Can We Really Exercise Free Will?

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JimiSurvivor, a few things need to be separated here.

2. Jeremiah 31:32 proves the old covenant was broken—not that the New Covenant is breakable
Jeremiah says Israel broke the former covenant, but immediately contrasts it with the New Covenant:
My point in referencing Jeremiah was to say that, in general, covenants, even those between God and man can be broken. That we are able to break the New Covenant we have with Jesus can be demonstrated in Hebrews:

26 If we deliberately go on sinning after we have received the knowledge of the truth, no further sacrifice for sins remains, 27but only a fearful expectation of judgment and of raging fire that will consume all adversaries.…(Hebrews 10:26)


a). DELIBERATELY: ἑκουσίως: An Adverb meaning voluntarily, willingly, of one's own accord: Hebrews 10:26 ἑκουσίως ἁμαρτάνειν (A. V. to sin willfully) as opposed to sins committed inconsiderately [i.e., without thought, carelessly], or from ignorance or weakness); in full awareness and with deliberate intent. It stands in contrast to anything done by compulsion, ignorance, or external coercion. The Lexical reference goes even further adding that in Hebrews 10:26 ἑκουσίως characterizes ongoing, high-handed rebellion that parallels Numbers 15:30–31. Such sin knowingly tramples the Son of God and rejects the only atonement God has provided. The warning underscores personal responsibility: persistent, willful sin places the sinner under certain judgment (Hebrews 10:27–29).
[https://biblehub.com/greek/1596.htm]

b). GO ON SINNING: The GRAMMATICAL FORM of the word SIN that is used here does not mean simply to commit a sin or even to commit a serious sin. Instead the author uses the PRESENT TENSE PARTICIPLE of the word sin which is
hamartanontōn [ἁμαρτανόντων] to indicate that this person has fallen into an ONGOING CONTINUAL PRACTICE [or life style] of sin.

c). THE KNOWLEDGE OF THE TRUTH: the word knowledge that is used here does not signify mere intellectual knowledge [gnosis]. Instead, the word is EPIGNOSIS (ἐπίγνωσις) The prefix epi has the effect of intensifying and elevating the quality of this knowledge.
[see https://biblehub.com/text/hebrews/10-26.htm]
So that it that it means:
an experiential, relational, and transforming knowledge. It is more than data acquisition; it embraces recognition, acknowledgment, and personal appropriation of truth revealed by God. In the New Testament it is always anchored in divine initiative and always bears moral and spiritual consequences.
d). All of this shows conclusively that the author's exemplar cannot mean a false convert
 
Sure, but that's not something we do so it can't be meritorious.
I totally agree, what I was reacting to were those who suggested that I suggesting that we have to constantly work to maintain salvation - as if it were like a program of meritorious work. However, our connection to Jesus is also portrayed in another way- as the organic connection that exists between the Vine and Branches It is like sharing the communion cup of life with Him. The covenant cup unites us with the Savior and out of that we experience fellowship and cleansing. This is not about performing works to EARN or make payments on our salvation. It illustrates how we receive His life and continue to commune with Him

After being grafted into the Vine we are instructed to abide, is to stay there, remain in Him and to continue to do so
If we do, Jesus promised we would reproduce fruit of His character. Of course, the opposite choice is also possible. Instead of continuing we could discontinue our walk with Him. This is why Jesus could say:
6 If anyone does not remain in Me, he is like a branch that is thrown away and withers. Such branches are gathered up, thrown into the fire, and burned (John 15:6).
As long as the branches remain attached the Vine they will not wither, nor is it possible to gather them up, and haul them out of the Vinyard to be burned.
 
Sure, but that's not something we do so it can't be meritorious.
Sure, but that's not something we do so it can't be meritorious.
We do not establish the covenant with Him but when we feel the CONVICTION of the Holy Spirit influence, we can respond to Him by REPENTING of our sins. We also can RECEIVE His testimony about the Son. Those are not meritorious works though they are necessary conditions that must exist before we will be willing to pass from death to life.

Much of what I said was a reaction to those who accused me of saying we have to constantly work to maintain salvation - as if it were like a program of meritorious works. However, our connection to Jesus is also portrayed in another way- as the organic connection that exists between the Vine and Branches It is like sharing the communion cup of life with Him. The covenant cup unites us with the Savior and out of that we experience fellowship and cleansing. This is not about performing works to EARN or make payments on our salvation. It illustrates how we receive His life and continue to commune with Him

After being grafted into the Vine we are instructed to abide, is to stay there, remain in Him and to continue to do so
If we do, Jesus promised we would reproduce fruit of His character. Of course, the opposite choice is also possible. Instead of continuing we could discontinue our walk with Him. This is why Jesus could say:
6 If anyone does not remain in Me, he is like a branch that is thrown away and withers. Such branches are gathered up, thrown into the fire, and burned (John 15:6).
As long as the branches remain attached the Vine they will not wither, nor is it possible to gather them up, and haul them out of the Vinyard to be burned.
 
I totally agree, what I was reacting to were those who suggested that I suggesting that we have to constantly work to maintain salvation - as if it were like a program of meritorious work. However, our connection to Jesus is also portrayed in another way- as the organic connection that exists between the Vine and Branches It is like sharing the communion cup of life with Him. The covenant cup unites us with the Savior and out of that we experience fellowship and cleansing. This is not about performing works to EARN or make payments on our salvation. It illustrates how we receive His life and continue to commune with Him

After being grafted into the Vine we are instructed to abide, is to stay there, remain in Him and to continue to do so
If we do, Jesus promised we would reproduce fruit of His character. Of course, the opposite choice is also possible. Instead of continuing we could discontinue our walk with Him. This is why Jesus could say:
6 If anyone does not remain in Me, he is like a branch that is thrown away and withers. Such branches are gathered up, thrown into the fire, and burned (John 15:6).
As long as the branches remain attached the Vine they will not wither, nor is it possible to gather them up, and haul them out of the Vinyard to be burned.
How do you sustain salvation? It's a gift. You can improve upon God's gift? Jesus left something undone?
 
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We do not establish the covenant with Him but when we feel the CONVICTION of the Holy Spirit influence, we can respond to Him by REPENTING of our sins. We also can RECEIVE His testimony about the Son. Those are not meritorious works though they are necessary conditions that must exist before we will be willing to pass from death to life.

