Exactly! If we confess our sins is in CONTRAST to if we say we have no sin (PRESENT TENSE) and if we say we have not sinned (PAST TENSE).Good luck confessing every single sin......
Exactly! If we confess our sins is in CONTRAST to if we say we have no sin (PRESENT TENSE) and if we say we have not sinned (PAST TENSE).Good luck confessing every single sin......
Not so long ago I was first introduced to what that means even though I've been a believer since 1982. It's being IN Christ having Jesus be "our Person" standing in "for us". After that, it's a daily journey about seeing just how much Jesus actually stands in for us. Many Christians are like I was and still proceeded a head in life in and about "self"
When we were not saved., Adam was our stand-in guy. We went before God in Adam and were not even in God's beloved family. So all our righteousness's were as filthy rags. We didn't even do anything but be born and live and become aware of God. We didn't do any good things or bad things we were just in Adam and outside of Christ. So when we heard the Gospel of our salvation that Jesus went on the cross on our behalf and died shedding His blood we learned He paid for all our sins making us totally worthy to go before the Father and to be recipients of His grace and truth forever after.
I was reading yet again of how majorly important the knowledge of being righteous IN Christ is. Actually I read it daily and because it is so shockingly unearthly I often forget it in my human self if I don't read it daily and allow the Holy Spirit to minister to my spirit that I am a son of God. But the Bible says to be aware of Christ's obedience at the cross. Most of us are living lives of being aware of our own obedience.
We have been taught to look at 'our' obedience and it has become a religious past time. Actually it is fought about among people who are Christians every day. I see it on these forums on CC all the time and actually whenever I come here the forums are slathered with believers who fight to look at their own righteousness and want others to look at their own righteousness. And even believe it's unholy to look to Christ's obedience and not our own as our pass port to God's hand in everything we are and do in our lives here while on earth.
In reading yesterdays devotional it reminded me yet again and I neeed to be reminded again and again because in my humaness I am distorted and negative. The Bible says in 2 Corinthians 10:5
Casting down arguments and every high thing that exalts itself against the knowledge of God, bringing every thought into captivity to the obedience of Christ.
That verse does not mean as most of us have been taught from day one in our Christian lives to cast down arguments and evil things by learning to think like Jesus. No., that comes later. What that verse does mean is when we fail., when life is fearful and when things in this world become and are overwhelming bigger than our ability to fix in all areas of our lives personally., corporately and universally., the answer is to bring our thoughts into captivity and think instead about the obedience of Christ. Romans 5:19 says;
For as through the one man's disobedience the many were made sinners, even so through the obedience of the One the many will be made righteous.
Many of us continue to be mislead into thinking it's by our obedience we have been made righteous. I see the devil do this all the time with people of faith. he wants us to look at ourselves and then he can freely condemn us because who knows better than us how loathsome we really are? Yet., because we are not IN Christ and 100% righteous and 100% IN the family now we are no longer our standard. Adam is no longer our standard bearer. Jesus is. There is no condemnation to those who are IN Christ Jesus. Romans 8:1-2 Because the law of the Spirit of life in Christ Jesus has set you free from the law of sin and of death.
This truth will free the persons who take it to live a life of faith. And in that we will bear a lot of fruit because it's the fruit of the Spirit not the fruit of the flesh. In living by the Spirit we will be walking testimonies of what Jesus has done in our lives and the good works come as an effect of our right standing IN Christ. Not our right standing in ourselves.
I hope to challenge many here in the Bible forum to consider this and see how different your Christian life will be when you are actually looking to Jesus who is the Author and Finisher of our faith.
The apostle Paul said to EXAMINE yourselves, and see if ye be in the faith, and to he that thinks he stands, take heed lest he fall........(bible 101)
Gal 5:16 This I say then, Walk in the Spirit, and ye shall not fulfil the lust of the flesh.
Gal 5:24 And they that are Christ's have crucified the flesh with the affections and lusts(will not sin,hate sin,do not want sin,by Spirit will not sin,and do righteousness).
Gal 5:25 If we live in the Spirit, let us also walk in the Spirit.
2Ti 2:19 Nevertheless the foundation of God standeth sure, having this seal, The Lord knoweth them that are his. And, Let every one that nameth the name of Christ depart from iniquity.
Heb 3:12 Take heed, brethren, lest there be in any of you an evil heart of unbelief, in departing from the living God.
Heb 3:13 But exhort one another daily, while it is called To day; lest any of you be hardened through the deceitfulness of sin.
Jas 1:12 Blessed is the man that endureth temptation(does not sin): for when he is tried, he shall receive the crown of life, which the Lord hath promised to them that love him.
