Can We Really Exercise Free Will?

[Journey_man]

I believe that I am saved because I put my trust in Jesus to save me as the scripture states.

Am I absolutely certain that I am saved as a fact?

Definitely not, because my salvation is ultimately in the hands of the Lord Himself.

I live by faith in Jesus Christ not by some theological discourse that states I am secure because God is sovereign.

Calvinism teaches absolute assurance but how do you know that you, personally, are saved?

The reason you don't know if you are saved, is because you don't believe what Gods has said -

1 John 5:13: John writes so that those who believe in the name of the Son of God may know they have eternal life.

There you have it, Gods Word reveals why you don't know if you are saved. I know that I am saved, because God is not a liar. I have placed my trust in the Lord Jesus, I believe His promise to save me is not conditional on my ability to remain steadfast in the faith. Salvation is of the Lord, not of my good works.

I'm not sure why you're so obsessed with John Calvin, but I can assure you that John Calvin cannot save you, nor can any man or religion. I would encourage you to take Gods Word seriously, and avoid vain disputes.

2 Peter 1:10: Believers are commanded to make their calling and election sure.

Romans 8:16: The Spirit bears witness with our spirit that we are children of God.

The only way I could lose my salvation, would be if God turns out to be the biggest liar. Hell would freeze over before that ever happens.

 

[HeIsHere]

God did not hide the gospel behind a framework.

 

[LifelongLearner]

You radical Arminians can't consider any scriptures, without looking at them through your distorted Arminian lens. I notice you haven't been able to find a single fault with anything Calvinism teaches.

You don't have any credible biblical support for your radical Arminianism, and that only serves to show your theology is based on your own private opinions and imagination and not on the bible.

Radical Arminians? Do you have any knowledge of their "theology"? The existence of a radical Arminian is less likely than that of the tooth fairy! Might think it possible you wanted to be humorous but something tells me that's probably as limited as your logic appears to be.

Realised it was likely daft to think the creation of a new free will thread yesterday, might mean people like you would remove your toys and play on that instead. Sickened but not surprised to see you and your kind still here.

 

[LifelongLearner]

Gods people don't create any "human system of theology that is biblically correct". We receive Systematic theology because we believe God reveals Himself in an orderly, unified way through Scripture, requiring believers to organize His teachings into logical categories.

Systematic theology does not force outside ideas onto the Bible. Instead, it flows from God's own character. God is not the author of confusion. He speaks with purpose and clarity. Because every part of Scripture comes from God's mind, all biblical truths fit together without contradiction.

Early theologians used the loci (topics) method. This means grouping verses by specific themes, like salvation or the nature of God, to understand the whole Bible.
The Christian church began organizing doctrines during its earliest centuries. The church faced false teachings and resolved disputes at major councils. These events forced thinkers to summarize Christian beliefs clearly.

Leaders wanted a reliable body of truth to teach new believers and children. Organizing doctrine made it easier to pass down the faith.

As you can appreciate, systematic theology didn't originate from ill-intentioned wolves in sheep's clothing. As the Lord Jesus said, "how can a kingdom that is divided against itself stand".

You think Calvinism is biblical, i don't, i see considerable errancy in it and many proponents seem to use it to legitimise probable psychological issues to themselves. As i've explained previously, much of what he said appears to be a reaction to the political and religious climate at the time.

That's the only part of this comment of yours which is worth a reply, the rest is fluff/hot air which probably only your buddies will appreciate.

 

[Inquisitor]

The reason you don't know if you are saved, is because you don't believe what Gods has said -

1 John 5:13: John writes so that those who believe in the name of the Son of God may know they have eternal life.

There you have it, Gods Word reveals why you don't know if you are saved. I know that I am saved, because God is not a liar. I have placed my trust in the Lord Jesus, I believe His promise to save me is not conditional on my ability to remain steadfast in the faith. Salvation is of the Lord, not of my good works.

I'm not sure why you're so obsessed with John Calvin, but I can assure you that John Calvin cannot save you, nor can any man or religion. I would encourage you to take Gods Word seriously, and avoid vain disputes.

2 Peter 1:10: Believers are commanded to make their calling and election sure.

Romans 8:16: The Spirit bears witness with our spirit that we are children of God.

The only way I could lose my salvation, would be if God turns out to be the biggest liar. Hell would freeze over before that ever happens.

i have a different approach to understanding how to identify in yourself and others why you are saved.

1 John 5:13
John writes so that those who believe in the name of the Son of God may know they have eternal life.
On it's own it is a genuine statement that John made but lacks the surrounding context.

Jesus stated that people know a tree by the fruit it bears and a believer will bear that fruit.

The fruit of the Holy Spirit must be visible over time and the greatest of the fruit is agape love.

If someone does not have that love for others, over time. then the parable of the Sower explains what happens.