Much of what I said was a reaction to those who accused me of saying we have to constantly work to maintain salvation - as if it were like a program of meritorious works. However, our connection to Jesus is also portrayed in another way- as the organic connection that exists between the Vine and Branches It is like sharing the communion cup of life with Him. The covenant cup unites us with the Savior and out of that we experience fellowship and cleansing. This is not about performing works to EARN or make payments on our salvation. It illustrates how we receive His life and continue to commune with Him

After being grafted into the Vine we are instructed to abide, is to stay there, remain in Him and to continue to do so
If we do, Jesus promised we would reproduce fruit of His character. Of course, the opposite choice is also possible. Instead of continuing we could discontinue our walk with Him. This is why Jesus could say:
6 If anyone does not remain in Me, he is like a branch that is thrown away and withers. Such branches are gathered up, thrown into the fire, and burned (John 15:6).
As long as the branches remain attached the Vine they will not wither, nor is it possible to gather them up, and haul them out of the Vinyard to be burned.
Believing, repentance, receiving are works. They are the responses one finds when God gives a new heart and spirit, and places His Spirit in them. They are actually the fruit of true conversion. They occur because someone has been placed into Christ and become a new creation.

We don't so much become attached to the Vine as we are attached to Him. We stay attached not so much by our effort, but by His commitment to us. To be sure, we are to set our hearts and minds on things above, but our success as Christians is due far more to the work of God in us than anything we do.
 
Believing, repentance, receiving are works. They are the responses one finds when God gives a new heart and spirit, and places His Spirit in them. They are actually the fruit of true conversion. They occur because someone has been placed into Christ and become a new creation.

We don't so much become attached to the Vine as we are attached to Him. We stay attached not so much by our effort, but by His commitment to us. To be sure, we are to set our hearts and minds on things above, but our success as Christians is due far more to the work of God in us than anything we do.

Well said and confirmed by the below verse.

[Jhn 15:16 KJV] – 16 Ye have not chosen me, but I have chosen you, and ordained you, that ye should go and bring forth fruit, and [that] your fruit should remain: that whatsoever ye shall ask of the Father in my name, he may give it you.
 
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My point in referencing Jeremiah was to say that, in general, covenants, even those between God and man can be broken. That we are able to break the New Covenant we have with Jesus can be demonstrated in Hebrews:

26 If we deliberately go on sinning after we have received the knowledge of the truth, no further sacrifice for sins remains, 27but only a fearful expectation of judgment and of raging fire that will consume all adversaries.…(Hebrews 10:26)


a). DELIBERATELY: ἑκουσίως: An Adverb meaning voluntarily, willingly, of one's own accord: Hebrews 10:26 ἑκουσίως ἁμαρτάνειν (A. V. to sin willfully) as opposed to sins committed inconsiderately [i.e., without thought, carelessly], or from ignorance or weakness); in full awareness and with deliberate intent. It stands in contrast to anything done by compulsion, ignorance, or external coercion. The Lexical reference goes even further adding that in Hebrews 10:26 ἑκουσίως characterizes ongoing, high-handed rebellion that parallels Numbers 15:30–31. Such sin knowingly tramples the Son of God and rejects the only atonement God has provided. The warning underscores personal responsibility: persistent, willful sin places the sinner under certain judgment (Hebrews 10:27–29).
[https://biblehub.com/greek/1596.htm]

b). GO ON SINNING: The GRAMMATICAL FORM of the word SIN that is used here does not mean simply to commit a sin or even to commit a serious sin. Instead the author uses the PRESENT TENSE PARTICIPLE of the word sin which is
hamartanontōn [ἁμαρτανόντων] to indicate that this person has fallen into an ONGOING CONTINUAL PRACTICE [or life style] of sin.
Jimi,

I appreciate the lexical and grammatical precision you brought to the table regarding Hebrews 10:26. Your definitions of hekousiōs (willfully), hamartanontōn (present tense participle for ongoing practice), and epignōsis (full/experiential knowledge) are entirely accurate.

However, your conclusion that this means a true child of promise can break the New Covenant completely collapses because you have failed to identify the specific, singular sin that the author of Hebrews is addressing, and you have misunderstood the legal architecture of a covenant.

You are treating "go on sinning" (hamartanontōn) as a generic lifestyle of moral failure or backsliding. But the immediate context dictates that the "willful sin" in view is not general immorality, but the specific sin of total apostasy—the decisive renunciation of Christ to return to the Levitical temple sacrifices.

1. The Real Meaning of Hebrews 10:26


Notice what the text says happens if someone commits this sin: "...there remaineth no more sacrifice for sins" (Heb 10:26).
Why would the author frame the consequence this way? Because he is writing to a first-century Jewish audience undergoing severe persecution. They were tempted to escape persecution by turning their backs on Jesus and going back to the temple to offer bulls and goats again.

The author’s argument is legal and absolute: If you willfully reject Jesus, you cannot go back to the temple for safety, because God has permanently abolished that system! Jesus is the final sacrifice (Heb 10:12–14). If you reject Him, there is simply no other sacrifice left in existence to cover you. Three verses later, he defines this willful sin explicitly: it is treading under foot the Son of God and treating His covenant blood with high-handed, malicious contempt (v. 29).

2. Why an "Epignōsis" of the Truth Does Not Equal Regeneration


You argue that because they received epignōsis (full, experiential knowledge), they must be true believers. But Scripture repeatedly shows that a person can have an elevated, experiential exposure to the truth, taste its power, and still be completely unregenerate.
  • Judas Iscariot had the highest epignōsis imaginable. He lived with the Truth incarnate for three years, preached the gospel, cast out devils, and experienced the relational dynamics of the apostolic ministry. Yet Jesus explicitly stated Judas was a "devil" from the beginning (John 6:70).
  • The Unchanged Nature: Peter describes these exact same false teachers in 2 Peter 2:20–22. He notes that they "escaped the pollutions of the world through the knowledge [epignōsis] of the Lord and Saviour." Yet what was their actual internal nature? Peter says they were dogs returning to their vomit and swine returning to the mire. They were never transformed into sheep; they were clean pigs.

3. The Unbreakable Legal Architecture of the New Covenant

Most importantly, your entire argument hinges on a fundamental misunderstanding of covenant mechanics. You are treating the New Covenant as if it were just like the Old Mosaic Covenant—a contract dependent on human performance that man can break.
But the New Covenant technically isn't a contract between God and volatile human beings. It is an intra-Trinitarian compact established between the Father and the Son, mediated by Christ. Man did not co-sign it; Jesus Christ is its exclusive Surety (Hebrews 7:22), taking full legal responsibility for the debt.

