Not By Works

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Dec 12, 2013
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Of course you deny complexity ...yet in your misguided reading scripture becomes one big contradictory mess.

I have trouble with your understanding which is wrong.

Hebrews actually affirms eternal security and a final sacrifice for all sin...that is how I know you do not get it.
Amen and I see Chuck still cannot grasp WHY salvation is spoken of in ALL THREE TENSES.....especially ignorant of a perfect tense or aorist tense Greek verb ....

Was saved
Am saved
CONTINUING TO BE SAVED

Cluminating IN A RESURRECTED or CHANGED BODY

A present CONTINUING RESULT from a past completed ACTION with EMPHASIS UPON THE COMPLETED ACTION

These jokers have no idea
 

Lafftur

Senior Member
Apr 18, 2017
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Okay, listen......what I am about to share is my private thoughts, conversations and ponderings with God but, here goes......

There is a journey of the soul AFTER salvation is received. The soul must be restored.

Why are we still on this Earth after salvation???!!! Is that it, is it all over after we receive Christ as Savior, Lord and King? Why are we still here? We share and preach the gospel to others and then killed for Christ. Is that it? What else is going on with us while we wait for our departure? Hmmm.......perhaps our soul is in need of being restored.

We're making a divine connection with our Creator God in Spirit, Soul and Body..... meaning that I understand the spirit connection - Light comes, we are alive and awakened, no longer in darkness, able to hear, see, taste, touch, and feel God with our spiritual senses.......but, still our bodies must die, be buried and remain on the Earth only to be resurrected so, our bodies will be redeemed into celestial beings, immortal, incorruptible.

What about our souls (mind, emotions and will).....we know the Word and the Holy Spirit renews our mind, perhaps this is the process of restoring our souls....if my mind is renewed with the knowledge, understanding and wisdom of God it restores my emotions to God's emotions and my will to God's Will.......so I am able to know (mind) the perfect will of God, love (emotion) it, and do it (will).

Hebrews 10:38-39 King James Version (KJV)
38 Now the just shall live by faith: but if any man draw back, my soul shall have no pleasure in him.
39 But we are not of them who draw back unto perdition; but of them that believe to the saving of the soul.


Those that draw back NEVER received the seed of faith in good ground. @oyster67 , you have received and believe and love God, your heart is good ground. You will not lose your salvation in Christ.

Stay in God's Word and press in and desire fellowship with God and His Holy Spirit, love Him, He is close to those that love Him....it doesn't mean we are perfect, it just means we desire to be so. :love:(y)
 
Jan 12, 2019
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Being born again is not a future event.
I have provided the scripture to indicate that, for Jews, that is their doctrine.

If you disagree with the scripture, maybe you want to tell us how you interpret what Peter and James were saying?
 

Lafftur

Senior Member
Apr 18, 2017
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John 15
15:5 I am the vine, ye [are] the branches: He that abideth in me, and I in him, the same bringeth forth much fruit: for without me ye can do nothing.
15:6 If a man abide not in me, he is cast forth as a branch, and is withered; and men gather them, and cast [them] into the fire, and they are burned.
That will be the Lake of Fire at the Great White Throne of Judgment, NOT the return of Christ to the Earth.
 

Lafftur

Senior Member
Apr 18, 2017
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It is Jesus who shall cast men into the fire.
Fire is only in the Lake of Fire at the Great White Throne of Judgment. Hell is simply a place of torment and is NOT the grand finale. Jesus has the keys to Hades/Hell and can lose us from that place - it only can hold our soul in torment which is because it needs to be restored.
 

oyster67

Senior Member
May 24, 2014
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You think it is maintained by continual contrition for sin and trying not to sin.
That is not the Gospel.
... and is not what I 'think'. We simply abide in Him. This is not a difficult concept. When we cease to feel contrition for sin, we have a big problem. It is time to humbly repent.
 

