What Happens if Someone Who Claims to be “Born Again”

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Jocund

Jocund

Banned
#121
Jan 14, 2021
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#121
Substance > Form

"And he spake this parable unto certain which trusted in themselves that they were righteous, and despised others: Two men went up into the temple to pray; the one a Pharisee, and the other a publican. The Pharisee stood and prayed thus with himself, God, I thank thee, that I am not as other men are, extortioners, unjust, adulterers, or even as this publican. I fast twice in the week, I give tithes of all that I possess. And the publican, standing afar off, would not lift up so much as his eyes unto heaven, but smote upon his breast, saying, God be merciful to me a sinner. I tell you, this man went down to his house justified rather than the other: for every one that exalteth himself shall be abased; and he that humbleth himself shall be exalted." - Luke 18:9-14 KJV
 
R

RaceRunner

Well-known member
#122
Oct 13, 2022
1,576
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#122
Jocund said:
Substance > Form

"And he spake this parable unto certain which trusted in themselves that they were righteous, and despised others: Two men went up into the temple to pray; the one a Pharisee, and the other a publican. The Pharisee stood and prayed thus with himself, God, I thank thee, that I am not as other men are, extortioners, unjust, adulterers, or even as this publican. I fast twice in the week, I give tithes of all that I possess. And the publican, standing afar off, would not lift up so much as his eyes unto heaven, but smote upon his breast, saying, God be merciful to me a sinner. I tell you, this man went down to his house justified rather than the other: for every one that exalteth himself shall be abased; and he that humbleth himself shall be exalted." - Luke 18:9-14 KJV
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Only non-heretics are humble according to God.
 
Dino246

Dino246

Senior Member
#124
Jun 30, 2015
24,772
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#124
RaceRunner said:
What do you believe happens if someone who claims to be “Born Again” is actually a “Heretic”?
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As I understand the terms, a heretic may repent or may persist in error. That decision determines their future.
 
oyster67

oyster67

Senior Member
#128
May 24, 2014
11,887
8,701
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#128
RaceRunner said:
is actually a “Heretic”?
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Depends on whether he is blasphemous or just stupid. Lots of people here on CC are just stupid. o_O (not Oyster, of course.)

Saul-to-Paul said:
What happens when God claims to love someone, and that someone goes after other gods in his old age before he dies?
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That is called Apostacy and is punishable by eternal hellfire. Solomon is an example of this.

Bob-Carabbio said:
Insufficient information.

EVERYBODY'S a "heretic" according to somebody else's "theology".
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Amen brother! Way to hit the nail on 'da head! (y)
 
Jocund

Jocund

Banned
#129
Jan 14, 2021
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526
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#129
RaceRunner said:
Only non-heretics are humble according to God.
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Citation?

Based on the allegory of the publican, it's clearly the case that outward doctrines are less important than the actual substance of spiritual humility and faith. The publican in that allegory is clearly one that lives by heretical doctrines and yet he was better off than the man that prided himself in doctrines that he ourwardly observed.
 
Dino246

Dino246

Senior Member
#130
Jun 30, 2015
24,772
13,408
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#130
Saul-to-Paul said:
A child of God can choose heresy, but can never be charged a heretic.
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Um... what? A heretic is a person who believes in or promotes heresy. It's that simple. I'm not sure your category distinction would hold up under scrutiny.
 
S

Saul-to-Paul

Junior Member
#131
Jun 5, 2017
341
57
28
#131
Saul-to-Paul said:
What happens when God claims to love someone, and that someone goes after other gods in his old age before he dies?
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oyster67 said:
That is called Apostacy and is punishable by eternal hellfire. Solomon is an example of this.
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You are then ignorant of God's love. Or believe God loves everyone, in which you're still ignorant.
 
Dino246

Dino246

Senior Member
#132
Jun 30, 2015
24,772
13,408
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#132
Saul-to-Paul said:
You are then ignorant of God's love. Or believe God loves everyone, in which you're still ignorant.
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There is no need to insult a respected member of this board as you have done, nor to make unwarranted assumptions about his beliefs.
 
