Salvation by works or faith isn't the point.
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aS LONG AS A PERSON BELIEVES THERE WAS AND IS SUCH A THING AS jUDAISM, OR ANY Christian DENOMINATION THAT jESUS, yESHUA, WILL ADOPT they will never understand the Israel of God, Yahweh, nor who the true praisers of Yah are.
Messianich Jews, Jews for Jesus, etc are just more denominations contrived by the minds of men, flesh.
Messianich Jews, Jews for Jesus, etc are just more denominations contrived by the minds of men, flesh.
Jews are coming to faith in Jesus, in record numbers. So much so that the State ministry has to create laws against us, and perpetuate decades of discrimination. Why would you treat us the same? Is that a proper form of evangelizing? Never understand? That is a lie. Why can't you love us as God loves us? Yeshua represents Israel, who represents the nations. A house divided will not stand, so you simply divide the house and claim your standing?
People should read before replying, I don't think they're is a contradiction, this isn't a works v faith debate. It's an appeal for love, an encouragement. It's not about contradicting being saved by faith, but that love and loyalty are also important.
The faith v works arguments seem to essentialise the religion into its bare minimum. Motivation had many threads to it.
The faith v works arguments seem to essentialise the religion into its bare minimum. Motivation had many threads to it.
And I hope you can tell that through my wrangling with those who seek to divide rather than join together I have been calling for the uplifting of others as opposed to the divisive nature of us vs them, or faith 'vs' works. I too believe that faith produces works and they are joined as one. And I'm not meaning works 'of the law' as if to be bound by observance to the law as given Israel. I mean works. All being good as from God. Because the Spirit is dwelling within you leading you to all truth and wisdom.
I agree with your premise as stated above.
I agree with your premise as stated above.
Let us call for the uplifting al the Israel of God.
This encompasses all who believe Jesus, Yeshua, no matter what they presently believe their individual labels are.
All who praise God are praisers of God, Yah. Unhappily most do not understand from Leah's naming Judah to the Judah of Israel, the Judah who betrayed Him, and the two flocks now one.
This encompasses all who believe Jesus, Yeshua, no matter what they presently believe their individual labels are.
All who praise God are praisers of God, Yah. Unhappily most do not understand from Leah's naming Judah to the Judah of Israel, the Judah who betrayed Him, and the two flocks now one.
My God is not linear that he would follow such a divisive path. My God existed before time, and planned the end from the beginning as he dwells with us along the way. What was will be, and what will be will become again. There is nothing new under the sun. Jesus existed in glory with God in the creation. He exists now in our hearts by the power of the spirit. And will exist again as King and Lord of all. Yet, in fact, he IS all these things now, then, and forever. It is only our human perspective that can not see the complete picture. But with God all things are possible. Not by might, but through the spirit.
Wisdom is to be sough above all things. Fear of God is the beginning of wisdom, but not it's final goal.
Wisdom is to be sough above all things. Fear of God is the beginning of wisdom, but not it's final goal.
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It has nothinng to do with trying
I alread posted romans 11
The bible also says jesus came to his own and they did not recieve him
The jews are the ones who chose barabbus over christ,
And as punishment for their sin and rebellion, they were destroyed in 70 ad.
Israel will be restored, they will be saved, but that has not happened yet, and for you to say they have, well you need to study some more
I alread posted romans 11
The bible also says jesus came to his own and they did not recieve him
The jews are the ones who chose barabbus over christ,
And as punishment for their sin and rebellion, they were destroyed in 70 ad.
Israel will be restored, they will be saved, but that has not happened yet, and for you to say they have, well you need to study some more
Are the nations restored yet? Are they on their way to being restored? Should I focus and quote all the texts that point out the folly of the nations?
I guess we have opposite perspectives. I choose to focus on the love God has for Israel, and the restoration that is fully connected with the mission of Jesus Christ. I choose to see how God is restoring his people Israel even now, and how he was with them all along. I mean, come on, is this not the way you see your salvation? God is restoring you to himself even now, and he was with you even as you were in sin. He called and formed you in it, he called you out of it and he remains with you the whole time. Even when you don't realize he is there. Even when you think he rejects you for all the sin in your life.
My God is forever loving, ever merciful and ever ever patient. He forgives. He FORGIVES. Why would you continually remind others of our sins when God forgives them, as he forgives you?
No, full restoration has not happened, yet. Never said that. But I speak things as God sees them, as God speaks them. Not as we choose to see them. Yes, I think you are choosing to see and focus only on the sins of Israel. When will you focus on her redemption? Why is yours greater than hers? If not, why should I speak redemption to you when you will not openly speak of reconciliation and redemption of others? Answer, only because I am not called to do unto others as they do unto me. Not saying your doing eye for eye, just that to hold onto and proclaim your own redemption and forgiveness while denying Israel that same right is what I am meaning.
Israel may enter last, but they were called first. And those inbetween are called to help others along the way. How is it a help to point out faults more than blessings?
I guess we have opposite perspectives. I choose to focus on the love God has for Israel, and the restoration that is fully connected with the mission of Jesus Christ. I choose to see how God is restoring his people Israel even now, and how he was with them all along. I mean, come on, is this not the way you see your salvation? God is restoring you to himself even now, and he was with you even as you were in sin. He called and formed you in it, he called you out of it and he remains with you the whole time. Even when you don't realize he is there. Even when you think he rejects you for all the sin in your life.
My God is forever loving, ever merciful and ever ever patient. He forgives. He FORGIVES. Why would you continually remind others of our sins when God forgives them, as he forgives you?
