Seventh-day Adventists

If God does not require us to list and ask forgiveness for each and every sin, why would we keep bothering Him with specifics? If all we do is look backward, we can't see ahead of us to grow and move on.

Isa. 1:18 "Come now, and let us reason together, saith the LORD: though your sins be as scarlet, they shall be as white as snow; though they be red like crimson, they shall be as wool.

Isa. 43:25, 26 "I, even I, am he that blotteth out thy transgressions for mine own sake, and will not remember thy sins. Put me in remembrance: let us plead together: declare thou, that thou mayest be justified."

If God is willing to call us clean, shouldn't we be also?

I know many SDA's and
I can't read all previous posts right now, but I know many SDAs and I don't see eye to eye with them on everything. But loving their neighbor and the Lord God, to them is key. I can't see any of them not making it to heaven. They have run a food bank around here for 30+ yrs w/o pushing any doctrine. Not that works account for Salvation but if it was not for them there would b many more hungry and ill-clothed people around here. Merry Christmas brothers and sisters in Christ!

While you have given a very lengthy response, you have not provided a satisfactory bibiical reason to believe in the so-called *Investigative Judgment*. Indeed this verse refutes any such idea, and here are the reasons:

1. *After this the judgment* applies to those who are without Christ and points to the Great White Throne Judgment (Revelation 20).

2. *So Christ was once offered to bear the sins of many* applies to those who have repented and believed on the Lord Jesus Christ, and therefore been saved by grace through faith, APART from works (Romans 4).

3. *Them that look for Him to appear the second time* applies to those who are saved and anticipate the Resurrection/Rapture of the saints (John 14:1-3).

4. *without sin unto salvation* applies to the culmination of the salvation of the saints, which is their glorification and perfection (Rom 8:29,30; 1 John 3:1-3).

ALL OF THIS IS STRICTLY ON THE MERITS OF CHRIST HIMSELF AND HIS FINISHED WORK.

No doubt, after the Resurrection/Rapture, there will be a judgment of the saints at the Judgment Seat of Christ in Heaven, followed by the Marriage of the Lamb. But this will be a judgment of the works of the saints and the receiving of rewards or not. But their salvation will always be secure in Christ.

On the other hand, Ellen G. White's *Investigative Judgment* is something else altogether. I quote from the SDA Fundamental Beliefs #24.

"...The investigative judgment reveals to heavenly intelligences who among the dead are asleep in Christ and therefore, in Him, are deemed worthy to have part in the first resurrection. It also makes manifest who among the living are abiding in Christ, keeping the commandments of God and the faith of Jesus, and in Him, therefore, are ready for translation into His everlasting kingdom...."

https://www.adventist.org/en/beliefs/restoration/christs-ministry-in-the-heavenly-sanctuary/

So this teaching is telling us that it is not the worthiness of Christ, but the worthiness of the saints which determines whether they will be at the Resurrection/Rapture. AND THAT IS FALSE DOCTRINE.

A simple acknowledgement that one is a sinner once to God and that one is sorry is sufficient for salvation. At that point forward saying you're sorry if you have sinned is part of the reconciliation process, not the salvation process itself which had already occurred when one first came to God as a sinner and prayed for forgiveness I agree with your entire post that there is no one who would remember each and every sin.

In 1 John 1, he is speaking to a mixed audience. Some saved (he speaks to them directly in Chapter 2 vs 1). In Chapter 1 vs 1, it's unbelievers he's targeting. He wouldn't have to try & convince someone that already knew Christ. Vs 1 Who we heard, we saw with our eyes & physically touched the Word of life. Believers don't need these proofs explained. They already know him & what he did.

The sin confession before God is a one time duty. We still need to confess transgressions to one another.

Acts 20: 21 Testifying both to the Jews, and also to the Greeks, repentance toward God, and faith toward our Lord Jesus Christ
(NOTE: The article TOWARD: repentance ""toward"" God. For the Jew that knew God this meant, you've turned your back, repent (change course) and return to God. Gentiles didn't have a covenant relationship with God. They were to acknowledge that God existed. Then admit they are sinners in need of a savior.

Water can't atone for sin, can good works, Sabbath observance nor confession can atone for sin

Hebrews 9:22 And almost all things are by the law purged with blood; and without shedding of blood is no remission.