As Psalm 89:27–36 flawlessly demonstrates, God made this everlasting covenant with the true David—Jesus Christ. The Father swore an immutable oath to the Son that He would never break His covenant or alter what left His lips, even when the Son's children stumble and require fatherly discipline (v. 30–34).

Look at the absolute legal reality of what you are suggesting: The Son has faithfully, legally, and completely taken care of the entire sin debt of His people on the cross (Heb. 10:14). If a single soul for whom Christ paid that debt were to break the covenant and perish in hell, it would mean the Father broke His sworn covenant with the Son. It would mean the Father accepted Christ’s payment but refused to deliver the purchased captive. That is a theological and legal impossibility.

4. The Author’s Direct Exclusion


The author of Hebrews completely refutes your idea that true believers are the ones drawing back to destruction. Look at how he concludes the entire warning section in Hebrews 10:39:

“But we are not of them who draw back unto perdition; but of them that believe to the saving of the soul.”
The author deliberately draws a line in the sand. There is a class of unregenerate professors who possess epignōsis, hang around the church, and then willfully draw back to perdition because their hearts were never changed. But the true Church—the children of promise—are fundamentally NOT of that group. They persevere because they have been perfected forever by the one, unbreakable offering of Christ.
 
Believing, repentance, receiving are works. They are the responses one finds when God gives a new heart and spirit, and places His Spirit in them. They are actually the fruit of true conversion. They occur because someone has been placed into Christ and become a new creation.
I think we should be careful about calling repentance and faith works since Paul so often contrasts works and faith. However, repentance and faith are they are the results of surrender to what the Holy Spirit is saying to us and doing in us.

We don't so much become attached to the Vine as we are attached to Him. We stay attached not so much by our effort, but by His commitment to us. To be sure, we are to set our hearts and minds on things above, but our success as Christians is due far more to the work of God in us than anything we do.
1. Jesus said HE IS THE VINE so it follows that being grafted into the Vine is the same thing as being attached to Him
2. I also do not see any emphasis on our EFFORTS in John 15
3. We are simply told to STAY THERE, REMAIN IN, CONTINUE IN the life of Christ.
4. At the same time, abiding in Him is presented to us as a choice
5. We are able to be joined to Christ because we have been cleansed by His atoning blood
6. Thereafter, we receive the Holy Spirit who is supposed to become the power by which we live

…19 And He took the bread, gave thanks and broke it, and gave it to them, saying, “This is My body, given for you; do this in remembrance of Me.” 20 In the same way, after supper He took the cup, saying, “This cup is the new covenant in My blood, which is poured out for you (Luke 22:19-20)
The blood sacrifice brings cleansing as well as the inner power of the Holy Spirit which enables us become like Jesus

33 “But this is the covenant I will make with the house of Israel after those days, declares the LORD. I will put My law in their minds and inscribe it on their hearts. And I will be their God, and they will be My people.
34 No longer will each man teach his neighbor or his brother, saying, ‘Know the LORD,’ because they will all know Me, from the least of them to the greatest, declares the LORD. For I will forgive their iniquities and will remember their sins no more.”
(Jeremiah 31:33-34)
 
I think we should be careful about calling repentance and faith works since Paul so often contrasts works and faith. However, repentance and faith are they are the results of surrender to what the Holy Spirit is saying to us and doing in us.


1. Jesus said HE IS THE VINE so it follows that being grafted into the Vine is the same thing as being attached to Him
2. I also do not see any emphasis on our EFFORTS in John 15
3. We are simply told to STAY THERE, REMAIN IN, CONTINUE IN the life of Christ.
4. At the same time, abiding in Him is presented to us as a choice
5. We are able to be joined to Christ because we have been cleansed by His atoning blood
6. Thereafter, we receive the Holy Spirit who is supposed to become the power by which we live

…19 And He took the bread, gave thanks and broke it, and gave it to them, saying, “This is My body, given for you; do this in remembrance of Me.” 20 In the same way, after supper He took the cup, saying, “This cup is the new covenant in My blood, which is poured out for you (Luke 22:19-20)
The blood sacrifice brings cleansing as well as the inner power of the Holy Spirit which enables us become like Jesus

33 “But this is the covenant I will make with the house of Israel after those days, declares the LORD. I will put My law in their minds and inscribe it on their hearts. And I will be their God, and they will be My people.
34 No longer will each man teach his neighbor or his brother, saying, ‘Know the LORD,’ because they will all know Me, from the least of them to the greatest, declares the LORD. For I will forgive their iniquities and will remember their sins no more.”
(Jeremiah 31:33-34)
I didn't call faith a work. You do like many people here and misrepresent what people say. I'm not going to begin every post defending things I haven't said.

Grace and peace.
 
Jimi,

I appreciate the lexical and grammatical precision you brought to the table regarding Hebrews 10:26. Your definitions of hekousiōs (willfully), hamartanontōn (present tense participle for ongoing practice), and epignōsis (full/experiential knowledge) are entirely accurate.
So you accept that the exemplar being discussed in Hebrews 10 despite having full/experiential knowledge of the truth had fallen into an ongoing practice of willful sin. That is quite an admission.
However, your conclusion that this means a true child of promise can break the New Covenant completely collapses because you have failed to identify the specific, singular sin that the author of Hebrews is addressing, and you have misunderstood the legal architecture of a covenant.
Here you say that the sin the author is referring to is a specific singular sin and you challenge ME to identify which sin it is.
However, I can find no evidence in the text that he was speaking about a certain specific kind of sin. This idea came from YOU not the Book of Hebrews or its author. You hint about some legal architecture of covenant yet, since you fail to explain exactly what you mean.

I cannot respond to that either.
You are treating "go on sinning" (hamartanontōn) as a generic lifestyle of moral failure or backsliding. But the immediate context dictates that the "willful sin" in view is not general immorality, but the specific sin of total apostasy—the decisive renunciation of Christ to return to the Levitical temple sacrifices.
The ultimate danger was certainly the sin of Apostasy although that path is always rife with sexual immorality which the Bible speaks about
1 Timothy 4:1-2: “The Spirit clearly says that in later times some will abandon the faith and follow deceiving spirits and things taught by demons.
2 Thessalonians 2:3: “Let no one deceive you in any way, for that day will not come until the rebellion occurs and the man of lawlessness-the son of destruction-is revealed.”

