Did Jesus ever tell us that we no longer need to keep the law of Moses?

Become, (Became, Becoming) to be.
"to come, change, or grow to be (as specified):He became tired.
to come into being."

Read the verse in that context. "But as many as received him, to them he gave the right to be the sons of God, even to them that believe on his name. "

Our Lord died , he did the hard work, to take the sins of the world upon himself when he died on the cross. All we have to do in return, any person on earth, is believe. John 3:16
Romans 8:14 For all who are led by the Spirit of God are sons of God.

Jesus is The Word, and in Him is Life and Light.
Galatians 3:26 For in Christ Jesus you are all sons of God, through faith.

5207. huios Usage: A son, descendant.
We are all children of God because we began in and from God at creation. Redemption, Salvation, is releasing the illusion of this world, the chasm between flesh and spirit, and recognizing, reuniting, our consciousness with our source. Reuniting ourselves with our Father.
We don't work for that. Jesus did the work so that we could believe we are more than this flesh. And always have been.

Romans 8:14 For all who are led by the Spirit of God are sons[a] of God.15 For you did not receive the spirit of slavery to fall back into fear, but you have received the Spirit of adoption as sons, by whom we cry, “Abba! Father!” 16 The Spirit himself bears witness with our spirit that we are children of God,

Footnotes:

1. [a]Romans 8:14 See discussion on “sons” in the Preface

"Are", children of God. Not, shall be if contingent upon our laboring to receive that gift. We are already received of that gift , the grace of the Father gifted us his only begotten son to die for us, our sins, so that we may live eternally in his life.

Of course, this is my understanding of the love, grace, and irrevocable gift of God. Those who believe differently in that our being children of God, descendants of God, through creation and reunion by God's gift of grace that achieved that through the sacrifice of himself on the cross, is their faith and belief. There are many who think they must labor in order to achieve the grace of God at the end. It is my belief that if I could do that , work to be rewarded with all the revelation of the gospel teaches, God would have then known he didn't have to die in order to seal a new covenant to that effect. He could have simply given rules to be obeyed and in the end had I stepped correctly in the outline those rules afforded on the road to redemption, would then be saved for having achieved that by my own effort.
However, I don't think someone who's vision and mind is occupied by the sin this world affords would be able to discern that path that is of righteousness and peace. How does one who is in sin know how to live righteously?

Anyway, those are my thoughts on this.

I think that we should make that point clear too. Who thinks that way on here?

I was pasting what the scripture said to that effect.

I agree.

Yes, I do believe that as well.

Your police analogy is a good one. I think we feel comfortable in the presence of law enforcement because we obey the laws. And I think that is because we know in our spirit and as a matter of character, even before I was saved, as I speak for myself now, that it is not who I am to murder, steal, and so forth.

I don't think the ten commandments issuance compelled a people to start following those rules. I think the ten commandments reiterated an understanding between God and good and decent people who knew the rules of good conduct and respect among people. And the commandments encapsulated those as an understanding between people and God.
I don't think people violated those commands before they were carved in stone. I think people, of course not all people, just as today when we know not all people are law abiding, lived the commands as they awaited their deliverer from the bonds of Egypt as slaves to Pharaoh and a tribe among one another.
And today, those commands are grounded in love. Love of God and love for self, and one another. That is why I believe God said he wrote his laws in our heart and mind so that we, not a singular people, we, may never be separated from them. I think that is why there are good people. And there are those who are removed from that awareness of being a moral person. Because that's what makes this world go round. It is why the creator of it knew we needed to be saved. Because we can never save ourselves.

To be clear, I was not referring to anyone in this community. As you see in my post, mine was a generalization. Because as we know there are teachings out there that allude to the works salvation principle.
I believe the teachings tell me that I am justified by faith.
There are those who disagree. (Those, as in, others anywhere at all. Just to be clear.)

“I and my Father are one.”
I’ll let Jesus answer for me.

Things are getting silly round here. I can't see me staying much longer.

I just got here. Stick around.

So far no one. Not one person has answered that question with a yes that I have seen. I believe if it wasn't for being brought up as it is not the way , it would never be mentioned at all as a way.

