The gospel of …..

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Cameron143

Well-known member
Mar 1, 2022
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#61
It is impossible to keep the OT law! There was only one person who was able to keep the law in its entirety. He happens to be the Son of the Father who created the law.

As a matter of interest, a person keeping the OT law would be arrested for cruelty to animals.
It's impossible to keep any commandment apart from Christ.
 

Pilgrimshope

Well-known member
Sep 2, 2020
12,573
5,077
113
#62
It is impossible to keep the OT law! There was only one person who was able to keep the law in its entirety. He happens to be the Son of the Father who created the law.

As a matter of interest, a person keeping the OT law would be arrested for cruelty to animals.
I actually am saying that no one can keep any law fully and completely. Most people can't even tell you what any singular command requires of an individual, let alone how to perform it and what the requisite inward reality must be met. This,coupled with the fact that sin remains in the flesh and none of our hearts are completely pure, means even if we understood any commandment in its totality, our motivations for keeping it would fall short of what is required. Of ourselves, there is a measure of sin in all we do. Their is either an element of the commandment that isn't met or an inward motivation that does not reflect the spiritual nature the commandment requires. If we chose the 3 purest acts we ever performed, and these were the only acts we ever performed, they would be insufficient to merit eternal life. They would be as filthy rags before God because they would not engender the righteousness demanded by the commandments. Jesus alone lived a life of perfect righteousness.
Given this, even being gloriously redeemed and made new, there remains in each of us impurity that makes the keeping of the commandments impossible in and of ourselves. It is only as we walk in the Spirit that we will not fulfill the lusts of the flesh; it is only as Christ lives in and through us that we actually attain to the righteousness of the law. This is true irrespective of which commandment you apply it to.
Thus, to focus on the law rather than on our relationship to Christ is to miss all that Christ has made available to us. He didn't save us so we could concentrate on obedience. He saved us so we could relate to Him. We were already related to the law. We were not in relationship with Him. Certainly as a result of this new relationship we will be obedient. But that isn't to be accomplished outside of our relationship with Christ. It is accomplished as we grow in the grace and knowledge of the Lord Jesus Christ. It is the natural outcome of the relationship, and not the basis of it.
Perhaps I just can't communicate well my thoughts. But a life with God hidden in Christ is so much more than keeping commandments.
“But a life with God hidden in Christ is so much more than keeping commandments”

it really isn’t brother

By this we know that we love the children of God, when we love God, and keep his commandments.

For this is the love of God, that we keep his commandments: and his commandments are not grievous. For whatsoever is born of God overcometh the world: and this is the victory that overcometh the world, even our faith.”
‭‭1 John‬ ‭5:2-4‬ ‭KJV‬‬

maybe it’s the word “ commandment “ ? Everything God speaks is a command brither he commanded the light to shine out of darkness and it obeyed , he commanded the dry ground be gathered together in one place and it obeyed he commanded the wind to stop blowing and the seas to calm and they did he commanded a dead man to rise up and walk from his grave and he obeyed …..

without his word we don’t have anything to believe there’s no truth without the law of Christ no life without the law of life no light without his judgements ect

We should receive his words as of God came and spoke himself we have to notice though Jesus wasn’t walking around repeating Moses law he was teaching a new thing a better thing that saves people who accept it

Brother there’s a reason Jesus sent the gospel out to all the world to hear it because that’s life eternal what we find in it is Gods truth that is written upon the hearts of those who accept it. That law becomes a living part of us to change us from rebels to those who love God

“And be not conformed to this world: but be ye transformed by the renewing of your mind, that ye may prove what is that good, and acceptable, and perfect, will of God.”
‭‭Romans‬ ‭12:2‬ ‭KJV‬‬

I’m just a sinner bound to sin and fail v I’m not who I was in born again I’m filled with Gods spirit I have the nature of Christ in me …..

i can do all things through Christ who gave me strength v Christ already did everything so I don’t have to do anything I can’t

The Old Testament corresponds with the people your describing who can’t do right can’t repent can’t keep the lords word the new testement changes the person with a far better word of life

if so be that ye have heard him, and have been taught by him, as the truth is in Jesus:( truth sets free ) that ye put off concerning the former conversation the old man, which is corrupt according to the deceitful lusts; ( this is the person your describing )

and be renewed in the spirit of your mind; ( Jesus teachings do this for believers not those who reject his teachings but believers they change our minds that were wrong before jesus came telling the truth to mankind about God


and that ye put on the new man, which after God is created in righteousness and true holiness.”( the new man doesn’t have any issues following where God leads him it’s in his nature to do right wheras it used to be on his nature to rebel)
‭‭Ephesians‬ ‭4:21-24‬ ‭KJV‬‬