Jas 1:13 Let no man say when he is tempted, I am tempted of God: for God cannot be tempted with evil, neither tempteth he any man:
Jas 1:14 But every man is tempted, when he is drawn away of his own lust, and enticed.
Jas 1:15 Then when lust hath conceived, it bringeth forth sin: and sin, when it is finished, bringeth forth death.
Jas 1:16 Do not err, my beloved brethren.
1Co 15:33 Be not deceived: evil communications corrupt good manners.
1Co 15:34 Awake to righteousness, and sin not; for some have not the knowledge of God: I speak this to your shame.
1Jn 3:10 In this the children of God are manifest, and the children of the devil: whosoever doeth not righteousness is not of God, neither he that loveth not his brother.
Rom 6:15 What then? shall we sin, because we are not under the law, but under grace? God forbid.
Rom 6:16 Know ye not, that to whom ye yield yourselves servants to obey, his servants ye are to whom ye obey; whether of sin unto death, or of obedience unto righteousness?
Rom 6:17 But God be thanked, that ye were the servants of sin, but ye have obeyed from the heart that form of doctrine which was delivered you.
Rom 6:18 Being then made free from sin, ye became the servants of righteousness.
Jas 2:24 Ye see then how that by works a man is justified, and not by faith only.
Forest Gump-stupid is as stupid does.
Jesus Christ-righteous is as righteous does.
Believing on the Lord,and inputed as righteousness,is a work,for whether it an act of the mind,or the body,it is a work,and the Bible says the action of righteousness is what defines them as a child of God,for the outward action is what establishes the inward action of believing,and having faith,for I can say I love my spouse,but then not show it outwardly by treating her bad,so then how do I love her.They can say they love Christ,but if they do not show it outwardly,how do they love Christ.
Actions speak louder than words,which the Bible says be not hearers of the word only,but be doers of the word.
Jesus said if you lust after a woman in your mind,it is the same as if you fornicated with her,so the action of the mind,is the same as the action of the body,and is a work of sin either way,and so whether we confess Christ,believe on Him,with the mind,or do an outward manifestation of righteousness,it is a work all the same.
Those that name the name of Christ have to depart from iniquity,and awake to righteousness,and sin not,and whoever does not do righteousness is not of God.
Some people try to make out when they are saved,the outward manifestation of sin does not affect their relationship with God,but God said it does affect their relationship with God.
Those that name the name of Christ have to depart from iniquity,and awake to righteousness,and sin not,and whoever does not do righteousness is not of God.
Faith alone,not saved by works,when we confess Christ,for we are in the flesh and that is all we can do.
Faith without works is dead,and a person is justified by works,and not faith alone,after we receive the Spirit,and the outward manifestation of the works establishes that we indeed love the Lord,and have faith.
But I quote the famous Lord Jesus Christ,doth thou not understandest.
You have not read the previous posts and are commenting as if I said "don't examine yourself" Our examining is to see if we are establishing OUR OWN righteousness OR walking in the established righteousness OF Christ. It gets so tiring when you guys don't bother to read any of the previous posts and then try to correct people who disagree with you. Read please then if you still want to correct we can actually discuss something.
"looking to Jesus., The Author and Finisher of our faith" When we walk in our own righteousness and have faith in our own goodness take heed we will fall flat on our faces. Pride goes before a fall.
False. I've already explained this to you numerous times.
What do you mean you've already explainfed this to me numerous times???
Does it look to you like I'm here to LEARN from you?
I'm here to tell you that you're wrong.
That you make grace out to be cheap
and that you're an Easy Believism Christian.
IOW, a Christian who will fight tooth and nail to convince himself he has to do NOTHING to remain in the Kingdom of God.
THIS IS WRONG. And I'll continue to say so forever.
Please do not bother to explain things to me.
Just answer me with scripture, as you normally do to Others.
Believers have eternal life NOW. John 5:24 - Most assuredly, I say to you, he who hears My word and believes in Him who sent Me has everlasting life, and shall not come into judgment, but has passed from death into life. Yet believers will not receive their glorified bodies until the end.
John 5:24 is very nice. We do, however, to keep in context (as you like to do) have to look back to just before that and just after that.
You know how wrong it is to just pull a verse out and make it say WHATEVER YOU WANT IT TO SAY.
No, we must make it say what either Jesus meant, or one of the Writers of the N.T.
John 5:19 The Son can only do what He sees the FAther doing.
John 5:20 The Father loves the Son and thus includes the Son in everything He does. And Jesus will do even Greater works.
John 5:21 Just as the FAther can give life, so can the Son give life.