I think it is important to recognize that the irrevocability of the Gift of Grace is true, God will not revoke it, but a man may choose not to walk in it which is to despise the Gift of Grace. The gift of Grace again fills a mans heart with a desire and love for the will and laws of God. If that Kleptomaniac I mentioned earlier neglects the inherent desire to "not steal" and to "consider the store owner" above himself, in other words the New Creations heart attitude, and returns again to his old ways, frustrating the Grace of God by sinning and does not quickly repent and put the old man back on the cross and give the Holy Spirit/Grace of God control over our hearts. To continue deliberately in those sins is to neglect and despise the Gift! That would be more than a slip, it would represent a deliberate and calculated despite to the Holy Spirit! And, in that case it would not be God that revoked it, it would be that individual that rejected it!

Heb 6:4-6 NIV It is impossible for those who have once been enlightened, who have tasted the heavenly gift, who have shared in the Holy Spirit, (5) who have tasted the goodness of the word of God and the powers of the coming age, (6) if they fall away, to be brought back to repentance, because to their loss they are crucifying the Son of God all over again and subjecting him to public disgrace.

In matters of that perspective , falling away, I first consider the words that refer to predestination of all things. And also I recall those words that tell me of God's zeal for his own glory. And then I remember the Lamb's Book of Life where all the saved given eternal life have their names written before the world began. And then I remember Jesus promising me that no one comes to him but that the Father calls them. And when we do this no one will remove us from his hand. That would refer to ourselves as well. When God's gifts are irrevocable that would settle the matter on both sides I think.

In short, I believe what God tells me about his grace and will. God chose me in him before I chose to follow Christ. God knows all things and when God would sacrifice himself in order to take on the sin debt that originated through himself for humankind , then God would never lose patience with any one of us who may stumble away from the path of righteousness in him. We may turn away from God however, God promises he will never turn away from us. I believe this because of the names written in the Book of Life before the beginning of this world. God foreknows and predestines all.

What I read the Apostle Saint Paul to be saying in the Hebrew verse is that while we may fall away, we are never lost again to what we once were. To become that sinner dead in our sins as we once were. To think that would necessitate crucifying Jesus all over again. No, when we are called to Christ by the Father the Father , remembering the Book of Life, knows us by name and knows we are there for eternity. He also knows we are human and frail and weak at times.

And even though we may stumble and turn away, we always and forever have God at our back. He does not turn away from us.
We in our behavior, choice if you will, cannot undo the rebirth that God's grace accomplished in making us a new creation in him. If we could, as I see it, that would make our will greater than what God has predestined for us. And that would then make us more aware, more powerful, than the Father of creation.
In my view, that would be blasphemy of the highest order. And sacrilege of the gift.

Slippery slope,

To disregard the potential for catastrophic loss as discussed in Hebrews 6:4-6 and to prolong a lapse into reviving the carnal man and supressing the gift of Grace, the New Creation, could be an eternal loss.

To disregard the admonition of Peter;
Php 2:12-15 NIV Therefore, my dear friends, as you have always obeyed—not only in my presence, but now much more in my absence—continue to work out your salvation with fear and trembling, (13) for it is God who works in you to will and to act according to his good purpose. (14) Do everything without complaining or arguing, (15) so that you may become blameless and pure, children of God without fault in a crooked and depraved generation, in which you shine like stars in the universe

If it is true and a man thinks there is room to dabble in sin He may be lost.

To ignore the knowledge given in Hebrews 6:4-6 invites foolishness! What if any harm is there in remaining eternally vigilant! Is it too proactive? Does it take away the Grace of God and the Holy Spirits gift of a heart to Do His will? NO! The only thing that is lost in negating Hebrews 6:4-6 is the free weekend "Sin pass" that so many wish to reserve room for while they espouse the merits of Gods Grace! Could people who espouse this doctrine have had it and lost it? Could they have never received it? Dunno!

