What is Hebrew Roots?

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Blik

Senior Member
Dec 6, 2016
7,312
2,428
113
#61
Galatians 4:21-25
21 Tell me, ye that desire to be under the law, do ye not hear the law?
22 For it is written, that Abraham had two sons, the one by a bondmaid, the other by a freewoman.
23 But he who was of the bondwoman was born after the flesh; but he of the freewoman was by promise.
24 Which things are an allegory: for these are the two covenants; the one from the mount Sinai, which gendereth to bondage, which is Agar.
25 For this Agar is mount Sinai in Arabia, and answereth to Jerusalem which now is, and is in bondage with her children.

The original Hebrew people made a mistake by rejecting Grace. People who go back to this Hebrew Roots make the same mistake.

But they don't know it. Those that desire to be under the law do not hear the law. If they did they wouldn't desire to be under it.

Interesting that the OP brings up demons. It shouldn't be surprising that the enemy uses just a little bit of truth mixed in with their lies.

You've got to admire this strategy, really. Only someone who has been to Christ can really spot the error of the Hebrew Roots philosophy.

Those who have not been to Christ still have the vail over their heart and mind and are vulnerable to the half truth/half lie that is espoused. These are people who have heard the good word of the gospel but it doesn't grow in the good ground of the prepared heart.

Mark 4:14-15
14 The sower soweth the word.
15 And these are they by the way side, where the word is sown; but when they have heard, Satan cometh immediately, and taketh away the word that was sown in their hearts.
If you will read Romans chapters 4 to 8 it will explain scripture to you. It explains the difference between the law in the spirit of God and the law as we know it from Moses. And how we should use this knowledge. Hebrew Roots means that you go to all scripture to learn about God including the roots. By including the roots of scripture about law, you find that all law has love as its core.

You are accusing all Hebrew people, even, of not accepting grace when this is part of all scripture and Hebrews studied and often followed scripture.
 
7

7seasrekeyed

Guest
#62
I have responded to 7 Seas. His post is in black, mine is underlined.

]well you and the Roots gang make a stand against scripture so
hello anti-God I guess :rolleyes:I am making a stand for scripture, all of it.

you are being ridiculous in your attempt to elevate Hebrew Roots above the Bible. I am elevating the bible above the false beliefs started by man.

you wish to go back to Mt Sinai? I'll buy your ticket and you can wait for the thunder and lightning but I don't think Moses is going to redo that gig...and certainly not God. Mt Sinai is in scripture, so I learn from it. I do not find any scripture telling me to not "go back" to scripture.

the true church are those who are IN Christ...the redeemed and the sanctified, not those who want to pick and choose what laws they want to follow to appear more righteous than those who are saved by FAITH. apparently you do not understand that FAITH has always been the way of salvation from Genesis to Revelation. You are correct about faith, we can have faith in all scripture tells us.

and Hebrew Roots is only too happy to teach you that. The idea of "Hebrew Roots" is to have faith in all of scripture, and to work at understanding its message.

do you believe Paul is a man called by God or do you ignore his letter? many Hebrew Roots groups ignore Paul because he puts a stick in the little grinding wheels of their self righteousness. Yes, Paul was called by God to be the apostle to the gentiles. He was a Jewish Hebrew Rabbi, and God used all his talents.

have you ripped Galatians out of your Bible yet? or does Hebrew Roots have their own version...like the Jehovah's Witnesses. If I ripped out any message the bible fives then it is not a policy of Hebrew Roots. If you actually think that the book of Galatians teaches anything different from the rest of scripture you will have to show me for I do not believe that.
you need to use colored font to separate who said what or quotes

not going to sort it out for you...it would be considerate to make plain who said what

I will say this though...the book of Galatians is a perfect slap in the face to all Hebrew Roots adherents who think keeping the law adds to creates salvation

Hebrew Roots says one thing, pretends it agrees with all of scripture and then scolds those who do not 'worship' on Saturday

as it is, from what I could make of your response, you are not actually denying what I said...just twisting what I said

if you actually believe that Paul was called of God to bring the gospel to the Gentiles...all the rest of the world apart from the Jews...then why do you do exactly what Galatians says is working for salvation in the flesh?

if you began in the Spirit, Paul says, you cannot go back to trying to satisfy the law in your flesh
 
7

7seasrekeyed

Guest
#63
If you will read Romans chapters 4 to 8 it will explain scripture to you. It explains the difference between the law in the spirit of God and the law as we know it from Moses. And how we should use this knowledge. Hebrew Roots means that you go to all scripture to learn about God including the roots. By including the roots of scripture about law, you find that all law has love as its core.

