the crops and fruit of the land -- the whole first half of the chapter is written to the land, not to the people -- maybe i should understand my sharing in the promise of prosperity as a spiritual blessing, not necessarily a physical one, seeing that i also am grafted spiritually, not physically, into the physical nation this promise was made to. since i enter into the promise through spirit, not through flesh, perhaps it is through spirit that i receive spiritual abundance.

if not the interpretation of the literal earthly land, why mix an interpretation of literal earthly prosperity?

this thing Ezekiel writes is about Jesus Christ, and in Him i look for a heavenly reward, which endures - no moth, no rust, right brother?

You see brother,

Many believe that God's material provision is not actually spiritual. Everything God provides is actually spiritual. Including temporal blessings such as word of knowledge, vision, money or gold, etc...

If you don't agree, how would you classify the material blessings of Abraham, Job, Isaac and Solomon.

The material blessings of these saints, are they spiritual or not?

If you are asking wether or not all believers are blessed with many physical riches, the answer is no....

Then for whom did Jesus receive all the riches for (Revelations 5 :12)? For some Christians? Not all?

luke 6

20And he lifted up his eyes on his disciples, and said, Blessed be ye poor: for yours is the kingdom of God.

21Blessed are ye that hunger now: for ye shall be filled. Blessed are ye that weep now: for ye shall laugh.

22Blessed are ye, when men shall hate you, and when they shall separate you from their company, and shall reproach you, and cast out your name as evil, for the Son of man's sake.

23Rejoice ye in that day, and leap for joy: for, behold, your reward is great in heaven: for in the like manner did their fathers unto the prophets.

24But woe unto you that are rich! for ye have received your consolation.

25Woe unto you that are full! for ye shall hunger. Woe unto you that laugh now! for ye shall mourn and weep.

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Luke Chapter 12

32 Fear not, little flock; for it is your Father's good pleasure to give you the kingdom.

33 Sell that ye have, and give alms; provide yourselves bags which wax not old, a treasure in the heavens that faileth not, where no thief approacheth, neither moth corrupteth.

34 For where your treasure is, there will your heart be also.


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Matthew 6:19-21
19 Lay not up for yourselves treasures upon earth, where moth and rust doth corrupt, and where thieves break through and steal:

20 But lay up for yourselves treasures in heaven, where neither moth nor rust doth corrupt, and where thieves do not break through nor steal:

21 For where your treasure is, there will your heart be also.

______________

It is not wise to focus on some material things you want....

some may be blessed with more things on this earth

but many of us believers will not have the same walk as others

and those who focus on what is eternal as opposed to what is temporal

will recieve much greater blessings in the long run

Concerning what is eternal.

One of the scriptures you just quoted speaks of laying treasures in heaven. Do you think if I lay enough financial or material treasures in heaven from the earth now, that it won't be eternal?

Of course, you will agree with me that I need to have the treasures here on earth first, before laying them in heaven.

Otherwise, if I don't have any treasures on earth now, which one will I lay in heaven from here?