Not By Works

LOL! I'm sure he meant Lot but just came out Job.

OMG I am so sorry!!

a legalist can't see or understand this. they would say you lacked faith.

Doh!

Why did I say Job lol

You are correct

Well what I would say to that is this
My faith may of been the size of a mustard seed , yet I thank the Lord that is is He who was holding me , not the other way round...
He said He would never leave me , never forsake me , and He did not
I was weak , He was and is my strength , just like He is to all of those who are in Him...
...xox...

I didn't want to interject when I read what you said.

I gave you the benefit of auto correct of Lot to Job.

Over here we say it's a job lot or is it a lob not?

Oh auto correct I meanr job and not lot

You articulate your question well: I wish I had time to give a longer version of why I view love (agape) this way, but here is the short answer:

My view of love (agape) is based directly on Scriptures like this one: (I John 4:7)
Beloved, let us love one another: for love is of God; and every one that loveth is born of God, and knoweth God.

The verse says that "every one who loves (agape) is born of God": so that means simply that someone who is not born of God cannot love (agape) others. Sure, they can do good deeds and have good moral motives for helping others, but they do not do their actions toward others because of the love of God in their hearts (they don't have the love of God in their hearts!). Morality and good intentions and good feelings is not agape (love). Agape can only come when Jesus is in the heart.

Interesting question, and definition of agape love being unconditional...
not that I am arguing against it, just remembering a very recent thread
where a number of Christians claimed that God does not love unconditionally.

(1) Where do we find…? - Christian Chat Rooms & Forums

I found other similar threads where people argued against God's unconditional love

Once again, you've proven yourself incapable of anything by weak arguments - not a single verse in all of Scripture even remotely suggests the wicked can be recipients and demonstrate "agape" toward others. The following Biblical argument irrefutably shows once and for all the wicked can never receive or demonstrate it - one from which you cower fear, refusing to answer:
1 John 3:7 KJV plainly says "agape" is demonstrated by happily keeping God's commandments, but Romans 8:7 KJV says the wicked can't keep them even if they wanted to.

Posthuman, can you see from Scripture that only those who happily keep God's commandments can demonstrate 'agape" and that the wicked can't keep God's commandments - neither happily nor reluctantly - even if they wanted to? Can you now see the "many' whose "agape" grows cold and dead, leaving them to wind up lost in the end were once SAINTS in possession of warm, living "agape"? Nope - your pride compels you to cling to a dead faith without works, a dead OSAS doctrine, and a made-up "Jesus" instead of the Jesus of Scripture.
Yes, when Jesus tells Christians "take heed that no man deceive "you" refers to "Jews", right? If your esoteric predecessors were alive today, they'd fully acknowledge you as a textbook example of why they believed allowing the ignorant masses access to the truth would be as careless as placing the proverbial sword in the hands of a child, young Posthuman.

this is all previously discussed & thoroughly refuted.

agape is the noun form of the verb agapao. that's just linguistics 101. it's fact.
1 John 2:15 & 1 John 4:7 equivocate agapao & agape - among many other verses, but 2 witnesses is enough to destroy your false doctrine ((whether you accept it or not doesn't matter at all. the truth is the truth))
'love growing cold' is spoken of in good terms in Revelation 3:15. it's the lukewarm who are spewed out of His mouth, not the cold.
in Matthew 24, the ((Jewish)) disciples ask Christ 3 questions. when will the ((Jewish)) temple be destroyed? what will be the sign of His coming? what will be the sign of the end of the age of the Gentiles?
Christ answers the 3rd question 1st, the 1st question second, and the second question 3rd.
your pet 'gotcha' verse which you horribly misinterpret as evidence that Christ will lose His sheep, is in the context of the answer to the 3rd question of the ((Jewish)) disciples: the end of the age of the Gentiles. the tribulation, aka "Jacob's trouble" -- a specifically Jewish event.
a time when the antichrist will be killing as many Jews as possible.
the love of many Jews will grow cold. many Jews will betray other Jews.
a time when Christians will have been raptured.

but you ain't ready to actually talk about any of this, are you?
you just want to talk about how you think anyone who doesn't ceremonially observe the physical sign of the Mosaic covenant ((sabbath)) will not be saved, right?
you only want to tell us that salvation is by physical sabbath observance, right?
you want to destroy our faith?
you only want to tell everyone whose faith is in Christ that Christ is unable to save them, that they must add ceremonial ritual inactivity in the flesh to their faith in order to be perfected, right?

you hate the assurance we have.
that puzzles me. i don't know why you would hate the confidence we have in our Lord, mighty to save.

