Not By Works

There is no difference but in terminology.....same coin......same thing.......except one is used by the workers for and salvation losers to devalue the truth

And of course I expect some flippant answer on your part and to fully reject the truth.....................

What a horrible post and thing to say.
So those who want to please God will be thrashing about on their beds...

and those who do NOTHING for God will die a peaceful death.

Isaiah 5:20-23
20Woe to those who call evil good, and good evil;
Who substitute darkness for light and light for darkness;
Who substitute bitter for sweet and sweet for bitter!

21Woe to those who are wise in their own eyes
And clever in their own sight!

22Woe to those who are heroes in drinking wine
And valiant men in mixing strong drink,

23Who justify the wicked for a bribe,
And take away the rights of the ones who are in the right!



1 Corinthians 15:1-2
1Now I make known to you, brethren, the gospel which I preached to you, which also you received, in which also you stand,
2by which also you are saved, if you hold fast the word which I preached to you, unless you believed in vain.


So easy to understand, it needs no comment...

Romans 7:15-20 and no problem on the questions.....

You don't know.
And yet you want to teach.

OSAS
Eternal Security
Perseverance of the Saints

DIFFERENT!
Learn it.

Not what I said and the truth is the truth.........that is exactly how they died...........

Sure Fran.....only in your mind and now you added one....more deception fro the Queen of Deception.......here I fixed it

yes, crops, you are right.

but we are talking about fruit. ( or we were till you moved the target again).

i'll say it again- grapes were a staple in Israel. grapes grow on vines that have to run, bloom, then the clusters of grapes began to grow.

that is a process. the vine is alive WHILE the fruit is in the PROCESS of growing.

if you want to try an adult word, it's called sanctification.

God bless you

This makes sense.

Maybe @UnderGrace was right and i just heard a bad sermon!

Thanks guys


Rom 7:15 For that which I do I allow not: for what I would, that do I not; but what I hate, that do I.
Rom 7:16 If then I do that which I would not, I consent unto the law that it is good.
Rom 7:17 Now then it is no more I that do it, but sin that dwelleth in me.
Rom 7:18 For I know that in me (that is, in my flesh,) dwelleth no good thing: for to will is present with me; but how to perform that which is good I find not.
Rom 7:19 For the good that I would I do not: but the evil which I would not, that I do.
Rom 7:20 Now if I do that I would not, it is no more I that do it, but sin that dwelleth in me.
Rom 7:21 I find then a law, that, when I would do good, evil is present with me.
Rom 7:22 For I delight in the law of God after the inward man:
Rom 7:23 But I see another law in my members, warring against the law of my mind, and bringing me into captivity to the law of sin which is in my members.
Rom 7:24 O wretched man that I am! who shall deliver me from the body of this death?
Rom 7:25 I thank God through Jesus Christ our Lord. So then with the mind I myself serve the law of God; but with the flesh the law of sin.

SOUNDS ABOUT RIGHT. Can i get an amen? Lets keep on fighting the good fight!

The fact that you have a struggle is a good sign bro.....and AMEN

HAHAHHAHAHAHAHHAHAHHAH love it....man the truth is so simple hey

Was the fruit in Matthew 13 crops or trees? Hahahahahahahaha, Dc

Sanctification is both instantaneous and progressive. In the real adult world, it begins instantly and then grows progressively.

Hahahahahahaha, DC

How long were the apostles saved before they began bearing fruit? Years?

Someone knows very little about church history.

Receive the word, teach others, who in turn teach others. No time to waste...

The danger is simply by repeating an idea, it becomes that idea is the only way to express the concept.
According to John, if we truly understand Jesus we will not sin.

That is quite a claim. Obviously no one could have experienced this, as these people know the whole of
human existance and can rightly judge everyone.

Now the idea that people are changed by God into people of the Kingdom is not a difficult step, considering
Jesus rose from the dead and will raise us from the dead. But defeated folk, lower their gaze to the ways of
the world and their slavery to sinful behaviour.

Those on the rocky ground are the ones who receive the word with joy when they hear it, but they have no root. They believe for a while, but in the time of testing they fall away.
It gets crazy when people go to such extraordinary lengths to explain away what a verse plainly states and means

Wrong again....you do not believe in eternal security....you believe in a self maintained salvation

This is called projection. What is its value?
It is rude, judgemental, condemnatory, derogatory.

If you know Jesus in your heart you know eternal security.
Paul describes the presence of the Holy Spirit as Gods approval on our lives.

Above I meant to say how long were the apostles converts saved before bearing fruit? Years before they could do it?That would have drastically slowed down the growth of the church which filled the known world even in Paul's day.

I guess you think the original believers did all that work by themselves for how ever many years it takes for a tree to grow

Not much knowledge of church history do you have

You got to realize that not everyone is an apostle.

Nobody said it ALWAYS takes a long time. To some people it IS instant. To some it takes time. IT VARIES

ah, so now I see what is behind your lack of being able to accept how fruit grows and matures.

you think sanctification is instantaneous .

you could not be more wrong.

moving on. nothing to see here. just another person so steeped in religious mindset, they can't see the forest for the tress.

Dont worry, WE GOT TIME.

That FRUIT will take some TIME.

(sorry guys i had to!)

Sorry to hear about you daughter stones, I will put you both on my prayer list. [/QUOTE]

Thank you. She is starting to do small things for herself now. The complication that rose was her ability to swallow. Now she is eating small bites of soft food. I am thankful for all prayers that arose all around the world. Took some time but she's healing.

No I said BOTH instantaneous and progressive.

I guess you don't ever read the posts.

How long did the original disciples bear all the fruit in the early church? In the amount of time it takes a tree to grow?

When Paul planted a church, did it take years for the children to bear fruit? How then did that church grow?