What is Hell ? A small study help

What both Paul and John experienced would today be called "out of body experiences". It's that simple.

What is the difference between "out of body experience" and a vision.

Does one leave their body to have a vision?

Hi thanks.... With all do respect I see that a little differently..

The unsaved will have nothing to be raised in or with .

I would offer. Ashes in the end.... going up in smoke they will never to rise as a new Creation . . . . the old earth or foundation is the witness of a residue of ashes. I think some call a hope of ashes rising the like Phoenix Something to be careful of. The old is not clothed or inherit the new .The new is not made of the rudiments of this this world .No one knows what the incorruptible will be other than incorruptible.

No rudiments of this world, What I call deader than a door nail . No memory of former things of the old corrupted earth.

When God saw pride in his head angel He corrupted the first creation . The wage of death was body, soul, spirit . Dead not eternally suffering.

The wrath or hell (tribulation) seeing hell is a living suffering it is being revealed from heaven even today .

Hell is described by the last as sign as a wonder which was fulfilled in Jesus signified by Jonas suffering likened to Jesus. . Hell is a living work of suffering with no rest called.

The punishment of Cain that he said he could not bear .this was because he refused to believe in a God not seen, Christ gave him no rest coming from his work of redemption, in his daily work that God had increased as punishment. . He became a restless wanderer who hated people of a faith, they preached their faith came from their savior.. Cain a marked man ( Unbelief ) God protected him from the hands of men he suffered his who life without a living hope of Christ sabbath . A work that Christ alone performed in our stead.

I would think the earth sets the stage used to reveal the gospel of Christ in respect to his bride the church the gospel. It is the gospel that can give a person his sabbath rest.

In both examples ( Jonas and Jesus ). . . of hells great fury the wrath of God we can see a living work of suffering being perform .(no dead sacrifices) Death shows spirit life has departed.

The wrath of God is the same as the wrath of hell men have divided that wrath and developed doctrine as a remnant here and another there . But death has one purpose to reveal the wrath of hell... the suffering we do perform in these bodies of death.

For I am not ashamed of the gospel of Christ: for it is the power of God unto salvation to every one that believeth; to the Jew first, and also to the Greek. For therein is the righteousness of God revealed from faith to faith: as it is written, The just shall live by faith. For the wrath of God is revealed from heaven against all ungodliness and unrighteousness of men, who hold the truth in unrighteousness; Because that which may be known of God is manifest in them; for God hath shewed it unto them. For the invisible things of him from the creation of the world are clearly seen, being understood by the things that are made, even his eternal power and Godhead; so that they are without excuse: Romans 1: 16- 20

I am offering three examples below of the finality of the death sentence of those who do not receive a new born again spirit that will rise on the last day . According to the rendering of the phrase "last day" it is used 6 or seven times in John .Both the day we receive our new bodies and the same twinkling of the eye the second death thrown into the lake of judgment never to rise to new spirit life forever more.

The promise of his wrath.

Genesis 3:19In the sweat of thy face shalt thou eat bread, till thou return unto the ground; for out of it wast thou taken: for dust thou art, and unto dust shalt thou return.

Our breath of life..

Psalm 104:29Thou hidest thy face, they are troubled: thou takest away their breath, ( spirit) they die, and return to their dust.

The flesh without the spirit essence is dead .. Just as faith as a work, without the ability of the spirit to move is dead (James 2:20 )

Ecclesiastes 12:7Then shall the dust return to the earth as it was: and the spirit shall return unto God who gave it.

(1) As it was (No life). . . . one source of no life

(2) unto God who gave it. (life) . . . the living source.

Sorry but you should believe Scripture, not what some false teachers have been promoting. There is a resurrection of the unsaved (or the unjust) called "the resurrection of damnation", and both Christ and Paul made that crystal clear.