Lot's love had grown cold, his soul being vexed by what he saw.
he did not speak to his sons.
he did not speak to his married daughters, only their husbands.

Lot was saved; Lot is righteous; Lot is saved.
Lot has not ceased to exist; Lot lives.

is David saved by his works or by his faith?

No body save by work
But faith will produce good work

Hey Bro!

I think they think that way because of a verse in scripture.

We love because he first loved us.

the question is. What type of love is God talking about here. I agree with you. A non believing husband can sacrificially love his wife and children.

Paul says people would come and use "grace" as a means to commit sexual perversion, aka "licentiousness". The word has bound up in it the idea of "freedom from natural bounds of sexual purity in order to commit sexual perversion". How else can grace be a means to licentiousness than to claim it is "freedom" to do it? That's exactly what OSAS does: gives "freedom" in the name of grace to live in bondage to sin.

You own up to nothing because you, by your own words, insist "we can't keep the law". Is that owning up? No! That's making an excuse. We don't pump our chests in self righteousness because we saints know overcoming temptation is only by the indwelling power of Jesus' righteousness -- conversely, those who whine and complain they can't overcome temptation are condemned by their own words as lacking the overcoming power of Jesus. Do you really expect to get away with telling God in the day of Judgment, "No one can keep the law" with Daniel and his three friends standing there in front of you?

Yes, there are licentious people. Jude condemned them to hell. James spoke of them, as CLAIMING to ave faith.

But tht does not negate what the word means. You claimed the word means something that it does not. In doing that you LIED.

Yet here you are continuing to try to defend your LIE.

so what should we do? All become legalists claiming we keep the law (when we do not) pump our chests praising God how we are not like the sinner (when we are) Go around telling everyone how righteous we are. And how we have earned our salvation (when we have not and CAN NOT) Go around telling others how we do not murder. Do drugs, commit adultry etc etc. so we are not evil (hereby EXCUSING our own sin, as a non issue, instead of focusing on our own sin, and allowing God to help us with our own sin, and allowing God to work on those people and their sin) basically do what you and every legalist from the time of adam has dne.

or own up to our sin, confess them, Stop looking to self and how good we think we are. And turning to God, learn to love as God loved, Learn to seek after the things of the spirit as Paul told us to. And seek to grow in christ

If you spent as much time trying to take care of your own sin and your own self righteousness as you do trying to attack prople who trust God and seek to serve and trust in him, You may be able to repent. But I fear from what I have witnessed from you that your pride is too deep.

Until ten, you will just continue to be another self righteous pharisee who attack the people of God. You will get yours one day my friend. But there is stil hope for you. I pray and hope you will repent.. God loves you/ and I pray you see that, and how damaging your gospel is to you and those who you try to teach.

The reason you keep saying there's not activity on Sabbath is because you're so Biblically ignorant. Isaiah plainly says the Sabbath is to be a time of corporate worship, doing Godly things, speaking Godly words, fellowship, breaking bread, etc.

What a dull religion you OSAS crowd must endure, constantly whining about how you all can't obey the law as they break it with lip-biting anticipation, looking at your watches with indignation if the preacher goes on for more than an hour...

People "using" the idea of Grace as licentiousness means that Grace should be rejected???

No. Anymore than people using electricity to electrocute people should cause everyone else to stop using electricity.

Is Grace dangerous? No. Only to legalists who try to push legalism not knowing what they say or affirm.


OSAS could give people the idea that they could live any way they want and still be saved. But any way they want would be Righteous in Christ if they were truly Saved.

We can't keep the Law. That is true.

The Lord Jesus already knows no one can keep the Law. No reason to tell Him facts He has Established.

The Only Way out of Condemnation is through and In Christ. Its not by pretending to keep the Law.

Where does Isaiah say the Sabbath is for corporate worship?