Not By Works

Thanks.....a WW2 buff......and many wonderful analogies can be found to accurately describe what salvation losers and salvation gainers by works believe and peddle......

I gave him more chances than I should have, but I kept hoping he would respond to my continuous calling him to be Born Again. He just kept Rejecting the Message, trusting only in his own abilities.

You are not the only one.........I asked him to no longer respond to me.......it is impossible to engage one that lacks scriptural honesty and integrity..

That third word should have been mean.

And a complete lack of Understanding.

When does that happen in relation to baptism? The moment you are saved you receive faith through grace, then salvation, and justification, and sanctification? Of does the gift faith through grace baptism, repent, then you are saved then then baptism then salvation then justification then sanctification? Maybe its just the order wrong, Please also let me know. and at what point are you grafted into the vine? When is it ok to do works? Faith, grace, save, repent, baptize, salvation, justification, sanctification, graft, works, eternal life

So the "unsaved" are grafted into the vine and then cut off and burned? So the unsaved can be grafted in, but they don't receive eternal salvation or justification, etc, but when the saved are grafted in they do? and they produce fruit and those fruit are not works they are?

fruits of the spirit is lifestyle? This may be answered by the question above. Just trying to keep it straight.
We do follow the law/keep the commandments then? We do sin, we do repent, we obey?

I am trying to put it all in the order as people are telling me it goes. I hope I got it close to right, I'll soon see. Very interested in the unsaved being grafted in. Very happy to see keep the commandments because of the Lords Prayer and sin and repentance. Looking forward to it.

Do you believe someone needs to experience the cerimony of water baptism to be saved?

If so you're wrong.

The baptism of the Holy spirit is more than enough to ensure someone is sealed and kept by the power of God.

That is not of the spirit, not productive, not you.

3 Jesus answered and said unto him, Verily, verily, I say unto thee, Except a man be born again, he cannot see the kingdom of God.

(Jesus chose to use birth as an earthly example to help the lost Nicodemus who believed in works and didn't understand spiritual things to explain something spiritual to him)

4 Nicodemus saith unto him, How can a man be born when he is old? can he enter the second time into his mother's womb, and be born?

(again Nicodemus is unable to understand this spiritual lesson even with an earthly example of birth so he uses his earthly reasoning to question Jesus)

5 Jesus answered, Verily, verily, I say unto thee, Except a man be born of water and of the Spirit, he cannot enter into the kingdom of God.

(still speaking of brith and trying to relate the two.... born of water = anatomical fluid and born of the Spirit = when God makes His children new)

6 That which is born of the flesh is flesh; and that which is born of the Spirit is spirit.

(again further explaining the two births.... born of flesh = born of water / born of Spirit = God)


7 Marvel not that I said unto thee, Ye must be born again.


nothing about baptism here

but I posted it with context since people who do not understand the scriptures try to tie this to water baptism

Jesus clearly demonstrates His point though, and it has nothing to do with water baptism

“Easy Believist”
Thank you for blessing me with more snarkiness. Please keep the insults coming. I rejoice in Jesus’ words found in Matthew 5:10-12. And believe me, you’re no burden. Praying for you is a joy, not a burden.

Eh?

The post is in reference to another post that mentioned a bartender. A bartender serves spirits such as vodka, gin, etc. Apparently a lame attempt at humor on my part.

WOW, you ask a LOT of Questions in ONE POST. You have to consider How much space there is left for ME to answer. DO NOT ASK MORE THAN TWO QUESTIONS PER POST. There are 10 in your post, which Limits me to very few sentences to answer each question.

I will try to SIMPLIFY IT, by starting with your misunderstanding of GRAFTED IN. Many Church think Christ Grafted into the Vine, MEANS they think we become Spiritual Israelites. NOT! And I can PROVE THAT TO YOU, that GOD is not FINISHED WITH ISRAEL And you need to Separate the Two Covenant Assemblies to be BIBLICAL until the RAPTURE.


