Day of the Lord - The Heathen

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KJV1611

KJV1611

Banned
#41
Nov 23, 2013
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#41
eternally-gratefull said:
1, this is a prophecy of gods judgment on edom (esau) not Isreal so i believe the Ops premise is incorrect, it is not Israel
2. Edom, as prophesied where wiped out, as if they had never been.
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At the day of the Lord, the heathen drink on God's holy mountain and Esau gets totally annihilated.
Are you saying that Edom was wiped out at the time of the day of the LORD?

Oba 1:15 For the day of the LORD is near upon all the heathen: as thou hast done, it shall be done unto thee: thy reward shall return upon thine own head.
Oba 1:16 For as ye (Edom) have drunk upon my holy mountain, so shall all the heathen drink continually, yea, they shall drink, and they shall swallow down, and they shall be as though they had not been.

Oba 1:18 And the house of Jacob shall be a fire, and the house of Joseph a flame, and the house of Esau for stubble, and they shall kindle in them, and devour them; and there shall not be any remaining of the house of Esau; for the LORD hath spoken it.
 
iamsoandso

iamsoandso

Senior Member
#42
Oct 6, 2011
7,840
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#42
KJV1611 said:
At the day of the Lord, the heathen drink on God's holy mountain and Esau gets totally annihilated.
Are you saying that Edom was wiped out at the time of the day of the LORD?

Oba 1:15 For the day of the LORD is near upon all the heathen: as thou hast done, it shall be done unto thee: thy reward shall return upon thine own head.
Oba 1:16 For as ye (Edom) have drunk upon my holy mountain, so shall all the heathen drink continually, yea, they shall drink, and they shall swallow down, and they shall be as though they had not been.

Oba 1:18 And the house of Jacob shall be a fire, and the house of Joseph a flame, and the house of Esau for stubble, and they shall kindle in them, and devour them; and there shall not be any remaining of the house of Esau; for the LORD hath spoken it.
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Oba. 1:15 "The day of the lord is near upon all the heathen"(God always used near,soon at hand ect. when speaking of the day of the Lord)
 
E

eternally-gratefull

Guest
#43
#43
KJV1611 said:
At the day of the Lord, the heathen drink on God's holy mountain and Esau gets totally annihilated.
Are you saying that Edom was wiped out at the time of the day of the LORD?

Oba 1:15 For the day of the LORD is near upon all the heathen: as thou hast done, it shall be done unto thee: thy reward shall return upon thine own head.
Oba 1:16 For as ye (Edom) have drunk upon my holy mountain, so shall all the heathen drink continually, yea, they shall drink, and they shall swallow down, and they shall be as though they had not been.

Oba 1:18 And the house of Jacob shall be a fire, and the house of Joseph a flame, and the house of Esau for stubble, and they shall kindle in them, and devour them; and there shall not be any remaining of the house of Esau; for the LORD hath spoken it.
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If god said it, it happened.
 
KJV1611

KJV1611

Banned
#44
Nov 23, 2013
13,684
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#44
iamsoandso said:
Oba. 1:15 "The day of the lord is near upon all the heathen"(God always used near,soon at hand ect. when speaking of the day of the Lord)
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Yes he does. And he tells us in Obadiah 1:18 when it happens. In the day of the Lord, the heathen will drink on God's holy mountain and Esau will be obliterated.

Oba 1:18 And the house of Jacob shall be a fire, and the house of Joseph a flame, and the house of Esau for stubble, and they shall kindle in them, and devour them; and there shall not be any remaining of the house of Esau; for the LORD hath spoken it.
 
iamsoandso

iamsoandso

Senior Member
#45
Oct 6, 2011
7,840
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#45
KJV1611 said:
Yes he does. And he tells us in Obadiah 1:18 when it happens. In the day of the Lord, the heathen will drink on God's holy mountain and Esau will be obliterated.

Oba 1:18 And the house of Jacob shall be a fire, and the house of Joseph a flame, and the house of Esau for stubble, and they shall kindle in them, and devour them; and there shall not be any remaining of the house of Esau; for the LORD hath spoken it.
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Yes the book of Obadiah is usually seen as written by the Obadiah who lived in the days of Elijah and would involve the Philistines or the Obadiah who lived in the days of Jeremiah and then would be speaking of the Babylonian captivity. But as you see "any remaining" could not be by the timing of the Herodian Dynasty https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Herodian_dynasty if Herod was an Edomite of Esau.
 