You are accusing all Hebrew people, even, of not accepting grace when this is part of all scripture and Hebrews studied and often followed scripture.

are you Jewish?

if not, your argument seems a little ridiculous

FYI, the Bible says that Jesus came to His own..the Jews...but they did not receive Him

stop denying the truth of the Bible by presenting a covenant that has been overwritten by the blood of Christ
 

Shamah

Senior Member
Jan 6, 2018
2,735
692
113
#64
Acts 15:6-7, “So the apostles and the elders met to consider this statement. After a lengthy debate, Peter stood up and said to them, “Brothers, you know that in the early days God chose me to be the one among you through whom the Gentiles would hear the message of the gospel and believe."

Galatians 2:7-9,7 On the contrary, when they saw that I had been entrusted with the gospel to the uncircumcised, just as Peter had been entrusted with the gospel to the circumcised"8 (for he who worked through Peter for his apostolic ministry to the circumcised worked also through me for mine to the Gentiles),"9 and when James and Cephas and John, who seemed to be pillars, perceived the grace that was given to me, they gave the right hand of fellowship to Barnabas and me, that we should go to the Gentiles and they to the circumcised."

seemed to be is word #G1380 δοκέω dokeo (d̮o-ke'-ō) v., 1. to suppose, consider, imagine., 2. (by implication) to seem (truthfully or uncertainly)., 3. (by inference) to presume., 4. (also) to repute or estimate., 5. (by extension) to be of reputation, estimable. {(used only in an alternate in certain tenses)} [a prolonged form of a primary verb, δόκω dốkō of the same meaning], KJV: be accounted, (of own) please(-ure), be of reputation, seem (good), suppose, think, trow, Compare: G1166, G1209, G2309, G3543, G3049, G5426, See also: G1384
 

Dino246

Senior Member
Jun 30, 2015
25,491
13,797
113
#65
If you will read Romans chapters 4 to 8 it will explain scripture to you. It explains the difference between the law in the spirit of God and the law as we know it from Moses. And how we should use this knowledge. Hebrew Roots means that you go to all scripture to learn about God including the roots. By including the roots of scripture about law, you find that all law has love as its core.

You are accusing all Hebrew people, even, of not accepting grace when this is part of all scripture and Hebrews studied and often followed scripture.
So... given that many of the commands in the Bible were given to specific people in specific contexts, how do you determine what is for them and what is for you today? Do you kill every human but spare the cattle when you conquer Ai? Do you go and wash in the pool of Siloam? Do you carry the ark on poles instead of on a cart?

The Law was given to a specific people in a specific context. It was not given to Gentiles in the 21st century.

We do learn about God through reading the OT. We learn that despite being chosen by God, blessed, protected, and given special status, Israel could not keep the Law. What makes you think you have a hope of doing so... perfectly as is required?
 

Blik

Senior Member
Dec 6, 2016
7,312
2,428
113
#66
you need to use colored font to separate who said what or quotes

not going to sort it out for you...it would be considerate to make plain who said what

I will say this though...the book of Galatians is a perfect slap in the face to all Hebrew Roots adherents who think keeping the law adds to creates salvation

Hebrew Roots says one thing, pretends it agrees with all of scripture and then scolds those who do not 'worship' on Saturday

as it is, from what I could make of your response, you are not actually denying what I said...just twisting what I said

if you actually believe that Paul was called of God to bring the gospel to the Gentiles...all the rest of the world apart from the Jews...then why do you do exactly what Galatians says is working for salvation in the flesh?

if you began in the Spirit, Paul says, you cannot go back to trying to satisfy the law in your flesh
If you truly believe that Paul, in Galatians speaks against what is in the rest of scripture, I just can't agree with you at all. Scripture speaks plainly. Evil entered at the very first and God made plans for us to save us from the death that evil brought to us. It was through the sacrifice of life blood, dying to sin. Christ was planned from the first, and we are to go to Christ for forgiveness and accept life through Him. Sin and death are inseparable, Christ grace and life are inseparable. We may choose.

The base of our not seeing it the same way seems to be your idea of sin and our relation to it. Also your idea of the attributes of God.

Hebrew Roots began when we had a big change in the world. There was Hitler, Jerusalem, and discovering writings from the time of Christ that were signs of this change. Prophecy that we were told about but didn't see happening for 2 thousand years began to be visible to us.