Does a righteous man have the issues of not being able to obey God ? Or is it different because he does t have that old rebel working in him constently so obeying God doesn’t sound like a chore anymore it’s just good common sense to obey one’s God almighty and creator who promises to save us and give us lasting life

the new testement changes beleivers brother without the New Testament word ( Gods true Eternal law ) we’re in the dark and don’t know the truth

We can change from what we used to be inside and all that is needed to accomplish it is to come into the lords presence and sit at his feet and hear the truth obeying God should become a chrirtians nature and we don’t get there by any other means than jeering the truth about things like repentance , obedience , true judgement based on deeds those things wake us up
 

Cameron143

Well-known member
Mar 1, 2022
14,909
5,370
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62
#63
“But a life with God hidden in Christ is so much more than keeping commandments”

it really isn’t brother

By this we know that we love the children of God, when we love God, and keep his commandments.

For this is the love of God, that we keep his commandments: and his commandments are not grievous. For whatsoever is born of God overcometh the world: and this is the victory that overcometh the world, even our faith.”
‭‭1 John‬ ‭5:2-4‬ ‭KJV‬‬

maybe it’s the word “ commandment “ ? Everything God speaks is a command brither he commanded the light to shine out of darkness and it obeyed , he commanded the dry ground be gathered together in one place and it obeyed he commanded the wind to stop blowing and the seas to calm and they did he commanded a dead man to rise up and walk from his grave and he obeyed …..

without his word we don’t have anything to believe there’s no truth without the law of Christ no life without the law of life no light without his judgements ect

We should receive his words as of God came and spoke himself we have to notice though Jesus wasn’t walking around repeating Moses law he was teaching a new thing a better thing that saves people who accept it

Brother there’s a reason Jesus sent the gospel out to all the world to hear it because that’s life eternal what we find in it is Gods truth that is written upon the hearts of those who accept it. That law becomes a living part of us to change us from rebels to those who love God

“And be not conformed to this world: but be ye transformed by the renewing of your mind, that ye may prove what is that good, and acceptable, and perfect, will of God.”
‭‭Romans‬ ‭12:2‬ ‭KJV‬‬

I’m just a sinner bound to sin and fail v I’m not who I was in born again I’m filled with Gods spirit I have the nature of Christ in me …..

i can do all things through Christ who gave me strength v Christ already did everything so I don’t have to do anything I can’t

The Old Testament corresponds with the people your describing who can’t do right can’t repent can’t keep the lords word the new testement changes the person with a far better word of life

if so be that ye have heard him, and have been taught by him, as the truth is in Jesus:( truth sets free ) that ye put off concerning the former conversation the old man, which is corrupt according to the deceitful lusts; ( this is the person your describing )

and be renewed in the spirit of your mind; ( Jesus teachings do this for believers not those who reject his teachings but believers they change our minds that were wrong before jesus came telling the truth to mankind about God


and that ye put on the new man, which after God is created in righteousness and true holiness.”( the new man doesn’t have any issues following where God leads him it’s in his nature to do right wheras it used to be on his nature to rebel)
‭‭Ephesians‬ ‭4:21-24‬ ‭KJV‬‬

Does a righteous man have the issues of not being able to obey God ? Or is it different because he does t have that old rebel working in him constently so obeying God doesn’t sound like a chore anymore it’s just good common sense to obey one’s God almighty and creator who promises to save us and give us lasting life

the new testement changes beleivers brother without the New Testament word ( Gods true Eternal law ) we’re in the dark and don’t know the truth

We can change from what we used to be inside and all that is needed to accomplish it is to come into the lords presence and sit at his feet and hear the truth obeying God should become a chrirtians nature and we don’t get there by any other means than jeering the truth about things like repentance , obedience , true judgement based on deeds those things wake us up
Depends on how you read what is written:

For this is the love of God, that we keep His commandments...

Is it saying this is how we love God? Or is it saying that obedience is a manifestation of God's love towards us?
It equates the love of God to obedience. But is it our love towards Him, or His love to us? What does it mean that the commandments aren't grievous?
 

Pilgrimshope

Well-known member
Sep 2, 2020
12,573
5,077
113
#64
It's impossible to keep any commandment apart from Christ.
Depends on how you read what is written:

For this is the love of God, that we keep His commandments...