There are two parts to salvation the lifelong confession of Jesus and the fruit of the Holy Spirit.

They cannot be separated from one another.

 

[Journey_man]

Radical Arminians? Do you have any knowledge of their "theology"? The existence of a radical Arminian is less likely than that of the tooth fairy! Might think it possible you wanted to be humorous but something tells me that's probably as limited as your logic appears to be.

Realised it was likely daft to think the creation of a new free will thread yesterday, might mean people like you would remove your toys and play on that instead. Sickened but not surprised to see you and your kind still here.

John Calvin became famous after he exposed Jacob Arminius' unbiblical "saved by works version of the gospel". The rest is history

 

[Journey_man]

You think Calvinism is biblical, i don't, i see considerable errancy in it and many proponents seem to use it to legitimise probable psychological issues to themselves. As i've explained previously, much of what he said appears to be a reaction to the political and religious climate at the time.

That's the only part of this comment of yours which is worth a reply, the rest is fluff/hot air which probably only your buddies will appreciate.

Your denial of the truth is astounding. You have failed to find a single fault with anything Calvinism - Reformed Theology teaches.

If you find a fault, then please bring it to my attention. I love correction, as it sharpens my sword. But making false statements about something you are clueless about, only serves to expose your deep fear of the unknown and your hatred of the truth.

 

[Genez]

John Calvin became famous after he exposed Jacob Arminius' unbiblical "saved by works version of the gospel". The rest is history

One wrong person proving another person wrong does not make that person right.

 

[Genez]

Your denial of the truth is astounding. You have failed to find a single fault with anything Calvinism - Reformed Theology teaches.

It is you who are guilty of that. You fail to see what others can see.

 

[LifelongLearner]

John Calvin became famous after he exposed Jacob Arminius' unbiblical "saved by works version of the gospel". The rest is history

Your denial of the truth is astounding. You have failed to find a single fault with anything Calvinism - Reformed Theology teaches.

If you find a fault, then please bring it to my attention. I love correction, as it sharpens my sword. But making false statements about something you are clueless about, only serves to expose your deep fear of the unknown and your hatred of the truth.

Personally haven't read the Arminius Gospel, however, sure it is works based from what i know of it. However, it seems very simplistic and childish to make everything about Calvinism and Armininism; they're clearly important to you for whatever reason but not to people like me. I really don't like you but will treat you with some respect if you stop substituting your word for God's word. Sure you must have said something i can agree with but it gets drowned out by all the tripe. I really don't like you but feel a little concerned about you too.

The above paragraph is incase you are genuine but i think you're more likely a troll. Calvinism is a theory, it isn't at fault, however, people like you give it an iffy name because your word/opinion matters most to you and you try to force others to agree. I have explained previously that people with certain psychological disorders, sometimes use Calvinism to support personal belief they're special. It's much more common in Calvinism than any other Christian theology, however, Calvinism isn't at fault, the problem is how some adherents interpret it.

It would be wise for you not to attempt managing our discussions, think we have very little in common. You aren't a person i feel any affinity for, however, discussions involving opposing opinions can be interesting and mutually beneficial.

 

[Journey_man]

i have a different approach to understanding how to identify in yourself and others why you are saved.

1 John 5:13
John writes so that those who believe in the name of the Son of God may know they have eternal life.
On it's own it is a genuine statement that John made but lacks the surrounding context.

Jesus stated that people know a tree by the fruit it bears and a believer will bear that fruit.

The fruit of the Holy Spirit must be visible over time and the greatest of the fruit is agape love.

If someone does not have that love for others, over time. then the parable of the Sower explains what happens.

There are two parts to salvation the lifelong confession of Jesus and the fruit of the Holy Spirit.

They cannot be separated from one another.

Your different approach to understanding salvation, is unbiblical. The Bible doesn't support your view, that a born again believer can lose his/her salvation. Matthew 7:18 is not teaching that a true believer can lose their salvation; rather, it is used to prove that a genuinely regenerated person will inevitably produce good fruit.

In Matthew 7:17-18 a "good tree" represents a person transformed by God (regenerated), while a "bad tree" represents an unregenerate person. Jesus states that a good tree cannot bear bad fruit, meaning a truly new heart given by God will fundamentally and ultimately result in a life oriented toward righteousness.

Good works and spiritual fruit do not earn or maintain salvation. Instead, they act as the visible, outward proof that a supernatural change has already occurred inside the person. God preserves those He saves. A true believer may stumble and sin heavily, but they will never completely or permanently forfeit a state of grace.

 

[craqdi]

Many have probably realised i don't think we can exercise free will, even think it's impossible for us to. Won't explain why i think it's an impossiblility for us yet, think it's useful for some to express why they think it exists first.

I have no doubt we have and can make choices throughout life, however, think our options are far more restricted than most realise. What do you think?