These writings they found opened up understanding that is just now reaching the people through scholars who studied, and that new knowledge of scripture was learning what the words that come to us meant to the people at the time they were written. From this understanding it became clear that our scripture was all one book, given by one God and that God did not change with different times. So scholars dug deeper into all scripture and the word went out to all Christians to accept scripture and study. It is called Roots because the study includes all scripture not just the NT. Hebrew is included because God created these people to enact His principles and what they can mean to us. They show us our flaws and our possibilities, for they are a flawed people also. It is a language God used for scripture from the first.
 

Blik

Senior Member
Dec 6, 2016
7,312
2,428
113
#67
So... given that many of the commands in the Bible were given to specific people in specific contexts, how do you determine what is for them and what is for you today? Do you kill every human but spare the cattle when you conquer Ai? Do you go and wash in the pool of Siloam? Do you carry the ark on poles instead of on a cart?

The Law was given to a specific people in a specific context. It was not given to Gentiles in the 21st century.

We do learn about God through reading the OT. We learn that despite being chosen by God, blessed, protected, and given special status, Israel could not keep the Law. What makes you think you have a hope of doing so... perfectly as is required?
I think you need to learn about God!!! God created man and for ages there was only man, not man and Jews. God loves all people. God created the Jews as a race, selecting them from gentiles. They were created because man had forgotten God and evil men told people some statues were God. We are given history of the Jews and told without white washing any of it to show God working if we live as God wants us to or if we don't. God thanks the Jews for what they did, but God doesn't see them as people to love and care for above all others. You are just as precious to God as a Jew.

The law is simply God principles given to us to live successfully by. Gentiles can accept them or Jews can accept them. Every one of them is based on love. If we are forgiven of our sin through Christ we turn our backs on sin and take on Christ and God's ways. There is no Jew/gentile in that, never was.

God is eternal, not under time and death as we are. At the time of Adam and Eve God was God, and today God is the very same.

Innocent pure animals were given for our sins, and Christ was given 2,000 years ago for our sins. God teaches us a lot by symbols. Also, we are to learn how some of the symbols show the spirit of the Lord. Symbolically, all through scripture is the teaching to trust how God created things.

If you would take the time to study OT explained to you by scholars who knows what the words meant at the time it was written you would not question God. If someone read of our times that their mouse stopped working or they looked for a needle in a haystack they would be as mixed up about us as you are about OT times.
 

Dino246

Senior Member
Jun 30, 2015
25,491
13,797
113
#68
I think you need to learn about God!!! God created man and for ages there was only man, not man and Jews. God loves all people. God created the Jews as a race, selecting them from gentiles. They were created because man had forgotten God and evil men told people some statues were God. We are given history of the Jews and told without white washing any of it to show God working if we live as God wants us to or if we don't. God thanks the Jews for what they did, but God doesn't see them as people to love and care for above all others. You are just as precious to God as a Jew.

The law is simply God principles given to us to live successfully by. Gentiles can accept them or Jews can accept them. Every one of them is based on love. If we are forgiven of our sin through Christ we turn our backs on sin and take on Christ and God's ways. There is no Jew/gentile in that, never was.

God is eternal, not under time and death as we are. At the time of Adam and Eve God was God, and today God is the very same.

Innocent pure animals were given for our sins, and Christ was given 2,000 years ago for our sins. God teaches us a lot by symbols. Also, we are to learn how some of the symbols show the spirit of the Lord. Symbolically, all through scripture is the teaching to trust how God created things.

If you would take the time to study OT explained to you by scholars who knows what the words meant at the time it was written you would not question God. If someone read of our times that their mouse stopped working or they looked for a needle in a haystack they would be as mixed up about us as you are about OT times.
Wow. And you call me "mixed up". Neither Jews nor Gentiles can successfully live "by the Law", and failing to do so perfectly is failing completely.

Those in Christ are not under the tutelage of the Law... period.
 

Blik

Senior Member
Dec 6, 2016
7,312
2,428
113
#69
Wow. And you call me "mixed up". Neither Jews nor Gentiles can successfully live "by the Law", and failing to do so perfectly is failing completely.

Those in Christ are not under the tutelage of the Law... period.
Matthew 5:18 For truly I tell you, until heaven and earth disappear, not the smallest letter, not the least stroke of a pen, will by any means disappear from the Law until everything is accomplished. 19 herefore anyone who sets aside one of the least of these commands and teaches others accordingly will be called least in the kingdom of heaven, but whoever practices and teaches these commands will be called great in the kingdom of heaven.
 

Dino246

Senior Member
Jun 30, 2015
25,491
13,797
113
#70
Matthew 5:18 For truly I tell you, until heaven and earth disappear, not the smallest letter, not the least stroke of a pen, will by any means disappear from the Law until everything is accomplished. 19 herefore anyone who sets aside one of the least of these commands and teaches others accordingly will be called least in the kingdom of heaven, but whoever practices and teaches these commands will be called great in the kingdom of heaven.
Christ is the culmination of the law so that there may be righteousness for everyone who believes. Romans 10:4

If you want to follow the Law, go right ahead and try. Remember though, you must follow it perfectly.

