Amillennial theology is in error - (no literal thousand year reign)

[starfield]

Again, the Animal Sacrifices in the Millennial Kingdom do not do not at all violate the New Testament teachings such as Hebrews 10, concerning the end of the Mosaic Law with the death of Messiah. They do not add nor take away from the Sacrifice which Jesus Christ gave on the Cross of Calvary.



Again read these Scriptures: (Ezek. 43:18-27, 44:11-15, 44:27-31, 45:15-25; 46:4-15; 46:20-24, Isa. 56:6-8).


They all teach that there will be animal sacrifices reinstituted in the Millennial Kingdom.

So you honestly believe there will be burnt and sin offerings in a so-called future millennial kingdom and this won't denigrate the finished work of Christ? You believe in restoration of the old sacrificial system even though the bible clearly states the blood of bulls and goats could not take away sin, the first was taken away and the second established, Christ offered one sacrifice for sins forever? It boggles my mind how people who call themselves Christians can believe such nonsense. I suggest that you, BradC, and others in this camp read Hebrews 8, 9, and 10 and ask the Holy Spirit for understanding.

P.S., I am done with this discussion. You're just repeating the same thing over and over again.

 

[starfield]

Starfiled, what you need to do is start studying your Bible more and Believe it. You need to be Dispensational and rightly divide the word of truth (2 Timothy 2:15).


But if you continue to refuse to rightly divide the word of truth, well then you will continue to be messed up Doctrinally just as you already are.

Rightly divide the word of truth, as in dispensationalism (slicing and dicing scripture into segments), eh? God has two separate plans and two people (Israel and the church), a secret rapture where you will be whisked to heaven before Jacob’s trouble, which is concept foreign to scripture?

Oh please! I left that camp already and I am NOT going back for it’s a theology from the pit of hell.

*exits thread*

 

[zone]

lol!



A case has to be built, a little here; a little there...but I'll switch up and give the full bible study version and summarize through, and if any gaps appear you can point them out and I'll try to fill them in.

Principle: "To God, 1000 of man's years = 1 day"​

I propose that the Plan of God is summed up in Creation week (Genesis Ch 1). Creation week indeed DID occur as recorded in scripture, but it was also a prophecy of the overall plan of God.

[TABLE="class: grid, width: 550, align: center"]
[TR]
[TD="align: center"]Day 1[/TD]
[TD="align: center"]Day 2[/TD]
[TD="align: center"]Day 3[/TD]
[TD="align: center"]Day 4[/TD]
[TD="align: center"]Day 5[/TD]
[TD="align: center"]Day 6[/TD]
[TD="align: center"]Day 7[/TD]
[/TR]
[TR]
[TD](Gen 1:3-5)
…God saw that the light WAS good, and he separated light from darkness …the first Day.[/TD]
[TD](Gen 1:6-8)
God made the firmament, divided waters from waters …Heaven [Sky]
…the second day[/TD]
[TD] (Gen 1:11-13)
Seed-bearing plants and trees … bear fruit with …various kinds.
…the third day[/TD]
[TD](Gen 1:14-19)
… And God made two great lights; greater light [sun] to rule day, [moon & stars also]
…the fourth day[/TD]
[TD](Gen 1:20-23)
… Let the water teem with living creatures… fill the waters in the seas & fowls of air
…the fifth day[/TD]
[TD](Gen 1:24-31)
…cattle, and creeping thing, and beast of the earth…[also] Let’s make man in our image
…the sixth day[/TD]
[TD](Gen 2:1-2) …heavens, earth and all hosts were finished.
God finished his work and then he rested on the seventh day.[/TD]
[/TR]
[/TABLE]


Day 1: Light is separated from darkness.

Day 2: Water is divided from water.

Day 3: Seeds and Trees of various fruit are created & multiply.

Day 4 : The Sun, Moon & Stars are created to Rule from heavens.

Day 5: Creatures born of Sea, and then Fouls of the Air are made.

Day 6: Beasts of the Earth, and then Mankind in God's Image, are made.

Day 7: God finishes his creative work, blesses this day as HOLY, and rests.

So of course, the 7th day of the week is the Sabbath...​

Through the prophet Ezekiel God said, “Also I gave them my Sabbaths as a sign between us, so they would know that I Yah made them holy.” (Ezekiel 20:12)

And God said, “Keep my Sabbaths holy, that they may be a sign between us. Then you will know that I am Yah your God.”(Ezekiel 20:20)

And through Isaiah he said, “If you keep your feet from breaking the Sabbath and from doing as you please on my holy day, if you call the Sabbath a delight and the LORD'S holy day [i.e. “The holy Day of the LORD”] honorable, and if you honor it by not going your own way and not doing as you please or speaking idle words,…”(Isaiah 58:13)

So this scripture proves that the Sabbath day IS "The Day of The Lord".​

no it doesnt



carrying on.........

 

[zone]

START: Now what I was leading up to in my previous post was the following outline that proves the 7th 1000 years of mankind IS "The Day of The Lord", and is consequently the Millennium/Thousand year reign.



In Day 1: Light is separated from darkness.
In Years 1-1000 of Man: Sinful Man is separated from God

Proof: Adam sins and dies in year 930, within the 1st 1000 years of man. He is also separated from god's garden.

So the 1st day was fulfilled in the 1st millennium of man.​

In Day 2: Water is separated from water.
In Years 1001-2000 of Man: After the flood, water once again separates from water to give Noah dry ground

Proof: Noah is born in year 1049 from Adam (Gen 5)...when he was 600 it was year 1648 and this was the time of the flood (Gen 6). It rained for 40 days/nights, and after 150 days water divided from water again to reveal dry ground; within the 2nd 1000 years of man.

