Righteousness

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oyster67

oyster67

Senior Member
#21
May 24, 2014
11,887
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#21
Jackson123 said:
Thanks for the answer, I want to be clean but fail all the time
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So do I and so did apostle Paul.

Romans
7:14 For we know that the law is spiritual: but I am carnal, sold under sin.
7:15 For that which I do I allow not: for what I would, that do I not; but what I hate, that do I.
7:16 If then I do that which I would not, I consent unto the law that [it is] good.
7:17 Now then it is no more I that do it, but sin that dwelleth in me.
7:18 For I know that in me (that is, in my flesh,) dwelleth no good thing: for to will is present with me; but [how] to perform that which is good I find not.
7:19 For the good that I would I do not: but the evil which I would not, that I do.
7:20 Now if I do that I would not, it is no more I that do it, but sin that dwelleth in me.
7:21 I find then a law, that, when I would do good, evil is present with me.
7:22 For I delight in the law of God after the inward man:
7:23 But I see another law in my members, warring against the law of my mind, and bringing me into captivity to the law of sin which is in my members.
7:24 O wretched man that I am! who shall deliver me from the body of this death?
7:25 I thank God through Jesus Christ our Lord. So then with the mind I myself serve the law of God; but with the flesh the law of sin.
 
Nehemiah6

Nehemiah6

Senior Member
#22
Jul 18, 2017
24,473
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#22
Jackson123 said:
I don't love sin but fail not to
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Which means that you have not crucified or mortified the flesh (the old Adamic sin nature). Christians have only two options: (1) walk in the Spirit or (2) live according to the flesh. And if #2 is habitual, it means that you were never even saved. Genuine Christians desire to walk in the Spirit -- be under the control of the Holy Spirit.
 
Peterlag

Peterlag

Banned
#23
Jun 15, 2020
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#23
JaumeJ said:
If you are in Messiah, you no longer have the guilt of any wrong doing imputed against you. There is no flesh without sin, however all in Jesus-Yeshua are free of that guilt.............Yet we must always confess our sings to our Father, always.
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You must be Catholic.
 
Peterlag

Peterlag

Banned
#24
Jun 15, 2020
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#24
oyster67 said:
1 John
1:8 If we say that we have no sin, we deceive ourselves, and the truth is not in us.
1:9 If we confess our sins, he is faithful and just to forgive us [our] sins, and to cleanse us from all unrighteousness.
1:10 If we say that we have not sinned, we make him a liar, and his word is not in us.
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The above verses are probably referring to those who had not yet became Christian.
 
Peterlag

Peterlag

Banned
#25
Jun 15, 2020
622
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#25
Nehemiah6 said:
Well isn't that wonderful.

You should be up on a mountain top in the Himalayas so that everyone can make a pilgrimage to the Great Guru Peter who has attained Moksha and Nirvana. The only thing missing now is that you should change your handle to *AscendedMasterPeter*.
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1 John 3 & 5
Whosoever abideth in him sinneth not: whosoever sinneth hath not seen him, neither known him.

Whosoever is born of God doth not commit sin, for his seed remaineth in him: and he cannot sin, because he is born of God.

We know that whosoever is born of God sinneth not.
 
Nehemiah6

Nehemiah6

Senior Member
#26
Jul 18, 2017
24,473
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#26
Peterlag said:
1 John 3 & 5 Whosoever abideth in him sinneth not: whosoever sinneth hath not seen him, neither known him....Whosoever is born of God doth not commit sin, for his seed remaineth in him: and he cannot sin, because he is born of God....We know that whosoever is born of God sinneth not.
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These verses can be easily misunderstood -- and in fact they are misunderstood by some.

So what do they teach and how does that fit in with the fact that the old nature ("the flesh") has not been eradicated after the New Birth, and therefore there is a conflict between the spirit and the flesh, or the indwelling Holy Spirit and the flesh?

1. When a person is born again, his/her spirit is *quickened* or made alive by the power of the Holy Spirit. The Holy Spirit takes up residence within our spirits, and we become children of God.

2. The Bible says that if any man be in Christ he is a "new creature" (or creation). Old things have passed away, and all things have become new. Therefore the new nature is indeed the quickened spirit, which desires to serve, please and obey God. And it is this "seed" which the apostle John speak of. This new nature abhors sin, since God gives the believer a new heart and a new spirit. Indeed the new nature cannot sin (as John says).

3. At the same time, God does not automatically remove the flesh (the sin nature which is within the soul). Therefore Christians can and do sin.

4. However, Paul says that "sin shall NOT have dominion over you" which means that no believer can be dominated by his/her old nature. And in order to keep the old nature under subjection, Christians are commanded to crucify (or mortify = put to death) the flesh. Christians do not have an excuse to sin, neither is salvation a license to sin.