1. The Real Meaning of Hebrews 10:26

Notice what the text says happens if someone commits this sin: "...there remaineth no more sacrifice for sins" (Heb 10:26).
Why would the author frame the consequence this way? Because he is writing to a first-century Jewish audience undergoing severe persecution. They were tempted to escape persecution by turning their backs on Jesus and going back to the temple to offer bulls and goats again.
This is OPINION of these Hebrew Christians - weak, timid, faltering, about to give up and depart from the faith and return to Judaism. What did the one who knew them personally and who had watched them for years have to say about them?

32 But recall the former days when, after you were
enlightened [this is the same word used in Hebrews 6:4 when it says they were enlightened once for all] you endured a hard struggle with sufferings,33 sometimes being publicly exposed to reproach and affliction, and sometimes being partners with those so treated.34 For you had compassion on those in prison, and you joyfully accepted the plundering of your property, since you knew that you yourselves had a better possession and an abiding one. 35 Therefore do not throw away your confidence, which has a great reward.36 For you have need of endurance, so that when you have done the will of God you may receive what is promised.
(Hebrews 10:32-36)
Yes, they had been through a lot and they still had more to endure. In his last sentence the author expresses his unity with them and encourages them to persevere in faith
39 But we are not of those who shrink back and are destroyed, but of those who have faith and preserve their souls
(Hebrews 10:39)

The author’s argument is legal and absolute: If you willfully reject Jesus, you cannot go back to the temple for safety, because God has permanently abolished that system! Jesus is the final sacrifice (Heb 10:12–14).
But the author does not mention the temple sacrifices nor does he suggest that these Jewish believers were tempted to revert back to those practices
 
2. Why an "Epignōsis" of the Truth Does Not Equal Regeneration

You argue that because they received epignōsis (full, experiential knowledge), they must be true believers. But Scripture repeatedly shows that a person can have an elevated, experiential exposure to the truth, taste its power, and still be completely unregenerate.
Even Jesus disciples did not know Him according to His true nature. Peter first saw it when Jesus asked him:
…15“ But what about you?” Jesus asked. “Who do you say I am?” 16 Simon Peter answered, “You are the Christ, the Son of the living God.” 17 Jesus replied, “Blessed are you, Simon son of Jonah! For this was not revealed to you by flesh and blood, but by My Father in heaven.…(Matthew 16:15-18)
Peter knew Jesus personally. However, this level of knowledge about Jesus came by revelation from the Father

Epignosis does not mean personal knowledge of the man Jesus. It has to do with revealed knowledge. What does an elevated experiential exposure to the truth even mean? When you use the phrase TASTE ITS POWER are you not aware that TASTE is a Biblical word meaning to EXPERIENCE. In what way do non-regenerate taste the power of God? Do you mean they feel goose bumps?
The disciples had a human understanding of Jesus. However, Peter, James and John got much a clearer view of who He really was on the Mountain of Transfiguration.

A lot of people had known Jesus after the flesh but much fewer knew who He really was.
Therefore, from now, we know no one according to the flesh. Even if we have known Christ according to the flesh, yet now we know Him thus [in this way] no longer (2 Corinthians 5:16)

  • Judas Iscariot had the highest epignōsis imaginable. He lived with the Truth incarnate for three years, preached the gospel, cast out devils, and experienced the relational dynamics of the apostolic ministry. Yet Jesus explicitly stated Judas was a "devil" from the beginning (John 6:70).
According to Thayer's Greek Lexicon, EPIGNOSIS when referring to God means the knowledge of his holy will and of the blessings which he has bestowed and constantly bestows on men through Christ: Ephesians 1:17; Colossians 1:10; 2 Peter 1:2; of Christ, i. e. the true knowledge of Christ's nature, dignity, benefits: Ephesians 4:13; 2 Peter 1:8; 2 Peter 2:20; of God and Christ: 2 Peter 1:2
The Topical Lexicon adds the following:
ἐπίγνωσις (epignōsis) denotes an experiential, relational, and transforming knowledge. It is more than data acquisition; it embraces recognition, acknowledgment, and personal appropriation of truth revealed by God. In the New Testament it is always anchored in divine initiative and always bears moral and spiritual consequences. Do you still think Judas had a full measure of this?
  • The Unchanged Nature: Peter describes these exact same false teachers in 2 Peter 2:20–22. He notes that they "escaped the pollutions of the world through the knowledge [epignōsis] of the Lord and Saviour." Yet what was their actual internal nature? Peter says they were dogs returning to their vomit and swine returning to the mire. They were never transformed into sheep; they were clean pigs.
First it says that they had ESCAPED the pollutions of the world through the EPIGNOSIS of their Lord and Savior.
No one escapes the pollution of the world and the flesh through intellectual knowledge ABOUT Jesus. This had to be speaking of the superior, revelatory saving knowledge of Jesus Christ. The fact that they knew Him as their Lord and Savior makes the point about the kind of knowledge they had with Jesus.

Peter did speak about a reversal of their decision - how after having been cleansed they returned to what their former lives and immersed themselves once again in sin. At this point, the metaphor fails so you try to import other metaphors - that of being sheep - and mix them together to present a picture Jesus never spoke about - where sheep metamorphose into pigs and back again. These are not the lessons Jesus taught,

3. The Unbreakable Legal Architecture of the New Covenant

Most importantly, your entire argument hinges on a fundamental misunderstanding of covenant mechanics. You are treating the New Covenant as if it were just like the Old Mosaic Covenant—a contract dependent on human performance that man can break.
But the New Covenant technically isn't a contract between God and volatile human beings. It is an intra-Trinitarian compact established between the Father and the Son, mediated by Christ. Man did not co-sign it; Jesus Christ is its exclusive Surety (Hebrews 7:22), taking full legal responsibility for the debt.
The New Covenant was made between God and believers. If it was not between them why did Jesus mislead us by having us drink the cup of covenant communion WITH Him
 
So you accept that the exemplar being discussed in Hebrews 10 despite having full/experiential knowledge of the truth had fallen into an ongoing practice of willful sin. That is quite an admission.