THE WORDS OF JESUS
Marvel not at this: for the hour is coming, in the which all that are in the graves shall hear his voice, And shall come forth; they that have done good, unto the resurrection of life; and they that have done evil, unto the resurrection of damnation. (Jn 5:28,29)

THE WORDS OF PAUL
But this I confess unto thee, that after the way which they call heresy, so worship I the God of my fathers, believing all things which are written in the law and in the prophets: And have hope toward God, which they themselves also allow, that there shall be a resurrection of the dead, both of the just and unjust. (Acts 24:14,15)

That confuses me (not that hard to do) LOl

Jesus never moved one inch. . . not one grain of sand fell of his foot. ... How long would it take back then on a Camel to show all the kingdoms of the world and all the glories of each one,.. . . Astro projection ? ?.


The Catholics I have a patron Astro projector. . . saint Padre Pio. Mister. . . . Hey I have a hole in my hand who can travel at will Biolocation. It was reported he washed the windows outside on a ten story cathedral with out a ladder or scaffolding .

No such thing as a out of the body experience. Catholisicim offers 3500 and rising out of the body worker with familiar spirts. I would ask. How many is enough?

As it is written. . . . information coming in .Simply enough...

Faith don't leave earth without it.. its the ticket home

Thanks Not a redemption matter...I hear you. . . no offence.

Unto the resurrection of damnation there shall be a resurrection of the dead as those who died under the letter of the law. Therefore they will never to rise to new spirit life with those who do all both rise together in the same twinkling of the eye. . Unexpected like a thief in the night.

John 6:39 And this is the Father's will which hath sent me, that of all which he hath given me I should lose nothing, but should raise it up again at the last day.

John 6:40 And this is the will of him that sent me, that every one which seeth the Son, and believeth on him, may have everlasting life: and I will raise him up at the last day.

John 6:44No man can come to me, except the Father which hath sent me draw him: and I will raise him up at the last day.

John 6:54Whoso eateth my flesh, and drinketh my blood, hath eternal life; and I will raise him up at the last day.

John 11:24Martha saith unto him, I know that he shall rise again in the resurrection at the last day.

John 12:48He that rejecteth me, and receiveth not my words, hath one that judgeth him: the word that I have spoken, the same shall "judge him" in the last day.

Those who believe not (no faith) have already been judged they are living out that judgment the first death . Death as wage of sin is thrown into the lake of fire. (tool or rod of judgement.

The new order in the new heavens and earth has no letter of the law that could kill. A new creation. The letter of the law having fulfilled its purpose of preparing the bride of Christ, the church. She is seen coming down on the last day

He that believeth on him is not condemned: but he that believeth not is condemned already, because he hath not believed in the name of the only begotten Son of God.John 3:18

Scripture doesn't use the phrase, "out of body experience". I'd suggest that the difference is that in a vision, one sees something like a movie, while in an OOBE, one is "inside" the movie.

If you're easily confused as you say, you'd do well to pay no attention at all to what the Catholics claim, either for experiences or doctrine.

The term is "astral projection" which is a belief of certain Eastern/mystic religions, not of biblical Christianity.

Scripture doesn't tell us how the devil showed Jesus all the kingdoms of the earth. Any guess is just that; a guess.

And neither one died and went to hell........

Well I feel like this is an assumption since maybe their body went with them?

Scripture simply doesn't say. Paul says that he doesn't know whether it was in the body or out of it.

In Paul's case, his out of body experience could have been when he had been left for dead at one time (Acts 14:19). In any event he was in Heaven and in fact in Paradise.

John says. "On the Lord’s Day I was in the Spirit... " Rev 1:10

Well of course he does not. He would never dreamed up the idea of out of the body experiences as a work of bilocation as if it was one of the approved manners God brought prophecy.

The only thing it could be is false information coming in as a lying wonder. The same kind the father of lies attempted to bring into Jesus fleshly mind. Jesus did the will of the Father in heaven all three times gave glory to God not seen as said again and again as it is written. Not as you imagine there you are. .wish upon a star. That how it would seem to me. it would appear to mock asll things written in the law and the prophets . Its getting more and more popular . Would that mean truth is growing?