It is totally unfeasible and whoever could follow an obvious truth with, for example, being shown on the Internet without clothes, for example, or establishing contacts in public and spontaneous places clearly should not afford under no circumstances is it unnatural

 

[OMC]

Your different approach to understanding salvation, is unbiblical. The Bible doesn't support your view, that a born again believer can lose his/her salvation. Matthew 7:18 is not teaching that a true believer can lose their salvation; rather, it is used to prove that a genuinely regenerated person will inevitably produce good fruit.

In Matthew 7:17-18 a "good tree" represents a person transformed by God (regenerated), while a "bad tree" represents an unregenerate person. Jesus states that a good tree cannot bear bad fruit, meaning a truly new heart given by God will fundamentally and ultimately result in a life oriented toward righteousness.

Good works and spiritual fruit do not earn or maintain salvation. Instead, they act as the visible, outward proof that a supernatural change has already occurred inside the person. God preserves those He saves. A true believer may stumble and sin heavily, but they will never completely or permanently forfeit a state of grace.

i have a different approach to understanding how to identify in yourself and others why you are saved.

1 John 5:13
John writes so that those who believe in the name of the Son of God may know they have eternal life.
On it's own it is a genuine statement that John made but lacks the surrounding context.

Jesus stated that people know a tree by the fruit it bears and a believer will bear that fruit.

The fruit of the Holy Spirit must be visible over time and the greatest of the fruit is agape love.

If someone does not have that love for others, over time. then the parable of the Sower explains what happens.

There are two parts to salvation the lifelong confession of Jesus and the fruit of the Holy Spirit.

They cannot be separated from one another.

Brother, the idea that a truly born‑again believer can lose salvation is not supported by Scripture. Jesus teaches that regeneration produces a fundamentally new nature, and that new nature inevitably bears fruit. Matthew 7:17–18 is not describing a saved person becoming unsaved — it is distinguishing between the regenerate and the unregenerate.
A “good tree” represents a person whom God has truly transformed. Jesus says a good tree cannot bear bad fruit, meaning that the new heart God gives will ultimately produce righteousness. This does not mean believers never sin, but that their lives cannot end in permanent rebellion. God preserves those He saves.
Good works do not earn salvation, nor do they keep salvation. They are the outward evidence of God’s inward work. A true believer may fall into serious sin, but God will not allow them to remain there permanently. He disciplines His children and restores them.
The Bible warns us against self‑justification, but it also assures us that salvation is God’s work from beginning to end. Those whom He regenerates, He keeps.

 

[Journey_man]

It is you who are guilty of that. You fail to see what others can see.

Yes I fail to see the invisible because it does not exist. Why don't you find one if you believe they exist. I've had a good look through the threads and I couldn't find a single one, they were all hiding in the dark.

 

[Journey_man]

Personally haven't read the Arminius Gospel, however, sure it is works based from what i know of it. However, it seems very simplistic and childish to make everything about Calvinism and Armininism; they're clearly important to you for whatever reason but not to people like me. I really don't like you but will treat you with some respect if you stop substituting your word for God's word. Sure you must have said something i can agree with but it gets drowned out by all the tripe. I really don't like you but feel a little concerned about you too.

The above paragraph is incase you are genuine but i think you're more likely a troll. Calvinism is a theory, it isn't at fault, however, people like you give it an iffy name because your word/opinion matters most to you and you try to force others to agree. I have explained previously that people with certain psychological disorders, sometimes use Calvinism to support personal belief they're special. It's much more common in Calvinism than any other Christian theology, however, Calvinism isn't at fault, the problem is how some adherents interpret it.

It would be wise for you not to attempt managing our discussions, think we have very little in common. You aren't a person i feel any affinity for, however, discussions involving opposing opinions can be interesting and mutually beneficial.

Personally haven't read the Arminius Gospel, however, sure it is works based from what i know of it. However, it seems very simplistic and childish to make everything about Calvinism and Armininism; they're clearly important to you for whatever reason but not to people like me. I really don't like you but will treat you with some respect if you stop substituting your word for God's word. Sure you must have said something i can agree with but it gets drowned out by all the tripe. I really don't like you but feel a little concerned about you too.

The above paragraph is incase you are genuine but i think you're more likely a troll. Calvinism is a theory, it isn't at fault, however, people like you give it an iffy name because your word/opinion matters most to you and you try to force others to agree. I have explained previously that people with certain psychological disorders, sometimes use Calvinism to support personal belief they're special. It's much more common in Calvinism than any other Christian theology, however, Calvinism isn't at fault, the problem is how some adherents interpret it.

It would be wise for you not to attempt managing our discussions, think we have very little in common. You aren't a person i feel any affinity for, however, discussions involving opposing opinions can be interesting and mutually beneficial.

So you admit you know nothing about Arminianism or Calvinism. That's OK, but the Bible has something to say about your lack of knowledge and self imposed ignorance of the gospel message.