Here you say that the sin the author is referring to is a specific singular sin and you challenge ME to identify which sin it is.
However, I can find no evidence in the text that he was speaking about a certain specific kind of sin. This idea came from YOU not the Book of Hebrews or its author. You hint about some legal architecture of covenant yet, since you fail to explain exactly what you mean.

I cannot respond to that either.

The ultimate danger was certainly the sin of Apostasy although that path is always rife with sexual immorality which the Bible speaks about
1 Timothy 4:1-2: “The Spirit clearly says that in later times some will abandon the faith and follow deceiving spirits and things taught by demons.
2 Thessalonians 2:3: “Let no one deceive you in any way, for that day will not come until the rebellion occurs and the man of lawlessness-the son of destruction-is revealed.”


This is OPINION of these Hebrew Christians - weak, timid, faltering, about to give up and depart from the faith and return to Judaism. What did the one who knew them personally and who had watched them for years have to say about them?

32 But recall the former days when, after you were enlightened [this is the same word used in Hebrews 6:4 when it says they were enlightened once for all] you endured a hard struggle with sufferings,33 sometimes being publicly exposed to reproach and affliction, and sometimes being partners with those so treated.34 For you had compassion on those in prison, and you joyfully accepted the plundering of your property, since you knew that you yourselves had a better possession and an abiding one. 35 Therefore do not throw away your confidence, which has a great reward.36 For you have need of endurance, so that when you have done the will of God you may receive what is promised.
(Hebrews 10:32-36)
Yes, they had been through a lot and they still had more to endure. In his last sentence the author expresses his unity with them and encourages them to persevere in faith
39 But we are not of those who shrink back and are destroyed, but of those who have faith and preserve their souls
(Hebrews 10:39)


But the author does not mention the temple sacrifices nor does he suggest that these Jewish believers were tempted to revert back to those practices
Jimi,

I appreciate your thoughtful engagement with the text, but your pushback relies on a fundamental misunderstanding of the book's structural blueprint. You claim that the text contains "no evidence" that the author is speaking about a specific sin, and you assert that my position regarding the Levitical temple sacrifices is merely an "opinion" not found in the book.
Let’s allow the internal syntax and legal architecture of the Book of Hebrews to settle this.

1. The Evidence for the "Specific, Singular Sin"

You stated you can find no evidence that a specific kind of sin is in view. However, the author explicitly identifies this specific sin just three verses later in Hebrews 10:29. He does not leave the definition of hamartanontōn (sinning willfully) up to our imagination; he defines it with a threefold legal indictment:
  1. “Trodden under foot the Son of God”
  2. “Counted the blood of the covenant... an unholy thing”
  3. “Done despite unto the Spirit of grace”
This is not a description of a Christian struggling with a generic lifestyle of moral failure, backsliding, or sexual immorality. This is a specific, ultimate, high-handed legal renunciation of the Person and Work of Jesus Christ. The grammar transitions from the general present-tense participle (hamartanontōn) in verse 26 to show that the ongoing practice in view is the ongoing rejection of Christ's cross in favor of something else.

2. The Levitical Temple: Context, Not Opinion

You claim the author does not mention temple sacrifices or a temptation to revert to them. But the entire architectural layout of the Book of Hebrews is a direct comparison between Jesus and the Levitical system.
Look at the immediate context leading directly into verse 26:
  • Hebrews 10:11: “And every priest standeth daily ministering and offering oftentimes the same sacrifices, which can never take away sins.”
  • Hebrews 10:12: “But this man, after he had offered one sacrifice for sins for ever, sat down on the right hand of God.”
  • Hebrews 10:14: “For by one offering he hath perfected for ever them that are sanctified.”
The author establishes that the Old Covenant animal sacrifices are legally obsolete and powerless. Then, immediately after establishing this, he issues the warning in verse 26: “If we sin willfully... there remaineth no more sacrifice for sins.”
Why say there remains "no more sacrifice"? Because if someone turns away from the one offering of Christ (v. 14), the only other place they could look for a sacrifice is the Levitical temple table (v. 11)—and God has completely closed that account. The statement is a legal reality: if you reject the final sacrifice, the old system has been emptied of its efficacy. You cannot find safety there.

3. Verses 32–39 Prove Particular Redemption, Not Apostasy of the Elect

You quoted verses 32–36 to show that these Hebrew believers were weak and faltering. But look at how the author concludes his thoughts in Hebrews 10:39:

“But we are not of them who shrink back unto perdition; but of them that believe to the saving of the soul.”
This is the ultimate dividing line of particular redemption. The author creates two distinct, mutually exclusive legal categories of people:
  1. Those who shrink back unto perdition (the unregenerate who possessed an external, epignōsis intellectual knowledge of the truth but lacked a new heart).
  2. Those who believe to the saving of the soul (the true elect).
Notice the author’s absolute confidence: “We are NOT of them who shrink back.” He doesn't say, "Be careful, or you might switch categories." He states objectively that true believers do not belong to the category of those who perish.
If a true child of promise could commit the apostasy of verse 26 and be destroyed, verse 39 would be a lie. The text stands firm: the warnings are real tools God uses to instruct and preserve His particular people, exposing those who only ever had an external attachment to the covenant while keeping His true "new creatures" walking in faith.
 
Even Jesus disciples did not know Him according to His true nature. Peter first saw it when Jesus asked him:
…15“ But what about you?” Jesus asked. “Who do you say I am?” 16 Simon Peter answered, “You are the Christ, the Son of the living God.” 17 Jesus replied, “Blessed are you, Simon son of Jonah! For this was not revealed to you by flesh and blood, but by My Father in heaven.…(Matthew 16:15-18)
Peter knew Jesus personally. However, this level of knowledge about Jesus came by revelation from the Father

Epignosis does not mean personal knowledge of the man Jesus. It has to do with revealed knowledge. What does an elevated experiential exposure to the truth even mean? When you use the phrase TASTE ITS POWER are you not aware that TASTE is a Biblical word meaning to EXPERIENCE. In what way do non-regenerate taste the power of God? Do you mean they feel goose bumps?
The disciples had a human understanding of Jesus. However, Peter, James and John got much a clearer view of who He really was on the Mountain of Transfiguration.