So the next part of the passage: faith toward our Lord Jesus Christ. Is applicable & necessary to both Jew & Gentile.

Remember, Jesus added thoughts (if you commit adultery in your heart) noboby can confess every sin. The good news is Christ paid for ALL your sins.

To whine & beg for forgiveness for something he already paid dearly for. Is an unbelief slap in his face. When the indwelling Holy Spirit makes you aware if a transgression. You don't wine of beg for forgiveness YOUR ALREADY FORGIVEN. So, you should repent = change course. Then praise & thank God for the forgiveness already given in the FINISHED! Sin atoning work of Jesus the Christ

Amen.....dealt with that yesterday.....and got the opportunity to explain salvation, justification and numerous other truths to a die hard Roman Catholic family......was a good experience....especially when I discussed Perfect and Aorist tense Greek verbs and how God can see us as continually justified before him while yet being sinners in the flesh........

I hate to bring this up on Christmas, but I don't think Dan should be questioning others.


Mail of the Beast:


Rev 13:16-17
And he causeth all, both small and great, rich and poor, free and bond, to receive the mail in their right hand, or in their foreheads:
And that no man might buy or sell, save he that had the mail, or the name of the beast, or the number of his name.
Rev 16:2
And the first went, and poured out his vial upon the earth; and there fell a noisome and grievous sore upon the men which had the mail of the beast, and upon them which worshipped his image.
Rev 19:20
And the beast was taken, and with him the false prophet that wrought miracles before him, with which he deceived them that had received the mail of the beast, and them that worshipped his image. These both were cast alive into a lake of fire burning with brimstone.

It's too late for Dan.

The rest of you... be warned.

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thank you Maxwell.

you just proved our point that the ellen white disciples do teach sunday worship is the mark of the beast.

to all you who deny this, please stop.

It could very well be but no one really knows for sure. There is nothing wrong however in warning people about the mark of the beast that will occur in the end-times, that your two choices are to renounce Jesus Christ and receive the mark or you die and watch your love ones die as well. It is odd though that those churches that hold to Sunday worship that is based on the tradition of the Catholic Church and yet at the same time preach about how evil that church is and that none of its members are Christian.

Oh no, the plagues of Revelation 22:18!

Matthew 25:46 King James Version (KJV)
46 And these shall go away into everlasting punishment: but the righteous into life eternal.
this verse say there is everlasting punishment

nothing wrong with warning people of the mark of the beast. which could or could not be the rfid chip.

it is certainly not going to church on sunday, as the ellen white followers teach.

and, as with the Trinity, the catholic church did not invent sunday worship their are multiple verses in the N.T. of Christ followers meeting " on the first day of the week".

and, to me, the most compelling piece of evidence , when John said He was ' in the Sprit on the Lord's Day, " he did NOT say Sabbath. a different greek word was used.

I didn't accuse you of hatred i asked if it was hatred and was wanting to understand why you accused them of being a cult.

Belief
9.....The Life, Death, and Resurrection of Christ .... In Christ’s life of perfect obedience to God’s will, His suffering, death, and resurrection, God provided the only means of atonement for human sin, so that those who by faith accept this atonement may have eternal life, and the whole creation may better understand the infinite and holy love of the Creator. This perfect atonement vindicates the righteousness of God’s law and the graciousness of His character; for it both condemns our sin and provides for our forgiveness. The death of Christ is substitutionary and expiatory, reconciling and transforming. The bodily resurrection of Christ proclaims God’s triumph over the forces of evil, and for those who accept the atonement assures their final victory over sin and death. It declares the Lordship of Jesus Christ, before whom every knee in heaven and on earth will bow. (Gen. 3:15; Ps. 22:1; Isa. 53; John 3:16; 14:30; Rom. 1:4; 3:25; 4:25; 8:3, 4; 1 Cor. 15:3, 4, 20-22; 2 Cor. 5:14, 15, 19-21; Phil. 2:6-11; Col. 2:15; 1 Peter 2:21, 22; 1 John 2:2; 4:10.)
10.....The Experience of Salvation..... In infinite love and mercy God made Christ, who knew no sin, to be sin for us, so that in Him we might be made the righteousness of God. Led by the Holy Spirit we sense our need, acknowledge our sinfulness, repent of our transgressions, and exercise faith in Jesus as Saviour and Lord, Substitute and Example. This saving faith comes through the divine power of the Word and is the gift of God’s grace. Through Christ we are justified, adopted as God’s sons and daughters, and delivered from the lordship of sin. Through the Spirit we are born again and sanctified; the Spirit renews our minds, writes God’s law of love in our hearts, and we are given the power to live a holy life. Abiding in Him we become partakers of the divine nature and have the assurance of salvation now and in the judgment. (Gen. 3:15; Isa. 45:22; 53; Jer. 31:31-34; Ezek. 33:11; 36:25-27; Hab. 2:4; Mark 9:23, 24; John 3:3-8, 16; 16:8; Rom. 3:21-26; 8:1-4, 14-17; 5:6-10; 10:17; 12:2; 2 Cor. 5:17-21; Gal. 1:4; 3:13, 14, 26; 4:4-7; Eph. 2:4-10; Col. 1:13, 14; Titus 3:3-7; Heb. 8:7-12; 1 Peter 1:23; 2:21, 22; 2 Peter 1:3, 4; Rev. 13:8.)