So the 2nd day was fulfilled in the 2nd millennium of man.​

In Day 3: Seeds and Trees of various fruit are created & multiply.
In Years 2001-3000 of Man: Abraham is made a father of many nations; given promised seed

Proof: Genesis 17:5-6 “…your name will be Abraham, for I have made you a father of many nations. I will make you very fruitful.”

Abram is born year 1992 from Adam (Gen 9-11), but is reborn "Abraham" year 2090 from Adam (approx 98 yrs later) and is given Isaac (promised SEED). He also had sons Ishmael, Medan and Midian which became nations. Isaac had twins (Jacob & Esau) who both had 12 sons. A total of 900 years then passes in scripture from Jacob's labors to Joseph slavery to Israel in Egypt to wilderness wandering, through to the time of the Judges (year 2990). All of this happened within the 3rd 1000 years of man.

In scripture, men are called "trees" and sons are called "branches".

So the 3rd day was fulfilled in the 3rd millennium of man.​

In Day 4 : The Sun, Moon & Stars are created to rule from the heavens.
In Years 3001-4000 of Man: Prophets & Kings of Israel reign during time of rebellion (darkness), then Christ (the light) is born.

Proof: "First the evening [darkness with moons & stars], then the morning (with the sun) is the ___ day" (Genesis)...and this is the order of these "rulers" are introduced.

Moon = The prophets, reflecting the light of God's word (Psalm 119:104-105)
Stars = Angels/Princes & Kings (Psalm 148:2-3; Daniel 10:13)

Both of these elements are introduced after the time of the Judges, when King Saul first appears. Construction of Solomon's temple begins 480 years after the exodus (which was 10 years after he was crowned). In this time Saul, Ish-Bosheth (son of Saul) and David reigned for a combined 91 years before Solomon. Then the kingdom is split, which resulted in the many kings and prophets until Israel & Judah's exile...so we are roughly between the years 3013-3593 from Adam.

- In year 3544 from Adam (or 457 BC) Persian King Artaxerxes "commands" to rebuild Jerusalem for 49 years (7 sevens; Daniel 9:25).

- In year 3593 from Adam (or 408 BC) Ezra & Nehemiah begin rebuilding the streets of Judah for 434 years (62 sevens; Daniel 9:25; Nehemiah 2:8-17; 4:17).

- In year 4028 from Adam (or 27-28 AD/CE) the Messiah is *cut off* (AFTER 62 sevens; Daniel 9:26). He was 30 years old...this makes his birth in year 3998 from Adam (or 3 BC); born just before the end of the 4th 1000 years of man. I can go into more scriptural detail with this proof if required.

Sun = Christ.

John 9:5, “While I am in the world, I am the light of the world” [also read John 3:19; 8:12; 12:35]. So Christ is The Great Light! We also know that he had all authority.

Malachi 4:2, “But unto you that fear my name shall the Sun of righteousness arise with healing in his wings…” fulfilled in Matthew 9:20-22.

In the middle of the last seven (last 7 years) Christ sentences the temple to destruction for rejecting him and causes all animal sacrifices to end (wars are also determined in the land until the end; Daniel 9:27). All of this happened within the 4th 1000 years of man.

So the 4th day was fulfilled in the 4th millennium of man.​

>>>The Great Tribulation begins<<<

- Desolation of Jerusalem & Punishment of people (Daniel 9:26-27; Matthew 24:15-16)

- Saints are persecuted (Daniel 7:25; Matthew 24)

- Christ in heaven receives the title deed of earth and begins loosing the seals. (Daniel 7:13-14; Revelation 5:1-11:19)

- Satan is cast to earth and establishes his "The Kingdom of Darkness" (since the light left; Revelation 12-13)

- The body of Christ suffers for the next 2000 years (Zechariah 13:8) or 40 Jubilees, like the trial of Israel in the desert was 40 years (Numbers 32:13), and the trial of Christ was 40 days (Matthew 4).

>>>The following 2 days are within this time frame<<<

alright

this is interesting.
i`ll read it several times though.....

 

[The_highwayman]

No it does not suggest that starfield. Not at all.


Again, the Animal Sacrifices in the Millennial Kingdom do not do not at all violate the New Testament teachings such as Hebrews 10, concerning the end of the Mosaic Law with the death of Messiah. They do not add nor take away from the Sacrifice which Jesus Christ gave on the Cross of Calvary.



Again read these Scriptures: (Ezek. 43:18-27, 44:11-15, 44:27-31, 45:15-25; 46:4-15; 46:20-24, Isa. 56:6-8).


They all teach that there will be animal sacrifices reinstituted in the Millennial Kingdom.


And after reading them, if you still reject the fact that there will be animal sacrifices in the Millennial Kingdom, well then you obviously don't believe the Bible.


Again, there will be animal sacrifices in the Millennial Kingdom. The Bible says there will be. Therefore there will be.

You are so far off base, a recon patrol could not find you.

 

[zone]

>>>The Great Tribulation begins<<<

- Desolation of Jerusalem & Punishment of people (Daniel 9:26-27; Matthew 24:15-16)

- Saints are persecuted (Daniel 7:25; Matthew 24)

- Christ in heaven receives the title deed of earth and begins loosing the seals. (Daniel 7:13-14; Revelation 5:1-11:19)

- Satan is cast to earth and establishes his "The Kingdom of Darkness" (since the light left; Revelation 12-13)

- The body of Christ suffers for the next 2000 years (Zechariah 13:8) or 40 Jubilees, like the trial of Israel in the desert was 40 years (Numbers 32:13), and the trial of Christ was 40 days (Matthew 4).