A lot of people had known Jesus after the flesh but much fewer knew who He really was.
Therefore, from now, we know no one according to the flesh. Even if we have known Christ according to the flesh, yet now we know Him thus [in this way] no longer (2 Corinthians 5:16)


According to Thayer's Greek Lexicon, EPIGNOSIS when referring to God means the knowledge of his holy will and of the blessings which he has bestowed and constantly bestows on men through Christ: Ephesians 1:17; Colossians 1:10; 2 Peter 1:2; of Christ, i. e. the true knowledge of Christ's nature, dignity, benefits: Ephesians 4:13; 2 Peter 1:8; 2 Peter 2:20; of God and Christ: 2 Peter 1:2
The Topical Lexicon adds the following:
ἐπίγνωσις (epignōsis) denotes an experiential, relational, and transforming knowledge. It is more than data acquisition; it embraces recognition, acknowledgment, and personal appropriation of truth revealed by God. In the New Testament it is always anchored in divine initiative and always bears moral and spiritual consequences. Do you still think Judas had a full measure of this?

First it says that they had ESCAPED the pollutions of the world through the EPIGNOSIS of their Lord and Savior.
No one escapes the pollution of the world and the flesh through intellectual knowledge ABOUT Jesus. This had to be speaking of the superior, revelatory saving knowledge of Jesus Christ. The fact that they knew Him as their Lord and Savior makes the point about the kind of knowledge they had with Jesus.

Peter did speak about a reversal of their decision - how after having been cleansed they returned to what their former lives and immersed themselves once again in sin. At this point, the metaphor fails so you try to import other metaphors - that of being sheep - and mix them together to present a picture Jesus never spoke about - where sheep metamorphose into pigs and back again. These are not the lessons Jesus taught,


The New Covenant was made between God and believers. If it was not between them why did Jesus mislead us by having us drink the cup of covenant communion WITH Him
Here is a highly precise, contextually grounded response to JimiSurvivor that directly engages his lexical defenses and his misunderstanding of covenant communion.

My Response to JimiSurvivor

Jimi,

You have provided excellent lexical definitions for epignōsis. But your argument falls into a classic theological trap: you are confusing the objective definition of a word with its subjective application in a text.

Lexicons tell us what a word can mean; the immediate context determines what a word does mean in that specific passage. Let's look at the text to dismantle the idea that epignōsis guarantees vital regeneration, and correct your understanding of the New Covenant architecture.

1. The Dynamic of Epignōsis Without Regeneration (2 Peter 2:20-22)

You cited Thayer’s and the Topical Lexicon to argue that epignōsis must always be a transforming, saving knowledge. If that is true, then you have a massive textual problem with 2 Peter 2:20–22.

The text explicitly states that these false teachers had an epignōsis of the Lord and Savior, and through it, they outward-escaped the pollutions of the world. Yet, Peter concludes by declaring their true, internal nature: “The dog is turned to his own vomit again; and the sow that was washed to her wallowing in the mire.”

You claim I am mixing metaphors, but this is Peter’s metaphor, not mine. Notice the precise language:
  • Peter does not say a sheep metamorphosed into a pig.
  • He says a sow (a pig) was washed.
A washed pig looks clean on the outside, just as an unregenerate person with a high epignōsis (intellectual illumination and reformation of manners) looks reformed on the outside. But a washed pig still possesses a pig’s nature. The moment it is left to itself, its immutable internal disposition drives it back to the mud.
They did not lose a sheep's nature; they simply manifested the pig's nature they had all along. This is the exact definition of an elevated, experiential exposure to truth that alters a person's outward behavior and theology without ever quickening their dead soul.

2. Did Judas Have Epignōsis?

You ask if Judas had a full measure of this knowledge. Look at Matthew 10:1–4 and Luke 10. Judas was officially commissioned by Christ. He was given supernatural power to heal sicknesses and cast out devils.

To cast out a devil in the name of Christ requires an objective recognition, acknowledgment, and personal operation of divine truth. Judas experienced the physical manifestation of God's power flowing directly through his own hands!

Yet, despite this supreme level of supernatural, experiential exposure, Jesus explicitly stated in John 6:70: “Have not I chosen you twelve, and one of you is a devil?” Judas was never a transformed sheep who lost his salvation; he was a devil from the beginning who possessed an extraordinary external illumination.

3. The New Covenant: Inter-Trinitarian Compact vs. The Communion Cup

Finally, you ask: “If the New Covenant was not between God and believers, why did Jesus mislead us by having us drink the cup of covenant communion WITH Him?”

Jesus did not mislead anyone. You are confusing the legal execution of a covenant with its practical administration.
A covenant requires a Surety—a legal representative who guarantees the fulfillment of the terms. Hebrews 7:22 explicitly states that Jesus is the Surety of a better testament.
  • In the Old Covenant, the people co-signed the contract at Mount Sinai, crying out, “All that the Lord hath spoken we will do” (Exodus 19:8). They broke it immediately because its execution depended on volatile human performance.
  • In the New Covenant, the elect did not co-sign the contract. The Father made the covenant with the Son on behalf of the elect before the foundation of the world (Titus 1:2, Ephesians 1:4). Jesus took full legal responsibility to fulfill the law, pay the penalty, and sovereignly send the Spirit to replace our stony hearts.
When we drink the communion cup, we are not "signing" a conditional contract based on our performance. We are partaking in a memorial celebration of a covenant that was already legally sealed and finished by Christ's blood alone. We drink the cup with Him as the beneficiaries of His estate, not as co-executors of the legal contract.

If the New Covenant depended on the believer's ability to maintain it, it would be just as volatile and breakable as the Old Covenant. But God says it cannot be broken precisely because He guarantees both sides of the ledger: “I will put my fear in their hearts, that they shall not depart from me” (Jeremiah 32:40).


 
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Here is a highly precise, contextually grounded response to JimiSurvivor that directly engages his lexical defenses and his misunderstanding of covenant communion.
You have provided excellent lexical definitions for epignōsis. But your argument falls into a classic theological trap: you are confusing the objective definition of a word with its subjective application in a text.

Lexicons tell us what a word can mean; the immediate context determines what a word does mean in that specific passage. Let's look at the text to dismantle the idea that epignōsis guarantees vital regeneration, and correct your understanding of the New Covenant architecture.
Sorry, but the purpose of Lexicons IS to give us the meaning of words. Your idea that Lexicons give ONLY objective definitions is misleading. A quality Lexicon will include both denotation and connotation of a word as well as its historic usage. It will also list usages in various passages which is why they include so many citations of scripture.