I'll trust in Christ's righteousness, thanks all the same.
 

BenFTW

Senior Member
Oct 7, 2012
4,834
981
113
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#71
Christ is the culmination of the law so that there may be righteousness for everyone who believes. Romans 10:4

If you want to follow the Law, go right ahead and try. Remember though, you must follow it perfectly.

I'll trust in Christ's righteousness, thanks all the same.
What do you say to the people teaching that being torah observant is pleasing to God? That it is how we live a holy life? So while we do not live in obedience to the Law for salvation, they argue we still follow its edicts. How would you differentiate between our morality, self righteousness, and holiness under the New Covenant (and not renewed) in comparison to the Old Covenant?
 
Mar 28, 2016
15,954
1,528
113
#72
If you will read Romans chapters 4 to 8 it will explain scripture to you. It explains the difference between the law in the spirit of God and the law as we know it from Moses. And how we should use this knowledge. Hebrew Roots means that you go to all scripture to learn about God including the roots. By including the roots of scripture about law, you find that all law has love as its core.

You are accusing all Hebrew people, even, of not accepting grace when this is part of all scripture and Hebrews studied and often followed scripture.
Why not just say biblical roots since it is God's word who is not a man as us that we learn from?
 

Grandpa

Senior Member
Jun 24, 2011
11,551
3,190
113
#73
If you will read Romans chapters 4 to 8 it will explain scripture to you. It explains the difference between the law in the spirit of God and the law as we know it from Moses. And how we should use this knowledge. Hebrew Roots means that you go to all scripture to learn about God including the roots. By including the roots of scripture about law, you find that all law has love as its core.

You are accusing all Hebrew people, even, of not accepting grace when this is part of all scripture and Hebrews studied and often followed scripture.
Studying and following scripture doesn't mean a person accepts or rejects Grace. The Hebrew people rejecting Grace is a fact written in scripture. Its why they were given Law. Its what all people are given who refuse Grace.

Most of the New Testament epistles explain that it is no more working at the law in the flesh (like the ancient Hebrews) after a person comes to Christ, but it is walking in the Spirit that is needful for a Christian.

A person can't do both. They either work in the flesh or walk in the Spirit. Hebrew Roots attempt to make the shadow of greater importance than the Real Thing.

Galatians 3:2-3
2 This only would I learn of you, Received ye the Spirit by the works of the law, or by the hearing of faith?
3 Are ye so foolish? having begun in the Spirit, are ye now made perfect by the flesh?

There is no difference to the Hebrew Roots between the Spirit and working at the law. They are one and the same. Obviously this whole philosophy is deceived.

It is a DANGEROUS side trip on the way to Christ. Its what Paul fights against in almost all of his epistles.
 
7

7seasrekeyed

Guest
#74
If you truly believe that Paul, in Galatians speaks against what is in the rest of scripture, I just can't agree with you at all. Scripture speaks plainly. Evil entered at the very first and God made plans for us to save us from the death that evil brought to us. It was through the sacrifice of life blood, dying to sin. Christ was planned from the first, and we are to go to Christ for forgiveness and accept life through Him. Sin and death are inseparable, Christ grace and life are inseparable. We may choose.

The base of our not seeing it the same way seems to be your idea of sin and our relation to it. Also your idea of the attributes of God.

Hebrew Roots began when we had a big change in the world. There was Hitler, Jerusalem, and discovering writings from the time of Christ that were signs of this change. Prophecy that we were told about but didn't see happening for 2 thousand years began to be visible to us.

These writings they found opened up understanding that is just now reaching the people through scholars who studied, and that new knowledge of scripture was learning what the words that come to us meant to the people at the time they were written. From this understanding it became clear that our scripture was all one book, given by one God and that God did not change with different times. So scholars dug deeper into all scripture and the word went out to all Christians to accept scripture and study. It is called Roots because the study includes all scripture not just the NT. Hebrew is included because God created these people to enact His principles and what they can mean to us. They show us our flaws and our possibilities, for they are a flawed people also. It is a language God used for scripture from the first.

are you able to comprehend the posts of others or do you put everything through a Hebrew Roots default filter?

no one...including me...has ever said in this forum...to the best of my knowledge...said anything whatsoever, at any time, even in their sleepiest moment, said anything even vaguely resembling the statement you made in red above

maybe stop quoting from the Roots playbook and try to engage with what people post because you are sounding quite silly at this point