John 5:22 The Father has given authority to the Son to be the judge. The Son is equal to the FAther.
John 5:23 Anyone who DISHONORS THE FATHER, DISHONORS THE SON, because it was the Father's decision to Put Jesus in a place of Honor.
JOHN 5:24 TRULY TRULY, means that what Jesus is about to say is VERY important...
Anyone listening to Jesus, and wishes to be in Agreement with the Father (who has put Jesus in charge), has at this very moment the real, lasting life, and is no longer Condemned TO BE AN OUTSIDER (but is a member of the Kingdom)
xxxxxxx NOW COMES THE IMPORTANT PART ........................ which many like to ignore ..............
John 5:25 Truly, truly,..... listen to Me, this is important... An hour is coming when THE DEAD shall hear the voice of THE SON, THE JUDGE.... the one whom GOD made be THE JUDGE
And those who are dead, shall hear the voice of Jesus.
John 5:27-29 God has given Jesus authority to judge the dead. An hour is coming when ALL IN THEIR TOMBS SHALL HEAR THE VOICE OF JESUS...
And they shall come forth...
Those who did the GOOD DEEDS to a resurrection of Life, , those who committed evil deeds to a resurrection of judgement.
As you can see, God put Jesus in charge of judgement.
Jesus will judge the dead one day.
Those who did GOOD WORKS to a resurrection of life.
Those who did evil deeds to a resurrection of judgement, the opposite of life.
GOOD DEEDS ARE NECESSARY. THEY ARE NOT OPTIONAL if we intend to follow Jesus.
It's not all about YOU. Genuine believers remain IN HIM. Those who depart demonstrate they were NOT OF US.
What is a genuine believer? Is this someone different than a believer?
I've heard the expression GENUINE BELIEVER
TRUE BELIEVER
What makes them better than A BELIEVER?
Could someone do MORE than believe?
What you're saying is that if I believe, I'm safe in all ways and can depend on Jesus for EVERYTHING. Even for doing MY WORK for me. As if it weren't enough that he hung on that cross for us all.
So, what do you say?
Are we EXPECTED to do good works or not?
Sometimes you make it sound like Jesus might be angry if we did good works.
I remember Him saying that this is ALL WE HAVE TO DO.
Could you please post a verse where Jesus said that we're ONLY TO BELIEVE IN HIM, and he'll save us??
You won't find one, as you well know.
Jesus is the door (not a revolving door) and He is also the way, the truth and the life.
Jesus does not need to lock genuine believers in. They want to stay there.
Genuine believers have exercised their free will to choose Jesus.
Good luck confessing EVERY single sin......
You fail to understand that 1 John 1:9 is IN CONTRAST TO 1 John 1:8 and 1 John 1:10. So if John is saying that we must confess ALL of our sins that we have ever committed (keep a specific inventory) then go ahead and write out a list of ALL of your sins right now (and don't forget a single one). I'll be waiting.
MMD
It's not that I fail to understand.
It's that I don't agree with you and neither does the bible.
I don't read in the Word of God that we are to keep an inventory.
It seems you enjoy adding and deducting words that are never said, either by me or the Word of God.
Here... Let's make it easy and simple for those reading along who might be a little confused by you... like new Christians for instance.
1 John 1:8-10 New International Version (NIV)
8 If we claim to be without sin, we deceive ourselves and the truth is not in us.
9 If we confess our sins, he is faithful and just and will forgive us our sins and purify us from all unrighteousness.
10 If we claim we have not sinned, we make him out to be a liar and his word is not in us.
verse 8 If we claim that we never sinned, we're only fooling ourselves and make a liar out of God.
veres 9 If we confess our sins, He is faithful and will forgive our sins and make us clean of all wrongdoing.
verse 10 If we claim we have never sinned, we make God to be a liar and we do not know the truth.
So...
1. We must admit to committing sins.
2. If we confess our sins, God will surely forgive them as He has promised.
3. If we say we have never sinned, we are lying and God knows the truth.
So,
Admit to the sin, ask for forgiveness, and God will forgive you.
If you say you've never sinned, you're a liar.
Now wasn't that easy? I'm sure it's better than contrasting and all that complicated stuff you like to do which is not necessary to understand he word of God.
Continued unforgiveness is the mark of an unbeliever and forgiveness would be the mark of a genuine believer. We should forgive others because God, through Christ, has forgiven us (Ephesians 4:32). It is inconceivable that someone who has truly experienced God's forgiveness could refuse to grant forgiveness to others. I've heard more than one interpretation for Matthew 6:14-15 - https://www.gotquestions.org/forgive-forgiven.html
You sure did write a lot. Most persons who do not believe in doing anything for God seem to do this.