5. Paul shows us the conflict between the Spirit and the flesh in Galatians 5, since this is real and it is true:

GALATIANS 5: CHRISTIANS ARE COMMANDED TO WALK IN THE SPIRIT
16 This I say then, Walk in the Spirit, and ye shall not fulfil the lust of the flesh.
17 For the flesh lusteth [craves sin] against the Spirit, and the Spirit [wars] against the flesh: and these are contrary [in conflict with] the one to the other: so that ye cannot do the things that ye would. 18 But if ye be led of the Spirit, ye are not under the law.

THE WORKS (SINS) OF THE FLESH
19 Now the works of the flesh are manifest, which are these; Adultery, fornication, uncleanness, lasciviousness, 20 Idolatry, witchcraft, hatred, variance, emulations, wrath, strife, seditions, heresies, 21 Envyings, murders, drunkenness, revellings, and such like: of the which I tell you before, as I have also told you in time past, that they which do such things shall not inherit the kingdom of God.

THE FRUIT (ATTITUDES) OF THE SPIRIT
22 But the fruit of the Spirit is love, joy, peace, longsuffering, gentleness, goodness, faith, 23 Meekness, temperance: against such there is no law.

THE FLESH MUST BE CRUCIFIED (PUT TO DEATH)
24 And they that are Christ's have crucified the flesh with the affections and lusts.25 If we live in the Spirit, let us also walk in the Spirit.
 
Peterlag

Peterlag

Banned
#27
Jun 15, 2020
622
79
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#27
Nehemiah6 said:
These verses can be easily misunderstood -- and in fact they are misunderstood by some.

So what do they teach and how does that fit in with the fact that the old nature ("the flesh") has not been eradicated after the New Birth, and therefore there is a conflict between the spirit and the flesh, or the indwelling Holy Spirit and the flesh?

1. When a person is born again, his/her spirit is *quickened* or made alive by the power of the Holy Spirit. The Holy Spirit takes up residence within our spirits, and we become children of God.

2. The Bible says that if any man be in Christ he is a "new creature" (or creation). Old things have passed away, and all things have become new. Therefore the new nature is indeed the quickened spirit, which desires to serve, please and obey God. And it is this "seed" which the apostle John speak of. This new nature abhors sin, since God gives the believer a new heart and a new spirit. Indeed the new nature cannot sin (as John says).

3. At the same time, God does not automatically remove the flesh (the sin nature which is within the soul). Therefore Christians can and do sin.

4. However, Paul says that "sin shall NOT have dominion over you" which means that no believer can be dominated by his/her old nature. And in order to keep the old nature under subjection, Christians are commanded to crucify (or mortify = put to death) the flesh. Christians do not have an excuse to sin, neither is salvation a license to sin.

5. Paul shows us the conflict between the Spirit and the flesh in Galatians 5, since this is real and it is true:

GALATIANS 5: CHRISTIANS ARE COMMANDED TO WALK IN THE SPIRIT
16 This I say then, Walk in the Spirit, and ye shall not fulfil the lust of the flesh.
17 For the flesh lusteth [craves sin] against the Spirit, and the Spirit [wars] against the flesh: and these are contrary [in conflict with] the one to the other: so that ye cannot do the things that ye would. 18 But if ye be led of the Spirit, ye are not under the law.

THE WORKS (SINS) OF THE FLESH
19 Now the works of the flesh are manifest, which are these; Adultery, fornication, uncleanness, lasciviousness, 20 Idolatry, witchcraft, hatred, variance, emulations, wrath, strife, seditions, heresies, 21 Envyings, murders, drunkenness, revellings, and such like: of the which I tell you before, as I have also told you in time past, that they which do such things shall not inherit the kingdom of God.

THE FRUIT (ATTITUDES) OF THE SPIRIT
22 But the fruit of the Spirit is love, joy, peace, longsuffering, gentleness, goodness, faith, 23 Meekness, temperance: against such there is no law.

THE FLESH MUST BE CRUCIFIED (PUT TO DEATH)
24 And they that are Christ's have crucified the flesh with the affections and lusts.25 If we live in the Spirit, let us also walk in the Spirit.
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I already did that. Put the flesh to death.
 
oyster67

oyster67

Senior Member
#28
May 24, 2014
11,887
8,697
113
#28
Peterlag said:
I already did that. Put the flesh to death.
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This must be done on a daily basis.

Luke 9:23 And he said to [them] all, If any [man] will come after me, let him deny himself, and take up his cross daily, and follow me.
 
Peterlag

Peterlag

Banned
#29
Jun 15, 2020
622
79
28
#29
oyster67 said:
This must be done on a daily basis.