KJV1611

KJV1611

Banned
#46
Nov 23, 2013
13,684
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#46
iamsoandso said:
Yes the book of Obadiah is usually seen as written by the Obadiah who lived in the days of Elijah and would involve the Philistines or the Obadiah who lived in the days of Jeremiah and then would be speaking of the Babylonian captivity. But as you see "any remaining" could not be by the timing of the Herodian Dynasty https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Herodian_dynasty if Herod was an Edomite of Esau.
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The verse isn't talking about Edomite's soandso it's using Edom to represent sinful Israel.
 
Dino246

Dino246

Senior Member
#47
Jun 30, 2015
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#47
KJV1611 said:
The verse isn't talking about Edomite's soandso it's using Edom to represent sinful Israel.
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To borrow your logic, that interpretation means that the word of God is presenting a lie, for Edom is not Israel.

You have a choice at this point: either you accept that metaphors are not, in fact, lies at all, but merely comparisons not using "like" or "as", and the Bible does include metaphors, or, Edom does not represent Israel, and your interpretation of Obadiah is wrong.

Pardon me while I nail the lid shut on your logical box. :)
 
KJV1611

KJV1611

Banned
#48
Nov 23, 2013
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#48
Dino246 said:
To borrow your logic, that interpretation means that the word of God is presenting a lie, for Edom is not Israel.

You have a choice at this point: either you accept that metaphors are not, in fact, lies at all, but merely comparisons not using "like" or "as", and the Bible does include metaphors, or, Edom does not represent Israel, and your interpretation of Obadiah is wrong.

Pardon me while I nail the lid shut on your logical box. :)
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How childish can we get here? The bible is full of symbolic language, one thing representing another to conceal the first's identity. That is not a metaphor. Could we move along and discuss the symbolism of this scripture instead of arguing over semantics?
 
Dino246

Dino246

Senior Member
#49
Jun 30, 2015
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#49
KJV1611 said:
How childish can we get here? The bible is full of symbolic language, one thing representing another to conceal the first's identity. That is not a metaphor. Could we move along and discuss the symbolism of this scripture instead of arguing over semantics?
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I'm not being childish at all; rather, I'm using your logic against you. I don't believe the passage is symbolic. I believe it is straightforward plain speech that means exactly what it says. There are passages that are symbolic and even cryptic, but I honestly don't think this is one of them.
 
KJV1611

KJV1611

Banned
#50
Nov 23, 2013
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#50
Dino246 said:
I'm not being childish at all; rather, I'm using your logic against you. I don't believe the passage is symbolic. I believe it is straightforward plain speech that means exactly what it says. There are passages that are symbolic and even cryptic, but I honestly don't think this is one of them.
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Switching to the NIV for easier reading.

Jacob and Joseph are the fire and Esau is the stubble. Jacob and Joseph will set Esau on fire and destroy him... Who are the "no survivors from Esau"?

Obadiah 18 New International Version (NIV)
18 Jacob will be a fire
and Joseph a flame;
Esau will be stubble,
and they will set him on fire and destroy him.
There will be no survivors
from Esau.”
The Lord has spoken.
 
Dino246

Dino246

Senior Member
#51
Jun 30, 2015
24,672
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#51
KJV1611 said:
Switching to the NIV for easier reading.

Jacob and Joseph are the fire and Esau is the stubble. Jacob and Joseph will set Esau on fire and destroy him... Who are the "no survivors from Esau"?

Obadiah 18 New International Version (NIV)
18 Jacob will be a fire
and Joseph a flame;
Esau will be stubble,
and they will set him on fire and destroy him.
There will be no survivors
from Esau.”
The Lord has spoken.
Click to expand...
I'm not sure that I understand your question. As there are no survivors from Esau, the 'no survivors' are 'nobody'. God always preserves a remnant of Isreal, which is additional evidence that the book is not using "Edom" symbolically.
 
KJV1611

KJV1611

Banned
#52
Nov 23, 2013
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#52
Dino246 said:
I'm not sure that I understand your question. As there are no survivors from Esau, the 'no survivors' are 'nobody'. God always preserves a remnant of Isreal, which is additional evidence that the book is not using "Edom" symbolically.
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In normal realms of thought, no survivors (more than one survivor) indicates that Esau (one person) represents a group.
If you can't see that then there's no need to continue with this discussion. :)
 
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