>>>The following 2 days are within this time frame<<<

hang on........i was okay with all that came before.

but are you now saying

Day 5 & 6 FOLLOWING - are actually somehow shoehorned into the 2000 year time frame - above

in which case 5 & 6 are not literal 1,000 year periods they are something else.

you will have to clarify (please).

In Day 5: Creatures of Sea, and then Fouls of the Air are made.
In Years 4001-5000 of Man: Revelation 13's Beast of the Sea is born approx. 1-1000 AD (...we no longer follow God's time at this point)

Proof 1: It has been approx 2000 years since Christ walked the earth. This is not disputed. So if God has been fulfilling his plan of Creation Week - in each millennium - we must conclude he has continued the same pattern.

Proof 2: The Papacy (The Seat of The Bishop of Rome) is Born 67 AD (or approx. year 4067 from Adam).

- In 312 AD (or approx 4312 from Adam), Rome adopts Christianity as official religion. The Church then changes the 10 commandments, adopts pagan customs, outlaws Sabbath-keeping on pain of death, develops new doctrines, purges everything Hebrew out of the faith = "Mystery Babylon, the Mother of Harlots" (God's unfaithful), who starts riding this beast.

- In 533 AD, Emperor Justinian's Decree made The Papacy Supreme Head of all churches

- In 538 AD (or 4538 from Adam), The Papacy is given Supreme Authority in matters of faith (6th head of the beast; Rev 13:3-7; Little horn of Daniel 7:8). The "Holy" Roman Empire (a "name of blasphemy") persecutes the saints (as heretics) for 42 prophetic months...exactly 1,260 years from 538 AD to 1798 AD (Rev 13:5) before being removed by Napoleon. The 6th head cut off...but healed later Lateran Concordat of 1929 - Papal Wound Healed!

- From The Catholic Church "Mother" was born daughter harlots like Islam and other religions, including "movements" from The Renaissance, like Secularism/Humanism (due to corruption of the true gospel & severe persecution lay people began denying there was even being a God and reasoned that it was all a lie fabricated to control the masses).

I can go into more scriptural detail with this proof if required. The beasts of the sea were commanded in Genesis to multiply, and so this beast has since it was born. All of this happened within the 5th 1000 years of man.

So the 5th day was fulfilled in the 5th millennium of man.​

In Day 6: Beasts of the Earth are made.
In Years 4001-5000 of Man: Revelation 13's Beast of the Earth is born approx. 1001-2000 AD (give or take a few dozen years because we don't follow God's calendar anymore).

um.....lol
youre losing me here.

are we making the Rev 13 beast something other than what it was - IMPERIAL ROME...just because we HAVE TO HAVE a 1,000 year = i day principle

tell me again about how you made the leap from Gods time to some other time; who did it; and where is that prophecy in scripture.

i already know - but need to see your explanation.

okay - have to come back later....couple hours - Lord willing.

 

[ChosenbyHim]

So you honestly believe there will be burnt and sin offerings in a so-called future millennial kingdom and this won't denigrate the finished work of Christ? You believe in restoration of the old sacrificial system even though the bible clearly states the blood of bulls and goats could not take away sin, the first was taken away and the second established, Christ offered one sacrifice for sins forever? It boggles my mind how people who call themselves Christians can believe such nonsense. I suggest that you, BradC, and others in this camp read Hebrews 8, 9, and 10 and ask the Holy Spirit for understanding.

Yes I do believe that there will be burnt offerings, sin offerings in the Millennial Kingdom. Why? Because there will be. The Scriptures clearly teach that there will be.


(Ezek. 43:18-27, 44:11-15, 44:27-31, 45:15-25; 46:4-15; 46:20-24, Isa. 56:6-8).


Go and read those Scriptures.


And no they do not add to or take away from the finished work of Jesus Christ.


And by the way I already mentioned this Starfield. The Law of Moses will not be reinstituted. What is instituted during the Millennial Kingdom is Kingdom Law. Are there some similarities between the two? Sure there are. But there are also plenty of differences between them as well.


I have read Hebrews 8,9, and 10. And again I already told you that the reinstitution of Animal Sacrifices in the Millennial Kingdom does not at all violate Hebrews 8, 9, and 10. Because the Mosaic Law was done away with. And also a new System will be brought into the Kingdom Age where Jesus Christ our Lord and Saviour is ruling and reigning with a Rod of Iron from Jerusalem.


What boggles my mind Starfied is how you could not believe in the Pre-trib. Rapture when it is such an essential Bible Doctrine.

P.S., I am done with this discussion. You're just repeating the same thing over and over again.

I am repeating these Bible truths over and over again, because you continue to reject what the Bible says.


If your still having a hard time understanding this, then why don't you listen to some good sermons on Premillennialism? They will help you a lot. That is if you take the time to understand what's being taught. If you are going to be a Bible believer, well you are going to need to be premillennial. It's that simple.


Premillennialism in the Old Testament, Dr. Arnold Fruchtenbaum

 

[KJV1611]

Yahshua where is the full version of the post that zone is quoting... interesting stuff, I would like to read the whole thing.

 

[zone]

it is right here.

lol!



A case has to be built, a little here; a little there...but I'll switch up and give the full bible study version and summarize through, and if any gaps appear you can point them out and I'll try to fill them in.

Principle: "To God, 1000 of man's years = 1 day"​

I propose that the Plan of God is summed up in Creation week (Genesis Ch 1). Creation week indeed DID occur as recorded in scripture, but it was also a prophecy of the overall plan of God.