I have always mistrusted commentaries because of their bias preferring, instead, to approach a passage linguistically before I interpret it according to its spiritual sense. It seems to me that what you want is a commentary rather than a linguistic analysis and study of words. However, until and unless we understand the language we have no basis for understanding it, still less to go deeper.

1. The Dynamic of Epignōsis Without Regeneration (2 Peter 2:20-22)

You cited Thayer’s and the Topical Lexicon to argue that epignōsis must always be a transforming, saving knowledge. If that is true, then you have a massive textual problem with 2 Peter 2:20–22.
A). I do not see any inconsistency in what I believe and what the text says because I, believe that, just as we are able to come to full knowledge [epignosis] of the truth by putting our faith in Christ so able to depart or when we fall away from Christ

B). The author of the Lexicon I was citing was Joseph Henry Thayer, who, like you, believed in Reformed theology so he cannot be called my ally in this.

The text explicitly states that these false teachers had an epignōsis of the Lord and Savior, and through it, they outward-escaped the pollutions of the world. Yet, Peter concludes by declaring their true, internal nature: “The dog is turned to his own vomit again; and the sow that was washed to her wallowing in the mire.”
A. Here is a look at the wider context of
2 Peter 2:19-21
They [the false teachers] promised them [and prospective converts] freedom, while they themselves were
slaves to depravity. For a man is a slave to whatever has mastered him. 20 If indeed they have ESCAP
ED the corruption of the world

B. The word ESCAPED is apophygontes [which is a compound of ἀπο (from) + φυγόντες (flee) ]
The fact that the word apophygontes is a participle shows us his escape in the process of happening
C. However, the fact that Peter used the AORIST tense shows that this escape a singular event, a decisive historic turning point that had happened IN THE PAST.

D. Since you do not seem convinced that EPIGNOSIS includes the saving knowledge of Jesus Christ, let us consult another classic language reference - Vine's Complete Expository Dictionary of New Testament Words.
Vine wrote that: epignosis is a strengthened form of gnosis that expresses a fuller or a full “knowledge,” or an “exact or full knowledge, discernment, or recognition,” He adds that the word entails a greater participation by the “knower” in the object (i.e., “the thing known,” that is the believer) thus more powerfully influencing him.

F. It is worth noting that the exemplar was enabled to escape corruption THROUGH the [superior/higher] knowledge [epignosis] of our Lord and Savior Jesus Christ . This reveals that the kind of knowledge he had received was dynamic and transformative

G. The narrative does not end with the subjects initial escape. The author goes on to add that this man
was AGAIN entangled in sin. The fact that the text says he was AGAIN entangled tells us that he again found himself bound in sin, this time to the point that he was completely OVERCOME by them. This reminds me of Jesus lesson about the seed which had fallen in thorny soil. At first it grew, but the weeds grew with it, until it choked out the divine seed and life ceased,
 

Can We Really Exercise Free Will?​


Without free will we could not answer that question.
Angels must laugh at us at times.

Within a predetermined sphere of what God granted for man's free will.
It at present is to be found within our thought process.
For God sees man's thought as action.
​
“You have heard that it was said, ‘You shall not commit adultery.’ ​
But I tell you that anyone who looks at a woman lustfully has ​
already committed adultery with her in his heart." Mat 5:27-28​
​
“You have heard that it was said to an older generation, ‘Do not murder,’ ​
and ‘whoever murders will be subjected to judgment.’ But I say to you ​
that anyone who is angry with a brother will be subjected to judgment." Mat 5:21-22​

God is at present training our thought process.
For after we are resurrected?
What we will think will be done.

For without sin, all thoughts are honored.
 
Sorry, but the purpose of Lexicons IS to give us the meaning of words. Your idea that Lexicons give ONLY objective definitions is misleading. A quality Lexicon will include both denotation and connotation of a word as well as its historic usage. It will also list usages in various passages which is why they include so many citations of scripture.

I have always mistrusted commentaries because of their bias preferring, instead, to approach a passage linguistically before I interpret it according to its spiritual sense. It seems to me that what you want is a commentary rather than a linguistic analysis and study of words. However, until and unless we understand the language we have no basis for understanding it, still less to go deeper.


A). I do not see any inconsistency in what I believe and what the text says because I, believe that, just as we are able to come to full knowledge [epignosis] of the truth by putting our faith in Christ so able to depart or when we fall away from Christ

B). The author of the Lexicon I was citing was Joseph Henry Thayer, who, like you, believed in Reformed theology so he cannot be called my ally in this.


A. Here is a look at the wider context of
2 Peter 2:19-21
They [the false teachers] promised them [and prospective converts] freedom, while they themselves were
slaves to depravity. For a man is a slave to whatever has mastered him. 20 If indeed they have ESCAP
ED the corruption of the world

B. The word ESCAPED is apophygontes [which is a compound of ἀπο (from) + φυγόντες (flee) ]
The fact that the word apophygontes is a participle shows us his escape in the process of happening
C. However, the fact that Peter used the AORIST tense shows that this escape a singular event, a decisive historic turning point that had happened IN THE PAST.

D. Since you do not seem convinced that EPIGNOSIS includes the saving knowledge of Jesus Christ, let us consult another classic language reference - Vine's Complete Expository Dictionary of New Testament Words.
Vine wrote that: epignosis is a strengthened form of gnosis that expresses a fuller or a full “knowledge,” or an “exact or full knowledge, discernment, or recognition,” He adds that the word entails a greater participation by the “knower” in the object (i.e., “the thing known,” that is the believer) thus more powerfully influencing him.

F. It is worth noting that the exemplar was enabled to escape corruption THROUGH the [superior/higher] knowledge [epignosis] of our Lord and Savior Jesus Christ . This reveals that the kind of knowledge he had received was dynamic and transformative

G. The narrative does not end with the subjects initial escape. The author goes on to add that this man
was AGAIN entangled in sin. The fact that the text says he was AGAIN entangled tells us that he again found himself bound in sin, this time to the point that he was completely OVERCOME by them. This reminds me of Jesus lesson about the seed which had fallen in thorny soil. At first it grew, but the weeds grew with it, until it choked out the divine seed and life ceased,
JimiSurvivor, I agree that lexicons give us the semantic range and usages of a word. My point is simply that a lexical definition does not automatically establish regeneration in every occurrence of ἐπίγνωσις (epignōsis). Context still determines how the word functions.

