Is it too late?

wattie, are you and I the only ones who have noticed what's going on? Has everyone else swallowed the Kool-Aid? Is the apostacy upon us?

You describe worldly things from a worldly perspective. The "real" church is the Body of Christ.

For the last hundred years or so, the church has been one step behind the world. As the world declines, so does the church. Where the world was yesterday is where the church is today.

You know John146, I believe you have your statement backwards. If you really give it more thought, I think you will see, it is the other way around.

Over the last 150 years are so, the Church began to stray further and further from the Truth. Only a very few churches were proclaiming the Truth of God's Holy Word by the 1970's.

Because of the church falling away and thus, the evil of Sin and church discipline no longer were being emphasized, the world fell into greater immorality. The churches were no longer casting out heretics and immoral members but were turning a blind eye to these things because increasing the membership roles became the priority. It is as if "evangelism" has gone completely overboard. All you have to do is say this little prayer and YOUR IN. Don't worry about those sins... there paid for on the cross and we know you have a busy life, so don't worry about studying the Bible, we will tell you what you need to know. (Sarcasm intentional).

Therefore, a world without an Objective Truth and proper guidance spun out of control. Of coarse, people like Dr. Spock and his books did not help matters. Don't discipline the children with a rod. Tragically, so-called pastors and believers were not carrying out proper Biblical discipline long before that.

Just a thought... take care.

There are plenty of good fellowships out there and plenty of faithful ministers, even some good ones on TV ... Jesus had megachurch

You know John146, I believe you have your statement backwards. If you really give it more thought, I think you will see, it is the other way around.

Over the last 150 years are so, the Church began to stray further and further from the Truth. Only a very few churches were proclaiming the Truth of God's Holy Word by the 1970's.

Because of the church falling away and thus, the evil of Sin and church discipline no longer were being emphasized, the world fell into greater immorality. The churches were no longer casting out heretics and immoral members but were turning a blind eye to these things because increasing the membership roles became the priority. It is as if "evangelism" has gone completely overboard. All you have to do is say this little prayer and YOUR IN. Don't worry about those sins... there paid for on the cross and we know you have a busy life, so don't worry about studying the Bible, we will tell you what you need to know. (Sarcasm intentional).

Therefore, a world without an Objective Truth and proper guidance spun out of control. Of coarse, people like Dr. Spock and his books did not help matters. Don't discipline the children with a rod. Tragically, so-called pastors and believers were not carrying out proper Biblical discipline long before that.

Just a thought... take care.

I think you must be pulling my leg. What good TV ministers are you referring too?

What good fellowship are you referring too? Proper fellowship is not just standing around talking. It is fellowship centered around Biblical Truth. Therefore, around doctrine with likeminded believers.

Act 2:42 And they continued steadfastly in the apostles' doctrine and fellowship, and in breaking of bread, and in prayers.

What do you mean?

Prayer, of course. That's a given.

But silence is what's gotten us to this point. It's our duty and responsibility to call out those who claim to be Christians who have strayed from the path. Maybe it's not my place to rebuke Rick Warren but I'm surprised someone closer to him hasn't said anything to him. If they did he clearly didn't listen.

"I charge you in the presence of God and of Christ Jesus, who is to judge the living and the dead, and by his appearing and his kingdom: preach the word; be ready in season and out of season; reprove, rebuke, and exhort, with complete patience and teaching."-2 Timothy 1-2

There was an incident between Paul and Peter in Antioch in which Paul confronted Peter. The account of this incident is recorded in Galatians 2:11-14:

"But when Cephas came to Antioch, I opposed him to his face, because he stood condemned. For before certain men came from James, he was eating with the Gentiles; but when they came he drew back and separated himself, fearing the circumcision party. And the rest of the Jews acted hypocritically along with him, so that even Barnabas was led astray by their hypocrisy. But when I saw that their conduct was not in step with the truth of the gospel, I said to Cephas before them all, 'If you, though a Jew, live like a Gentile and not like a Jew, how can you force the Gentiles to live like Jews?' "

When Paul recounted this event to the Galatians was he gossiping or teaching them?