[TABLE="class: grid, width: 550, align: center"]
[TR]
[TD="align: center"]Day 1[/TD]
[TD="align: center"]Day 2[/TD]
[TD="align: center"]Day 3[/TD]
[TD="align: center"]Day 4[/TD]
[TD="align: center"]Day 5[/TD]
[TD="align: center"]Day 6[/TD]
[TD="align: center"]Day 7[/TD]
[/TR]
[TR]
[TD](Gen 1:3-5)
…God saw that the light WAS good, and he separated light from darkness …the first Day.[/TD]
[TD](Gen 1:6-8)
God made the firmament, divided waters from waters …Heaven [Sky]
…the second day[/TD]
[TD] (Gen 1:11-13)
Seed-bearing plants and trees … bear fruit with …various kinds.
…the third day[/TD]
[TD](Gen 1:14-19)
… And God made two great lights; greater light [sun] to rule day, [moon & stars also]
…the fourth day[/TD]
[TD](Gen 1:20-23)
… Let the water teem with living creatures… fill the waters in the seas & fowls of air
…the fifth day[/TD]
[TD](Gen 1:24-31)
…cattle, and creeping thing, and beast of the earth…[also] Let’s make man in our image
…the sixth day[/TD]
[TD](Gen 2:1-2) …heavens, earth and all hosts were finished.
God finished his work and then he rested on the seventh day.[/TD]
[/TR]
[/TABLE]


Day 1: Light is separated from darkness.

Day 2: Water is divided from water.

Day 3: Seeds and Trees of various fruit are created & multiply.

Day 4 : The Sun, Moon & Stars are created to Rule from heavens.

Day 5: Creatures born of Sea, and then Fouls of the Air are made.

Day 6: Beasts of the Earth, and then Mankind in God's Image, are made.

Day 7: God finishes his creative work, blesses this day as HOLY, and rests.

So of course, the 7th day of the week is the Sabbath...​

Through the prophet Ezekiel God said, “Also I gave them my Sabbaths as a sign between us, so they would know that I Yah made them holy.” (Ezekiel 20:12)

And God said, “Keep my Sabbaths holy, that they may be a sign between us. Then you will know that I am Yah your God.”(Ezekiel 20:20)

And through Isaiah he said, “If you keep your feet from breaking the Sabbath and from doing as you please on my holy day, if you call the Sabbath a delight and the LORD'S holy day [i.e. “The holy Day of the LORD”] honorable, and if you honor it by not going your own way and not doing as you please or speaking idle words,…”(Isaiah 58:13)

So this scripture proves that the Sabbath day IS "The Day of The Lord".​

START: Now what I was leading up to in my previous post was the following outline that proves the 7th 1000 years of mankind IS "The Day of The Lord", and is consequently the Millennium/Thousand year reign.



In Day 1: Light is separated from darkness.
In Years 1-1000 of Man: Sinful Man is separated from God

Proof: Adam sins and dies in year 930, within the 1st 1000 years of man. He is also separated from god's garden.

So the 1st day was fulfilled in the 1st millennium of man.​

In Day 2: Water is separated from water.
In Years 1001-2000 of Man: After the flood, water once again separates from water to give Noah dry ground

Proof: Noah is born in year 1049 from Adam (Gen 5)...when he was 600 it was year 1648 and this was the time of the flood (Gen 6). It rained for 40 days/nights, and after 150 days water divided from water again to reveal dry ground; within the 2nd 1000 years of man.

So the 2nd day was fulfilled in the 2nd millennium of man.​

In Day 3: Seeds and Trees of various fruit are created & multiply.
In Years 2001-3000 of Man: Abraham is made a father of many nations; given promised seed

Proof: Genesis 17:5-6 “…your name will be Abraham, for I have made you a father of many nations. I will make you very fruitful.”

Abram is born year 1992 from Adam (Gen 9-11), but is reborn "Abraham" year 2090 from Adam (approx 98 yrs later) and is given Isaac (promised SEED). He also had sons Ishmael, Medan and Midian which became nations. Isaac had twins (Jacob & Esau) who both had 12 sons. A total of 900 years then passes in scripture from Jacob's labors to Joseph slavery to Israel in Egypt to wilderness wandering, through to the time of the Judges (year 2990). All of this happened within the 3rd 1000 years of man.

In scripture, men are called "trees" and sons are called "branches".

So the 3rd day was fulfilled in the 3rd millennium of man.​

In Day 4 : The Sun, Moon & Stars are created to rule from the heavens.
In Years 3001-4000 of Man: Prophets & Kings of Israel reign during time of rebellion (darkness), then Christ (the light) is born.

Proof: "First the evening [darkness with moons & stars], then the morning (with the sun) is the ___ day" (Genesis)...and this is the order of these "rulers" are introduced.

Moon = The prophets, reflecting the light of God's word (Psalm 119:104-105)
Stars = Angels/Princes & Kings (Psalm 148:2-3; Daniel 10:13)

Both of these elements are introduced after the time of the Judges, when King Saul first appears. Construction of Solomon's temple begins 480 years after the exodus (which was 10 years after he was crowned). In this time Saul, Ish-Bosheth (son of Saul) and David reigned for a combined 91 years before Solomon. Then the kingdom is split, which resulted in the many kings and prophets until Israel & Judah's exile...so we are roughly between the years 3013-3593 from Adam.

- In year 3544 from Adam (or 457 BC) Persian King Artaxerxes "commands" to rebuild Jerusalem for 49 years (7 sevens; Daniel 9:25).

- In year 3593 from Adam (or 408 BC) Ezra & Nehemiah begin rebuilding the streets of Judah for 434 years (62 sevens; Daniel 9:25; Nehemiah 2:8-17; 4:17).

