Beginning of sorrows
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Isaiah 53:3-4 NKJV
[3] He is despised and rejected by men, A Man of sorrows and acquainted with grief. And we hid, as it were, our faces from Him; He was despised, and we did not esteem Him. [4] Surely He has borne our griefs And carried our sorrows; Yet we esteemed Him stricken, Smitten by God, and afflicted.
[3] He is despised and rejected by men, A Man of sorrows and acquainted with grief. And we hid, as it were, our faces from Him; He was despised, and we did not esteem Him. [4] Surely He has borne our griefs And carried our sorrows; Yet we esteemed Him stricken, Smitten by God, and afflicted.
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Here's what I see regarding...
"the beginning of birth PANGS [PLURAL]" (Matt24:4-8; Mk13:5-8 [and DESCRIBED in Lk21:8-11, but not so named, there]) :
--they are equivalent to "the SEALS" of Rev 6 (and Rev1:1 states, "The Revelation of Jesus Christ, WHICH GOD GAVE UNTO HIM [Jesus], TO SHEW UNTO His servants [note 7:4] things which must come to pass [note 4:1 (future things!)] IN QUICKNESS [NOUN]" [not things which will unfold over the past 2000 years or so, but "IN QUICKNESS [NOUN]")
--the info within the Olivet Discourse shows the SEQUENCE to be: "but BEFORE ALL THESE [that is, BEFORE ALL THESE 'beginning of birth PANGS [PLURAL]' just described]," before that even begins, the 70ad events must take place (vv.12-24a [though 24b follows from there, and ENDS at the END of the future trib at Christ's Second Coming to the earth])--Matt22:7-8 also shows this very important SEQUENCE (v.7 being the 70ad events; v.8 being the info He further supplied ["THEN SAITH HE" (AFTER the v.7 "burned up their city" events)] thus given in "The Revelation" in 95ad)
--the INITIAL "birth PANG [SINGULAR; 1Th5:2-3]" is the commencement of the [earthly-located] time period, "the Day of the Lord" (involving the ARRIVAL of "the man of sin" AND all he will do, over the course of 7 yrs, leading UP TO Christ's Second Coming to the earth [FOR the promised and prophesied earthly Millennial Kingdom, i.e. "the wedding FEAST/SUPPER" aka "the kingdom of the heavens [on the earth, upon His 'RETURN' there]"]). Note: "the Day of the Lord" continues on to include the entire 1000-yr earthly MK, minus "the man of sin" (2Th2:8 "whom the Lord shall consume...destroy..."; that is to say, 2Th2:9a,4,8 shows the BEGINNING/MIDDLE/END of the 7 yrs just as Dan9:27a[26] does)
--Matt24:4/Mk13:5 "G1500 - tis - 'a certain one' " is the equivalent of the INITIAL "birth PANG [SINGULAR]" which is the "FIRST SEAL" (the "whose coming/arrival/advent//presence/parousia" [2Th2:9a] of the "man of sin" IN HIS TIME [Dan9:27a(26)]). I believe both 1 and 2 Thessalonians is supplying the SEQUENCE of where our Rapture takes place IN RELATION [time-wise] TO "the Day of the Lord [the time period commencing with the arrival of the man of sin/SEAL ONE]," and that is "FIRST" ("The Departure FIRST" [the same noun EVENT of v.1]) before the Day of the Lord with its man of sin can "BE PRESENT" to unfold upon the earth, over the course of some time (namely, the seven years / 70th Week)--"The Day of the Lord" only and ever transpires ON THE EARTH.
So I hope in all that you can see my bottom-line answer to the OP Q as to whether or not we "see" the beginning tip of the birth pangs.
I'm happy to clarify anything that isn't clear (I know it's a big post, I apologize for its length
)
"the beginning of birth PANGS [PLURAL]" (Matt24:4-8; Mk13:5-8 [and DESCRIBED in Lk21:8-11, but not so named, there]) :
--they are equivalent to "the SEALS" of Rev 6 (and Rev1:1 states, "The Revelation of Jesus Christ, WHICH GOD GAVE UNTO HIM [Jesus], TO SHEW UNTO His servants [note 7:4] things which must come to pass [note 4:1 (future things!)] IN QUICKNESS [NOUN]" [not things which will unfold over the past 2000 years or so, but "IN QUICKNESS [NOUN]")
--the info within the Olivet Discourse shows the SEQUENCE to be: "but BEFORE ALL THESE [that is, BEFORE ALL THESE 'beginning of birth PANGS [PLURAL]' just described]," before that even begins, the 70ad events must take place (vv.12-24a [though 24b follows from there, and ENDS at the END of the future trib at Christ's Second Coming to the earth])--Matt22:7-8 also shows this very important SEQUENCE (v.7 being the 70ad events; v.8 being the info He further supplied ["THEN SAITH HE" (AFTER the v.7 "burned up their city" events)] thus given in "The Revelation" in 95ad)
--the INITIAL "birth PANG [SINGULAR; 1Th5:2-3]" is the commencement of the [earthly-located] time period, "the Day of the Lord" (involving the ARRIVAL of "the man of sin" AND all he will do, over the course of 7 yrs, leading UP TO Christ's Second Coming to the earth [FOR the promised and prophesied earthly Millennial Kingdom, i.e. "the wedding FEAST/SUPPER" aka "the kingdom of the heavens [on the earth, upon His 'RETURN' there]"]). Note: "the Day of the Lord" continues on to include the entire 1000-yr earthly MK, minus "the man of sin" (2Th2:8 "whom the Lord shall consume...destroy..."; that is to say, 2Th2:9a,4,8 shows the BEGINNING/MIDDLE/END of the 7 yrs just as Dan9:27a[26] does)
--Matt24:4/Mk13:5 "G1500 - tis - 'a certain one' " is the equivalent of the INITIAL "birth PANG [SINGULAR]" which is the "FIRST SEAL" (the "whose coming/arrival/advent//presence/parousia" [2Th2:9a] of the "man of sin" IN HIS TIME [Dan9:27a(26)]). I believe both 1 and 2 Thessalonians is supplying the SEQUENCE of where our Rapture takes place IN RELATION [time-wise] TO "the Day of the Lord [the time period commencing with the arrival of the man of sin/SEAL ONE]," and that is "FIRST" ("The Departure FIRST" [the same noun EVENT of v.1]) before the Day of the Lord with its man of sin can "BE PRESENT" to unfold upon the earth, over the course of some time (namely, the seven years / 70th Week)--"The Day of the Lord" only and ever transpires ON THE EARTH.
So I hope in all that you can see my bottom-line answer to the OP Q as to whether or not we "see" the beginning tip of the birth pangs.
I'm happy to clarify anything that isn't clear (I know it's a big post, I apologize for its length
)
an old friend called me early this morning, he lives in NY, he told me that the
governor is trying to pass a bill that when a baby is born you don't have to
check the space for 'boy or girl' - he also said a woman there is telling
people that our little ones should be given a chance until they are
around 3-5 to see if they relate as a boy or a girl in their lives...
this, in a way is beyond belief, but on the other hand, just being witness
to what is happening in this day and age, it's really not that surprising...
how much more grief must we be witness to until our Saviour intervenes???
governor is trying to pass a bill that when a baby is born you don't have to
check the space for 'boy or girl' - he also said a woman there is telling
people that our little ones should be given a chance until they are
around 3-5 to see if they relate as a boy or a girl in their lives...
this, in a way is beyond belief, but on the other hand, just being witness
to what is happening in this day and age, it's really not that surprising...
how much more grief must we be witness to until our Saviour intervenes???
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