There is the most common GRAPHED IN trees in our agriculture. English Walnut are GRAPHED IN to Black Walnut trunks and Roots. NEVER DO THEY PRODUCE BLACK WALNUTS ON THE ENGLISH WALNUT BRANCHES. So much for the FALSE THEORY that we are Spiritual Israelites. It only means we get the Sustenances come from the SAME SOURCE as the Isaelites.

Do you know that the word CHURCH is NOT IN THE TEACHINGS OF THE DISCIPLES or JESUS? JESUS Did not say: "I will build my CHURCH and the gates of Hades will not prevail against it." Here is what JESUS actually SAID:

Matthew 16:18 (YLT)
18 `And I also say to thee, that thou art a rock, and upon this rock I will build my assembly, and gates of Hades shall not prevail against it;

Yes, that is the SAME NAME AS HE CALLED THE OLD TESTAMENT ASSEMBLY. I personally think they confused the issue by INSERTING the word CHURCH when they started to use it, sometime after the BIBLE was complete. There are TWO FOLDS, that will not become ONE FLOCK, UNTIL THE RAPTURE.
Look at this:

John 10:14-17 (NJB)
14 I am the good shepherd; I know my own and my own know me,
15 just as the Father knows me and I know the Father; and I lay down my life for my sheep.
16 And there are other sheep I have that are not of this fold, and I must lead these too. They too will listen to my voice, and there will be only one flock, one shepherd.
17 The Father loves me, because I lay down my life in order to take it up again.

First of all remember the Birthday of the CHURCH is the Day of Pentecost after HIS RESURRECTION. So who is he talking to HERE? It has to be the LAST of the Old Testament SAINTS, who had the FAITH OF ABRAHAM just like us. They believed GOD and it was counted unto them as Righteousness. So they were all saved the same way we are. AND BOTH OF US LISTEN TO HIS VOICE.

Malachi 3:6 (HCSB)
6 “Because I, Yahweh, have not changed,
you descendants of Jacob have not been destroyed.

When we have that FAITH OF ABRAHAM, we are SAVED, AND GOD KNOWS WHO WE ARE WAY BEFORE, and HE SAID BEFORE TIME BEGAN:

2 Timothy 1:9 (HCSB)
9 He has saved us and called us with a holy calling, not according to our works, but according to His own purpose and grace,
which was given to us in Christ Jesus before time began.

Here is why I have a low tolerance for People who think they can EARN SALVATION and have to WORK TO KEEP THEMSELVES SAVED.

John 10:1 (NASB)
1 "Truly, truly, I say to you, he who does not enter by the door into the fold of the sheep, but climbs up some other way, he is a thief and a robber.

Now that is an Eye Opener.

When WE make a DECISION to RECEIVE CHRIST as LORD meaning MASTER, we know that Decision MEANS NO TURNING BACK.
AND WHO IS RESPONSIBLE TO KEEP US SAVED ? ? ? GUESS WHO ? ? ?

John 10:27-30 (HCSB)
27 My sheep hear My voice, I know them, and they follow Me.
28 I give them eternal life, and they will never perish—ever! No one will snatch them out of My hand.
29 My Father, who has given them to Me, is greater than all. No one is able to snatch them out of the Father’s hand.
30 The Father and I are one.”

1 Peter 1:3-5 (HCSB)
3 Praise the God and Father of our Lord Jesus Christ. According to His great mercy, He has given us a new birth into a living hope through the resurrection of Jesus Christ from the dead
4 and into an inheritance that is imperishable, uncorrupted, and unfading, kept in heaven for you.
5 You are being protected by God’s power through faith for a salvation that is ready to be revealed in the last time.

Philippians 1:6 (HCSB)
6 I am sure of this, that He who started a good work in you will carry it on to completion until the day of Christ Jesus.


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Maybe it would be helpful if I share a bit of my Testimony with you.

First of all I was born and raised a LUTHERAN that was baptized as an infant. I was NOT Born Again until I was 29 years of age, and only then do I consider myself a REAL CHRISTIAN, and did not change churches until I was 30 years old, and now I am 70. Was I a Church Goer that thought I had to be a Christian because I took up space on a pew fairly regularly. They only had 10 - 15 minute sermons in the Lutheran Church, a STARVATION DIET OF THE WORD at best. I first when to Evangelical Free Church with 45 min. sermons, then to a non-denominational that the sermons lasted at least an hour. I COULD NOT GET ENOUGH BIBLE TEACHING!