Then you end your post with:
...how different your Christian life will be when you are actually looking to Jesus who is the Author and Finisher of our faith.
So those of us, such as myself, that believe Jesus left us with many things to do and become,
are looking to whom for our Christian life?
Is there a different Jesus I don't know about?
Apparently so.
Where did Jesus say, in all His discourses, that we're to sit back and do nothing?
Where did He say that HE is going to do everything for us?
If I compare myself to some I am, in my own sight more, righteous than than are others are more righteous than me. When I compare myself to the true standard of righteousness, Y-shua I never come close. Therefore, I am grateful that the day when it counts the day I stand before G-d for judgement (and today) G-d calls me righteous because when the Father looks at me He sees the Blood of Messiah covering me. Yes, my righteousness is of Y-shua and that, righteous before G-d is the only righteousness that matters.
1 John 1:6 - If we say that we have fellowship with Him, and walk in darkness, we lie and do not practice the truth. But if we walk in the light as He is in the light, we have fellowship with one another, and the blood of Jesus Christ His Son cleanses us from all sin. Walking in darkness is descriptive of children of the devil. Walking in the light is descriptive of children of God. Only those who are saved/believers are in the light.
Acts 26:18 - to open their eyes, in order to turn them from darkness to light, and from the power of Satan to God, that they may receive forgiveness of sins and an inheritance among those who are sanctified by faith in Me.
2 Corinthians 6:14 - Do not be unequally yoked together with unbelievers. For what fellowship has righteousness with lawlessness? And what communion has light with darkness?
Ephesians 5:8 - for you were formerly darkness, but now you are Light in the Lord; walk as children of Light. Children of the devil walk in darkness, not in the light. Children of God walk in the light, not in darkness. IF confirms these positions in verses 6 and 7. It's one or the other.
In 1 John 2:9, we read - He who says he is in the light, and hates his brother, is in darkness until now. In vs. 11 - But he who hates his brother is in darkness and walks in darkness, and does not know where he is going, because the darkness has blinded his eyes.
*Compare with 1 John 3:10 - In this the children of God and the children of the devil are manifest: Whoever does not practice righteousness is not of God, (compare with 1 John 1:6 - does not practice the truth) nor is he who does not love his brother. *Notice that "walks in darkness, hates his brother" is connected with children of the devil.
Notice that 1 John 1:9 - If we confess our sins, he is faithful and righteous to forgive us our sins, and to cleanse us from all unrighteousness (vs. 9) is IN CONTRAST TO - If we say that we have no sin, (PRESENT TENSE) we deceive ourselves, and the truth is not in us (vs. 8) and - If we say that we have not sinned, (PAST TENSE) we make him a liar, and his word is not in us (vs. 10).
Some people misunderstand verse 9 to mean that we must confess each specific sin that we commit as we commit them (keep a specific inventory) as an additional requirement to remain cleansed and if we forget a sin we are toast!
Paul is clear that we are saved by grace through faith, not works and NOT faith and works or faith + "these" works and just not "those" works.
That sounds similar to the same argument I hear from Roman Catholics. Elsewhere, Paul said we are not saved by works of righteousness which we have done.. (Titus 3:5) and that God saved us and called us with a holy calling, not according to our works, but according to His own purpose and grace which was given to us in Christ Jesus before time began. That covers good works in general/works of obedience produced out of faith.
Works put in their proper place are subsequent to saving faith in Christ. The Bible says we are saved by grace through faith, not works, whether religious works or good works/works of obedience produced out of faith etc.. This does not remove good works/works of obedience from the Christian life, it just puts them in their proper place, subsequent to regeneration and salvation.
Verse 10 does not imply that we are saved by good works. In verse 10, we read - For we are His workmanship, created in Christ Jesus FOR good works, which God prepared beforehand that we should walk in them.
Exactly. We can't ever establish our own righteousness. It just is not there. And when we humans start looking for it in all the wrong places., we fail miserably in our walk as believers here on earth. That is why we are constantly reminded in the Bible to look to Jesus and away from self. When we are examining ourselves it's about seeing if we are of the mindset of seeing Christ's righteousness and not our own. That is what self examining is about. Not seeing if your being a great worker.
The Holy Spirit will point us to Jesus at all times. Why don't you guys who are against the "obedience of faith" stop and see what we are trying to share with you. Get away from looking at your own obedience and begin the awesome journey of living in the obedience of faith. Seeing HIS obedience and like the sheep that we are., follow Him because that is what He tells us to do. We are not herded and driven.,No., we are lead and we called to follow. Jesus goes before and we follow after. This happens when we are first saved and forever after as believers.