- In year 4028 from Adam (or 27-28 AD/CE) the Messiah is *cut off* (AFTER 62 sevens; Daniel 9:26). He was 30 years old...this makes his birth in year 3998 from Adam (or 3 BC); born just before the end of the 4th 1000 years of man. I can go into more scriptural detail with this proof if required.

Sun = Christ.

John 9:5, “While I am in the world, I am the light of the world” [also read John 3:19; 8:12; 12:35]. So Christ is The Great Light! We also know that he had all authority.

Malachi 4:2, “But unto you that fear my name shall the Sun of righteousness arise with healing in his wings…” fulfilled in Matthew 9:20-22.

In the middle of the last seven (last 7 years) Christ sentences the temple to destruction for rejecting him and causes all animal sacrifices to end (wars are also determined in the land until the end; Daniel 9:27). All of this happened within the 4th 1000 years of man.

So the 4th day was fulfilled in the 4th millennium of man.​

>>>The Great Tribulation begins<<<

- Desolation of Jerusalem & Punishment of people (Daniel 9:26-27; Matthew 24:15-16)

- Saints are persecuted (Daniel 7:25; Matthew 24)

- Christ in heaven receives the title deed of earth and begins loosing the seals. (Daniel 7:13-14; Revelation 5:1-11:19)

- Satan is cast to earth and establishes his "The Kingdom of Darkness" (since the light left; Revelation 12-13)

- The body of Christ suffers for the next 2000 years (Zechariah 13:8) or 40 Jubilees, like the trial of Israel in the desert was 40 years (Numbers 32:13), and the trial of Christ was 40 days (Matthew 4).

>>>The following 2 days are within this time frame<<<




In Day 5: Creatures of Sea, and then Fouls of the Air are made.
In Years 4001-5000 of Man: Revelation 13's Beast of the Sea is born approx. 1-1000 AD (...we no longer follow God's time at this point)

Proof 1: It has been approx 2000 years since Christ walked the earth. This is not disputed. So if God has been fulfilling his plan of Creation Week - in each millennium - we must conclude he has continued the same pattern.

Proof 2: The Papacy (The Seat of The Bishop of Rome) is Born 67 AD (or approx. year 4067 from Adam).

- In 312 AD (or approx 4312 from Adam), Rome adopts Christianity as official religion. The Church then changes the 10 commandments, adopts pagan customs, outlaws Sabbath-keeping on pain of death, develops new doctrines, purges everything Hebrew out of the faith = "Mystery Babylon, the Mother of Harlots" (God's unfaithful), who starts riding this beast.

- In 533 AD, Emperor Justinian's Decree made The Papacy Supreme Head of all churches

- In 538 AD (or 4538 from Adam), The Papacy is given Supreme Authority in matters of faith (6th head of the beast; Rev 13:3-7; Little horn of Daniel 7:8). The "Holy" Roman Empire (a "name of blasphemy") persecutes the saints (as heretics) for 42 prophetic months...exactly 1,260 years from 538 AD to 1798 AD (Rev 13:5) before being removed by Napoleon. The 6th head cut off...but healed later Lateran Concordat of 1929 - Papal Wound Healed!

- From The Catholic Church "Mother" was born daughter harlots like Islam and other religions, including "movements" from The Renaissance, like Secularism/Humanism (due to corruption of the true gospel & severe persecution lay people began denying there was even being a God and reasoned that it was all a lie fabricated to control the masses).

I can go into more scriptural detail with this proof if required. The beasts of the sea were commanded in Genesis to multiply, and so this beast has since it was born. All of this happened within the 5th 1000 years of man.

So the 5th day was fulfilled in the 5th millennium of man.​

In Day 6: Beasts of the Earth are made.
In Years 4001-5000 of Man: Revelation 13's Beast of the Earth is born approx. 1001-2000 AD (give or take a few dozen years because we don't follow God's calendar anymore).

Proof 1: It has been approx 2000 years since Christ walked the earth. This is not disputed. So if God has been fulfilling his plan of Creation Week - in each millennium - we must conclude he has continued the same pattern.

Proof 2: Matching Revelation 13:11-18...

• Has 2 Horns (Rev 13:11) = 2 Extremities of its power
• Looks like a lamb = It appears righteous and pure
• Speaks like a dragon = Speaks completely contrary to The Scriptures
• Exercises all power of the Beast of the Sea = Assumes the old empire's former leadership authority
• Causes all people on earth to worship the Beast = Causes everyone to love the old empire; melting pot
• Makes fire come down from heaven = Created fire (power) that can rain down from the sky; atomic bomb.
• Deceives those on earth to make an image of the beast = Convinces many to copy/imitate their image, and by extension the old empire's
• Power to give life to the image of the beast = Developed the ability to animate/move the image/picture to spread ideals of the old empire: Democracy (of the people), Not Theocracy (of God)
• That the image should both speak = Later developed the sound for its "Motion Pictures" to spread its message (indoctrinate?)
• Cause many who don't worship the image should be killed = Propagandizes to make enemies of those who don't conform to the idea (of Democracy?) [Iraq; Libya; Syria; Iran?]
• Causes all to receive a mark in hand or forehead in order to buy & sell = Forces world to be bound to (and work for) a global financial system whether they believe in it or not
• Here is wisdom; the number of a man; 666 = The global financial/banking system was created by one family who's name was changed to represent a "Red Hexagram" (6 sides; 6 points; 6 triangles); "Red Shield" (German. Rothschild).

The United States of America is the only beast (i.e. kingdom) that has perfectly matched all of these characteristics...even being "born" in 1776 AD (or approx 4776 from Adam) within this 6th millennium.