I am no stranger to the notion that a life of continual obedience to the will of God is a life without sin! At Sinai the Israelite's "stood afar off" as the commandments were given to Moses, Why, because to hear them they (the old man that loved sin) would DIE! The sinful nature would be put down! They essentially Kept the New Creation at a distance;

Exo 20:18-21 NIV When the people saw the thunder and lightning and heard the trumpet and saw the mountain in smoke, they trembled with fear. They stayed at a distance (19) and said to Moses, "Speak to us yourself and we will listen. But do not have God speak to us or we will die." (20) Moses said to the people, "Do not be afraid. God has come to test you, so that the fear of God will be with you to keep you from sinning." (21) The people remained at a distance, while Moses approached the thick darkness where God was.

They were facing their Pentecost and refused the Spirit of God that would "keep you from sinning"! But the reality of the "Old Man" abnegating the throne and allowing the New Creation to put the old man down meant crisply that the sins they relished and took pleasure in would be terminated! Sobering reality! Remember Israel had already agreed in Ex Ch 19 to the conditions of the contract/covenant, but they reneged on the Hearing the voice of God that would stop them from sinning! That was a step too far! When men accept the gift of justification do they not accept the Lordship of Christ over their lives? Is that not one of the terms of the New Covenant? Is not the receiving the Holy Spirit and hence a new heart that will keep them from sinning part of that contract/covenant? If so them where is the problem with validating the meaning of Hebrews 6:4-6 in it's full strength?

Let no one deceive you with empty words, for because of such things God’s wrath comes on those who are disobedient. Therefore do not be partners with them. For you were once darkness, but now you are light in the Lord. Live as children of light (for the fruit of the light consists in all goodness, righteousness and truth) and find out what pleases the Lord. Have nothing to do with the fruitless deeds of darkness, but rather expose them. For it is shameful even to mention what the disobedient do in secret. But everything exposed by the light becomes visible, for it is light that makes everything visible. This is why it is said: “Wake up, O sleeper, rise from the dead, and Christ will shine on you.” Ephesians 5:6-14

So then, men ought to regard us as servants of Christ and as those entrusted with the secret things of God. Now it is required that those who have been given a trust must prove faithful. I care very little if I am judged by you or by any human court; indeed, I do not even judge myself. My conscience is clear, but that does not make me innocent. It is the Lord who judges me. Therefore judge nothing before the appointed time; wait till the Lord comes. He will bring to light what is hidden in darkness and will expose the motives of men’s hearts. At that time each will receive his praise from God. Now, brothers, I have applied these things to myself and Apollos for your benefit, so that you may learn from us the meaning of the saying, “Do not go beyond what is written.” Then you will not take pride in one man over against another. For who makes you different from anyone else? What do you have that you did not receive? And if you did receive it, why do you boast as though you did not? 1 Corinthians 4:1-7

Rom 8:12-13 NIV Therefore, brothers, we have an obligation—but it is not to the sinful nature, to live according to it. (13) For if you live according to the sinful nature, you will die; but if by the Spirit you put to death the misdeeds of the body, you will live,

There are the marching orders, from Paul! Walk circumspectly.

1Jn 3:6 NIV No one who lives in him keeps on sinning. No one who continues to sin has either seen him or known him.

I have heard it said many times; "Anyone who defends lawlessness does not, and cannot Know the God of Grace they claim!"

So rather than REST in and ABIDE in the Power that stopped the kleptomania you think it is a better idea to TURN AWAY and go back to your own work.

Sounds like a bad decision to me. One that is warned AGAINST by Paul and Peter. And Christ Himself...

2 Peter 3:17-18
17 Ye therefore, beloved, seeing ye know these things before, beware lest ye also, being led away with the error of the wicked, fall from your own stedfastness.
18 But grow in grace, and in the knowledge of our Lord and Saviour Jesus Christ. To him be glory both now and for ever. Amen.

Galatians 5:1 Stand fast therefore in the liberty wherewith Christ hath made us free, and be not entangled again with the yoke of bondage.

Peter calls it the Error of the wicked. Paul asks how you can be so foolish for going back to it.

Galatians 3:3 Are ye so foolish? having begun in the Spirit, are ye now made perfect by the flesh?

The Scripture shows that it is actually the other way around. Those that defend their work at the law cannot know what Grace even is to even begin to comment on knowing the God of Grace.