Is it saying this is how we love God? Or is it saying that obedience is a manifestation of God's love towards us?
It equates the love of God to obedience. But is it our love towards Him, or His love to us? What does it mean that the commandments aren't grievous?
it just is saying what it says brother this is how we know we love the children of God ( one another )

when we Love God and keep his commandments we’re loving one another

By this we know that we love the children of God,

when we love God, and keep his commandments.”
‭‭1 John‬ ‭5:2‬ ‭KJV‬‬

Remember how he said “ all the law and prophets hang on these two commandments “ ? Love God and also your neighbor as yourself ? That’s the same thing John is saying just differently and with other details like “ this is how we know we love one another “

brother look at what Jesus was teaching those who followed him just this example

this is how we love another imperfect human according to the Lord this is an action of love towards another consider this brother I think it’s a good sample of what I’m poorly trying to say

this is Gods word to believers in Jesus the children of God by faith Galatians 3s conclusion this doctrine is bf r those people Paul’s talking to the children of God this is thier law that’s meant to be written inside thier heart so that it’s part of thier conscience thier belief inside thier hesrt and it can guide and steer them

Be ye therefore merciful, as your Father also is merciful.

Judge not, and ye shall not be judged: condemn not, and ye shall not be condemned: forgive, and ye shall be forgiven: give, and it shall be given unto you; good measure, pressed down, and shaken together, and running over, shall men give into your bosom. For with the same measure that ye mete withal it shall be measured to you again.


( ok that’s my example of what Gods teaching man to do it’s because we are all imperfect like your saying that’s our law we who trust in Christ now here’s the difference in obeying it or not )


And why call ye me, Lord, Lord, and do not the things which I say? ( it’s a contradiction to Jesus )

Whosoever cometh to me, and heareth my sayings, and doeth them, I will shew you to whom he is like: he is like a man which built an house, and digged deep, and laid the foundation on a rock: and when the flood arose, the stream beat vehemently upon that house, and could not shake it: for it was founded upon a rock.


But he that heareth, and doeth not, is like a man that without a foundation who built an house upon the earth; against which the stream did beat vehemently, and immediately it fell; and the ruin of that house was great.”
‭‭Luke‬ ‭6:36-38, 46-49‬ ‭KJV‬‬

Do you see how if we listen to Jesus he’s able to sort of just lay it out in front of us if we’re willing to really listen to him as if Jesus is Our Lord ?

jesus wasn’t the one ordaining or mediating th e law of Moses Moses mediated it , and angels ordained it of course it’s of God this we all inderrrsnd but the ordination and mediation is not Jesus word , blood , preisthood , temple , promised land ect it’s a different covenant is all I’m saying we do have to learn from and obey Jesus however

we just like his disciples walk with him bekieving the gospel and learning from him the rough hesring the word he sent to us and applying it as we learn . We grow up we make many mistakes like your saying brother

what im saying is listen to what he’s saying and you might understand what I’m saying isn’t in opposition …to what yourrrrre saying

“After this manner therefore pray ye: Our Father which art in heaven, Hallowed be thy name. Thy kingdom come. Thy will be done in earth, as it is in heaven.

And forgive us our debts, as we forgive our debtors. For if ye forgive men their trespasses, your heavenly Father will also forgive you: but if ye forgive not men their trespasses, neither will your Father forgive your trespasses.”
‭‭Matthew‬ ‭6:9-10, 12, 14-15‬ ‭KJV‬‬

Okay do you see how that , requires obedience ? Because there’s a consequence of not being forgiven that comes with not obeying it ? And how important it is for us to even when we’re offended make sure and do this ?

“And when ye stand praying, forgive, if ye have ought against any: that your Father also which is in heaven may forgive you your trespasses. But if ye do not forgive, neither will your Father which is in heaven forgive your trespasses.”
‭‭Mark‬ ‭11:25-26‬ ‭KJV‬‬

Do you see how that’s a law that’s going to save a person who isn’t perfect through e mercies of God and only if we accept what he’s saying because the law of Moses doesn’t say that , it condemns sinners to death and says “ shew no mercy thine eye shall not pity take an eye for an eye and a tooth for a tooth “

Jesus said no don’t do that , do the opposite when someone offends you pardon them like I pardoned you when you had sinned and needed mercy”

We need to look at the right law is all I’m saying brother and understand who’s words will judge the world

“So speak ye, and so do, as they that shall be judged by the law of liberty. For he shall have judgment without mercy, that hath shewed no mercy; and mercy rejoiceth against judgment.”
‭‭James‬ ‭2:12-13‬ ‭KJV‬‬

The gospel sets us free it’s the law of Christ we’re taught to hear and believe and follow after his commands his teachings , his words and sayings that’s our law he’s the Christian’s law giver and his law saves souls from sin and death from condemnation from wayward sonship he calls us home brother the tablet is our heart but the words are those the Lord sent tonus in the gospel those should rule our heart and mind as far as becoming our law inside its zgods true law meant to be written on our hearts

arhats why Jesus was always telling everyone it’s about hearing my word and continuing in it following after it in sincerity even if you fail sometimes the things Jesus said in His law are right there for us to forgive us and restore us and strengthen us and lift us back up

The things Moses said in his law cannot do that for sinners instead it doesn this to them and also to thier congregation image Jesus teaching this in the gospel ???