No, full restoration has not happened, yet. Never said that. But I speak things as God sees them, as God speaks them. Not as we choose to see them. Yes, I think you are choosing to see and focus only on the sins of Israel. When will you focus on her redemption? Why is yours greater than hers? If not, why should I speak redemption to you when you will not openly speak of reconciliation and redemption of others? Answer, only because I am not called to do unto others as they do unto me. Not saying your doing eye for eye, just that to hold onto and proclaim your own redemption and forgiveness while denying Israel that same right is what I am meaning.
Israel may enter last, but they were called first. And those inbetween are called to help others along the way. How is it a help to point out faults more than blessings?
What the people of the world seek for is realness: love relationship, and vitality. Faith in God can be seen as a mere intellectual exercise that somehow tries to appease deity and does nothing for the psyche of the person.
The Sufi sect of Islam endeavors to find love, realness, and vitality by emphasizing the love of God instead of simply being a "slave" of God (as is typical of Islam). But it winds up becoming a swirling confusing mass of dances, chants, and bashed hopes of something that is never found. Why? because the core is Sufism is still selfishness! I want to find meaning and love for myself!
But the God of the Bible speaks truth and shows the way. Jesus said" I am the way, the truth, and the life". Man has sinned and the wages of sin is death! We are doomed to hell and eternal death. But God stepped in! His love gave a way through the death of His Son. This is way faith is so central to the Christian faith. We believe what God said and do not depend on our own works. We believe that the death of Jesus was the full payment for our sins.
But the human quest for love and reality is the key underlying story. It is the love of God that forms the foundation of the Christian faith. And it is a love story that results in devotion and vital service for the King of King and Lord of Lords.
But love will never be found in trying to find it by one's own ideas: it only be found the way that God said: by faith in His Son.!
The Sufi sect of Islam endeavors to find love, realness, and vitality by emphasizing the love of God instead of simply being a "slave" of God (as is typical of Islam). But it winds up becoming a swirling confusing mass of dances, chants, and bashed hopes of something that is never found. Why? because the core is Sufism is still selfishness! I want to find meaning and love for myself!
But the God of the Bible speaks truth and shows the way. Jesus said" I am the way, the truth, and the life". Man has sinned and the wages of sin is death! We are doomed to hell and eternal death. But God stepped in! His love gave a way through the death of His Son. This is way faith is so central to the Christian faith. We believe what God said and do not depend on our own works. We believe that the death of Jesus was the full payment for our sins.
But the human quest for love and reality is the key underlying story. It is the love of God that forms the foundation of the Christian faith. And it is a love story that results in devotion and vital service for the King of King and Lord of Lords.
But love will never be found in trying to find it by one's own ideas: it only be found the way that God said: by faith in His Son.!
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It's what James gave as an example of faith in the resurrection of Jesus Christ.
If you have faith, it doesn't necessity mean you will be ok.
I don't mean this in a nasty way at all. Look at. Buddhism. It's the enlightenment of man, without God. Satan also appears as an angel of light. It's nice that's Buddhists want to live in peace with everyone, but this is nothing more than atheism wrapped in a blanket. And the idea that if you don't attain enlightenment in this life, you might get there in the next is nonsense because,
it is appointed unto men once to die, but after this the judgment. Heb.9:27
As far as Rabia of Basra, its nice she want to devote her life to others for God. Jesus will decide where she goes, along with her Prophet Muhammad.
No hard feelings intended here my friend.
If you have faith, it doesn't necessity mean you will be ok.
I don't mean this in a nasty way at all. Look at. Buddhism. It's the enlightenment of man, without God. Satan also appears as an angel of light. It's nice that's Buddhists want to live in peace with everyone, but this is nothing more than atheism wrapped in a blanket. And the idea that if you don't attain enlightenment in this life, you might get there in the next is nonsense because,
it is appointed unto men once to die, but after this the judgment. Heb.9:27
As far as Rabia of Basra, its nice she want to devote her life to others for God. Jesus will decide where she goes, along with her Prophet Muhammad.
No hard feelings intended here my friend.
Sounds peachy but has no relevance to spiritual realities. The whole point of the preaching of the Gospel is so that no one will go to Hell. Everything else follows salvation by grace through faith in Christ alone and His finished work of redemption. If there was no Hell, there would have been no need for the cross.
Since you mention Sufism, which is a branch of Islam, even the Quran has much to say about Hell and Paradise. Except that according to the Quran, it is Christians and Jews are are deemed to be infidels bound for Hell.
Since you mention Sufism, which is a branch of Islam, even the Quran has much to say about Hell and Paradise. Except that according to the Quran, it is Christians and Jews are are deemed to be infidels bound for Hell.
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Sounds like they are going to have to learn what Paul meant when he said all that stuff I count as dung.
Under the new covenant believing the WORD of GOD Is all that Is needed and then renewing the mind to the new creation they had become.
Romans 12:1-2
King James Version
1 I beseech you therefore, brethren, by the mercies of God, that ye present your bodies a living sacrifice, holy, acceptable unto God, which is your reasonable service.
2 And be not conformed to this world: but be ye transformed by the renewing of your mind, that ye may prove what is that good, and acceptable, and perfect, will of God.
Under the new covenant believing the WORD of GOD Is all that Is needed and then renewing the mind to the new creation they had become.
Romans 12:1-2
King James Version
1 I beseech you therefore, brethren, by the mercies of God, that ye present your bodies a living sacrifice, holy, acceptable unto God, which is your reasonable service.
2 And be not conformed to this world: but be ye transformed by the renewing of your mind, that ye may prove what is that good, and acceptable, and perfect, will of God.