Abraham's Sacrifice of Issac and Ethics.

[psychomom]

it's time for 'stupid questions with ellie'.

is a test of faith for God's sake, or for our own?

is He uncertain of the outcome? or is it so we ourselves see how strong and competent He is for us?

 

[WebersHome]

-

I am confuse because it was a sin for children of Israel to sacrifice their
children

The covenant that Yhvh's people agreed upon with God wasn't in force till
much later, and as Bible law isn't retroactive, then the covenant had no
jurisdiction over Abraham. (Rom 4:15, Rom 5:13, and Gal 3:17)

A technical point that is often overlooked in the "human sacrifice" issue is
that in every instance banning the practice, it is underage children that are
condemned as offerings-- innocent children; viz: babes; and in particular,
one's own. (e.g. Lev 18:21, Lev 20:2-5, Deut 12:31, Deut 18:10, cf. 2Kgs
16:3, 2Kgs 17:31, 2Kgs 23:10, 2Kgs 21:6, Ps 106:34, Ezk 20:31, Ezk
23:37, Jer 7:31, Jer 19:4, Jer 32:35). But I have yet to encounter an
instance where God expressed abhorrence at sacrificing a consenting adult.

The reason that it's wrong for covenanted Jews to sacrifice a consenting
adult is because human sacrifices aren't specified.

†. Deut 4:2 . .You shall not add anything to what I command you or take
anything away from it, but keep the commandments of the Lord your God
that I enjoin upon you.

†. Deut 5:29-30 . . Be careful, then, to do as the Lord your God has
commanded you. Do not turn aside to the right or to the left: follow only the
path that the Lord your God has enjoined upon you

===========================================

 

[SarahM777]

Each of us have our faith tested on one way or another, to one degree or another, some more severely than others. This brings up a good question. Why did God not allow Abraham to go through with the sacrifice since Abraham was rightfully convinced that God could raise his son from the dead?

God never told us. You'll have to ask Him.

 

[oldhermit]

it's time for 'stupid questions with ellie'.

is a test of faith for God's sake, or for our own?

is He uncertain of the outcome? or is it so we ourselves see how strong and competent He is for us?

I would think this is for our growth and spiritual development. God does not operate on a learning curve. God told Abraham at the end of this, "now I know that you fear God, seeing you have not withheld your son, your only son, from me.” This was not a question of whether God was uncertain of Abraham's faith. This is a matter of confirmation. God was confirming what he already knew. He knew how this was going to play out. This was established as a type of Christ's sacrifice. These things are not subject to uncertainties.

 

[kaylagrl]

Absolutely. That is spot on. Does Issac belong to Abraham or to the Almighty?

Well Ive seen a few babies dedicated in my time.The pastor makes it quite clear the child has been given into their safe keeping by God. So Issac belonged to God. IMO

 

[oldhermit]

God never told us. You'll have to ask Him.

Let me offer this for your consideration.
God did not allow Abraham to complete the sacrifice of his son I think for the following reasons.
1. Because the act itself was not important. The only thing that was of importance was Abraham's willingness to obey the will of God. In this, faith is now proven.
2. The level of acceptable faith had been achieved. If God had allowed Abraham to slay his son and burn the meat off his bones believing that God would raise him from the dead, how long do you suppose God would have continued to test that faith before returning Isaac to him? An hour, a day, a week, a month, a year? No doubt, the longer the absence of his son the greater the level of faith that would be required. When Abraham raised the knife to slay his son, God stops him there. This was enough. This was the level of faith God would accept as the standard. He did not require a higher level of faith. God remembers that we are but dust and that we are frail.
3. The world says God does not have the right to make such demand of man. The Word of God shows us that we do not have the right to refuse. Acceptable faith is faith that reserves nothing unto one's self. Like Abraham, God did not withhold his son either. If Abraham is committing an unethical act in the sacrifice of his son, what kind of ethics does God violate at Calvary? NONE!

 

[SarahM777]

it's time for 'stupid questions with ellie'.

is a test of faith for God's sake, or for our own?

is He uncertain of the outcome? or is it so we ourselves see how strong and competent He is for us?

Or is part of it for another reason which we don't think of? God already knows the outcome of the test. God knew before Satan ever asked Him to test Job. God set the limits of the test. Satan DOES NOT know the outcome of the test. Often test can also be a display for the angels and the principalities of the air.

