Not By Works

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Dan_473

Dan_473

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UnderGrace said:
The term "justified" must be understood within the context of the letter. James is certainly not speaking about the justification (eternal salvation) that comes from God.

He makes it very clear he is writing on the profitable Christian life, that is how do we live after we are born again.

Also the word saved does not always refer to saved, as in saved from hell, one has to read this word in context too.

James is writing to believers.
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Dan_473 said:
That certainly is an interesting way of looking at it!
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Found a song that expresses thought well I think

Interesting page about how Martin Luther felt about the book of James

http://www.bible-researcher.com/antilegomena.html
 
G

gb9

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justpassinthrough said:
Amen... because they did not feed the hungry, clothe the poor, visit the sick and those in prison.


I agree.



Unfortunately this context is from the previous verses -


Let’s look -


“For the kingdom of heaven is like a man traveling to a far country, who called his own servants and delivered his goods to them. Matthew 25:14


These talents were given to His own servants. Not unbelievers.


“But his lord answered and said to him, ‘You wicked and lazy servant, you knew that I reap where I have not sown, and gather where I have not scattered seed. So you ought to have deposited my money with the bankers, and at my coming I would have received back my own with interest. So take the talent from him, and give it to him who has ten talents.
For to everyone who has, more will be given, and he will have abundance; but from him who does not have, even what he has will be taken away. And cast the unprofitable servant into the outer darkness. There will be weeping and gnashing of teeth.’ Matthew 26:26-30



And cast the unprofitable servant into the outer darkness. There will be weeping and gnashing of teeth.’



The context of Matthew 25 is about what He will do on the Day of Judgement when He returns, to gather His people, His own servants, to Judge each one according to their deeds.



Then the King will say to those on His right hand, ‘Come, you blessed of My Father, inherit the kingdom prepared for you from the foundation of the world:
for I was hungry and you gave Me food;
I was thirsty and you gave Me drink;
I was a stranger and you took Me in;
I was naked and you clothed Me;
I was sick and you visited Me;
I was in prison and you came to Me.’




“Then He will also say to those on the left hand, Depart from Me, you cursed, into the everlasting fire prepared for the devil and his angels:
for I was hungry and you gave Me no food;
I was thirsty and you gave Me no drink;
I was a stranger and you did not take Me in,
naked and you did not clothe Me,
sick and in prison and you did not visit Me.’



These on the left hand buried their talents and did nothing with the love and forgiveness and life of Jesus they were given.




And let our people also learn to maintain good works, to meet urgent needs, that they may not be unfruitful. Titus 3:14



Unfortunately their are indeed those who are unfruitful Christians who do nothing with the life of Jesus.





JPT
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nice try, but as usual, fail.

the unprofitable servant did not like his master.

notice, the other servants , after telling the master what they had did, were told " share your master's joy".

the other servant said his master was a hard man, and basically called his master a thief.

so, the 3rd servant was not serving his master with joy, he did not like his master and did not even try to do the right thing.

no true Christ follower will look at Jesus and call Him a hard man and a thief.
 
mailmandan

mailmandan

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gb9 said:
nice try, but as usual, fail.

the unprofitable servant did not like his master.

notice, the other servants , after telling the master what they had did, were told " share your master's joy".

the other servant said his master was a hard man, and basically called his master a thief.

so, the 3rd servant was not serving his master with joy, he did not like his master and did not even try to do the right thing.

no true Christ follower will look at Jesus and call Him a hard man and a thief.
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Amen! This parable if often quoted by works-salvationists who try to teach there are believers/Christians who do absolutely nothing and will not be saved while boasting about how much THEY DO.

In this parable, the talents represent monetary value and are distributed according to ability (vs. 15). The requirement is to invest in Christ.The first two servants deposited their money with the bankers (Matthew 25:27) but the third servant buried his money in the ground (vs. 25). The third servant had been given abilities and the opportunity to believe and bear fruit in accordance, but had chosen to reject it.

The fact that the latter man in this parable is called "wicked/worthless" and "slothful/lazy" and an "unprofitable" servant who is cast out into outer darkness, certainly indicates that he was NOT A TRUE disciple of the master. The idea of this illustrative parable is that all true believers will produce fruit in varying degress. All believers are fruitful, but not all are equally fruitful (Matthew 13:23). Those who produce no results at all are not truly converted.

This is the man's characterization of the master—“reaping where he did not sow and gathering where he scattered no seed.” This slothful so-called servant does not represent a genuine believer, for it is obvious that this man had no true knowledge of the master. Two of these servants were children of God, but not the third. Children of God are not cast out into outer darkness.