Paul tells us in Galatians, that going back to the law is rejecting what Christ has done for us

so, maybe deal with that. tell you what, Read Galatians and then get back
 

Grandpa

Senior Member
Jun 24, 2011
11,551
3,190
113
#75
are you able to comprehend the posts of others or do you put everything through a Hebrew Roots default filter?

no one...including me...has ever said in this forum...to the best of my knowledge...said anything whatsoever, at any time, even in their sleepiest moment, said anything even vaguely resembling the statement you made in red above

maybe stop quoting from the Roots playbook and try to engage with what people post because you are sounding quite silly at this point

Paul tells us in Galatians, that going back to the law is rejecting what Christ has done for us

so, maybe deal with that. tell you what, Read Galatians and then get back
Better probably read Galatians a few times.

I don't think once is going to do it for this one.
 

Dino246

Senior Member
Jun 30, 2015
25,491
13,797
113
#76
What do you say to the people teaching that being torah observant is pleasing to God? That it is how we live a holy life? So while we do not live in obedience to the Law for salvation, they argue we still follow its edicts. How would you differentiate between our morality, self righteousness, and holiness under the New Covenant (and not renewed) in comparison to the Old Covenant?
I say that such people are deceived, because nobody can be "torah observant". The Israelites couldn't, and Gentiles certainly can't.

James 2:10 says, "For whoever keeps the whole law and yet stumbles at just one point is guilty of breaking all of it."

That means all the sacrifices, all the offerings, all the feasts, tithing your crops perfectly, offering animals for cleansing after childbirth, showing up at the temple (which is where, exactly?) three times a year, never having a lustful or murderous thought, etc.

"Torah observance" is a complete farce of self-righteousness and a mockery of Christ.

Paul explains in Galatians 5 that the point is to walk by the Spirit, not the flesh. Following the Law never made people pleasing to God; it restrained the flesh.
 
7

7seasrekeyed

Guest
#77
Hebrew Roots began when we had a big change in the world. There was Hitler, Jerusalem, and discovering writings from the time of Christ that were signs of this change. Prophecy that we were told about but didn't see happening for 2 thousand years began to be visible to us.
no that is not so

it was actually in the mid 1990's that the emergence began

Hebrew Roots is not an organized group at all. much like NAR, groups have different flavors and some are very extreme while some have a genuine interest in the OT

the following is actually written by a Jew...not a Gentile wanna be...and it is pretty balanced and offers an overall view

even actual Jews take exception overreaching Gentiles presuming they know more about the law and how to please God than the people it was given to in the first place

so here it is for anyone wanting to get a better picture


The Jewish Roots Movement: Pros and Cons


As Jewish believers, we often encourage Gentile Christians to learn about the Jewish roots of their faith. Many benefit from the insights they gain from these connections. However, a growing segment of believers are demonstrating an excessive interest in their Jewish roots, which can be harmful to their spiritual health.

What is the Jewish Roots movement?
The Hebraic Roots or Jewish Roots movement refers to various organizations with a common emphasis on recovering the original Jewishness of Christianity. This recovery comes through studying the Bible in its Jewish context, observing the Torah, keeping the Sabbath and festivals, avoiding the “paganism” of Christianity, affirming the existence of original Hebrew language gospels and, in some cases, denigrating the Greek text of the New Testament. Writers such as Roy Blizzard, David Bivin, Brad Young and Robert Lindsay have given much impetus to this movement.
A proliferation of teachers, ministries and institutions associated with the Jewish/Hebraic roots movement has a growing presence on the Internet. Consequently, many believers are intrigued. In trying to understand the movement, we find a certain fuzziness that makes it difficult to characterize it by any one set of doctrines. Some organizations associated with the movement offer statements of faith that are evangelical in their understanding of salvation. Others are way off the mark.

