Jesus did not say follow preachers, He said follow Me.

So many are told that Paul's writings are laws but they are not laws. They are there to help us
if we need help. To give us examples and hope and encouragement and help who needs it but
how in the world did laws overtake; my friends that is false teaching. Every time verses get
peppered on to the screen, is like those verse are the authority. Well they are not and maybe
you should start telling your pastors that. We are on this earth to follow God and God is our
only. ( period)

Hello @Relic, I may be misunderstanding what you mean in the OP (and I apologize if I am), but how can we learn to follow Jesus apart from what is written in the Bible

Thanks

~Deut
p.s. - if I'm way off base about the main point of your thread, please let me know what it is. Thanks again!

I believe he is talking about how we put to much emphasis in Pauls writings and in preachers, if Paul were alive right now I bet he would say to people to not idolize the words he writes because it is in Christ the glory is to be given , and not to worship men who teach but worship he who is man and God and the great teacher-or something like that. I don't make a good PaulXD

Indeed.

Pastor Mike Winger says that he doesn't want his listeners to take at face value the things he says. Mike wants us to be like the Bereans and check the Scriptures to "see if those things are so".

I will add that Paul, as well as the other Biblical authors, received direct revelation and instruction from God.

While I certainly agree that far too many believers/Denominations/Church Groups and Pastors/Preachers misunderstand Pauls Teachings.................SOME of what Paul wrote ARE COMMANDMENTS FROM GOD. Those words recorded in his Epistles ARE to be obeyed.

Again, Paul wrote in two distinct and separate styles:

Thus sayeth the Lord: Commandment from God, and must be obeyed

I would rather that/it would be better that: Pauls advice on how to live a Christian life with as little stress and problems as possible. To be considered, and followed if one is of a mind to. IF one chooses to not follow his advice, then whatever the results are, is on them...........in some cases, the results have NOT ONE THING to do with eternal salvation.......

All this being said: Preachers/Pastors were appointed by Christ to feed, tend to, and protect His sheep. The are BIBLICAL.......does not mean they are to be the focal point of our Faith, but they are to be respected, and listened to for they are appointed to Preach the Gospel of Jesus Christ.

edited to add, before someone else misunderstands............. Yes, there are false prophets, and just bad preachers/teachers............that's why the indwelling presence of the Holy Spirit is so very important. To allow us to be able to discern such as them.

13For this cause also thank we God without ceasing, because, when ye received the word of God which ye heard of us, ye received it not as the word of men, but as it is in truth, the word of God, which effectually worketh also in you that believe. 14For ye, brethren, became followers of the churches of God which in Judaea are in Christ Jesus:

So Paul said that his words were the Word of God and also the first churches such as Thessalonica recieved his words as not the words of men but at it is in truth the word of God.

There is no such thing as following Paul's words instead of following Gods Words. This scripture tells you they are the same.

I do agree that there are a few examples where people have adopted the leaven of the Pharisees and attempted to enforce a Law from Paul's writings that Paul never intended. But that is not Paul's fault, that is just bad hermeneutics (interpretation) on the part of those who have misunderstood the heart or (authorial intent) behind Paul's words and also misunderstood the heart of God and the message that Jesus preached concerning mercy and God's focus on love and mercy and truth.

Romans 13:10

Pauls Letters are the Word of God.. Paul was inspired by God.. People who seek to undermine and denegrate the writings of Paul are attacking the message of God..

Attacking any of the New Testament is attacking the Word of God..

"And He Himself gave some to be apostles, some prophets, some evangelists, and some pastors and teachers, for the equipping of the saints for the work of ministry, for the edifying of the body of Christ,"

Yeah.. we best be listening to them. Don't know how to break it to you but there are so many wonderful men women of God out there that GOD put over us. There are already to many out there thinking they need no Church no pastor no one over them. Yet can be so easily deceived. Moved by ever wind of doctrine.

what did Jesus say to Saul? Saul never once touched Jesus. "Then he fell to the ground, and heard a voice saying to him, “Saul, Saul, why are you persecuting Me?”

Look what we do today. Well not we. All the exposed and what not. There was this preacher that fell. You know him. There is nothing about him we don't know. Yet.. I heard a story today from a woman preacher (2015) who was with this huge Christian crowd/meeting. And the story she shared. SHOCKING! I am 59 and what happen to him was many many years ago. Every video, post you name it.. this story was never once shared. And thousands where there. It would change your out look on him in a heart beat.. if you believed he was wrong evil what ever.

What that preacher did is written in the word. Telling us to do that very thing. That preacher said.. there are not that many spiritual leaders today. That point out that error.. in front of all of them.. on and on.. then WE love you.. WE forgive you. Hugged and both cried and cried. Thats what Christ does when you fall. Picks you brings right back. Those two preachers? The one ..well didn't agree with them at all. How odd that was the one .. that didn't give up on him. A group you know and many make fun of. wow..

I have judged based on all the facts....yet was not the truth at all. Anyway.. so when the world attacks you..hurts you... They are really hurting Christ. And He does NOT like it nor takes its when anyone touches His Children. See.. you and Him are ONE! That preacher.. just make sure they preach the word..

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Not yet on either side on this question

Is there a kind of bond formed between a Christian and those they have converted ? Is there a responsibility the preacher feels toward the converts? Does the bond foster a desire to mirror the preacher in the heart of the converts? I think these are things a following is made
of.

Now that I'm thinking about it.....would we have any way to know what Jesus was like without the info given by the generation before?

your comment is true. I am saying there is enough in the gospels for us to follow our journey to God

if we feel we need some help, we can go to see Pauls assistance or opinion...just don't make
pauls writings laws.

I have no problem with Paul quoting a law that he ascribes to God. my point is Paul is not the maker of laws

you may be misunderstanding, I am saying we have the gospels with Jesus in themfor

us to follow Jesus so Jesus is our only authority. But many forlks have turned Pauls letters and other peoples
letters into laws. Those letters are not laws.....don't get me wrong, I am not throwing Paul out of the Bible
and read him often but I never take him as an authority before Christ

Do you look at the NT as only the first 4 books are scripture and the rest is merely human commentary that may or may not be true?

2Timothy 3: 16. All scripture is given by inspiration of God... Galatians 1:11, 12. But I certify you, brethren, that the gospel which was preached of me is not after man. 12. For I neither received it of man, neither was I taught it, but by the revelation of Jesus Christ. What "laws" are you talking about? Give scripture, not opinions. There are babes in Christ that read such trash and unbelief that you have written, and you have affected such, in your ignorance. I, as fellow member of the body of Christ, strongly rebuke you.

Think about that for a minute. You are actually saying that you put your confidence in Matthew, Mark, Luke, and John as having the true word of God to help us "to follow our journey to God" but Paul is not on the same inspired scale? Jesus did not write anything. Why do you believe Matthew is worth following but not Paul?