Did Jesus ever tell us that we no longer need to keep the law of Moses?

  • Christian Chat is a moderated online Christian community allowing Christians around the world to fellowship with each other in real time chat via webcam, voice, and text, with the Christian Chat app. You can also start or participate in a Bible-based discussion here in the Christian Chat Forums, where members can also share with each other their own videos, pictures, or favorite Christian music.

    If you are a Christian and need encouragement and fellowship, we're here for you! If you are not a Christian but interested in knowing more about Jesus our Lord, you're also welcome! Want to know what the Bible says, and how you can apply it to your life? Join us!

    To make new Christian friends now around the world, click here to join Christian Chat.
Oct 24, 2019
302
28
28
None of this suggests that Abraham had the Holy Spirit, nor that he received the Holy Spirit because of his obedience to the law.

Try again.
Of course he had the anointing. No one can inherit the kingdom of God unless he receives the airflow of God, both in the new covenant, and also the old covenant.
 

Hevosmies

Well-known member
Sep 8, 2018
3,612
2,633
113
I do not seek Jewry, as of being a "jew" is cool, I seek obedience. The Messiah taught obedience to the Torah, and that is why I obey the Torah. If I cared about what Jews thought about me, I would gladly join one of their synagogues. If I cared what Messianic Jews thought about me, I would join one of their assemblies. What I care about is the truth and what God wants. I am willing to give up everything for the sake of that, and I have. I am willing to suffer and die for it, and God willing, I will. So while you sit there ridiculing me, which is contrary to what a believer should be doing to another believer who is actually obeying the Torah, you're actually dismissing a man who speaks the truth. What truth do I speak? That we must obey the Torah. That we must believe in Yeshuah. That we must be rich in good works by doing good works for the poor. The we must lessen ourselves to necessities. That we must walk perfectly before God. That paper money and fiat currency is the true mark of the beast, and that we must exit the financial system in order to remove the mark of the beast. And much more profound knowledge and understanding that is true, that Jews nor Messianic Jews possess. And finally, yes, only the seed of Abraham will rule with the Messiah for 1,000 years, which is why the 144,000 sealed are only numbered among the sons of Israel. Should I explain in depth why? Perhaps not. I've already wasting enough pearls for today.
You heard it here first, paper money is mark of the beast. EVERYONE is toast already. Ridicilous. Its SPIRIT in english not airflow.

Bla bla, you are great i am a swine. What else is new?
 
Oct 24, 2019
302
28
28
You heard it here first, paper money is mark of the beast. EVERYONE is toast already. Ridicilous. Its SPIRIT in english not airflow.

Bla bla, you are great i am a swine. What else is new? I will ridicule you most definately, and I dont consider you a believer. You are preaching another gospel and WEIRD stuff. Just another self-appointed cult leader, thats how I see it, not a believer at all
I would not expect someone who rejects the Torah to suddenly welcome me with open arms. Those who do not walk in the truth ridicule and despise those who do. If you continue on this path soon enough you will see that I was speaking the truth, and will regret not having believed me, but my hope for you is that you do come to the truth, even though you ridiculed me and all you are doing is heaping coals of wrath upon your own head.
 

Dino246

Senior Member
Jun 30, 2015
25,472
13,785
113
What truth do I speak? ... That paper money and fiat currency is the true mark of the beast, and that we must exit the financial system in order to remove the mark of the beast. And much more profound knowledge and understanding that is true, that Jews nor Messianic Jews possess. ... I've already wasting enough pearls for today.
Okay, so you take a narrow futurist interpretation of Revelation, you believe you have understanding beyond what most Christians claim, and you are quite willing to imply insults. Anything else you'd like to share about yourself?
 