“And while the children of Israel were in the wilderness, they found a man that gathered sticks upon the sabbath day. …..And the LORD said unto Moses, The man shall be surely put to death: all the congregation shall stone him with stones without the camp. And all the congregation brought him without the camp, and stoned him with stones, and he died; as the LORD commanded Moses.”
‭‭Numbers‬ ‭15:32, 35-36‬ ‭

Remember Jesus was presented with a woman caught in the act of adultery and forgave her and called her to repentance from her sin ? His law is grace and truth we want his law inside our hearts and mknds continually and we do also want to think we’re supposed to and are able to obey him he taught us that as did the apostles
 

Pilgrimshope

Well-known member
Sep 2, 2020
12,573
5,077
113
#65
He’s trying to change our hearts through Christs sacrifice for our sins an act of great Love for all sinners and change our minds with his words of truth and life we’re taught to believe and follow after as if it’s Gods word

the gospel is the most important thing that’s ever happened in the earth
 

JaumeJ

Senior Member
Jul 2, 2011
21,242
6,532
113
#66
Beware of falling into the trap of thinking following the law is the same as obeying the Father. We are to obey Him according to the teachings of Jesus Yeshua. If you are one of the myriads who hate the law it would be a very good idea to go through the teachings of our Savior and learn just how they are to be understood..

Here is a simple example of a law that is naturally included in love. It is written we are not to move our landmark upon another's land in order to increase our land. Now, because of the Blood of the Lamb are we free of this law, or has it become our nature not to dream of doing such a thing?

In other words, though we are free of the law, we do not mover our vences into all of our neighbor's property in order to have more property for ourselves.

Wake up folks and learn freedom in spirit and in truth. Stop bickering over those 613 laws and learn from Jesus Yeshua.
 

Pilgrimshope

Well-known member
Sep 2, 2020
12,573
5,077
113
#67
Beware of falling into the trap of thinking following the law is the same as obeying the Father. We are to obey Him according to the teachings of Jesus Yeshua. If you are one of the myriads who hate the law it would be a very good idea to go through the teachings of our Savior and learn just how they are to be understood..

Here is a simple example of a law that is naturally included in love. It is written we are not to move our landmark upon another's land in order to increase our land. Now, because of the Blood of the Lamb are we free of this law, or has it become our nature not to dream of doing such a thing?

In other words, though we are free of the law, we do not mover our vences into all of our neighbor's property in order to have more property for ourselves.

Wake up folks and learn freedom in spirit and in truth. Stop bickering over those 613 laws and learn from Jesus Yeshua.
“Beware of falling into the trap of thinking following the law is the same as obeying the Father. We are to obey Him according to the teachings of Jesus Yeshua.”

right.

“And Jesus came and spake unto them, saying, All power is given unto me in heaven and in earth. Go ye therefore, and teach all nations, baptizing them in the name of the Father, and of the Son, and of the Holy Ghost: teaching them to observe all things whatsoever I have commanded you: and, lo, I am with you alway, even unto the end of the world. Amen.”
‭‭Matthew‬ ‭28:18-20‬ ‭KJV‬‬

It’s the law of Christ
 

JaumeJ

Senior Member
Jul 2, 2011
21,242
6,532
113
#68
“Beware of falling into the trap of thinking following the law is the same as obeying the Father. We are to obey Him according to the teachings of Jesus Yeshua.”

right.

“And Jesus came and spake unto them, saying, All power is given unto me in heaven and in earth. Go ye therefore, and teach all nations, baptizing them in the name of the Father, and of the Son, and of the Holy Ghost: teaching them to observe all things whatsoever I have commanded you: and, lo, I am with you alway, even unto the end of the world. Amen.”
‭‭Matthew‬ ‭28:18-20‬ ‭KJV‬‬

It’s the law of Christ
Is grace a law? I suppose one could look upon it that way.
 

Soyeong

Active member
Oct 11, 2023
771
93
28
#69
I would try to keep the law if 1 person could enumerate all that is entailed in loving God with all one's heart, mind, soul, and strength.

This shouldn't be too difficult for the lawyers amongst us as they have already told us the commandments can be kept. Any takers?
God's commandments are His instructions for how to love Him with all of our heart, mind, soul, and strength:

Deuteronomy 6:4-7 You shall love the Lord your God with all your heart and with all your soul and with all your might. 6 And these words that I command you today shall be on your heart. 7 You shall teach them diligently to your children, and shall talk of them when you sit in your house, and when you walk by the way, and when you lie down, and when you rise.