 

[SarahM777]

Let me offer this for your consideration.
God did not allow Abraham to complete the sacrifice of his son I think for the following reasons.
1. Because the act itself was not important. The only thing that was of importance was Abraham's willingness to obey the will of God. In this, faith is now proven.
2. The level of acceptable faith had been achieved. If God had allowed Abraham to slay his son and burn the meat off his bones believing that God would raise him from the dead, how long do you suppose God would have continued to test that faith before returning Isaac to him? An hour, a day, a week, a month, a year? No doubt, the longer the absence of his son the greater the level of faith that would be required. When Abraham raised the knife to slay his son, God stops him there. This was enough. This was the level of faith God would accept as the standard. He did not require a higher level of faith. God remembers that we are but dust and that we are frail.
3. The world says God does not have the right to make such demand of man. The Word of God shows us that we do not have the right to refuse. Acceptable faith is faith that reserves nothing unto itself. Like Abraham, God did not withhold his son either. If Abraham is committing an unethical act in the sacrifice of his son, what kind of ethics does God violate at Calvary? NONE!

#1 God has and always been after our hearts.
#2 Agreed
# 3 Agreed.

 

[psychomom]

I would think this is for our growth and spiritual development. God does not operate on a learning curve. God told Abraham at the end of this, "now I know that you fear God, seeing you have not withheld your son, your only son, from me.” This was not a question of whether God was uncertain of Abraham's faith. This is a matter of confirmation. God was confirming what he already knew. He knew how this was going to play out. This was established as a type of Christ's sacrifice. These things are not subject to uncertainties.

the example of Christ's sacrifice is the biggest thing i draw from this history.

God needs no learning curve, but i often find i'm glad i get one?
i think of these statements:

And not only this, but we also exult in our tribulations, knowing that tribulation brings about perseverance; and perseverance, proven character; and proven character, hope (Rom 5:3-4)

God seems to think 'these things are not subject to uncertainties', too.
we, as His own, are tried and tested, and He always knows the end result.
we may fail a time or two in unbelief, or we may, as Abraham, 'stagger not' at other times.

"My times are in Your hands", indeed.

 

[WebersHome]

-
†. Gen 22:12b . . For now I know that you fear God, since you have not
withheld your son, your favored one, from Me.

Someone usually wants to know how a supposedly omniscient God didn't
know till then that Abraham would go through with it. Well; in the Bible; the
word "know" isn't limited to academic information. It often refers to
experiential knowledge; like when a man knows his wife; viz: sleeps with her.

By omniscience, God has seen the future already even before it takes place.
It's all laid out before him like an open road map. He can see every avenue
and every city all in one glance. However; like a traveler; God isn't in every
place all at once. David, in Psalm 139, said God's spirit is omnipresent, but I
have yet to see a scripture that proves God has the ability to travel in time.

He no doubt already knew ahead of time every single thing that would take
place the day Abraham and Isaac were on that mountain. None of that took
God by surprise. He saw it all ahead of time-- but God had yet to be there
and take part when it actually happened. Afterwards; God not only knew in
His head that Abraham feared him; but God knew it in His heart too via
personal experience. It's like the difference between knowing all there is to
know about Chile's Atacama desert by reading about it in National
Geographic; and actually hiking in it yourself: feeling the temperature and
the sunshine, sensing the isolation, awed by the expanse, breathing the air,
sitting on the ground, and tasting the dust.

========================================

 

[AuphirahQueen]

-


The covenant that Yhvh's people agreed upon with God wasn't in force till
much later, and as Bible law isn't retroactive, then the covenant had no
jurisdiction over Abraham. (Rom 4:15, Rom 5:13, and Gal 3:17)

A technical point that is often overlooked in the "human sacrifice" issue is
that in every instance banning the practice, it is underage children that are
condemned as offerings-- innocent children; viz: babes; and in particular,
one's own. (e.g. Lev 18:21, Lev 20:2-5, Deut 12:31, Deut 18:10, cf. 2Kgs
16:3, 2Kgs 17:31, 2Kgs 23:10, 2Kgs 21:6, Ps 106:34, Ezk 20:31, Ezk
23:37, Jer 7:31, Jer 19:4, Jer 32:35). But I have yet to encounter an
instance where God expressed abhorrence at sacrificing a consenting adult.

The reason that it's wrong for covenanted Jews to sacrifice a consenting
adult is because human sacrifices aren't specified.

†. Deut 4:2 . .You shall not add anything to what I command you or take
anything away from it, but keep the commandments of the Lord your God
that I enjoin upon you.

†. Deut 5:29-30 . . Be careful, then, to do as the Lord your God has
commanded you. Do not turn aside to the right or to the left: follow only the
path that the Lord your God has enjoined upon you

===========================================

My complete response in fullness:

I am confuse because it was a sin for children of Israel to sacrifice their children as the heathens who sacrifice their children to Molech deity in Leviticus 18:21

That is why the atheist debate on the ETHIC ISSUE because atheist knows the scriptures better than most Christians. The atheist study the Sacred Word daily because that is atheist strategy because the atheist knows by experience most Christians do not study the history of Jewish faith to get understanding of Christian faith or most Christians do not read the Sacred Word in context.
King James Bible
And thou shalt not let any of thy seed pass through the fire to Molech, neither shalt thou profane the name of thy God: I am the LORD.

