Russia/Ukraine

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ZNP

Well-known member
Sep 14, 2020
31,919
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#61
All I know is if Puerto Rico decided they would join an alliance with Russia and put Nuclear missile bases in that island, which is 1,000 miles from the US I would have a problem with it, so obviously putting NATO missiles in Ukraine which is 0 miles from Russia should be viewed as a provocative action.
 

soberxp

Senior Member
May 3, 2018
2,511
482
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#62
All I know is if Puerto Rico decided they would join an alliance with Russia and put Nuclear missile bases in that island, which is 1,000 miles from the US I would have a problem with it, so obviously putting NATO missiles in Ukraine which is 0 miles from Russia should be viewed as a provocative action.
You can refer to the Cuban crisis at cold war time.
 

cv5

Well-known member
Nov 20, 2018
18,450
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#63
Biden wanted this war so badly because he did not want Americans to focus on his TOTAL FAILURE as a president, and his total destruction of America. But Zelensky wanted this war for his own ego, not to benefit Ukrainians.
1) 10% for the "big guy" from the Ukraine weaponizing cash flows. Gigantic sums.
2) unlimited cocaine supply and vast monthly bribes to Z for continued compliance. Estimates are Z has hundreds of millions grifted away by now.

All paid for by idiotic US and EU taxpayers.

And that's the game folks. Not complicated. $$$Works the same everywhere$$$.

The useful idiots do their part and idolize the belligerent leaders/actors and die for a cause that is a phantasm and lie.

All this while Satan laughs.
 
Nov 26, 2021
1,125
545
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India
#64
Cv5, you mean like the Budapest Memorandum where the UK and the US convinced Ukraine to give up its Nuclear Missiles - to Russsia!?! - in exchange for Russia's Promise not to attack or threaten Ukraine. Yeah, that lies in the dust now.

Source: "The memoranda, signed in Patria Hall at the Budapest Convention Center with US Ambassador Donald M. Blinken amongst others in attendance,[2] prohibited the Russian Federation, the United Kingdom and the United States from threatening or using military force or economic coercion against Ukraine, Belarus, and Kazakhstan, "except in self-defence or otherwise in accordance with the Charter of the United Nations." As a result of other agreements and the memorandum, between 1993 and 1996, Belarus, Kazakhstan and Ukraine gave up their nuclear weapons ...

According to the three memoranda,[5] Russia, the US and the UK confirmed their recognition of Belarus, Kazakhstan and Ukraine becoming parties to the Treaty on the Non-Proliferation of Nuclear Weapons and effectively abandoning their nuclear arsenal to Russia and that they agreed to the following:
  1. Respect the signatory's independence and sovereignty in the existing borders.[6]
  2. Refrain from the threat or the use of force against the signatory"[3][4]
From: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Budapest_Memorandum

If Ukraine had been accepted into NATO in 2008, Putin would most probably not have attacked it: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ukraine–NATO_relations#Bucharest_summit:_2008–2009 He's not foolish enough to attack a NATO country. And NATO is a defensive alliance only. Article 5 is not about attacking any other country, but only taking an attack on one as an attack on all. Also NATO did not accept Ukraine precisely because they thought Putin may give that as an excuse to invade. But now their very non-acceptance led to his invasion. Moreover, when Finland and Sweden saw Putin's aggression, they applied to join NATO. So if Putin considered Ukraine a threat, when it wasn't even close to joining NATO, why not Finland and Sweden? The Truth is Putin respects strength and won't commit further aggressions if he knows he will lose. That's why he's not attacking Finland or Sweden. Against Ukraine, he thought he'll win easily, but yeah, that didn't happen.

Here is the Ukrainian Ministry of Defense estimates of number of troops Russia has lost in its unjust invasion. 65000.

For context, Russia lost nearly 15,000 soldiers in its 10 year War with Afghanistan. America lost some 2500 in 20 years.

Wiki: "Over 15,000 Soviet troops were killed in Afghanistan from 1979 until 1989." That was across 10 years here.

Wiki: "There were 2,456 United States military deaths in the War in Afghanistan." This is 65,000 in some 8 months.

 

soberxp

Senior Member
May 3, 2018
2,511
482
83
#65
1) 10% for the "big guy" from the Ukraine weaponizing cash flows. Gigantic sums.
2) unlimited cocaine supply and vast monthly bribes to Z for continued compliance. Estimates are Z has hundreds of millions grifted away by now.