Deuteronomy 10:12-13 “And now, Israel, what does the Lord your God require of you, but to fear the Lord your God, to walk in all his ways, to love him, to serve the Lord your God with all your heart and with all your soul, 13 and to keep the commandments and statutes of the Lord, which I am commanding you today for your good?

Deuteronomy 11:1 “You shall therefore love the Lord your God and keep his charge, his statutes, his rules, and his commandments always.

Deuteronomy 11:13 “And if you will indeed obey my commandments that I command you today, to love the Lord your God, and to serve him with all your heart and with all your soul,

Deuteronomy 13:1-5 “If a prophet or a dreamer of dreams arises among you and gives you a sign or a wonder, 2 and the sign or wonder that he tells you comes to pass, and if he says, ‘Let us go after other gods,’ which you have not known, ‘and let us serve them,’3 you shall not listen to the words of that prophet or that dreamer of dreams. For the Lord your God is testing you, to know whether you love the Lord your God with all your heart and with all your soul. 4 You shall walk after the Lord your God and fear him and keep his commandments and obey his voice, and you shall serve him and hold fast to him. 5 But that prophet or that dreamer of dreams shall be put to death, because he has taught rebellion against the Lord your God, who brought you out of the land of Egypt and redeemed you out of the house of slavery, to make you leave the way in which the Lord your God commanded you to walk. So you shall purge the evil from your midst.

Deuteronomy 30:6-8 And the Lord your God will circumcise your heart and the heart of your offspring, so that you will love the Lord your God with all your heart and with all your soul, that you may live. 7 And the Lord your God will put all these curses on your foes and enemies who persecuted you. 8 And you shall again obey the voice of the Lord and keep all his commandments that I command you today.

Joshua 22:5 Only be very careful to observe the commandment and the law that Moses the servant of the Lord commanded you, to love the Lord your God, and to walk in all his ways and to keep his commandments and to cling to him and to serve him with all your heart and with all your soul.”
 

Soyeong

Active member
Oct 11, 2023
771
93
28
#70
If a law does not contain mercy, understanding and love, we are free to ignore it. however the laws which are contained within Love are always to be obeyed. Now read the 613, and you will know which are embellishments of man.
In Deuteronomy 5:31-33, Moses wrote down everything that God instructed Him without departing from it, so all of Law of Moses was commanded by God. Likewise, the Law of Moses is referred to as being the Law of God in verses like Nehemiah 8:1-8, Ezra 7:6-12, and Luke 2:22-23. Moreover, Jesus quoted three times from Deuteronomy to defeat the temptations of Satan, so he affirmed its authority. In Matthew 23:23, Jesus said that justice, mercy, and faith are weightier matters of the Mosaic Law, and in Matthew 22:36-40, Jesus summarized the Mosaic Law as being about how to love God and our neighbor.
 

Cameron143

Well-known member
Mar 1, 2022
14,909
5,370
113
62
#71
God's commandments are His instructions for how to love Him with all of our heart, mind, soul, and strength:

Deuteronomy 6:4-7 You shall love the Lord your God with all your heart and with all your soul and with all your might. 6 And these words that I command you today shall be on your heart. 7 You shall teach them diligently to your children, and shall talk of them when you sit in your house, and when you walk by the way, and when you lie down, and when you rise.

Deuteronomy 10:12-13 “And now, Israel, what does the Lord your God require of you, but to fear the Lord your God, to walk in all his ways, to love him, to serve the Lord your God with all your heart and with all your soul, 13 and to keep the commandments and statutes of the Lord, which I am commanding you today for your good?

Deuteronomy 11:1 “You shall therefore love the Lord your God and keep his charge, his statutes, his rules, and his commandments always.

Deuteronomy 11:13 “And if you will indeed obey my commandments that I command you today, to love the Lord your God, and to serve him with all your heart and with all your soul,

Deuteronomy 13:1-5 “If a prophet or a dreamer of dreams arises among you and gives you a sign or a wonder, 2 and the sign or wonder that he tells you comes to pass, and if he says, ‘Let us go after other gods,’ which you have not known, ‘and let us serve them,’3 you shall not listen to the words of that prophet or that dreamer of dreams. For the Lord your God is testing you, to know whether you love the Lord your God with all your heart and with all your soul. 4 You shall walk after the Lord your God and fear him and keep his commandments and obey his voice, and you shall serve him and hold fast to him. 5 But that prophet or that dreamer of dreams shall be put to death, because he has taught rebellion against the Lord your God, who brought you out of the land of Egypt and redeemed you out of the house of slavery, to make you leave the way in which the Lord your God commanded you to walk. So you shall purge the evil from your midst.