Holman Christian Standard Bible
You are not to make any of your children pass through the fire to Molech. Do not profane the name of your God; I am Yahweh.

Find the following verses interesting: It was a testing of Obedience

Genesis 22 Holman Christian Standard Bible (HCSB)

The Sacrifice of Isaac

22 After these things God tested Abraham and said to him, “Abraham!”
“Here I am,” he answered.

8 Abraham answered, “God Himself will provide[b] the lamb for the burnt offering, my son.” Then the two of them walked on together.

Hallelujah Hallelujah!!!


12 Then He said, “Do not lay a hand on the boy or do anything to him. For now I know that you fear God, since you have not withheld your only son from Me.” 13 Abraham looked up and saw a ram[d]caught in the thicket by its horns. So Abraham went and took the ram and offered it as a burnt offering in place of his son. 14 And Abraham named that place The Lord Will Provide,[e] so today it is said: “It will be provided[f] on the Lord’s mountain.”
15 Then the Angel of the Lord called to Abraham a second time from heaven16 and said, “By Myself I have sworn,” this is the Lord’s declaration: “Because you have done this thing and have not withheld your only son,[g]17 I will indeed bless you and make your offspring as numerous as the stars of the sky and the sand on the seashore. Your offspring will possess the gates of their enemies. 18 And all the nations of the earth will be blessed[h] by your off spring because you have obeyed My command.”

Hallelujah Hallelujah!! I believe Abraham trusted ABBA to provide the lamb because of his obedience to ABBA command.


In the Hebrew tradition this is called, Akedah (the binding) and nissah/test means to prove the quality of not " to entice to do wrong. God used the event to affirm the sterling character of Abraham's faith.

3. Of the highest quality: a person of sterling character.

How many Christians today would be obedient as Abraham to sacrifice your most prize possession that you love so much?
AKEDAH (ʿAqedah; Heb. הָדֵקֲע, lit. "binding (of Isaac)"), the Pentateuchal narrative (Gen. 22:1–19) describing God's command to *Abraham to offer *Isaac, the son of his old age, as a sacrifice. Obedient to the command, Abraham takes Isaac to the place of sacrifice and binds him (va-ya'akod, Gen. 22:9, a word found nowhere else in the Bible in the active, conjugative form) on the altar. The angel of the Lord then bids Abraham to stay his hand and a ram is offered in Isaac's stead. The Akedah became in Jewish thought the supreme example of self-sacrifice in obedience to God's will and the symbol of Jewish martyrdom throughout the ages.
Critical View

The Akedah narrative is generally attributed to source E (which uses ʾElohim as the Divine Name) with glosses by the Redactor (R, hence also the use of the Tetragrammaton); or to source J (in which the Divine Name is the Tetragrammaton) which may have made use of E material (Peake's Commentary on the Bible(1962), 193). The original intent of the narrative has been understood by the critics either as an etiological legend explaining why the custom of child sacrifice was modified in a certain sanctuary by the substitution of a ram (Gunkel), or as a protest against human sacrifice (Skinner, Genesis (1910), 331–2). The name Moriah ("land of Moriah," Gen. 22:2) occurs elsewhere (II Chron. 3:1) as the name of the Temple site; hence the Jewish tradition that the Temple was built on the spot at which the Akedah took place. There is no further reference to the Akedah in the Bible.

The Akedah influenced both Christian and Islamic thought. In early Christian doctrine, the sacrifice of Isaac is used as a type for the sacrifice of Jesus (see Tertullian, Adversus Marcionem, 3:18; Clement of Alexandria, Paedogogica, 1:5, 1; Schoeps, in: JBL, 65 (1946), 385–92). In Islam, the Akedah is held up for admiration (Koran 37:97–111), but the more accepted opinion is that it was Ishmael, Abraham's other son and the progenitor of the Arabs, who was bound on the altar and that the whole episode took place before Isaac's birth. The Akedah has been a favorite theme in religious art for centuries.

Akedah

 

[AuphirahQueen]

AQueen chuckles at above questions ! I do find questions interesting, challenging and I do enjoy pondering. I will be answering the following questions with Biblical answers. Did you think of these trick or entrapment questions ? HMMMMMM!!![/QUOTEf Abrahams obligations were to both God and his son. Since the son was the will of god, that through him the messiah would come, there was no conflict. Satan often tries to make one were there isn't.

Pharisees also called JESUS CHRIST satan/The Lord of Flies! If you are calling me satan thank you!!


New American Standard Bible
But when the Pharisees heard this, they said, "This man casts out demons only by Beelzebul the ruler of the demons."

King James Bible
But when the Pharisees heard it, they said, This fellow doth not cast out devils, but by Beelzebub the prince of the devils.

Holman Christian Standard Bible
When the Pharisees heard this, they said, "The man drives out demons only by Beelzebul, the ruler of the demons."