*The fact that this man is called a "servant" does not mean necessarily that he was saved. The Israelites were referred to by God as "My servant whom I have chosen" (Isaiah 43:10) even though not all of the Israelites were saved.
 
stonesoffire

stonesoffire

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iPad glitch


justpassinthrough said:
Jesus defined the phrase “inherit the kingdom” for us.



Then the King will say to those on His right hand, ‘Come, you blessed of My Father, inherit the kingdom prepared for you from the foundation of the world: Matthew 25:34


Those on His left hand who do not inherit the kingdom will hear these awful words -



Then He will also say to those on the left hand, Depart from Me, you cursed, into the everlasting fire prepared for the devil and his angels: Matthew 25:41



JPT
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These are two different uses of the word kingdom. That's why one should think about studying in order to rightly divide the Word.

The first post was about walking and living as a spiritual man or woman. Walking in power.

This is about dividing sheep from goats and I believe this is at the Great White Throne Judgement. The nations are before Him here.

Paul said that to be absent from the body, will be present with the Lord. So why would all believers be there at the GWT?

At the end....there will be a new earth and the kingdom will have all Gods children with Him. He then gives rule to certain ones so there is the use of the word kingdom.
 
J

justpassinthrough

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gb9 said:
nice try, but as usual, fail.

the unprofitable servant did not like his master.

notice, the other servants , after telling the master what they had did, were told " share your master's joy".

the other servant said his master was a hard man, and basically called his master a thief.

so, the 3rd servant was not serving his master with joy, he did not like his master and did not even try to do the right thing.

no true Christ follower will look at Jesus and call Him a hard man and a thief.
Click to expand...

Who was the Master of the unprofitable servant ?




JPT
 
J

justpassinthrough

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stonesoffire said:
iPad glitch




These are two different uses of the word kingdom. That's why one should think about studying in order to rightly divide the Word.

The first post was about walking and living as a spiritual man or woman. Walking in power.

This is about dividing sheep from goats and I believe this is at the Great White Throne Judgement. The nations are before Him here.

Paul said that to be absent from the body, will be present with the Lord. So why would all believers be there at the GWT?

At the end....there will be a new earth and the kingdom will have all Gods children with Him. He then gives rule to certain ones so there is the use of the word kingdom.
Click to expand...

The phrase I’m referring to is “inherit the kingdom of God” or “will not inherit the kingdom of God”.



Those Christians who have the ability to walk according to the Spirit, because they are born again and have the Holy Spirit, but instead, they practice the works of the flesh, and walk according to the sinful desires of the flesh, will not inherit the kingdom of God.


I say then: Walk in the Spirit, and you shall not fulfill the lust of the flesh.

For the flesh lusts against the Spirit, and the Spirit against the flesh; and these are contrary to one another, so that you do not do the things that you wish. But if you are led by the Spirit, you are not under the law.
Now the works of the flesh are evident, which are: adultery, fornication, uncleanness, lewdness, idolatry, sorcery, hatred, contentions, jealousies, outbursts of wrath, selfish ambitions, dissensions, heresies, envy, murders, drunkenness, revelries, and the like; of which I tell you beforehand, just as I also told you in time past, that those who practice such things will not inherit the kingdom of God. Galatians 5:16-21



  • those who practice such things will not inherit the kingdom of God.




JPT
 
stonesoffire

stonesoffire

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justpassinthrough said:
The phrase I’m referring to is “inherit the kingdom of God” or “will not inherit the kingdom of God”.



Those Christians who have the ability to walk according to the Spirit, because they are born again and have the Holy Spirit, but instead, they practice the works of the flesh, and walk according to the sinful desires of the flesh, will not inherit the kingdom of God.


I say then: Walk in the Spirit, and you shall not fulfill the lust of the flesh.

For the flesh lusts against the Spirit, and the Spirit against the flesh; and these are contrary to one another, so that you do not do the things that you wish. But if you are led by the Spirit, you are not under the law.
Now the works of the flesh are evident, which are: adultery, fornication, uncleanness, lewdness, idolatry, sorcery, hatred, contentions, jealousies, outbursts of wrath, selfish ambitions, dissensions, heresies, envy, murders, drunkenness, revelries, and the like; of which I tell you beforehand, just as I also told you in time past, that those who practice such things will not inherit the kingdom of God. Galatians 5:16-21



  • those who practice such things will not inherit the kingdom of God.




JPT
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Inheritance is the meaning of the New Covenant. A different contract drawn up by the Godhead, and carried out in the blood of Jesus's Cross. It's nothing like the old of you do this and I will do that.