Not knowing the truth is one thing, but then claiming that those who know the truth suffer psychological disorders is absurd. 2 Peter 3:3-5 explicitly describes scoffers who are willingly ignorant of God’s work in creation and judgment.

2 Timothy 2:23 But avoid foolish and ignorant disputes, knowing that they generate strife.

Hosea 4:6 God declares that His people are destroyed for a lack of knowledge, specifically because they have rejected knowledge.

Ephesians 4:18 People have their understanding darkened and are alienated from God "because of the ignorance that is in them, due to their hardness of heart."

 

[OMC]

So you admit you know nothing about Arminianism or Calvinism. That's OK, but the Bible has something to say about your lack of knowledge and self imposed ignorance of the gospel message.

Not knowing the truth is one thing, but then claiming that those who know the truth suffer psychological disorders is absurd. 2 Peter 3:3-5 explicitly describes scoffers who are willingly ignorant of God’s work in creation and judgment.

2 Timothy 2:23 But avoid foolish and ignorant disputes, knowing that they generate strife.

Hosea 4:6 God declares that His people are destroyed for a lack of knowledge, specifically because they have rejected knowledge.

Ephesians 4:18 People have their understanding darkened and are alienated from God "because of the ignorance that is in them, due to their hardness of heart."

Brother, both Arminianism and Calvinism are attempts to explain how God saves sinners, but Scripture itself is our final authority. We must test every theological system by the Word, not by tradition or preference (Acts 17:11).

Calvinism emphasizes God’s sovereign initiative in salvation (John 6:37; Ephesians 1:4–5). Arminianism emphasizes human responsibility and the universal offer of grace (1 Timothy 2:4; 2 Peter 3:9). Both systems contain biblical truths, and both can be distorted when taken beyond Scripture.

A Christian must hold two things together: God truly saves by His sovereign grace, and humans are genuinely commanded to repent and believe. Scripture affirms both without contradiction.

The question should always be “What does Scripture teach?” And Scripture teaches that salvation is God’s work from beginning to end (Philippians 1:6), yet the call to faith is real and binding (Romans 10:9–13)

 

[LifelongLearner]

So you admit you know nothing about Arminianism or Calvinism. That's OK, but the Bible has something to say about your lack of knowledge and self imposed ignorance of the gospel message.

Not knowing the truth is one thing, but then claiming that those who know the truth suffer psychological disorders is absurd. 2 Peter 3:3-5 explicitly describes scoffers who are willingly ignorant of God’s work in creation and judgment.

2 Timothy 2:23 But avoid foolish and ignorant disputes, knowing that they generate strife.

Hosea 4:6 God declares that His people are destroyed for a lack of knowledge, specifically because they have rejected knowledge.

Ephesians 4:18 People have their understanding darkened and are alienated from God "because of the ignorance that is in them, due to their hardness of heart."

Know it isn't deliberately so but your reply is genuinely funny, my comment does not suggest a lack of awareness of either. However, you included my comment, so people can see how erroneous your reply is, if they choose to.

"Not knowing the truth is one thing, but then claiming that those who know the truth suffer psychological disorders is absurd."

No *those* in my reply, which was specific to you. I almost hope you're a troll for your sake, or the lack of self awareness you usually present is very concerning.

 

[LifelongLearner]

Brother, both Arminianism and Calvinism are attempts to explain how God saves sinners, but Scripture itself is our final authority. We must test every theological system by the Word, not by tradition or preference (Acts 17:11).

Calvinism emphasizes God’s sovereign initiative in salvation (John 6:37; Ephesians 1:4–5). Arminianism emphasizes human responsibility and the universal offer of grace (1 Timothy 2:4; 2 Peter 3:9). Both systems contain biblical truths, and both can be distorted when taken beyond Scripture.

A Christian must hold two things together: God truly saves by His sovereign grace, and humans are genuinely commanded to repent and believe. Scripture affirms both without contradiction.

The question should always be “What does Scripture teach?” And Scripture teaches that salvation is God’s work from beginning to end (Philippians 1:6), yet the call to faith is real and binding (Romans 10:9–13)

Agree, Romans 4:3 leaps to mind "Abraham believed God, and it was credited to him as righteousness" Faith isn't a work, there are quite a few scriptures which prove it isn't.

 

[rogerg]

Agree, Romans 4:3 leaps to mind "Abraham believed God, and it was credited to him as righteousness" Faith isn't a work, there are quite a few scriptures which prove it isn't.

It isn't when faith is given to someone as a free gift from God.

 

[LifelongLearner]

It isn't when faith is given to someone as a free gift from God.

Grinning here, text can be rubbish at conveying the full meaning of a comment, pretty sure i read yours wrong at first. We can have momentary experiences of thinking there must be a God, however, that's all they'll be if he doesn't make the spark a flame.