Carps and critics have been galore.

God's message for the end times is "forsake not the gathering of yourselves together as the manner of some is, especially when you see the time drawing near."

I mean whenever the true gospel is preach the crowds will come, if Jesus is truly being lifted up He will draw all men unto Him.

I mean whenever the true gospel is preach the crowds will come, if Jesus is truly being lifted up He will draw all men unto Him.

I mean whenever the true gospel is preach the crowds will come, if Jesus is truly being lifted up He will draw all men unto Him.

Pretty soon it's going to be one big happy family: Islam, Catholicism and Evangelicalism hand-in-hand skipping merrily down the (broad) road.

The difference between the large crowds that followed Jesus and modern megachurches is Jesus served while megachurch leaders are served. Jesus delivered, megachurches may or may not deliver. And even if they do, is it the truth they're delivering or self-indulgence?

With all due respect, this is a ridiculous argument. Crowd size has nothing at all to do with the preaching of the true gospel. Rock concerts draw large crowds, as do sporting events, etc.

The crowds followed Jesus mostly because of His miracles. This in part explains the modern megachurch phenomenon. What you have are claims of outright miracles taking place or promises of miracles: health and wealth mainly, but basically whatever you need to have what you think is the "good life" the megachurches are happy to promise. Whether they can deliver on these promises is another matter. But all that's necessary to keep "customers" coming back is the belief that they can. There are also very professional "praise and worship" leaders there to entertain you. Oftentimes there's not that much difference between these "praise and worship" services and an actual rock concert.

The difference between the large crowds that followed Jesus and modern megachurches is Jesus served while megachurch leaders are served. Jesus delivered, megachurches may or may not deliver. And even if they do, is it the truth they're delivering or self-indulgence?

NO - you are certainly not the only ones.

The World Church is rapidly coming together, just as the Lord spoke of it and the Father planned it. These events are grievous to the true believer but we should all take hope in that this was planned from the beginning according to Scripture. God is working all things to His determinate end.

This World Church, full of the worlds way of doing things, must continue to compromise with other religious beliefs in order to bring about a global unity. I read just the other day, where one of the so-called Christian book writers (Name left out intentionally), said that: "Muslims have a better understanding of whom Christ was than many Christian believers.". REALLY??? This kind of statement coming from one who professes a belief in Jesus Christ, is indeed a huge fall down a very slippery slope. But hey, we have to make room for the Muslim belief system. (He says with great sarcasm). True believers know that Christ is more than a Prophet, more than a Holy one sent from God.... He is the Eternal Son of God!!!!

As far as what true believers should do? If one finds themselves caught up in this mess, then - "Come out and be ye separate says the Lord." However, if one does just that, then understand you will lose fellowship with the ones you have known but you will gain further communion with God for doing so. Therefore, one must ask themselves, "Do I want to please God or please man?". What one should not do, is remain in one of these so-called churches thinking they might be able to fix the situation. This rarely, if ever works.

The years ahead will be difficult for true believers. The ones who hold to the TRUTH as taught in Holy Scripture. But Jesus Christ is The WORD and His TRUTH must be defended.... even unto death. It was always known, that a day was coming when True believers would find no truth being proclaimed in the worlds churches. No place to assemble but in homes again with like minded believers. Even the Book of Revelation, talks about a day when the Jews will abandon the Temple because it has been desecrated by the Anti-Christ.

Yes there are bleak days ahead but I say: "Even so... come Lord Jesus!".

I agree, forsake not the assembling of yourselves together. It doesn't say forsake not assembling with heretics and false teachers.

"And have no fellowship with the unfruitful works of darkness, but rather expose them."-Ephesians 5:11

I'm sure we disagree on what the "unfruitful works of darkness" are; we'll just have to agree to disagree on that one.

We can't have unity just for the sake of unity. Are you aware of the push that's been on for quite some time to unite Evangelicalism with Catholicism and Islam? Should we extend the right hand of fellowship to a total lie just for the sake of unity? This is the spirit of antichrist at work.