Luke 9:23 And he said to [them] all, If any [man] will come after me, let him deny himself, and take up his cross daily, and follow me.
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In Colossians we read "putting off the body of the sins of the flesh by the circumcision of Christ:" We did not put it off. It was the circumcision of Christ. Two verses later we read "together with him, having forgiven you all trespasses;..." Again, it's "in him" or "with him." I also want to get Hebrews in here where we see Christ offered himself once "for this he did once" and not like the high priest who offered up the sacrifice daily. The Lord Christ "after he had offered one sacrifice for sins for ever, sat down on the right hand of God;..."
 
oyster67

oyster67

Senior Member
#30
May 24, 2014
11,887
8,697
113
#30
It just seems that you claim to have attributes that only God has.
 
J

Jackson123

Senior Member
#31
Feb 6, 2014
11,769
1,370
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#31
Salvation by faith alone but faith that save never alone

Martin Luther.

Martin Luther declare salvation by faith alon in the context to not agree with catholic that saling indulgence, not in the context ;" let rob the bank any way salvation not by work"

That is why Martin say :"faith that save never alone"

Because real faith produce or bear fruit.
 
Lafftur

Lafftur

Senior Member
#34
Apr 18, 2017
6,739
3,556
113
#34
Peterlag said:
I don't have sin.
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A sinner that is not saved, their sin is unto death - the penalty of sin is death.

As a Believer, you and all of us do not commit sin that is unto death. However, our flesh can sin if we choose to not walk by the Spirit.

If any man see his brother sin a sin which is not unto death, he shall ask, and he shall give him life for them that sin not unto death.

There is a sin unto death: I do not say that he shall pray for it.

All unrighteousness is sin: and there is a sin not unto death.

We know that whosoever is born of God sinneth not; but he that is begotten of God keepeth himself, and that wicked one toucheth him not.
1 John 5:16-18 - https://www.biblegateway.com/passage?search=1 John 5:16-18&version=KJV

As Believers, we are children of God learning how to walk by the Spirit so we do NOT fulfill the lusts of our flesh (which is sin that is NOT unto death). :love:(y)
 
Peterlag

Peterlag

Banned
#35
Jun 15, 2020
622
79
28
#35
Lafftur said:
A sinner that is not saved, their sin is unto death - the penalty of sin is death.

As a Believer, you and all of us do not commit sin that is unto death. However, our flesh can sin if we choose to not walk by the Spirit.

If any man see his brother sin a sin which is not unto death, he shall ask, and he shall give him life for them that sin not unto death.

There is a sin unto death: I do not say that he shall pray for it.

All unrighteousness is sin: and there is a sin not unto death.

We know that whosoever is born of God sinneth not; but he that is begotten of God keepeth himself, and that wicked one toucheth him not.
1 John 5:16-18 - https://www.biblegateway.com/passage?search=1 John 5:16-18&version=KJV

As Believers, we are children of God learning how to walk by the Spirit so we do NOT fulfill the lusts of our flesh (which is sin that is NOT unto death). :love:(y)
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It's the learning how to walk by the spirit that scares me since I did not learn it neither was I taught it.
 
Peterlag

Peterlag

Banned
#36
Jun 15, 2020
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#36
Lafftur said:
No need to start labeling people...@JaumeJ is IN CHRIST just like you and me. :love:(y)
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The Catholics came up with the idea for Christians to confess their sins. So since you say I should confess my sins is why I say you must be Catholic.
 
JohnR7

JohnR7

Banned
#37
Dec 30, 2019
1,266
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#37
Jackson123 said:
My question is, if I have faith but I am adulterer or drunker, do I inherit the kingdom, go to heaven or not?
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Yes but in some cases people do not receive a reward. We have to live right if we want to be used by God. "If it is burned up, the builder will suffer loss but yet will be saved--even though only as one escaping through the flames." (1Cor3:15) If people suffer loss that will be saved but they are still saved. If we want to be used by God we have to live right so we can set a right example for others.
 
JaumeJ

JaumeJ

Senior Member
#38
Jul 2, 2011
21,234
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#38
Peterlag said:
The Catholics came up with the idea for Christians to confess their sins. So since you say I should confess my sins is why I say you must be Catholic.
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It is in the Word. Confess your sins one to another in all situations, however especially when illness should fall upon you. Call for the elders, confess your sins, and they will anoint you and you will be made well.
 
Peterlag

Peterlag

Banned
#39
Jun 15, 2020
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#39
JaumeJ said:
Ask around. My faith is only that of Abraham.
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Oh... I mentioned it because of the statement made about confessing sins. Since the Catholics came up with that concept is why I asked.
 
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