Wall

Senior Member
Mar 13, 2013
1,417
154
63
Paul instructed that circumcision of the flesh, shabbaths, new moons, feasts, appointed times, food, drink are not necessary to observe in the Torah, because they are fulfilled differently under the new covenant,
That is not so. We need not keep circumcision of the flesh but we must keep Gods 10 commandments including Gods sabbath day

1 COR. 7 [19] Circumcision is nothing, and uncircumcision is nothing, but the keeping of the commandments of God.
 
Oct 24, 2019
302
28
28
That is not so. We need not keep circumcision of the flesh but we must keep Gods 10 commandments including Gods sabbath day

1 COR. 7 [19] Circumcision is nothing, and uncircumcision is nothing, but the keeping of the commandments of God.
The Torah is not limited to only 10 commandments, it is the entire first five books of the bible. And shabbath observance is also not required under the new covenant, hence "let no man judge you by feast or shabbaths". Not to mention the weekly shabbath is not the only shabbath of the Torah, there are also the great shabbaths in relation to the appointed times of the Torah. Observing one shabbath and not the other is hypocrisy.
 

NayborBear

Banned Serpent Seed Heresy
The Torah is not limited to only 10 commandments, it is the entire first five books of the bible. And shabbath observance is also not required under the new covenant, hence "let no man judge you by feast or shabbaths". Not to mention the weekly shabbath is not the only shabbath of the Torah, there are also the great shabbaths in relation to the appointed times of the Torah. Observing one shabbath and not the other is hypocrisy.
Revelation 20
6 Blessed and holy is he that hath part in the first resurrection: on such the second death hath no power, but they shall be priests of God and of Christ, and shall reign with him a thousand years.

Jez sayin'.
 
Oct 24, 2019
302
28
28
I agree. We are to keep ALL the sabbath days
Then keep all the shabbaths, in accordance to the measure of the belief you have. But to those who have higher understanding, we know that the shabbaths are foreshadows of realities found in the Messiah, in accordance to what the apostle Paul explained, for whoever enters into the millennial shabbath will fulfill the requirement of the Torah to observe shabbath, for we will rest from our works just as God rested from his.
 

Wall

Senior Member
Mar 13, 2013
1,417
154
63
And shabbath observance is also not required under the new covenant, hence "let no man judge you by feast or shabbaths".
EZEKIEL 45 [17] And it shall be the prince's part to give burnt offerings, and MEAT offerings, and DRINK offerings, in the FEASTS, and in the NEW MOONS, and in the SABBATHS, in all solemnities of the house of Israel: he shall prepare the sin offering, and the meat offering, and the burnt offering, and the peace offerings, to make reconciliation for the house of Israel.

Heres a scripture, same exact order as Col.2{16}, meat, drink, holy days (feast days), new moons, sabbaths. No doubt what so ever these 2 scriptures are speaking of the same thing. Do you think Ezek 45 is saying what you say Col.2:16 is saying?
 

gb9

Senior Member
Jan 18, 2011
12,320
6,690
113
hope all you Shabbat lovers have fun pretending to be jewish, since those were the only people commanded to keep it.

Sabbath keeping, not required for gentile Christ followers.

but, carry on Judeaizers. keep living in fantasy land.
 
Oct 24, 2019
302
28
28
EZEKIEL 45 [17] And it shall be the prince's part to give burnt offerings, and MEAT offerings, and DRINK offerings, in the FEASTS, and in the NEW MOONS, and in the SABBATHS, in all solemnities of the house of Israel: he shall prepare the sin offering, and the meat offering, and the burnt offering, and the peace offerings, to make reconciliation for the house of Israel.