So the difference between before I was Born Again and after, I totally Surrendered to JESUS, the night of my third attempt at SUICIDE in a week; is the difference between NIGHT AND DAY. I do not think I was ever saved growing up, but that night after several hours of weeping and CRYING like a baby, over my utterly sinful lifestyle, I willing gave CONTROL OF MY LIFE TO JESUS as my LORD AND MASTER out of PURE LOVE. THAT IS THE FIRST TIME I KNOW HE CAME INTO MY HEART AND THE HOLY SPIRIT TOO, and began to transform ME. IT WAS CHRIST IN ME WHO DID IT ALL.

Ask me again, if you want more details.

Here is how weird it is. I say salvation can be lost BUT even with your beliefs, as opposed to mine as they are, would never be the cause of salvation lost. I believe you can only have one or two verses of the Bible correct, and if you love God, you take Jesus as your Lord and Savior, you are good as gold. (All of this is good up until the day Satan arrives then it all changes but for now these are all true as the day is long) It is about INTENT, not knowledge. I believe AFTER ALL THE GIFTS ARE HANDED OUT SO IT doesn't matter, that you will be held accountable. There will be rewards and punishment. And if you do not repent for your sins it is going to be bad.

Now, here is where we really differ. If a person, having truly been saved at one time, and in love with the Lord, with all they are, but something in this world happens and they choose to TURN YOUR BACK ON HIM and get as evil as they want, God does not have to honor that gift.
You say He does.
I say God has limits You say God does not. So other than how much I should be covered under your doctrine, I am not, and as much as you don't think you are covered under mine, you are.

I am not going to get into the rest because I see "Israel" as different with different promises that can not be changed. It has to do with the first earth age and the first being last and the last being first and that whole Rapture thing we shall not touch.

I wish I understood the reason for saying snarkiness.
Easy believism is just that. It is a theological definition of a group who have a focus on a framework
at no cost. Now if speaking the truth is snarky, unfortunately your position is flawed.

If you want to suggest it is the gospel and I am a legalist, then that is how our views play out.
If you are hungering and thirsting after righteousness, then amen.

But I asked a question, and you said I was snarky. That suggested to me you are sensitive to
the definitions that have been discovered by others about these groups. Now I do not know your
position, but agression to questions leaves little else.

I do wonder if being honest is not the simplest method. Each believer can explain their perspective.
Maybe the idea others might disagree and show another perspective is just too difficult to handle.

I am just joking. Do you know how serious people take themselves, like another is going to suddenly
see something new, or another will no longer be on their original course.
I also suspect quite a few disorders lie underneath some interactions nothing to do with spiritual
issues but simple coping strategies. God bless you.

Pompous ideas. Everyone uses their assumptions to interpret words and verses.
If one wants honesty, you need to put on the assumptions of another and see it their way.

Sadly emotional bias can stop some from doing this, because the pain or even possibility of another
perspective has to be rejected. We are all vulnerable to this, which is why we need to be humble and
questioning always.

The problem is when people hold emotional sway over others, while hiding their true foundations.
A clear indication of those who do this, say things like, "you do not know what I believe".
But being destructive or critical about others positions, is so much easier if you do not declare ones
own position.

Jesus was simple. Get ones heart right, justice, mercy and failfulness, purify ones heart and you will
see God. Ofcourse the impure and unrepentant will never agree, because their very state denies the
reality which would confirm the truth of it. Once you compromise with sin, greed and self indulgence
is the only way, domination and playing the game of top of the hill.

It is obvious who is playing top of the hill and who cares about the heart. What literally flows from
them is conversations and words declares it from the hill top.

Amen.......these salvation losers and workers for <---no scriptural honesty, no scriptural integrity and context is a non existent word nor do the very definitions of the words mean a thing.....

Several now banned members love the terms easy believism....they obviously did not understand...

Be not removed from the simplicity found in Christ

which is

It pleased God by tue foolishness of preaching to save them that believe