Romans 11:6 And if by grace, then is it no more of works: otherwise grace is no more grace. But if it be of works, then it is no more grace: otherwise work is no more work.


I am curious to find these people who defend lawlessness.

Unless you mean Christians who have received Salvation and with it the blessing of REST from their work at the law. I already know them. Well a few, anyway...

I have been hearing about these " Christians " who defend lawlessness, but, much like bigfoot or the loch ness monster, have yet to see any actual proof of them, by the ones who throw out the accusations.

now, if they are referring to us who use the New Testament instructions on how we are to conduct ourselves, which repeat nine of the Ten, with the exception being the Sabbath, and not the Law of Moses. ( one, not multiple as the judeaizers say). then maybe I have seen some...

It is so strange how we go round and round on this one. To try to keep the law as a "carnal man" is the same as asking a kleptomaniac candy feind to keep his hand in his pockets in serve yourself/honor system candy store, let's make that a gourmet candy store! He would have no rest in trying or succeeding in his attempts! But the Justified man who goes on to receive the anointing of the Holy Spirit who subdues his Kleptomaniasm and replaces it with a love for Gods law not to steaal and for the candy store owner, well he has rest in his decision not to steal any candy! It's now the predominate desire over his once predominate desire to steal! New creation, no longer "under the Law", but at peace with it! In fact he no longer hates the law that condemned Him, but now loves it! Same law, different heart, new position in relation to it!

So rather than REST in and ABIDE in the Power that stopped the kleptomania you think it is a better idea to TURN AWAY and go back to your own work.

Sounds like a bad decision to me. One that is warned AGAINST by Paul and Peter. And Christ Himself...

2 Peter 3:17-18
17 Ye therefore, beloved, seeing ye know these things before, beware lest ye also, being led away with the error of the wicked, fall from your own stedfastness.
18 But grow in grace, and in the knowledge of our Lord and Saviour Jesus Christ. To him be glory both now and for ever. Amen.

Galatians 5:1 Stand fast therefore in the liberty wherewith Christ hath made us free, and be not entangled again with the yoke of bondage.

Peter calls it the Error of the wicked. Paul asks how you can be so foolish for going back to it.

Galatians 3:3 Are ye so foolish? having begun in the Spirit, are ye now made perfect by the flesh?


A continually contentious. judging, spirit, not exhibiting any form of a Christlike spirit again, today. He speaks of receiving the anointing spirit and you turn it into law of Moses.

What is it you teach Bro?
Obedience to God or the contrary? Please clarify.
Thank you.

“No good tree bears bad fruit, nor does a bad tree bear good fruit. Each tree is recognized by its own fruit. People do not pick figs from thornbushes, or grapes from briers. The good man brings good things out of the good stored up in his heart, and the evil man brings evil things out of the evil stored up in his heart. For out of the overflow of his heart his mouth speaks. “Why do you call me, ‘Lord, Lord,’ and do not do what I say? I will show you what he is like who comes to me and hears my words and puts them into practice. He is like a man building a house, who dug down deep and laid the foundation on rock. When a flood came, the torrent struck that house but could not shake it, because it was well built. But the one who hears my words and does not put them into practice is like a man who built a house on the ground without a foundation. The moment the torrent struck that house, it collapsed and its destruction was complete.” Luke 6:43-49

nothing strange about it. we Christians are right and you judeaizers are wrong.

you imply that a truly saved person will be obeying the Law of Moses ( there is only one, it is NOT DIVDIED).''
so, I have brought up the N.T. instructions on how we are to conduct ourselves, you do not care. you keep pointing back to the Old Testament Law.

so, it is simple . trust Christ, and then follow the N.T. instructions that Paul and John and Peter and John laid out.

like this- John said in his first letter that we are to obey the Commands. then He explained that the Commands are to believe in the name of Son, and love one another. which echoes Jesus words of believe in Me and a New Command I give you- love one another.....

so, no Sabbath or Torah needed to keep the Commands.

see how that works?

have you judeaizers ever read the N.T.? i mean, there are lots and lots of instructions for the Christ follower to keep.

of course, no Sabbath. that is why you judeaizers reject the New in favor of the Old...