All paid for by idiotic US and EU taxpayers.

And that's the game folks. Not complicated. $$$Works the same everywhere$$$.

The useful idiots do their part and idolize the belligerent leaders/actors and die for a cause that is a phantasm and lie.

All this while Satan laughs.
Most Chinese think so.
 

soberxp

Senior Member
May 3, 2018
2,511
482
83
#66
Cv5, you mean like the Budapest Memorandum where the UK and the US convinced Ukraine to give up its Nuclear Missiles - to Russsia!?! - in exchange for Russia's Promise not to attack or threaten Ukraine. Yeah, that lies in the dust now.

Source: "The memoranda, signed in Patria Hall at the Budapest Convention Center with US Ambassador Donald M. Blinken amongst others in attendance,[2] prohibited the Russian Federation, the United Kingdom and the United States from threatening or using military force or economic coercion against Ukraine, Belarus, and Kazakhstan, "except in self-defence or otherwise in accordance with the Charter of the United Nations." As a result of other agreements and the memorandum, between 1993 and 1996, Belarus, Kazakhstan and Ukraine gave up their nuclear weapons ...

According to the three memoranda,[5] Russia, the US and the UK confirmed their recognition of Belarus, Kazakhstan and Ukraine becoming parties to the Treaty on the Non-Proliferation of Nuclear Weapons and effectively abandoning their nuclear arsenal to Russia and that they agreed to the following:
  1. Respect the signatory's independence and sovereignty in the existing borders.[6]
  2. Refrain from the threat or the use of force against the signatory"[3][4]
From: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Budapest_Memorandum

If Ukraine had been accepted into NATO in 2008, Putin would most probably not have attacked it: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ukraine–NATO_relations#Bucharest_summit:_2008–2009 He's not foolish enough to attack a NATO country. And NATO is a defensive alliance only. Article 5 is not about attacking any other country, but only taking an attack on one as an attack on all. Also NATO did not accept Ukraine precisely because they thought Putin may give that as an excuse to invade. But now their very non-acceptance led to his invasion. Moreover, when Finland and Sweden saw Putin's aggression, they applied to join NATO. So if Putin considered Ukraine a threat, when it wasn't even close to joining NATO, why not Finland and Sweden? The Truth is Putin respects strength and won't commit further aggressions if he knows he will lose. That's why he's not attacking Finland or Sweden. Against Ukraine, he thought he'll win easily, but yeah, that didn't happen.

Here is the Ukrainian Ministry of Defense estimates of number of troops Russia has lost in its unjust invasion. 65000.

For context, Russia lost nearly 15,000 soldiers in its 10 year War with Afghanistan. America lost some 2500 in 20 years.

Wiki: "Over 15,000 Soviet troops were killed in Afghanistan from 1979 until 1989." That was across 10 years here.

Wiki: "There were 2,456 United States military deaths in the War in Afghanistan." This is 65,000 in some 8 months.

The Russians started the war because the Ukrainians slaughtered the ethnic Russians or pro Russian people in Ukraine, which is the official statement.
 

cv5

Well-known member
Nov 20, 2018
18,450
7,255
113
#67
Cv5, you mean like the Budapest Memorandum
LOL. Friend.....I know basically every treaty, every promise, every negotiation that was brokered since 1990 and before.

Believe me.....Putin's hand was forced. Stuffing NATO and their military into Ukraine was the last straw. Everyone knows this.
Everyone knows the 2014 coup was the turning point, and how this happened immediately after negotiations broke down....AGAIN.

BTW......the vast majority of Eastern Ukrainians are Russian by BLOOD AND LANGUAGE. THEY ARE RUSSIAN for pity's sake.

Only about 20-25% of western Ukraine are actually Ukrainian.....with plenty of old-shool Nazi actors and sympathies to boot.
 

ZNP

Well-known member
Sep 14, 2020
31,919
5,634
113
#69
Yes, nuclear war does have a downside, but there is also an upside.

The US and all these other countries have very extensive underground bunkers that are well stocked, so they can ride our a nuclear war. Everyone that counts has a ticket and a bed set aside for them.