If these are 2 of the fundamental beliefs of the SDA church it sounds like righteousness by faith alone.

By faith we are made right with God.
"Led by the Holy Spirit we sense our need, (conviction) acknowledge our sinfulness, repent of our transgressions, (repentance) and exercise faith in Jesus as Saviour and Lord, Substitute and Example." (justification).

If SDA people are convicted by the Holy Spirit about keeping the Sabbath they are following divine council by repenting of that sin.
Luk 13:3 I tell you, Nay: but, except ye repent, ye shall all likewise perish.
Act 17:30 And the times of this ignorance God winked at; but now commandeth all men every where to repent:
Rev_3:19 As many as I love, I rebuke and chasten: be zealous therefore, and repent.

well, since Sabbath keeping was never commanded to gentiles, then their is no conviction for a sin for not following a command given to Israel only.

if anyone chooses to keep the Sabbath, that is fine. but, as in the case of the ellen white followers, when someone makes it a requirement, then that is wrong.

Sabbath keeping has 0 to do with salvation by faith in Christ.

DICTIONARY
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ev·er·last·ing
/ˌevərˈlastiNG/
adjective

1. 1.
   lasting forever or for a very long time.
   "the damned would suffer everlasting torment"
   synonyms:eternal, endless, never-ending, perpetual, undying, abiding, enduring, infinite, boundless, timeless More
   
   

noun

1. 1.
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   eternity.
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   a flower of the daisy family with a papery texture, retaining its shape and color after being dried, especially a helichrysum.

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[QUOTE="preacher4truth, post: 3807065, member: 249896"]Oh no, the plagues of Revelation 22:18! [/QUOTE]

Well I did get a call from an ex tonight... it's that's not a plague then I don't know what is.


Now, if anyone sees post #87 and is genuinely worried about changing God's word, and the plagues of Revelation 22:18, then I'll be happy to explain things, and point out how I try to carefully contextualize these kinds of jokes... so people know it's a joke.

I know it's sad, but I actually do think about the stupid things I say before I say them....
and after carefully thinking about the stupid things...
somehow...
I still decide they sound fine.


Merry Christmas Everyone.

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I think there is much difference from SDA and JW's and Mormonism.

The issue with SDA is really only one. it is the concern of overly legalistic and works based approach to their doctrine. Col 2:16-23 says :

Let no one pass judgment on you in questions of food and drink, or with regard to a festival or a new moon or a Sabbath. These are a shadow of the things to come, but the substance belongs to Christ. Let no one disqualify you, insisting on asceticism and worship of angels, going on in detail about visions, puffed up without reason by his sensuous mind, and not holding fast to the Head, from whom the whole body, nourished and knit together through its joints and ligaments, grows with a growth that is from God. If with Christ you died to the elemental spirits of the world, why, as if you were still alive in the world, do you submit to regulations "Do not handle, Do not taste, Do not touch" (referring to things that all perish as they are used) according to human precepts and teachings? These have indeed an appearance of wisdom in promoting self-made religion and asceticism and severity to the body, but they are of no value in stopping the indulgence of the flesh.

Therefore I place the SDA in this category.