The Negative
Pastor Ken Garrison, Director of the Tsemach Institute for Biblical Studies, wrote a book titled Hebraic Roots, which states that the Church, in straying from its Hebraic heritage, has fallen into error. Further, he claims that the doctrine of the Holy Trinity must be rejected as unscriptural. Roy Blizzard, more widely known than Garrison, comes close to rejecting the inerrancy of Scripture and seems to hold to an aberrant, if not heretical, view of the Trinity, according to the Christian Research Institute.1
If you enter messianic chatrooms you may well encounter people who describe the Trinity as a Gentile invention of the Nicene Council. This is a gross misunderstanding—if not gross ignorance—of church history. Since Father, Son and Holy Spirit are each described as God in Scripture, it also undermines God’s Word to dismiss the doctrine of the Trinity as a man-made invention. Both the Hebrew and Greek Scriptures provide the foundation for understanding God’s triune nature. The Jewish writers of the New Testament expressed truth about the deity of Messiah based upon their grasp of the Jewish Bible and their experience with Yeshua.
Dwight Pryor, a leading voice for evangelicals in the Jewish Roots movement, warns that some believers are forsaking Jesus and Christianity because of their growing fondness for Judaism and its teachings. They are crossing a line from appreciation to adulation of their Jewish roots. It almost seems as though these lapsing Christians believe that a special insight into their roots somehow elevates their status—as though there is an inherent superiority in being Jewish.
These people have forgotten that God loves every nation, and that all cultures have unique contributions to make to the Body of Messiah. Gentiles who say, “We are no longer Gentiles, regardless of our background” are confused and on the road to spiritual trouble. Adherents of the so-called “Two House Theory” constitute one group that has fallen into this kind of error.
Hebraic Roots teachers call upon believers to study Hebrew and learn about Jewish culture, which most of us can appreciate. More often than not, however, they call Gentiles to a Torah-observant and/or festival observant lifestyle as a means of drawing closer to Jesus and being conformed to His image. The implication is, if you really want to please God, if you really want to be holy, here are the rules. Even though most do not believe these observances are necessary for one’s salvation, there is often an implication that this is the higher way. Scripture warns against such things.
When believers forsake apostolic teaching, when they downgrade the Greek New Testament text, when they elevate the roots of their faith above the faith itself, they are in danger.
Many don’t realize that it is impossible to return to the precise practices of the early church, when Jewish believers served as the chief leaders. Much of the Jewish Roots movement is actually based upon later Jewish/rabbinic tradition. More importantly, the question of whether Gentiles need to adopt a Jewish lifestyle and return to Jewish roots was settled by the Jerusalem Council described in Acts 15. The remarkable news of the gospel is that, in Yeshua, Jews and Gentiles have direct access to God. Rural Christians in China won’t be drawn closer to God through studying Hebrew and waving Israeli flags in worship. They need what we all need: more time in prayer and meditation on the Word of God.

The Positive
As Jewish believers, we certainly need to understand our roots. It would be a shame to forsake our birthright. Not only that, but counter-missionaries often try to undermine our beliefs by assigning them false origins, so we need to know the real origins of our faith. I’d be rich if I had a dollar for every time I’ve been told that Christianity was invented by Gentiles who didn’t know the Jewish Bible. Of course, that accusation belies the accuser’s own ignorance of the Jewish roots of our faith.
It’s also important for Gentiles to understand the Jewish roots of their faith so they can better relate (and hopefully witness) to their Jewish friends, as well as oppose anti-Semitism when they see it.
Believers who wish to learn more about the Jewish roots of Christianity do well. Learning about the Jewish roots of Christianity can transform a black and white understanding of Scripture into “living color.” A deeper understanding of first century Judaism can also help people better understand Yeshua and His contemporaries. There are many good books and tapes available on the subject. But Jewish and Gentile believers need to focus on applying the words and actions of Yeshua to their cultural context today. Maybe we can help serve as a reality check for those brothers and sisters who begin to reject sound teaching and slip into an unhealthy glorification of Jewish roots.
Should opportunities present themselves, let’s reflect God’s desire for Jews and Gentiles to be reconciled through faith in Messiah. Let’s carefully remind our brothers and sisters that God is glorified when we accept one another with our different backgrounds and distinct heritages. We need to communicate to our Gentile brothers and sisters that there is no superiority in being born Jewish or Gentile, and that in Yeshua all of us can be thankful for the various identities God gave us.
Like the inexperienced gardener who may confuse the flowers with the weeds, so the enthusiastic, but callow, believer may be unable to distinguish between those Jewish Roots teachings which enrich or impoverish our faith. That’s the danger. There are thorns in the garden. We should pay attention to Paul’s inspired advice to Timothy: “Watch your life and doctrine closely. Persevere in them, because if you do, you will save both yourself and your hearers” (1 Timothy 4:16).

SOURCE
 

Blik

Senior Member
Dec 6, 2016
7,312
2,428
113
#78
Better probably read Galatians a few times.

I don't think once is going to do it for this one.
Most of these posts has to do with the law. Galatians is especall7y mentioned as opposing law. Yet Paul does not oppose law in Galatians. Paul, in fact, gives a tougher law to follow.

Galatians 2:19 “For through the law I died to the law so that I might live for God. 20 I have been crucified with Christ and I no longer live, but Christ lives in me. The life I now live in the body, I live by faith in the Son of God, who loved me and gave himself for me. 21 I do not set aside the grace of God, for if righteousness could be gained through the law, Christ died for nothing!”