But after a war is over you can "build back better". Right now socialism has spread across the world like a cancer, so every person that dies helps solve so many issues. Social Security can be solvent again. This is one way to eliminate our 31 trillion debt.

You also eliminate all those lawsuits and criminal trials for fraud, corruption, and mass murder from the Pandemic. This war is just like the purge. After the night is over anyone who survives the bombs, the cancer and the collapse of society will be happy to embrace a fascist regime with law and order.

The Lord said His Spirit would not strive with man forever because man is flesh. Everyone wants their opinion, so much so that they don't want God's opinion, don't want the Bible, don't want evangelicals. Well, the day will come when the restrainer will step aside and they will get the civilization they deserve.
 

soberxp

Senior Member
May 3, 2018
2,511
482
83
#70
No county on planet earth is more corrupt than China in terms of sheer scale. They win the prize.
Corruption is a world problem, just like people are greedy. If you want to make a comparison, corruption in the United States is legal and corruption in China is illegal, but some people will take risks.

It's not my business for the God's sake.
 
Nov 26, 2021
1,125
545
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India
#73
Prez. Zelensky on Twitter on the Morning of Feb. 24: "Russia treacherously attacked our state in the morning, as Nazi Germany did in #2WW years,” he wrote. “As of today, our countries are on different sides of world history. [Russia] has embarked on a path of evil, but [Ukraine] is defending itself & won’t give up its freedom no matter what Moscow thinks.”

Also, the US offered Zelensky a route out of his country and out of personal danger. But he said no, he was going to stay and fight, and suffer with his people. He could have saved himself the trouble if he wanted to. But he didn't. Mark of a leader who cares for his people. He said: "I need ammo, not a ride". He intended to stay and defend his country, and he did.

If Ukraine stops fighting, there will no Ukraine. If Russia stops fighting, the War ends. The onus is on Russia to retreat.

I do not agree with those who take an excessively pessimistic view of eschatology and believe nuclear war is inevitable. When the people of Nineveh repented at Jonah's preaching, God relented of the punishment He had said He would bring on them, if they did not repent. This is a standard Biblical principle and explained in Jer 18:7-10: "7 If at any time I announce that a nation or kingdom is to be uprooted, torn down and destroyed, 8 and if that nation I warned repents of its evil, then I will relent and not inflict on it the disaster I had planned. 9 And if at another time I announce that a nation or kingdom is to be built up and planted, 10 and if it does evil in my sight and does not obey me, then I will reconsider the good I had intended to do for it." So I do not believe Nuclear War is unavoidable. It depends on how much repentance is done.

Also, some men and women of God have prophesied of a last end times "Billion Soul Harvest" before Anti-Christ comes. I think Satan is trying to prevent that, by stirring up nuclear wars etc. If the war happens, then the Anti-Christ will probably show up after that with a "solution". But God's Will imo is for the Billion Soul Harvest and thus not for the Nuclear War that would kill, not save, 100s of Millions or Billions.

"'A Billion-Soul Harvest': The End Times Ushering in History's Greatest Revival?

Christian ministries have been called streams of God. A number of them are coming together because they believe their unity could help set off history's greatest revival."

https://www1.cbn.com/content/billion-soul-harvest-end-times-ushering-historys-greatest-revival [Video in the link].

God Bless.
 

cv5

Well-known member
Nov 20, 2018
18,450
7,255
113
#74
Prez. Zelensky on Twitter on the Morning of Feb. 24: "Russia treacherously attacked our state in the morning, as Nazi Germany did in #2WW years,” he wrote. “As of today, our countries are on different sides of world history. [Russia] has embarked on a path of evil, but [Ukraine] is defending itself & won’t give up its freedom no matter what Moscow thinks.”
Typical propaganda ops bro. The first casualty in the fog of war is truth.
Same lies coming from both sides. Both equally at fault. Both will be judged for it.

I never.....ever trust anything either side promulgates. But.....I do stay apprised of this war drama nevertheless.
 

ZNP

Well-known member
Sep 14, 2020
31,919
5,634
113
#75
Prez. Zelensky on Twitter on the Morning of Feb. 24: "Russia treacherously attacked our state in the morning, as Nazi Germany did in #2WW years,” he wrote. “As of today, our countries are on different sides of world history. [Russia] has embarked on a path of evil, but [Ukraine] is defending itself & won’t give up its freedom no matter what Moscow thinks.”