The beasts of the earth were commanded in Genesis to multiply, and this beast has indeed multiplied nation by nation in it's short 238 year lifespan. And all of this has happened within THIS 6th 1000 years of man...but that's not all that was made on the 6th day.




In Day 6: Man in God's Image is made.
In Years 4001-5000 of Man: True Israel is born. The "Elijah" work that corrects the path; The Great Multitude & 144,000 first fruits (approx 1001 AD -2000 AD give or take a few dozen years because we don't follow God's calendar anymore).

This is the time frame we're currently in. Most of us were born after the most severe trials of the Great Tribulation (Dark Ages, The Inquisition, Crusades, 2 World Wars, etc..), but we were also born from within Mystery Babylon (i.e. we are "Zerubabbel" = "seed of Babylon" commissioned to finish the house of God; Zech 4). So the 7th day (Sabbath day) is upon us NOW.

So the 6th day IS just about finished in this millennium.​

CONCLUSION: So I think by showing the fulfillment of each of the days of Creation Week, I've shown that indeed that 2 Peter 3:8 and Psalm 90:4 establishes "1000 years = 1 day" as a principle to follow, and that "The Day of The Lord" is The Sabbath and the next 1000 years of man to follow. Accordingly, we can take note of the following verses to understand what happens during that millennium.



In Day 7: God finishes his creative work, blesses this day as HOLY, and rests.
In Years 5001-6000 of Man: The Day of The Lord; The 1000 year reign of the saints, starting with the 1st Resurrection.

Zechariah 13:9


This passage ties to Malachi 3:2 in relation to the last 2000 years of the body of Christ. Truly Christians have died for 2000 years but this third part (Christians of the next 1000 years) will be purified and will live.

Hosea 6:1-2


John 6:45


Notice that Hosea and John both use the same language...both are speaking about the last day of the week; the Sabbath; The Day of the Lord. And if God has been fulfilling creation week during each millennium of man, this means the 7th millennium is uniquely marked by the resurrection of the righteous of God.

Zechariah 3:9


This stone is a repeat prophecy of the uncut stone from Daniel 2:45 that smashes the Nebuchadnezzar statue at its feet. The reign of Christ with his saints will correct the practices of the nations that "remain" (Daniel 7:12) and teach them the truth about God. This will take 1000 years. Death still exists at this point.

Zechariah 14:16


This passage proves two things: 1) there will be other nations that still exist during the reign of the Lord (Daniel 7:12), and 2) when the Lord reigns **all MUST celebrate the Feast of Tabernacles** or there will NOT be any rain for that nation...this hasn't happened yet (because the world at large doesn't even know about this feast, let alone celebrate it), so the Lord is not currently reigning *on earth* (though he now reigns in heaven).

So the 7th day will be fulfilled in the 7th millennium of man.
(Which is now at the door)​

Yahshua where is the full version of the post that zone is quoting... interesting stuff, I would like to read the whole thing.

 

[ChosenbyHim]

Rightly divide the word of truth, as in dispensationalism (slicing and dicing scripture into segments), eh? God has two separate plans and two people (Israel and the church), a secret rapture where you will be whisked to heaven before Jacob’s trouble, which is concept foreign to scripture?

Rightly diving the word of truth as in understanding the natural divisions which are already in the Scriptures.


You are not to be sloppy with your approach and study of the Scriptures. You don't take passages that are Doctrinally for Israel and try to somehow apply them Doctrinally for a Christian in the Church Age, it doesn't work.


And when you do try to do that you create heresy and false doctrine.


You need to exercise your senses to know this simple truth that things which are DIFFERENT are NOT THE SAME.


God is a God of Distinction.


The Gospel of the Kingdom IS NOT the Gospel of the Grace of God.


The Church IS NOT Israel and Israel IS NOT the Church.


And yes the Church will be removed from off of the Earth BEFORE the time of Jacob's trouble begins. The Scriptures do indeed teach that. The time of JACOB'S Trouble is not for the Church, it is for Israel (JACOB). THINGS THAT ARE DIFFERENT ARE NOT THE SAME.

Oh please! I left that camp already and I am NOT going back for it’s a theology from the pit of hell.



*exits thread*

No, what happened was is that you bought into the LIE of Amillennialism which some heretic fed you and ever since then you have failed to exercise common sense and discernment. And also you have refused to take what Bible says literally.

 

[KJV1611]

Thanks Zone. I'm viewing from work on my I phone... hard to find stuff on this little screen.

 

[Hoffco]

Yahshua, Your reasoning is a bit twisted.! you can not make a conclusion on a topic with out studing the passages which talk about the topic. "The Day of the Lord" is not the sabbath. My computer just gave me more posts: So ,I see what you are saying. AND, this is weard, I agree with you.LOL , But it is a waste of time, when SOULS ae going to Hell,every second, to waste my time argueing for such a trivial point.! I think you are right , I think God's plan for this age is 7,000 yrs.. AND, proberly the point your making is to prove that the days of creation are literal 24 hr. days, I agree on that point. If I was to guess, Zone doesn't agree with us on the literal days of creation, I ithink I would be correct, right, Zone? She love the world a little too much. She is hung up on worldly thinking: false science of the unbelieving, wicked world. Sorry, Zone, but,am I right? Love ya. Hoffco

 

[ChosenbyHim]

Dispensational Theology is the Biblical system.