Heres a scripture, same exact order as Col.2{16}, meat, drink, holy days (feast days), new moons, sabbaths. No doubt what so ever these 2 scriptures are speaking of the same thing. Do you think Ezek 45 is saying what you say Col.2:16 is saying?
That is because under the millennial rulership of the Messiah shabbath observance and feasts and also circumcision of the flesh will all be required again, for just as a higher standard of righteousness is expected from us under the new covenant of the Messiah than in the old covenant of Moses, so in likewise manner a higher standard of righteousness will be expected from those under the millennial covenant than in our current covenant with the Messiah, which is foreshadowed by the second generation circumcising their flesh when they entered the promised land, for they were not circumcised in the flesh, for they were under the covenant of Moses whose sign was resting on the weekly Shabbath and not under the Abrahamic covenant whose sign was the circumcision of the flesh,

At that time Yehovah said to Joshua, “Make flint knives and circumcise the sons of Israel a second time.”
So Joshua made flint knives and circumcised the sons of Israel at Gibeath-haaraloth. And this is the reason why Joshua circumcised them: all the males of the people who came out of Egypt, all the men of war, had died in the wilderness on the way after they had come out of Egypt. Though all the people who came out had been circumcised, yet all the people who were born on the way in the wilderness after they had come out of Egypt had not been circumcised.
Joshua 5:2-5
 

Wall

Senior Member
Mar 13, 2013
1,417
154
63
That is because under the millennial rulership of the Messiah shabbath observance and feasts and also circumcision of the flesh will all be required again,...........
I dont believe you answered my question

EZEKIEL 45 [17] And it shall be the prince's part to give burnt offerings, and MEAT offerings, and DRINK offerings, in the FEASTS, and in the NEW MOONS, and in the SABBATHS, in all solemnities of the house of Israel: he shall prepare the sin offering, and the meat offering, and the burnt offering, and the peace offerings, to make reconciliation for the house of Israel.

Heres a scripture, same exact order as Col.2{16}, meat, drink, holy days (feast days), new moons, sabbaths. No doubt what so ever these 2 scriptures are speaking of the same thing. Do you think Ezek 45 is saying what you say Col.2:16 is saying?
 

Wall

Senior Member
Mar 13, 2013
1,417
154
63
That is because under the millennial rulership of the Messiah shabbath observance and feasts and also circumcision of the flesh will all be required again.......
HEBREWS 13 [8] Jesus Christ the same yesterday, and to day, and for ever.

Does this new testament scripture really mean what it says?

PROVERBS 24 [19] Fret not thyself because of evil men, neither be thou envious at the wicked;[20] For there shall be no reward to the evil man; THE CANDLE OF THE WICKED SHALL BE PUT OUT.[21] My son, fear thou the LORD and the king: and MEDDLE NOT WITH THEM THAT ARE GIVEN TO CHANGE:[22] For their calamity shall rise suddenly; and who knoweth the ruin of them both?

PSALM 89 [30] IF HIS CHILDREN FORSAKE MY LAW, and walk not in my judgments; [31] If they break my statutes, AND KEEP NOT MY COMMANDMENTS; [32] Then will I visit their transgression with the rod, and their iniquity with stripes. [33] Nevertheless my lovingkindness will I not utterly take from him, nor suffer my faithfulness to fail. [34] MY COVENANT WILL I NOT BREAK, NOR ALTER the thing that is gone out of my lips.

The "many" believe that Gods 4th commandment has been altered

ECCLES. 3 [14] I know that, WHATSOEVER GOD DOETH, IT SHALL BE FOR EVER: nothing can be put to it, nor any thing taken from it: and God doeth it, that men should fear before him. [15] That which hath been is now; and that which is to be hath already been; and God requireth that which is past.

MALACHI 3 [2] BUT WHO MAY ABIDE THE DAY OF HIS COMING? AND WHO SHALL STAND WHEN HE APPEARETH? for he is like a refiner's fire, and like fullers' soap:[3] And he shall sit as a refiner and purifer of silver: and he shall purify the sons of Levi, and purge them as gold and silver, that they may offer unto the LORD an offering in righteousness.[4] Then shall the offering of Judah and Jerusalem be pleasant unto the LORD, as in the days of old, and as in former years.[5] And I will come near to you to judgment; and I will be a swift witness against the sorcerers, and against the adulterers, and against false swearers, and against those that oppress the hireling in his wages, the widow, and the fatherless, and that turn aside the stranger from his right, and fear not me, saith the LORD of hosts.[6] FOR I AM THE LORD, I CHANGE NOT;

HEBREWS 13 [8] Jesus Christ the same yesterday, and to day, and for ever.