Jesus shares His life with all His own.

Entrance into heaven only requires faith. Works are for rewards. Those who have neither remain under the law and the heart is judged. Only God can do that.
 
G

gb9

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justpassinthrough said:
Sorry, your master is the one you obey.


“But why do you call Me ‘Lord, Lord,’ and not do the things which I say?
Luke 6:46




JPT
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Jesus said to believe in Him.

so, to believe ( mental action ) is to obey.

then one will do good works, because they believe.

good works are done by people who are saved because they are saved, not to produce or maintain salvation.
 
dcontroversal

dcontroversal

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mailmandan said:
He continues to confuse descriptive passages of scripture with prescriptive passages of scripture and remains under the delusion that he will inherit the kingdom of God based on the merits of his performance/works and not through faith in Christ alone. (John 3:18; Acts 10:43; 16:31; 1 Corinthians 1:21; Romans 1:16; 4:4-6; 10:4; Ephesians 2:8,9; Philippians 3:9; Titus 3:5; 2 Timothy 1:9 etc..)
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That is the problem with many....they conflate numerous biblical truths into one big quagmire of false teaching.......ignorantly I might add.....
 
J

justpassinthrough

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stonesoffire said:
Inheritance is the meaning of the New Covenant. A different contract drawn up by the Godhead, and carried out in the blood of Jesus's Cross. It's nothing like the old of you do this and I will do that.

Jesus shares His life with all His own.

Entrance into heaven only requires faith. Works are for rewards. Those who have neither remain under the law and the heart is judged. Only God can do that.
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You can make up whatever you want.

You can explain away the truth.

You can mock me.

You can call me names.

NOTHING WILL CJANGE THE TRUTH.

The meaning of the phrase “will not inherit the kingdom of God” does not change.


Those who do not inherit the kingdom of God are cursed and are cast into the everlad
stonesoffire said:
Inheritance is the meaning of the New Covenant. A different contract drawn up by the Godhead, and carried out in the blood of Jesus's Cross. It's nothing like the old of you do this and I will do that.

Jesus shares His life with all His own.

Entrance into heaven only requires faith. Works are for rewards. Those who have neither remain under the law and the heart is judged. Only God can do that.
Click to expand...

Christians who do not inherit the kingdom of God have no part or place in God’s kingdom.



Nothing you say or do will change the meaning of the words of Jesus Christ.



Then the King will say to those on His right hand, ‘Come, you blessed of My Father, inherit the kingdom prepared for you from the foundation of the world: Matthew 25:34



“Then He will also say to those on the left hand, Depart from Me, you cursed, into the everlasting fire prepared for the devil and his angels: Matthew 25:41




JPT
 
J

justpassinthrough

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gb9 said:
Jesus said to believe in Him.

so, to believe ( mental action ) is to obey.

then one will do good works, because they believe.

good works are done by people who are saved because they are saved, not to produce or maintain salvation.
Click to expand...


Can a person be saved by disobeying the Lord Jesus Christ?


Yes or No.




JPT
 
C

cdmeyer

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Faith and Works are necessary for Salvation...Of course, if you have that Jesus will save you if you do his commandments, then you will want to do them.
 
dcontroversal

dcontroversal

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gb9 said:
nice try, but as usual, fail.

the unprofitable servant did not like his master.

notice, the other servants , after telling the master what they had did, were told " share your master's joy".

the other servant said his master was a hard man, and basically called his master a thief.

so, the 3rd servant was not serving his master with joy, he did not like his master and did not even try to do the right thing.

no true Christ follower will look at Jesus and call Him a hard man and a thief.
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AMEN...........another Chubby Checker version of the twist.......
 
dcontroversal

dcontroversal

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stonesoffire said:
Inheritance is the meaning of the New Covenant. A different contract drawn up by the Godhead, and carried out in the blood of Jesus's Cross. It's nothing like the old of you do this and I will do that.

Jesus shares His life with all His own.

Entrance into heaven only requires faith. Works are for rewards. Those who have neither remain under the law and the heart is judged. Only God can do that.
Click to expand...
AMEN......MISTHOS --->reward....PAY or wages for service rendered......NOT for salvation, but because OF salvation...........so many conflate these truths into that which is false.....
 
Hevosmies

Hevosmies

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justpassinthrough said:
The meaning of the phrase “will not inherit the kingdom of God” does not change.


Those who do not inherit the kingdom of God are cursed and are cast into the everlad
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Does anyone here disagree though?

I agree, those who practice such things will not inherit the kingdom. Thats what it says. Doesnt it?
 
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