Deuteronomy 30:6-8 And the Lord your God will circumcise your heart and the heart of your offspring, so that you will love the Lord your God with all your heart and with all your soul, that you may live. 7 And the Lord your God will put all these curses on your foes and enemies who persecuted you. 8 And you shall again obey the voice of the Lord and keep all his commandments that I command you today.

Joshua 22:5 Only be very careful to observe the commandment and the law that Moses the servant of the Lord commanded you, to love the Lord your God, and to walk in all his ways and to keep his commandments and to cling to him and to serve him with all your heart and with all your soul.”
Once again you answer but can't tell me what a single commandment requires of me. How can you obey what you cannot explain?
 

Pilgrimshope

Well-known member
Sep 2, 2020
12,573
5,077
113
#72
Is grace a law? I suppose one could look upon it that way.
Must Moses wrote is his law , what Jesus said is his law

“Bear ye one another's burdens, and so fulfil the law of Christ.”
‭‭Galatians‬ ‭6:2‬ ‭KJV‬‬

He taught a law of liberty and mercy

“So speak ye, and so do, as they that shall be judged by the law of liberty. For he shall have judgment without mercy, that hath shewed no mercy; and mercy rejoiceth against judgment.”
‭‭James‬ ‭2:12-13‬ ‭KJV‬‬

I’d say indeed the gospel is Gods law that will never change or fade away and will remain

Its only a matter of which law one

“For the law of the Spirit of life in Christ Jesus hath made me free

from the law of sin and death.”
‭‭Romans‬ ‭8:2‬ ‭KJV‬‬

There are two laws one according to Moses words the other according to Christs is all I’m saying one will condemn Sinners and our then to death , one will call sinners to repentance and teach then righteousness and give them life

do you see how this is a law ? And whether we obey it or reject it matters to the outcome ?

Be ye therefore merciful, as your Father also is merciful. Judge not, and ye shall not be judged: condemn not, and ye shall not be condemned: forgive, and ye shall be forgiven: give, and it shall be given unto you; good measure, pressed down, and shaken together, and running over, shall be given into your bosom. For with the same measure that ye mete withal it shall be measured to you again.”
‭‭Luke‬ ‭6:36-38‬ ‭KJV‬‬

What’s more is he’ll never change but remain the same Always

This should be the gospel

“but this shall be the covenant that I will make with the house of Israel; After those days, saith the LORD, I will put my law in their inward parts, and write it in their hearts; and will be their God, and they shall be my people.

And they shall teach no more every man his neighbour, and every man his brother, saying, Know the LORD: for they shall all know me, from the least of them unto the greatest of them, saith the LORD: for I will forgive their iniquity, and I will remember their sin no more.”
‭‭Jeremiah‬ ‭31:33-34‬ ‭

What I’m saying is he’s not talking about writing Moses law in our hearts but the gospel the law of Christ our Lord his law that he promised this law

Hearken unto me, my people; and give ear unto me, O my nation: for a law shall proceed from me, and I will make my judgment to rest for a light of the people.”
‭‭Isaiah‬ ‭51:4‬ ‭KJV‬‬

so yeah I’d say we should look at it as a law but not try to reduce it all down to the term “grace “ the gospel of grace is just a reference to the gospel Jesus came to preach and accomplish it becomes a living law within um our conscience like a compass to guide us
 

jamessb

Active member
Feb 10, 2024
738
121
43
Santa Fe NM
#73
God's commandments are His instructions for how to love Him with all of our heart, mind, soul, and strength:

Deuteronomy 6:4-7 You shall love the Lord your God with all your heart and with all your soul and with all your might. 6 And these words that I command you today shall be on your heart. 7 You shall teach them diligently to your children, and shall talk of them when you sit in your house, and when you walk by the way, and when you lie down, and when you rise.

Deuteronomy 10:12-13 “And now, Israel, what does the Lord your God require of you, but to fear the Lord your God, to walk in all his ways, to love him, to serve the Lord your God with all your heart and with all your soul, 13 and to keep the commandments and statutes of the Lord, which I am commanding you today for your good?

Deuteronomy 11:1 “You shall therefore love the Lord your God and keep his charge, his statutes, his rules, and his commandments always.