[video=youtube;tY2J8kKRl98]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tY2J8kKRl98[/video]

Uploaded on Jan 21, 2012​

This is a response video to Bro. John's video 'One False view leads to another'
In this video I explain that dispensational theology, including the pre-trib view is the most bliblically consistent view, reconciling all the scriptures, ignoring none and interpretating them literally.​

​

 

[Hoffco]

A secret Rapture is boloney, the Rature is open for the world to see and Jesus bring "sudden destruction" upon the earth, which causes Satan to enter the false peasemaker, "man of sin" to turn ugly and become the Antichrist. Hoffco

 

[Hoffco]

There is not one verse in the Bible that supports the pre-tri rapture. you guys will be very embarrised in a few short yrs.
please, read 2thess, 2:1-13. Hofco

 

[Hoffco]

WOW, the silence is deadly. Thess passage is the Achileves heal for you pre=tri rapturist,! Is it not? you can not answer 2thess:1-13 etc, with your mind set, Sooo, why not try the Mid-tri. view, you will find, it fits the Bible better,! Hoffco Sorry for my spell.

 

[konroh]

- “I have reserved for myself seven thousand who have not bowed the knee to Baal.” 5So too, at the present time there is a remnant chosen by grace.
SO TOO AT THE PRESENT TIME (Paul's day) "there is a remnant chosen by grace."

You make a case that it is remnant theology that is driving the interpretation of Rom. 11, and I agree that there is some of this idea. But after Paul had addressed the idea of remnant, he makes the following statement:

11Again I ask: Did they stumble so as to fall beyond recovery?

Israel as a nation can recover from their stumbling.

what will their acceptance be but life from the dead? 16If the part of the dough offered as firstfruits is holy, then the whole batch is holy; if the root is holy, so are the branches.

The idea is that since some of Israel didn't believe, and that resulted in reward for the Gentiles, imagine what the belief of Israel will do, life from the dead!

23And if they do not persist in unbelief, they will be grafted in, for God is able to graft them in again.

This is a clear idea against a remnant belief, it's the idea that all the branches cut off can believe and be grafted in again.

26and in this way all Israel will be saved. As it is written:
“The deliverer will come from Zion;
he will turn godlessness away from Jacob.
27And this is my covenant with them
when I take away their sins.”g

How is all Israel saved, this goes against the idea that only a remnant is saved, it's the idea that the remnant leads to the whole of Israel being saved, of course when they believe.

but as far as election is concerned, they are loved on account of the patriarchs, 29for God’s gifts and his call are irrevocable.

This is so clear, God promised Abraham promises, and He will fulfill them, they are irrevocable. These are fulfilled to the nation of Isreal.

While Rom. 11 certainly has some ideas of remnant theology, it also carries unconditional fulfillment of God's covenant theology. God will entirely fulfill the new covenant which was promised to Israel by saving all Israel.

 

[Yahshua]

hang on........i was okay with all that came before.

but are you now saying

Day 5 & 6 FOLLOWING - are actually somehow shoehorned into the 2000 year time frame - above

in which case 5 & 6 are not literal 1,000 year periods they are something else.

you will have to clarify (please).

Sure...No, I haven't changed anything. I'm saying that the last 2000 years, the same length of time Christ has currently been gone from this earth = (a) the great tribulation time period of the saints and (b) days/millenniums 5 and 6 respectively. They are literally two 1,000 year periods where the "saints" have had to "endure" (either persecution or deception). In the first 1000-yr period, the beast of the sea was born (this fulfills the 5th day of creation with the creatures of the sea created). And in the second 1000-yr period, the beast of the earth was born (this fulfills the 6th day of creation with the beasts of the earth created).

The Great Tribulation time period started after Christ and has encompassed the last 2000 years Christ has been gone; and the beasts ARE the embodiment of that tribulation. This is why I said earlier that I'm not a preterist or a futurist in a sense. Truly a lot of Revelation has been fulfilled before any of us were even born...but we're still in Revelation (albeit somewhere at the tail end of the 6th millennium/day) as a tiny bit more remains.

um.....lol
youre losing me here.

are we making the Rev 13 beast something other than what it was - IMPERIAL ROME...just because we HAVE TO HAVE a 1,000 year = i day principle

Apologies but no I'm not forcing anything (at least I don't think I am). Imperial Rome existed before Christ was born, so Imperial Rome was not the beast of Rev 13 ***UNTIL*** it swallowed up the faith "once delivered to the saints" and becomes The "Holy" Roman Empire ("upon its heads the NAME of blasphemy"; Rev 13:1)...when the byzantine empire split from it. This happened *after* Christ when The Papacy (bishop of Rome) was eventually established and given "all authority in matters of faith" then Rome became the beast of Rev 13 (with the Papacy as the 6th head that would by mortally wounded but later healed).

If we follow the vision's narrative from the end of Rev 12 through to the beginning of Ch 13, we see that "water" came from satan's mouth to swallow up the "woman". Whatever comes out of satan's mouth is a lie. The earth drinks the water and from that emerges the beast of the sea. Likewise, after the original saints were killed they were replaced and the doctrines that were warned against by the apostles were adopted.

tell me again about how you made the leap from Gods time to some other time; who did it; and where is that prophecy in scripture.

i already know - but need to see your explanation.

okay - have to come back later....couple hours - Lord willing.

Daniel 7:25

He will (a) speak against the Most High and (b) oppress his holy people and (c) try to change the set times and the laws. (d) The holy people will be delivered into his hands for a time, times and half a time.

Revelation 13:5

And there was given unto him a mouth speaking (a) great things and blasphemies; and (d) power was given unto him to continue forty and two months.

This is The Papacy.

(a) Not only was the empire called "holy" (a designation for God alone), but the 'mouth' was dubbed "Christ incarnate" (vicar of Christ), claiming to have all ecclesiastical powers...and he was also named "Father" (i.e. papa/pope), "call no man 'father'"; perpetuating false doctrines with his "infallibility".