You have shown that epignōsis can mean full, accurate, or profound knowledge of Christ. I agree. But you still have to prove:

epignōsis = regeneration.

And 2 Peter 2:20–22 actually creates a problem for that equation.

Peter says these men:

“escaped the pollutions of the world through the knowledge [ἐπίγνωσις] of the Lord and Saviour Jesus Christ”
Then:

“they are again entangled therein, and overcome.”
And Peter concludes:

“The dog is turned to his own vomit again; and the sow that was washed to her wallowing in the mire.”
So yes, they experienced a real escape and possessed real knowledge of Christ. But Peter never says they were regenerated.

Your point about the aorist only establishes that the escape is presented as a completed past event. It does not establish that the event was regeneration.

Likewise, saying epignōsis is “transformative” does not prove regeneration. Moral reformation is not identical to the new birth.

And your seed analogy actually creates a problem for your position. If the seed represents regenerated eternal life, are you saying eternal life can be choked out and die? Jesus says:

“I give unto them eternal life; and they shall never perish.”
—John 10:28
When Peter explicitly describes the new birth, he says:

“Being born again, not of corruptible seed, but of incorruptible, by the word of God, which liveth and abideth for ever.”
—1 Peter 1:23
That is very different from:

escape → epignōsis → return to corruption.

Peter's dog-and-sow imagery strongly suggests that the outward washing did not change the underlying nature.

So I'm not denying their knowledge, their escape, or the reality of their experience.

I'm denying the assumption that:

full knowledge = regeneration.

Reformation = regeneration.

Experience = regeneration.


You have established that these men knew Christ and experienced a real escape from worldly corruption.

You still have to show where Peter says they were born again.

The lexicon doesn't say it.
The aorist doesn't say it.
Epignōsis doesn't say it.
And Peter's final description of the dog and sow certainly doesn't say it.
 

Can We Really Exercise Free Will?​


Without free will we could not answer that question.
Angels must laugh at us at times.

Within a predetermined sphere of what God granted for man's free will.
It at present is to be found within our thought process.
For God sees man's thought as action.
​
“You have heard that it was said, ‘You shall not commit adultery.’ ​
But I tell you that anyone who looks at a woman lustfully has ​
already committed adultery with her in his heart." Mat 5:27-28​
​
“You have heard that it was said to an older generation, ‘Do not murder,’ ​
and ‘whoever murders will be subjected to judgment.’ But I say to you ​
that anyone who is angry with a brother will be subjected to judgment." Mat 5:21-22​

God is at present training our thought process.
For after we are resurrected?
What we will think will be done.

For without sin, all thoughts are honored.
Genez, your argument invents a speculative philosophy that is foreign to the text of Scripture.

You claim that free will is "at present to be found within our thought process" and that this exists within a "predetermined sphere." You are attempting to isolate the human mind as a sovereign, autonomous zone where God does not exercise absolute decretive control.

Your framework completely collapses when we look at what Scripture actually teaches about God's sovereign dominion over the thoughts, intents, and hearts of men.

1. God does not merely observe thoughts; He sovereignly rules them

Your premise relies on the idea that the thought process is an independent sphere of human free will. But Scripture declares that the thoughts of man’s heart are entirely subject to God’s absolute, sovereign control and first cause:

“The king's heart is in the hand of the Lord, as the rivers of water: he turneth it whithersoever he will.” —Proverbs 21:1

“A man's heart deviseth his way: but the Lord directeth his steps.” —Proverbs 16:9
God does not sit outside the mind waiting to see what man will think. He actively shapes, directs, and determines the inclinations of the heart to accomplish His eternal purpose. If man’s thoughts were an independent, libertarian variable, then God would not be the absolute first cause of all things, and His omniscience would be dependent on the creature.

2. Matthew 5 does not establish free will; it establishes total depravity

You cite Matthew 5:21–22 and 27–28 to argue that "God sees man's thought as action." But you are completely missing Christ’s purpose in the Sermon on the Mount.

Jesus was not teaching that the mind is a sovereign free-will playground. He was exposing the radical depth of human sin and natural depravity. The Pharisees believed that as long as they didn't commit the outward physical act of murder or adultery, they were righteous by the Law. Christ shatters their self-righteousness by showing that the nature of the natural man is corrupt from the inside out.
The natural man cannot think holy thoughts by his own autonomous power because his mind is in a state of absolute captivity to sin:

“Because the carnal mind is enmity against God: for it is not subject to the law of god, neither indeed can be.” —Romans 8:7
If the thought process is where "free will" resides, it is a free will that can only choose sin, rebellion, and death until the vital phase of regeneration occurs.

3. The resurrection is about perfect holiness, not instantly manifested thoughts


Your assertion that after the resurrection "what we will think will be done" because "all thoughts are honored" sounds more like mysticism than biblical eschatology.

The reason there will be no sin in the New Heaven and New Earth is not because God decides to "honor all thoughts" as a cosmic vending machine. It is because the elect will be perfectly conformed to the image of Jesus Christ, completely finalized in holiness, and delivered forever from the presence of the flesh. Our thoughts will be perfectly aligned with God's decretive will because He has fully perfected us—not because He has granted us an autonomous power to instantly manipulate reality with our minds.

The Bottom Line:

You state that "without free will we could not answer that question." The truth is exactly the opposite. Without God’s sovereign decree giving us being, life, and breath, we could not answer any question.

God does not create a "sphere" where the creature stands independent of His sovereign decree. From the highest cosmic event to the most hidden, fleeting thought in the human mind, God is the absolute first cause working all things according to the counsel of His own will (Ephesians 1:11). Man wills and man thinks, but he does so strictly within the execution of God's immutable decree, not as an autonomous agent operating in a closed thought-realm.


 
Genez, your argument invents a speculative philosophy that is foreign to the text of Scripture.

You claim that free will is "at present to be found within our thought process" and that this exists within a "predetermined sphere." You are attempting to isolate the human mind as a sovereign, autonomous zone where God does not exercise absolute decretive control.

God determines from within certain spheres of what we shall choose from...

Joshua 24:15


But if serving the Lord seems undesirable to you, then choose for yourselves this day
whom you will serve, whether the gods your ancestors served beyond the Euphrates,
or the gods of the Amorites, in whose land you are living. But as for me and my household,
we will serve the Lord.”
​


Note: Then choose for yourselves this day whom you will serve."
 
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