Lafftur

Senior Member
Apr 18, 2017
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... and is not what I 'think'. We simply abide in Him. This is not a difficult concept. When we cease to feel contrition for sin, we have a big problem. It is time to humbly repent.
Sounds like the Holy Spirit "woooing" us to God...dealing with our souls......:unsure::love:
 
E

EleventhHour

Guest
... and is not what I 'think'. We simply abide in Him. This is not a difficult concept. When we cease to feel contrition for sin, we have a big problem. It is time to humbly repent.
The point is contrition for sin is not the meaning of repent.

All the contrition in the world will not save you... acknowledging that Jesus paid the debt for your sin is what saves because you can never measure up.
 

oyster67

Senior Member
May 24, 2014
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It is far past my bedtime. Thanks for the opportunity to post Scripture and share truth with many. God bless and good night.
 
Dec 12, 2013
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The point is contrition for sin is not the meaning of repent.

All the contrition in the world will not save you... acknowledging that Jesus paid the debt for your sin is what saves because you can never measure up.
Sin is not the issue in a believer that has been born AGAIN FROM ABOVE and made SPIRITUALLY ALOVE

a. It is finished <-paid in full
b. The SPIRIT IS BORN Again and does not sin
c. Said Spirit is still bound in a body of sin
d. Christ TOOK ALL OF our sin and imputed HIS RIGHTEOUSNESS
e. Where sin ABOUNDS in a believer GRACE ABOUNDS THE MORE
f. WE ARE CHASTENED for SIN not cast away
g. God sees US THROUGH THE BLOOD AND PASSES OVER US IN JUDGEMENT
h. JESUS continually mediates for us

SIN IS NOT the issue for a beliver other than FELLOWSHIP 1st John

OUR SONSHIP is securely held by CHRIST
 

Lafftur

Senior Member
Apr 18, 2017
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Sin is not the issue in a believer that has been born AGAIN FROM ABOVE and made SPIRITUALLY ALOVE

a. It is finished <-paid in full
b. The SPIRIT IS BORN Again and does not sin
c. Said Spirit is still bound in a body of sin
d. Christ TOOK ALL OF our sin and imputed HIS RIGHTEOUSNESS
e. Where sin ABOUNDS in a believer GRACE ABOUNDS THE MORE
f. WE ARE CHASTENED for SIN not cast away
g. God sees US THROUGH THE BLOOD AND PASSES OVER US IN JUDGEMENT
h. JESUS continually mediates for us

SIN IS NOT the issue for a beliver other than FELLOWSHIP 1st John

OUR SONSHIP is securely held by CHRIST
dc, I agree, especially with the SPIRITUALLY ALOVE....lol! :giggle::love:(y)

Seriously though, I agree. Well said.
 

Lafftur

Senior Member
Apr 18, 2017
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Listen everyone, God loves you, hold on to your salvation in Christ alone!

Why would God slain the Lamb from the foundation of the world, tell Adam, Eve and the serpent that the Seed of the woman would crush the serpent's head and he can only bruise His heel, send His Word wrapped in flesh as the Lamb of God that takes away the sin of the world, in human flesh fulfill ALL the human requirements required by God, then kill His Word in human flesh which is now His Son the firstborn of many brethren, shed His Blood for the forgiveness of sins, go to Hell and rise back to life again.......only so we can "lose it all"???? Really?!!

I just don't believe God is going to let any of us mess up His plan for us......:unsure::love:
 

Lafftur

Senior Member
Apr 18, 2017
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My view peesonally off the hip...John knew full well of their hypocrisy....most of what they did was to be seen of men and they ALL knew full well that this "NEW WAY" WAS at some point going to "TAKE THEIR PLACE AWAY"......MUCH LIKE A POLITICIAN today....they will play both sides in some form or fashion and like Jesus said....