Deuteronomy 11:13 “And if you will indeed obey my commandments that I command you today, to love the Lord your God, and to serve him with all your heart and with all your soul,

Deuteronomy 13:1-5 “If a prophet or a dreamer of dreams arises among you and gives you a sign or a wonder, 2 and the sign or wonder that he tells you comes to pass, and if he says, ‘Let us go after other gods,’ which you have not known, ‘and let us serve them,’3 you shall not listen to the words of that prophet or that dreamer of dreams. For the Lord your God is testing you, to know whether you love the Lord your God with all your heart and with all your soul. 4 You shall walk after the Lord your God and fear him and keep his commandments and obey his voice, and you shall serve him and hold fast to him. 5 But that prophet or that dreamer of dreams shall be put to death, because he has taught rebellion against the Lord your God, who brought you out of the land of Egypt and redeemed you out of the house of slavery, to make you leave the way in which the Lord your God commanded you to walk. So you shall purge the evil from your midst.

Deuteronomy 30:6-8 And the Lord your God will circumcise your heart and the heart of your offspring, so that you will love the Lord your God with all your heart and with all your soul, that you may live. 7 And the Lord your God will put all these curses on your foes and enemies who persecuted you. 8 And you shall again obey the voice of the Lord and keep all his commandments that I command you today.

Joshua 22:5 Only be very careful to observe the commandment and the law that Moses the servant of the Lord commanded you, to love the Lord your God, and to walk in all his ways and to keep his commandments and to cling to him and to serve him with all your heart and with all your soul.”
Don't forget to slaughter the appropriate animal for the forgiveness of your sins.
 

jamessb

Active member
Feb 10, 2024
738
121
43
Santa Fe NM
#74
In Deuteronomy 5:31-33, Moses wrote down everything that God instructed Him without departing from it, so all of Law of Moses was commanded by God. Likewise, the Law of Moses is referred to as being the Law of God in verses like Nehemiah 8:1-8, Ezra 7:6-12, and Luke 2:22-23. Moreover, Jesus quoted three times from Deuteronomy to defeat the temptations of Satan, so he affirmed its authority. In Matthew 23:23, Jesus said that justice, mercy, and faith are weightier matters of the Mosaic Law, and in Matthew 22:36-40, Jesus summarized the Mosaic Law as being about how to love God and our neighbor.
Again, don't forget to slaughter the appropriate animal for the forgiveness of your sins.
 

Pilgrimshope

Well-known member
Sep 2, 2020
12,573
5,077
113
#75
Don't forget to slaughter the appropriate animal for the forgiveness of your sins.
But first find a levite preist to do it so the constant reminder of sin is reiterated

“But in those sacrifices there is a remembrance again made of sins every year. For it is not possible that the blood of bulls and of goats should take away sins.”
‭‭Hebrews‬ ‭10:3-4‬ ‭KJV‬‬
 

JaumeJ

Senior Member
Jul 2, 2011
21,242
6,532
113
#76
Do all here know that It is Jesus Yeshua Who gave thelaw to Moses? In the beginning was the Word, and the Word was with God, and the Word was God.
 

Pilgrimshope

Well-known member
Sep 2, 2020
12,573
5,077
113
#77
Do all here know that It is Jesus Yeshua Who gave thelaw to Moses? In the beginning was the Word, and the Word was with God, and the Word was God.
“Do all here know that It is Jesus Yeshua Who gave thelaw to Moses? “

yeah of course that’s been stated several times the law has a purpose and a culmination .

“In the beginning was the Word, and the Word was with God, and the Word was God.”

moses wasn’t in the beginning what he said came because of man’s sinfulness

“The Pharisees also came unto him, tempting him, and saying unto him, Is it lawful for a man to put away his wife for every cause?

And he answered and said unto them, Have ye not read, that he which made them at the beginning made them male and female, and said, For this cause shall a man leave father and mother, and shall cleave to his wife: and they twain shall be one flesh? Wherefore they are no more twain, but one flesh. What therefore God hath joined together, let not man put asunder. ( this is what is said before Moses law teaching divorce so they ask Jesus why it’s different )


They say unto him, Why did Moses then command to give a writing of divorcement, and to put her away?

He saith unto them, Moses because of the hardness of your hearts suffered you to put away your wives:

but from the beginning it was not so.”
‭‭Matthew‬ ‭19:3-8‬ ‭KJV‬‬

Jesus is saying Moses commanded them that because they were so hard hearted do you see how Moses influence and judgements are there ? And Jesus is actually speaking something else that was before Moses law ?

Notice how Moses said this

“And the man that committeth adultery with another man's wife, even he that committeth adultery with his neighbour's wife, the adulterer and the adulteress shall surely be put to death.”
‭‭Leviticus‬ ‭20:10‬ ‭KJV‬‬

Jesus doesn’t follow or teach that because it can’t save a sinner it can only make the other sinners kill them

Can you say Jesus is teaching this ?

“And thine eye shall not pity; but life shall go for life, eye for eye, tooth for tooth, hand for hand, foot for foot.”
‭‭Deuteronomy‬ ‭19:21‬ ‭KJV‬‬

or is he teaching a contrary thing in the gospel ?

