The cross

Howdy. I.v been doing research on the crusades etc and realised that in these times and right up to just a few decades ago the cross to millions of people through the years meant death torture and persecution if they didn't change their belief to Christianity, by order of the pope's. So why do Christians still wear this evil symbol? Cheers Al

I have researched the cross myself. From the Roman times, the cross or crucifixion was their form of capital punishment. Have a look at the Egyptian "Ankh", that is a form of a cross. The older style Hebrew languages had a "+" or a "x" which is a Tav. The english letter T (Latin T) would of originated from this symbol. The symbol is a lot older than we think. If anyone knows about Norse myth, and Thor's hammer Mjolnir, have you ever notice that it resembles a T symbol.

It's true that a great many misguided people have used force and even violence to expand the kingdom of God, but that isn't the way that God teaches us to operate. Christians don't wear crosses to remind themselves or others of persecution. Rather, they wear it to remind themselves of the death and resurrection of Jesus Christ.

Jesus died on a Roman cross to pay the penalty for sin, once, for all. He was buried, and three days later, rose again to life. The cross is a symbol of this gospel. What was once an instrument of death is now a symbol of the hope of eternal life through Christ.

Are you saying all these previous pope,s were misguided. It's my understanding that God chose all previous pope,s and was it gods will these other millions suffered in pain and death to expand the kingdom of God?

Cliffy, you may want to research the history of the popes and the catholic church. One of the Pope's titles as known by is Vicar of Christ. Vicar is based on the Latin word "vicarius" which means a substitute (the online etymology dictionary confirms this). Cross reference that to the greek, and you get the word "anti", and you can check and confirm this using Strong's Concordance g473.

The cross being an evil symbol is in opinion that is not held by everyone. I am surmising that there are those that wear a cross as a reminder that Jesus died for their sins. I see nothing wrong with that.

God appoints all of those in positions of authority regardless of whether they are perceived as being good or bad. It is certainly not God's will and desire that millions suffer in pain but rather God wants us to have life and to have it more abundantly.

Well i personally do not wear a cross and never have but i do understand why a lot of Christians do..

Yes the cross does represent to Christians the pain and suffering Jesus went through when He suffered death for us on a cross.. So it aids them in remembering what Jesus went through..

The cross is not an evil symbol.. When it is remembered in this way..

You need to read at lest One Gospel.. The Gospel of Matthew would be good for you, to give you some understanding at the actual teachings Jesus taught His followers.. I am sure if you simply read one Gospel you would see that slaughtering people was not the way Jesus told his followers to spread His message..

Just because the Catholic church says God chose the Popes does not mean it is true. Since several Popes were morally-bankrupt and had 1000's killed in the "name of God" it doesn't take much logic, from a Christian point of view, to know that those people were not chosen by God. God doesn't advocate spreading the Gospel at the point of a sword.

the cross symbolises to the christian that death has been overcome because of Jesus death and resurrection

read your bible, yashua was crucified on a tree.

Have you asked Moslems the same question about their symbols ?
I reject your words.

Surely that's because a hammer is T shaped ?
It's a hammer, not a symbol of anything except a hammer.

There's no rune which corresponds to T( although you'd expect there to be because they were designed to be easy to carve ). The nearest is "tiwaz" but that's actually more like an upward arrowhead than a T and it's specifically a warrior rune connected to the false god Tyr.

The rune for Thor is "thurisaz" and it's like a P but with the top 'circle ' formed by straight lines ,(pointed if you like).

Ps. Not being awkward, but I thought you might be interested.

The crucifix was a Tee post, what made the one Jesus was crucified on different than the others was the added sign on the top of the tee post thus the cross was born.

Did Jesus Christ die on a cross? Yes. Does scripture mention the cross elsewhere? Yes.

Mark 8:34 New International Version (NIV)
34 Then he called the crowd to him along with his disciples and said: “Whoever wants to be my disciple must deny themselves and take up their cross and follow me.

A error in reasoning is to judge a religion by the people's actions. Do we judge Islam because of the jihadist? Or do we judge Islam off its writings? Same goes for the Bible.

Nothing in scripture makes the cross out to be viewed as bad from a theological perspective. It is a symbolism to provide a image that we ourselves must surrender to God's will and submit our flesh to God's mercy. A symbolic representation of God's sacrifice and his grace to follow.

It's not necessarily wrong to judge a religion by people's actions if they're following that religion and what their scriptures tell them to do.
Aren't we told to judge a prophet by the fruits of his words ?

I don't take the OP as being earnest or straightforward to be honest, but you certainly are and its to you that I say it's obvious that anyone could try to discredit a true religion by seeKing to associate it's symbols with some apparent or claimed wrongdoing by human beings.

I'd also add that I'm not prepared to just accept the OP's one paragraph synopsis of the crusades as an authoritative judgement upon the conduct of so many long dead people, or the idea that any wrong doing was confined to one side - which it certainly wasn't .

That is exactly what I said.

In quote of me, " Or do we judge Islam off its writings? Same goes for the Bible."


Do you judge Christianity as bad when in the name of Christianity multiple people was murdered in the Salem Witch Trials?

If the teaching of that religion tells its believers to burn witches at the stake then yes you can accurately judge that religion as bad.

But if the Bible doesn't teach that then you can accurately say the so called Christians wasn't truly following their Holy Book.

Yes the Christian Crusades is rarely accurately taught. Or the knowledge that Islam had been crusading for centuries leading up the Christian defense of Europe and then the crusades to take back the Holy Land. In light of that context great evil was still committed under the Christian Crusaders who was for the most part brain washed by the state controlled church.

But knowing that still doesn't take away the fact that if you judge the people to try and judge the religion then that is a error in reasoning. You must judge their actions and words against the writings or commands of their Holy book, not just them and then say well Christianity is evil.

I think perhaps we reach the same destination by different roads.
I think it's an increasing methodology and deception in the modern world to try to discredit the message by discrediting the messenger , and that's what the OP was trying to do.

I'm not sure why we go into witch trials at Salem , but I think we're told not to suffer a witch to live, aren't we ? That's a complicated question but I don't discount the existence of things on the say so of modern interpretations or sensibilities. In fact , I'm quite sure that the modern equivalents are rife, spreading their unsavoury philosophy under cover of what they claim to be rational thinking and tolerance - the test of which is how tolerant they are of things they disagree with.

By the way, man cannot be good nor evil. These things are above him, but he has free will and may chose which he wishes to obey. Of course, in order to do this he must make a decision which is which.