S

Saul-to-Paul

Junior Member
#133
Jun 5, 2017
341
57
28
#133
Dino246 said:
There is no need to insult a respected member of this board as you have done, nor to make unwarranted assumptions about his beliefs.
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I would not be insulted if someone called me ignorant......now Antichrist, with me believing God was manifested in the flesh is a different story.
 
Dino246

Dino246

Senior Member
#134
Jun 30, 2015
24,772
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#134
Saul-to-Paul said:
I would not be insulted if someone called me ignorant......now Antichrist, with me believing God was manifested in the flesh is a different story.
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Try to focus on the ideas rather than on the people presenting them. "You are..." statements are rarely necessary and even more rarely accurate.
 
ResidentAlien

ResidentAlien

Well-known member
#135
Apr 21, 2021
7,606
3,190
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#135
At what point does heresy become a salvation issue. Is anything a salvation issue nowadays? How often do you hear: We may disagree but it's not a salvation issue; we can be brothers and sisters in Christ.

Ecumenists like Rick Warren and the Catholic pope tell us if you love Jesus we're on the same team. And, if you believe in the Creator God you'll be saved.

Clearly, what we believe and preach has an impact on our standing before God.

" . . . and with all unrighteous deception among those who perish, because they did not receive the love of the truth, that they might be saved." 2 Thessalonians 2:10
 
ZNP

ZNP

Well-known member
#136
Sep 14, 2020
32,098
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#136
ResidentAlien said:
At what point does heresy become a salvation issue. Is anything a salvation issue nowadays? How often do you hear: We may disagree but it's not a salvation issue; we can be brothers and sisters in Christ.

Ecumenists like Rick Warren and the Catholic pope tell us if you love Jesus we're on the same team. And, if you believe in the Creator God you'll be saved.

Clearly, what we believe and preach has an impact on our standing before God.

" . . . and with all unrighteous deception among those who perish, because they did not receive the love of the truth, that they might be saved." 2 Thessalonians 2:10
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The items of the faith.

If it isn't an item of the faith then it can simply be two different interpretations. But if you deny the Lord who redeemed you then it is a salvation issue. But be careful, they will hide this fact. Maybe they talk a good game about the blood but you also need something else. However, this recent Chrislam movement clearly denies that Jesus is the only way to the father.
 
ResidentAlien

ResidentAlien

Well-known member
#137
Apr 21, 2021
7,606
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#137
ZNP said:
The items of the faith.

If it isn't an item of the faith then it can simply be two different interpretations. But if you deny the Lord who redeemed you then it is a salvation issue. But be careful, they will hide this fact. Maybe they talk a good game about the blood but you also need something else. However, this recent Chrislam movement clearly denies that Jesus is the only way to the father.
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Are you saying the only "item of the faith" is a profession of Christ? Everything else is up for personal interpretation?
 
tourist

tourist

Senior Member
#138
Mar 13, 2014
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Tennessee
#138
RaceRunner said:
is actually a “Heretic”?
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I would say that it would depend on what the biblical and spiritual source was for such claim. Even then, regardless of the biblical or spiritual source, that would not necessarily make that person a heretic.
 
tourist

tourist

Senior Member
#139
Mar 13, 2014
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Tennessee
#139
Saul-to-Paul said:
What happens when God claims to love someone, and that someone goes after other gods in his old age before he dies?
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In that case that person was never convicted by the Holy Spirit that salvation was indeed assured and therefore was not born-again in the first place.
 
tourist

tourist

Senior Member
#140
Mar 13, 2014
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#140
Saul-to-Paul said:
If someone is truly born again, there is no need for repentance.
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There has to be repentance, otherwise you would merely asking for forgiveness for sins that you are really not sorry for and have no desire to live your live in the way that God intends you to do. Repentance is a life-long process being comforted and guided by the Holy Spirit.
 
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