(b) During the height of power, he oversaw "the dark ages", "the Inquisition", "the Crusades" with saints caught in the middle. He burned, tortured, & beheaded "Heretics" to their doctrines.

(c) It was Pope Gregory who established the Gregorian calendar (in 1582 from Rome's Julian calendar) that the world currently uses. From this calendar, days are no longer determined by God's reckoning (from evening to evening), but from midnight to midnight (most darkness). Months are no longer determined by sighting God's new moon (which was always every 29 & 1/2 days). And years are no longer determined by the ripening of the barley crop which added a 13th month to the year if it wasn't yet ripe by the time the 12th month ended). God's holidays (which were appointments we were meant to rehearse, because that's when God faithfully said he'd meet with us) were replaced by the Pope's holidays. And all of these changes warp our reckoning of time, causing our "clock" to tick out of sync and faster than God's clock, making us "late" for our appointments.

God doesn't operate by man's clock, that's why scripture says "tries to change times and laws". God's gonna follow his clock whether we're privy to it or not.

(d) The Pope's reign continued from 538 AD - 1798 AD (1,260 years/prophetic days); 42 prophetic months; "time, times, and 1/2 time (i.e. 3 & 1/2)"...until Napoleon ended the Papacy. But then the mortal wound to the 6th head was healed...The "Holy" Roman Empire was just the 6th head. There was also a 7th head and the "body" becomes an 8th head (Rev 17).

----

Notwithstanding, man's time can be synchronized back to God's time using the life & ministry of Christ (i.e. clues from the gospels themselves tied to Roman records). With Christ as the centerpiece of time, we can roll backwards to the time of the Persian empire and sync secular dates to biblical dates & prophecies like Daniel's 70 weeks. But when going forward in time from Christ, we must approximate years the further and further we get AWAY from Christ's ministry because our Gregorian "clock" accelerates through years (i.e. our new years begin as soon as the last day of the 12th month ends). This is why I say "approx." when syncing the 5th millennium and added "give or take a few dozen years" when syncing the 6th millennium.

Regardless, truly we know that Christ has been gone for roughly 2000 years ("2 days") and if God has faithfully fulfilled the first 4 days of creation in the previous 4 millennia, then I must conclude God has continued that plan...with no gaps (wink) in between.

---

By the way, I was rushing and incorrectly posted the millennium for the last day in my millennium post. They should be:

Years 5001-6000 years of man = Day 6
Years 6001-7000 years of man = Day 7

 

[starfield]

I would have to ask if you know the purpose of animal sacrifices? They NEVER were a substitute for the Perfect Sacrifice...

Heb 10:4 For it is not possible that the blood of bulls and of goats should take away sins.

Heb 10:3 But in those sacrifices there is a remembrance again made of sins every year.

They were the schoolmaster, the instructor that foreshadowed the sacrifice of Christ. They were the shadow or type.

And yes, if you read Ezek 40 - 48, you will find that sacrifices will be performed in the Millenium. Those people will need a schoolmaster also.

Hebrews 10:26-39
26 For if we sin wilfully after that we have received the knowledge of the truth, there remaineth no more sacrifice for sins,
27 But a certain fearful looking for of judgment and fiery indignation, which shall devour the adversaries.
28 He that despised Moses' law died without mercy under two or three witnesses:
29 Of how much sorer punishment, suppose ye, shall he be thought worthy, who hath trodden under foot the Son of God, and hath counted the blood of the covenant, wherewith he was sanctified, an unholy thing, and hath done despite unto the Spirit of grace?
30 For we know him that hath said, Vengeance belongeth unto me, I will recompense, saith the Lord. And again, The Lord shall judge his people.
31 It is a fearful thing to fall into the hands of the living God.
32 But call to remembrance the former days, in which, after ye were illuminated, ye endured a great fight of afflictions;
33 Partly, whilst ye were made a gazingstock both by reproaches and afflictions; and partly, whilst ye became companions of them that were so used.
34 For ye had compassion of me in my bonds, and took joyfully the spoiling of your goods, knowing in yourselves that ye have in heaven a better and an enduring substance.
35 Cast not away therefore your confidence, which hath great recompence of reward.
36 For ye have need of patience, that, after ye have done the will of God, ye might receive the promise.
37 For yet a little while, and he that shall come will come, and will not tarry.
38 Now the just shall live by faith: but if any man draw back, my soul shall have no pleasure in him.
39 But we are not of them who draw back unto perdition; but of them that believe to the saving of the soul.

The writer of Hebrews discusses the danger of reverting to the OT system.
Do you see that? Does it sound familiar?
The millennialists who want a Jewish temple, priesthood, and sacrificial system reinstated. Tsk tsk.
The law was a shadow of the things that were to come. Christ is the reality.


Galatians 3:24-25
24 Wherefore the law was our schoolmaster to bring us unto Christ, that we might be justified by faith.
25 But after that faith is come, we are no longer under a schoolmaster.

Are you in Christ?
Why are you stuck under the law, Sir?

 

[konroh]

Hoffco, your Achilles heel idea has the Rapture right in the passage! The idea of a Restrainer being removed who is the one who indwells Christian saints, and in this way the Antichrist can rise to power. It's not an Achilles heel, it's another proof!

Jesus said the Holy Spirit was with you, and will be in you. This was fulfilled to the disciples at Pentecost. The Holy Spirit restrains the Antichrist, it's natural that only God could restrain the Satan-empowered man of lawlessness, so when the Restrainer is removed, Satan prevails. This does not in any way preclude people again becoming believers and having the Holy Spirit in the Tribulation, we clearly see Rev. picturing a war between Holy-Spirit empowered saints and Satan-empowered beast.

2 Thess doesn't contradict pre-trib Rapture theory. Sorry.