Jesus reveals to His children the exclusive source of faith by which we only can know God. as it is written.(prophecy)

Jesus told him to go sell his wares someone where else .Christians buy truth as it is written. The god of this world fled away looking for another to deceive with mysticism which is not the faith that comes from hearing God.

Earthly inspired of the devil intruding into those things which he hath not seen, vainly puffed up by his fleshly mind,.

No such thing as literally out of your body. A body without a spirit has no life at all. (james2:26) Backup batteries not included . The whole idea makes no biblical sense.

Let no man beguile you of your reward in a voluntary humility and worshipping of angels, intruding into those things which he hath not seen, vainly "puffed up" by his fleshly mind, And not holding the Head, from which all the body by joints and bands having nourishment ministered, and knit together, increaseth with the increase of God. Colossains2: 18-19

Nor would he have made up such a convoluted and verbose description. As I said before, what he and John experienced would today be called "out of body experiences". I didn't say, or even hint, that he called them that.

So is that what you think Paul experienced? False information coming in as a lying wonder?

Scripture doesn't say that. What the devil did was show Jesus all the kingdoms of the world. Scripture doesn't say how, and it doesn't even hint that it was a "lying wonder". Jesus didn't challenge the devil on the ownership of the kingdoms; He accepts that they are the devil's to give.

Again, you are convoluting the truth by dragging together unrelated passages.

It would also help if you learned what key terms actually mean instead of assuming that you understand them.

The subject seems to be about. How can we hear God's prophecy as vision as one of the manners of brining new prophecy .This is when he was still bringing new revelations ,

In this case "which it is not lawful … to repeat " They were designed for Paul's own comfort, and not for communication to others. Like the thorn in his side in his born again vision. Others saw the light but were not given the faith to believe. They did not hear the voice of God.

Paul had not the authority or freedom and if he had would he have been permitted earthly men could not comprehend them . A man may hear and know more than he can speak.

If I have told you earthly things, and ye believe not, how shall ye believe, if I tell you of heavenly things? (Joh 3:12)

Not every thing Christ revealed was written down. Like he informs us in John 21 the whole world could not hold the books that could be written . We are subject to as it is written .Why go above that which is written if we walk by faith?

And there are also many other things which Jesus did, the which, if they should be written every one, I suppose that even the world itself could not contain the books that should be written. Amen. John 21:25

You said he did not know. You would have to know something to believer it . Do you think he was confused and had no idea if vision come in to ones mind as inspired prophecy. I think he knew were he was and whether or not he was in or out of His body.

Its one of those things . No matter where you go there you are.

Big difference between faith and mysticism.

No need to guess when a person has the faith needed to believe. Guessing is for philosophers . The creators of false visions as lying wonders.

God has not left us as orphans . Jesus said three time. . . as it is written for some reason . Who gave Jesus those words? Why?

The improper kind of vision did not puff up the fleshly mind of Jesus even though in his weakened mind having not eaten 40 days . He suffered through it giving glory to God not seen. Why go above that which is written ?

It does reveals the philosophy king. The king of will worship . His motto ….I will be like God

Colossian is designed to turn things right side up . As it is written (sola scriptura) the reforming authority in any generation. Study the doctrine of "will worship" having to do with "voluntary humility" or self edification

Beware lest any man spoil you through philosophy and vain deceit, after the tradition of men, after the rudiments of the world, and not after Christ. Colossian 2:8

Let no man beguile you of your reward in a voluntary humility and worshipping of angels, intruding into those things which he hath not seen, vainly puffed up by his fleshly mind, Colossian 2:18

Wherefore if ye be dead with Christ from the rudiments of the world, why, as though living in the world, are ye subject to ordinances, (Touch not; taste not; handle not; Which all are to perish with the using after the commandments and doctrines of men? Which things have indeed a shew of wisdom in will worship, and humility, and neglecting of the body: not in any honour to the satisfying of the flesh. , Colossian 2: 20-23