We are to die to sin with Jesus, and live with Christ within us. So now we have the spirit of the law to follow with Christ, now the legalistic law only. Jesus explained to us what that was like in Matthew 5.

These posts seem to say that we are not to live through Christ who was sinless, but simply without law.

Because the idea behind Hebrew Roots is to know God, they learn about the rituals given before Christ. Paul explains that to us if you will listen to him. Paul explained that being circumcised was not the physical, but we were to follow being circumcised without using the physical symbol of it. By going to the roots of what circumcision means, we can follow in the true sense.
 

Blik

Senior Member
Dec 6, 2016
7,312
2,428
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#79
no that is not so

it was actually in the mid 1990's that the emergence began

Hebrew Roots is not an organized group at all. much like NAR, groups have different flavors and some are very extreme while some have a genuine interest in the OT

the following is actually written by a Jew...not a Gentile wanna be...and it is pretty balanced and offers an overall view

even actual Jews take exception overreaching Gentiles presuming they know more about the law and how to please God than the people it was given to in the first place

so here it is for anyone wanting to get a better picture


The Jewish Roots Movement: Pros and Cons


As Jewish believers, we often encourage Gentile Christians to learn about the Jewish roots of their faith. Many benefit from the insights they gain from these connections. However, a growing segment of believers are demonstrating an excessive interest in their Jewish roots, which can be harmful to their spiritual health.

What is the Jewish Roots movement?
The Hebraic Roots or Jewish Roots movement refers to various organizations with a common emphasis on recovering the original Jewishness of Christianity. This recovery comes through studying the Bible in its Jewish context, observing the Torah, keeping the Sabbath and festivals, avoiding the “paganism” of Christianity, affirming the existence of original Hebrew language gospels and, in some cases, denigrating the Greek text of the New Testament. Writers such as Roy Blizzard, David Bivin, Brad Young and Robert Lindsay have given much impetus to this movement.
A proliferation of teachers, ministries and institutions associated with the Jewish/Hebraic roots movement has a growing presence on the Internet. Consequently, many believers are intrigued. In trying to understand the movement, we find a certain fuzziness that makes it difficult to characterize it by any one set of doctrines. Some organizations associated with the movement offer statements of faith that are evangelical in their understanding of salvation. Others are way off the mark.

The Negative
Pastor Ken Garrison, Director of the Tsemach Institute for Biblical Studies, wrote a book titled Hebraic Roots, which states that the Church, in straying from its Hebraic heritage, has fallen into error. Further, he claims that the doctrine of the Holy Trinity must be rejected as unscriptural. Roy Blizzard, more widely known than Garrison, comes close to rejecting the inerrancy of Scripture and seems to hold to an aberrant, if not heretical, view of the Trinity, according to the Christian Research Institute.1
If you enter messianic chatrooms you may well encounter people who describe the Trinity as a Gentile invention of the Nicene Council. This is a gross misunderstanding—if not gross ignorance—of church history. Since Father, Son and Holy Spirit are each described as God in Scripture, it also undermines God’s Word to dismiss the doctrine of the Trinity as a man-made invention. Both the Hebrew and Greek Scriptures provide the foundation for understanding God’s triune nature. The Jewish writers of the New Testament expressed truth about the deity of Messiah based upon their grasp of the Jewish Bible and their experience with Yeshua.
Dwight Pryor, a leading voice for evangelicals in the Jewish Roots movement, warns that some believers are forsaking Jesus and Christianity because of their growing fondness for Judaism and its teachings. They are crossing a line from appreciation to adulation of their Jewish roots. It almost seems as though these lapsing Christians believe that a special insight into their roots somehow elevates their status—as though there is an inherent superiority in being Jewish.
These people have forgotten that God loves every nation, and that all cultures have unique contributions to make to the Body of Messiah. Gentiles who say, “We are no longer Gentiles, regardless of our background” are confused and on the road to spiritual trouble. Adherents of the so-called “Two House Theory” constitute one group that has fallen into this kind of error.
Hebraic Roots teachers call upon believers to study Hebrew and learn about Jewish culture, which most of us can appreciate. More often than not, however, they call Gentiles to a Torah-observant and/or festival observant lifestyle as a means of drawing closer to Jesus and being conformed to His image. The implication is, if you really want to please God, if you really want to be holy, here are the rules. Even though most do not believe these observances are necessary for one’s salvation, there is often an implication that this is the higher way. Scripture warns against such things.
When believers forsake apostolic teaching, when they downgrade the Greek New Testament text, when they elevate the roots of their faith above the faith itself, they are in danger.
Many don’t realize that it is impossible to return to the precise practices of the early church, when Jewish believers served as the chief leaders. Much of the Jewish Roots movement is actually based upon later Jewish/rabbinic tradition. More importantly, the question of whether Gentiles need to adopt a Jewish lifestyle and return to Jewish roots was settled by the Jerusalem Council described in Acts 15. The remarkable news of the gospel is that, in Yeshua, Jews and Gentiles have direct access to God. Rural Christians in China won’t be drawn closer to God through studying Hebrew and waving Israeli flags in worship. They need what we all need: more time in prayer and meditation on the Word of God.