So why do many believe that their god is a wishy washy God. Changing continually.

Old testament – keep the sabbath
New testament – dont bother
1000 yr rest (in the Kingdom) – Gotta keep the sabbath again (scripture below)

ISAIAH 66 [22] For as the NEW HEAVENS AND THE NEW EARTH, which I will make, shall remain before me, saith the Lord, so shall your seed and your name remain. [23] And it shall come to pass, that from one new moon to another, and FROM ONE SABBATH TO ANOTHER, shall ALL FLESH COME TO WORSHIP BEFORE ME, saith the Lord.

So has the sabbath been changed or altered? Many make that claim. But i gotta believe that Jesus is the same yesterday, today and forever
 

Wall

Senior Member
Mar 13, 2013
1,417
154
63
hope all you Shabbat lovers have fun pretending to be jewish, since those were the only people commanded to keep it.
EPHES. 2 [11] Wherefore remember, that ye being IN TIME PAST GENTILES in the flesh, who are called Uncircumcision by that which is called the Circumcision in the flesh made by hands; [12] That at that time ye were without Christ, being aliens from the commonwealth of Israel, and STRANGERS FROM THE COVENANTS OF PROMISE, having no hope, and without God in the world: [13] BUT NOW IN CHRIST JESUS ye who sometimes were far off are made nigh by the blood of Christ. [14] For he is our peace, who hath made both one, and hath broken down the middle wall of partition between us;

It was for Israel only. Was. We were once strangers from Gods covenants of promise, having no hope. BUT NOW in Christ, should we take hold of those covenants, we have hope

ISAIAH 56 [6] Also the sons of THE STRANGER, that join themselves to the Lord, to serve him, and to love the name of the Lord, to be his servants, every one THAT KEEPETH THE SABBATH from polluting it, and TAKETH HOLD OF MY COVENANT; [7] EVEN THEM WILL I BRING TO MY HOLY MOUNTAIN, and make them joyful in my house of prayer: their burnt offerings and their sacrifices shall be accepted upon mine altar; FOR MINE HOUSE SHALL BE CALLED AN HOUSE OF PRAYER FOR ALL PEOPLE.

Even them (us gentile strangers mentioned in Ephes.2) will He bring to His holy mountain, if we should take hold of His sabbath covenant. Jesus will bring us to the 1000yr period of rest. His house will be a house of prayer for ALL people....Not just the house of Israel

ISAIAH 14 [1] For the LORD will have mercy on Jacob, and will yet CHOOSE ISRAEL, AND SET THEM IN THEIR OWN LAND: AND THE STRANGERS SHALL BE JOINED WITH THEM, and they shall cleave to the house of Jacob. [2] And the people shall take them, and bring them to their place: and the house of Israel shall possess them in the land of the LORD for servants and handmaids: and they shall take them captives, whose captives they were; and they shall rule over their oppressors. [3] And it shall come to pass in the day that the LORD shall give thee rest from thy sorrow, and from thy fear, and from the hard bondage wherein thou wast made to serve, [4] That thou shalt take up this proverb against the king of Babylon, and say, How hath the oppressor ceased! the golden city ceased! [5] The LORD hath broken the staff of the wicked, and the sceptre of the rulers. [6] He who smote the people in wrath with a continual stroke, he that ruled the nations in anger, is persecuted, and none hindereth. [7] THE WHOLE EARTH IS AT REST, AND IS QUIET: THEY BREAK FORTH INTO SINGING.
 