"But woe to you, scribes and Pharisees, hypocrites, because you shut off the kingdom of heaven from people; for you do not enter in yourselves, nor do you allow those who are entering to go in.
The arrival of "The Messiah" was expected and many thought John the Baptist was the Messiah. The Pharisees did not know what to expect when the Messiah arrived because they had made NO ROOM for Him. They were kind of concerned that He might upset the "apple cart."

The Romans occupied Jerusalem at the time and Herod had positioned himself as King of the Jews to deal with the Roman governor - Pontus Pilate. Then, the religious leaders had positioned themselves under the High Priest Caiaphas, so where does the "Messiah" fit in.....:unsure:

They were expecting the Messiah to come as KING and establish His Kingdom but, they were NOT told by the priests that should have known the scriptures of Moses and the Prophets that Messiah would have to suffer first, then return as King of Kings and Lord of Lords.

Anyways, John the Baptist announced the arrival of the Messiah as The Lamb of God that takes away the sin of the world. Amen. :love:(y)

No matter man's hindrance to God's plan, God's plan still comes to pass.....there is NO stopping it, amen.
 
May 19, 2020
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Hold on dc, Jesus opposed the Pharisees because they were denying The and Their very own Messiah that they should have recognized if the Pharisees had been preaching Moses and the Prophets CORRECTLY.

They fell short and missed the mark because they loved the praise of man more than the praise of God. This too was King Saul's demise - eyes on the people and NOT God.

What does this mean to us as true born again believers? KNOW THE WORD and be FILLED WITH THE HOLY SPIRIT. It's NOT a physical warfare it is "celestial" or "spiritual" warfare, as you said. Don't look at the people, have no fear of people - they are POWERLESS.

All true born again believers have angels assigned to them and they are sealed with the Holy Spirit - spiritually mark that they belong to God which means angels, demons, devils, evil spirits, Jesus and the Father can see the MARK on all that are HIS.

What are we to fear, seriously???

Yes, the Seal of the Holy Spirit is a TARGET on us in the Spiritual Realm but that very same TARGET causes the enemy to TREMBLE. All we got to do is SEE what they SEE!!! God's children.....

I just don't care about the enemy, God has everything on a time schedule.......I'm staying with the Good Shepherd and encourage others to do the same.

Stop looking at the people and look at the souls.....have dove's eyes, see the souls in the spirit....don't be moved by what people say. It matters more what the Holy Spirit says and gives you eyes to see.......I refuse to fear or fret.....or engage in silly arguments.
Amen!.....you are extremely strong in the Lord!.....
 
Jan 12, 2019
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Listen everyone, God loves you, hold on to your salvation in Christ alone!

Why would God slain the Lamb from the foundation of the world, tell Adam, Eve and the serpent that the Seed of the woman would crush the serpent's head and he can only bruise His heel, send His Word wrapped in flesh as the Lamb of God that takes away the sin of the world, in human flesh fulfill ALL the human requirements required by God, then kill His Word in human flesh which is now His Son the firstborn of many brethren, shed His Blood for the forgiveness of sins, go to Hell and rise back to life again.......only so we can "lose it all"???? Really?!!

I just don't believe God is going to let any of us mess up His plan for us......:unsure::love:
What if you take the mark of the beast during the Tribulation, after you believe in Christ?
 
May 19, 2020
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Listen everyone, God loves you, hold on to your salvation in Christ alone!

Why would God slain the Lamb from the foundation of the world, tell Adam, Eve and the serpent that the Seed of the woman would crush the serpent's head and he can only bruise His heel, send His Word wrapped in flesh as the Lamb of God that takes away the sin of the world, in human flesh fulfill ALL the human requirements required by God, then kill His Word in human flesh which is now His Son the firstborn of many brethren, shed His Blood for the forgiveness of sins, go to Hell and rise back to life again.......only so we can "lose it all"???? Really?!!

I just don't believe God is going to let any of us mess up His plan for us......:unsure::love:

You must know that no one on the planet can mess up the plans that God has for his children.