The Positive
As Jewish believers, we certainly need to understand our roots. It would be a shame to forsake our birthright. Not only that, but counter-missionaries often try to undermine our beliefs by assigning them false origins, so we need to know the real origins of our faith. I’d be rich if I had a dollar for every time I’ve been told that Christianity was invented by Gentiles who didn’t know the Jewish Bible. Of course, that accusation belies the accuser’s own ignorance of the Jewish roots of our faith.
It’s also important for Gentiles to understand the Jewish roots of their faith so they can better relate (and hopefully witness) to their Jewish friends, as well as oppose anti-Semitism when they see it.
Believers who wish to learn more about the Jewish roots of Christianity do well. Learning about the Jewish roots of Christianity can transform a black and white understanding of Scripture into “living color.” A deeper understanding of first century Judaism can also help people better understand Yeshua and His contemporaries. There are many good books and tapes available on the subject. But Jewish and Gentile believers need to focus on applying the words and actions of Yeshua to their cultural context today. Maybe we can help serve as a reality check for those brothers and sisters who begin to reject sound teaching and slip into an unhealthy glorification of Jewish roots.
Should opportunities present themselves, let’s reflect God’s desire for Jews and Gentiles to be reconciled through faith in Messiah. Let’s carefully remind our brothers and sisters that God is glorified when we accept one another with our different backgrounds and distinct heritages. We need to communicate to our Gentile brothers and sisters that there is no superiority in being born Jewish or Gentile, and that in Yeshua all of us can be thankful for the various identities God gave us.
Like the inexperienced gardener who may confuse the flowers with the weeds, so the enthusiastic, but callow, believer may be unable to distinguish between those Jewish Roots teachings which enrich or impoverish our faith. That’s the danger. There are thorns in the garden. We should pay attention to Paul’s inspired advice to Timothy: “Watch your life and doctrine closely. Persevere in them, because if you do, you will save both yourself and your hearers” (1 Timothy 4:16).

SOURCE
On the whole this is a good article. The study that I have done led by Hebrew Roots people disagree with what it says about learning Hebrew language and culture.

In the negative of the Hebrew Roots, this article speaks against studying the Hebrew language. I often find it necessary tp look up the meaning of an original Hebrew word. Language reflects the culture of a nation and the Hebrew language and culture was used by the men who wrote what they heard from God. Even in the NT, the men God chose to give us this scripture were versed in that language and culture, even when they wrote in another language. When this language and culture is studied, it certainly is not from any desire to change our identity. It is necessary to understanding scripture.

As an illustration, we read that in the beginning God created light. Then on the fourth day God created the source of the light. By going to the original Hebrew we find that first God created all of what we think of as things good and that was translated as light.
 
7

7seasrekeyed

Guest
#80
Most of these posts has to do with the law. Galatians is especall7y mentioned as opposing law. Yet Paul does not oppose law in Galatians. Paul, in fact, gives a tougher law to follow.

Galatians 2:19 “For through the law I died to the law so that I might live for God. 20 I have been crucified with Christ and I no longer live, but Christ lives in me. The life I now live in the body, I live by faith in the Son of God, who loved me and gave himself for me. 21 I do not set aside the grace of God, for if righteousness could be gained through the law, Christ died for nothing!”

We are to die to sin with Jesus, and live with Christ within us. So now we have the spirit of the law to follow with Christ, now the legalistic law only. Jesus explained to us what that was like in Matthew 5.

These posts seem to say that we are not to live through Christ who was sinless, but simply without law.

Because the idea behind Hebrew Roots is to know God, they learn about the rituals given before Christ. Paul explains that to us if you will listen to him. Paul explained that being circumcised was not the physical, but we were to follow being circumcised without using the physical symbol of it. By going to the roots of what circumcision means, we can follow in the true sense.



it's like a bad fact finder got together with wiki and produced the almanac of discourse according to spellcheck having a bad day

c o m p r e h e n s i o n

get some