Remembering this one thing

Jesus Christ the same yesterday, and to day, and for ever.”
‭‭Hebrews‬ ‭13:8‬ ‭KJV‬‬

Would jesus ever teach this for a young woman who’s been found to have had pre marital sex ?

“then they shall bring out the damsel to the door of her father's house, and the men of her city shall stone her with stones that she die: because she hath wrought folly in Israel, to play the whore in her father's house: so shalt thou put evil away from among you.”
‭‭Deuteronomy‬ ‭22:21‬ ‭KJV‬‬

You’re saying Jesus was teaching this stuff ? Or does it make more sense if this guy is in charge speaking for God with this dispostion to the people ?

“Behold, I send an Angel before thee, to keep thee in the way, and to bring thee into the place which I have prepared. Beware of him, and obey his voice, provoke him not; for he will not pardon your transgressions: for my name is in him.”
‭‭Exodus‬ ‭23:20-21‬ ‭

Surely anyone who knows Jesus knows he pardons sin the gospel is all about remission of sins and repentance

when your reading Moses law of course God gave him the mediation of the law for the children of isreal but one has to also acknolwedge th at it’s not the dispostion of Christ speaking those commands and it’s not Jesus that interceded and sabed the people when God was going to destroy them all it was Moses he became the intercessor and mediator God then gave the angel the ordination

the gospel isn’t God speaking to an angel who will not pardon sin giving him the rule over the people and it’s also not the same mediation of Moses that’s why Jesus speaks what Moses wrote and then says the opposite in his teachings

you have heard in the law of Moses ….but I say to you this contrary thing

show no pity put the sinners to death said the angel ……and be merciful do not condemn the sinners to death said Jesus

that’s the issue with the law it isn’t that it’s not of God of course it is yes indeed it’s not Gods word to his children however

“Wherefore then serveth the law? It was added because of transgressions, till the seed should come to whom the promise was made; and it was ordained by angels in the hand of a mediator. Now a mediator is not a mediator of one, but God is one.”
‭‭Galatians‬ ‭3:19-20‬ ‭KJV‬‬

That’s the issue that makes it different it is t “ God the father , son and holy ghost in one rather it is God speaking to that angel with that opposite dispostion from Christ and then the angel appearing to Moses making judgements in gods name like this this isn’t Jesus he doesn’t have this disposition he’s the same always

“And while the children of Israel were in the wilderness, they found a man that gathered sticks upon the sabbath day. And the LORD ( my name is in him ) said unto Moses, The man shall be surely put to death: all the congregation shall stone him with stones without the camp. And all the congregation brought him without the camp, and stoned him with stones, and he died; as the LORD commanded Moses.”
‭‭Numbers‬ ‭15:32, 35-36‬ ‭KJV‬‬

Brother Jesus doesn’t command believers to do things like that to someone who picked a stick up off the ground on a sabbath day

Moses law has a purpose it’s not our covenant however we have a word and covenant made through Jesus Christ and the gospel not this one

“These are the words of the covenant, which the LORD commanded Moses to make with the children of Israel in the land of Moab, beside the covenant which he made with them in Horeb.”
‭‭Deuteronomy‬ ‭29:1‬ ‭KJV‬‬

moses mediation was for them and that land because they were idolaters and worshipped false gods continually is why the angel was ordained and Moses made mediator it was because of what they did

“And they made a calf in those days, and offered sacrifice unto the idol, and rejoiced in the works of their own hands. Then God turned, and gave them up to worship the host of heaven; ( ordained of angels ) as it is written in the book of the prophets, O ye house of Israel, have ye offered to me slain beasts and sacrifices By the space of forty years in the wilderness? Yea, ye took up the tabernacle of Moloch, And the star of your god Remphan, Figures which ye made to worship them: And I will carry you away beyond Babylon.”
‭‭Acts‬ ‭7:41-43‬ ‭

We need the gospel it is the father son and Holy Ghost manifest offering life not the law given to israel for transgression that came along much later than the beginning
 

Soyeong

Active member
Oct 11, 2023
771
93
28
#80
The slaughter of animals is a fundamental requirement of keeping the Old Testament law.
The Mosaic Law also instructions for offerings to be made at the temple with a presiding Levitical priesthood. When the Israelites were exiled to Babylon the condition for their return to the land was to first return to obedience to God's law, which again contains instructions in regard to temple practice which they couldn't obey because the temple had just been destroyed, so we are not required to follow laws in regard to temple practice when there is no temple in which to practice them. Most of the Mosaic Law has nothing to do with the slaughter of animals.