gb9

Senior Member
Jan 18, 2011
12,320
6,690
113
EPHES. 2 [11] Wherefore remember, that ye being IN TIME PAST GENTILES in the flesh, who are called Uncircumcision by that which is called the Circumcision in the flesh made by hands; [12] That at that time ye were without Christ, being aliens from the commonwealth of Israel, and STRANGERS FROM THE COVENANTS OF PROMISE, having no hope, and without God in the world: [13] BUT NOW IN CHRIST JESUS ye who sometimes were far off are made nigh by the blood of Christ. [14] For he is our peace, who hath made both one, and hath broken down the middle wall of partition between us;

It was for Israel only. Was. We were once strangers from Gods covenants of promise, having no hope. BUT NOW in Christ, should we take hold of those covenants, we have hope

ISAIAH 56 [6] Also the sons of THE STRANGER, that join themselves to the Lord, to serve him, and to love the name of the Lord, to be his servants, every one THAT KEEPETH THE SABBATH from polluting it, and TAKETH HOLD OF MY COVENANT; [7] EVEN THEM WILL I BRING TO MY HOLY MOUNTAIN, and make them joyful in my house of prayer: their burnt offerings and their sacrifices shall be accepted upon mine altar; FOR MINE HOUSE SHALL BE CALLED AN HOUSE OF PRAYER FOR ALL PEOPLE.

Even them (us gentile strangers mentioned in Ephes.2) will He bring to His holy mountain, if we should take hold of His sabbath covenant. Jesus will bring us to the 1000yr period of rest. His house will be a house of prayer for ALL people....Not just the house of Israel

ISAIAH 14 [1] For the LORD will have mercy on Jacob, and will yet CHOOSE ISRAEL, AND SET THEM IN THEIR OWN LAND: AND THE STRANGERS SHALL BE JOINED WITH THEM, and they shall cleave to the house of Jacob. [2] And the people shall take them, and bring them to their place: and the house of Israel shall possess them in the land of the LORD for servants and handmaids: and they shall take them captives, whose captives they were; and they shall rule over their oppressors. [3] And it shall come to pass in the day that the LORD shall give thee rest from thy sorrow, and from thy fear, and from the hard bondage wherein thou wast made to serve, [4] That thou shalt take up this proverb against the king of Babylon, and say, How hath the oppressor ceased! the golden city ceased! [5] The LORD hath broken the staff of the wicked, and the sceptre of the rulers. [6] He who smote the people in wrath with a continual stroke, he that ruled the nations in anger, is persecuted, and none hindereth. [7] THE WHOLE EARTH IS AT REST, AND IS QUIET: THEY BREAK FORTH INTO SINGING.
and who was the Covenant that Isaiah spoke of made with?

according to Leviticus 26, it was made with " the fathers of those who came out of Egypt"

so, unless you can trace your ancestry back to those who crossed the red sea, then that Covenant ( containing the Law and Sabbath) was not made with you.
 
Oct 24, 2019
302
28
28
I dont believe you answered my question

EZEKIEL 45 [17] And it shall be the prince's part to give burnt offerings, and MEAT offerings, and DRINK offerings, in the FEASTS, and in the NEW MOONS, and in the SABBATHS, in all solemnities of the house of Israel: he shall prepare the sin offering, and the meat offering, and the burnt offering, and the peace offerings, to make reconciliation for the house of Israel.

Heres a scripture, same exact order as Col.2{16}, meat, drink, holy days (feast days), new moons, sabbaths. No doubt what so ever these 2 scriptures are speaking of the same thing. Do you think Ezek 45 is saying what you say Col.2:16 is saying?
Indeed they are related, but under the new covenant matters of food, drink, feasts, new moons, and shabbaths are not required to be observed. In the millennial covenant, they will be required to be observed again.
 

Wall

Senior Member
Mar 13, 2013
1,417
154
63
and who was the Covenant that Isaiah spoke of made with?

according to Leviticus 26, it was made with " the fathers of those who came out of Egypt"

so, unless you can trace your ancestry back to those who crossed the red sea, then that Covenant ( containing the Law and Sabbath) was not made with you.
Could you word this a little better sose i can understand what you are saying? Thanks