Also, the US offered Zelensky a route out of his country and out of personal danger. But he said no, he was going to stay and fight, and suffer with his people. He could have saved himself the trouble if he wanted to. But he didn't. Mark of a leader who cares for his people. He said: "I need ammo, not a ride". He intended to stay and defend his country, and he did.

If Ukraine stops fighting, there will no Ukraine. If Russia stops fighting, the War ends. The onus is on Russia to retreat.

I do not agree with those who take an excessively pessimistic view of eschatology and believe nuclear war is inevitable. When the people of Nineveh repented at Jonah's preaching, God relented of the punishment He had said He would bring on them, if they did not repent. This is a standard Biblical principle and explained in Jer 18:7-10: "7 If at any time I announce that a nation or kingdom is to be uprooted, torn down and destroyed, 8 and if that nation I warned repents of its evil, then I will relent and not inflict on it the disaster I had planned. 9 And if at another time I announce that a nation or kingdom is to be built up and planted, 10 and if it does evil in my sight and does not obey me, then I will reconsider the good I had intended to do for it." So I do not believe Nuclear War is unavoidable. It depends on how much repentance is done.

Also, some men and women of God have prophesied of a last end times "Billion Soul Harvest" before Anti-Christ comes. I think Satan is trying to prevent that, by stirring up nuclear wars etc. If the war happens, then the Anti-Christ will probably show up after that with a "solution". But God's Will imo is for the Billion Soul Harvest and thus not for the Nuclear War that would kill, not save, 100s of Millions or Billions.

"'A Billion-Soul Harvest': The End Times Ushering in History's Greatest Revival?

Christian ministries have been called streams of God. A number of them are coming together because they believe their unity could help set off history's greatest revival."

https://www1.cbn.com/content/billion-soul-harvest-end-times-ushering-historys-greatest-revival [Video in the link].

God Bless.
Ukraine is not a US ally, making Ukraine a member of NATO violates previous agreements we have with Russia, and this war in the Ukraine is not a matter of US national interest.

If Germany and France decide to take the lead in the response as a member of NATO the US can support them. But that is it. In my opinion Biden should be impeached for sending tens of billions of dollars of military equipment to Ukraine. It is Congress that declares war, not the president. The idea that he will get us into WW3 without Congress voting is impeachable offense.
 

cv5

Well-known member
Nov 20, 2018
18,450
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#76
Ukraine is not a US ally, making Ukraine a member of NATO violates previous agreements we have with Russia, and this war in the Ukraine is not a matter of US national interest.
NATO membership rules stipulate that there shall be NO MILITARY CONFLICTS in the petitioning country when filing for membership.

Furthermore.....NATO has already turned them down. In writing.

What you hear regarding this question is nothing more than mindless propaganda doom-loops.
 

cv5

Well-known member
Nov 20, 2018
18,450
7,255
113

ZNP

Well-known member
Sep 14, 2020
31,919
5,634
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#78

ZNP

Well-known member
Sep 14, 2020
31,919
5,634
113
#79
 
P

persistent

Guest
#80
SUSPICIOUS PHOTO ......WHO is FUTURISM


Elon Musk Warns "Civilization Is Over" If Ukraine Doesn't Give in to Russia
Noor Al-Sibai - 3h ag


1666032262045.png

Newly-minted political expert Elon Musk has issued a stark warning to Ukraine as Russia's invasion of the former Eastern Bloc country continues. © Provided by Futurism
Nuclear Meltdown
Self-proclaimed political expert Elon Musk has issued a stark warning to Ukraine as Russia's invasion continues.
Using Twitter, the platform he is likely to soon own and control, the world's richest man made a number of eyebrow-raising predictions for eventualities regarding the outcome of Russia's invasion of Ukraine.
"If Russia is faced with the choice of losing Crimea or using battlefield nukes, they will choose the latter," the SpaceX and Tesla CEO tweeted. "[The West has] already sanctioned/cutoff Russia in every possible way, so what more do they have left to lose?"
"If we nuke Russia back, they will nuke us and then we have WW3," he added.
In short, Musk is arguing that Ukraine should give in to Russia's demands, or else — a highly controversial perspective that has already landed him in hot water recently.
Last week, he announced SpaceX will no longer supply Starlink internet satellite tech to Ukraine, a decision he reversed two days later.