Did Jesus fail????

[Stunnedbygrace]

All can see in post #121 I did not misquote Joseph Prince, even by Willie's book---->>>>

Here is the quote Willie provided of JP--->>>>

And here the same quote in the OP that I posted--->>>

Word for word people, don't believe all the lies of these deceivers, but prove all things.

I agree that this is an unfortunate sentence. I've let rip with quite a few of my own. I don't wish to skewer anyone for an unfortunate sentence. I would have to do so to myself too if I was fair.

 

[Adstar]

Well JP followers might twist this to say we are set free from the law, but clearly Jesus is talking about being set free from sin----->>>>>
John 8:31-36

[SUP]31 [/SUP]Then said Jesus to those Jews which believed on him, If ye continue in my word, then are ye my disciples indeed;
[SUP]32 [/SUP]And ye shall know the truth, and the truth shall make you free.
[SUP]33 [/SUP]They answered him, We be Abraham's seed, and were never in bondage to any man: how sayest thou, Ye shall be made free?

[SUP]34 [/SUP]Jesus answered them, Verily, verily, I say unto you, Whosoever committeth sin is the servant of sin.

[SUP]35 [/SUP]And the servant abideth not in the house for ever: but the Son abideth ever.

[SUP]36 [/SUP]If the Son therefore shall make you free, ye shall be free indeed.

Clearly Jesus is talking about those who are in bondage to sin being servants of sin, and He being able to set them free from this bondage of sin and sinning, that is those who actually believe and abide in His words.

Even if you are correct in the free from Sin interpretation you are again adding to the word of God because your adding the word Now to it..

[SUP]""36 [/SUP]If the Son therefore shall make you free (of sin) (Now), ye shall be free indeed""

Where does it say in the scriptures that at the moment one accepts Jesus as LORD and Savior that they are instantly transformed into sinless beings because of the indwelling of the Holy Spirit ? But the scriptures do say that when we shall be resurrected from the dead on the day of judgement we shall be transformed in such a way..

 

[Willie-T]

I agree that this is an unfortunate sentence. I've let rip with quite a few of my own. I don't wish to skewer anyone for an unfortunate sentence. I would have to do so to myself too if I was fair.

It is NOT "an unfortunate sentence". Because he did not just simply write that one, single, solitary sentence. That sentence or two was dishonestly extracted from a full paragraph, which was part of an even larger section. The absolutely dishonest thing that ISIT posted by this author was pulled out of the WHOLE text I have repeatedly asked people, in all fairness, to go and read.

 

[Willie-T]

All can see in post #121 I did not misquote Joseph Prince, even by Willie's book---->>>>

Here is the quote Willie provided of JP--->>>>

And here the same quote in the OP that I posted--->>>

Word for word people, don't believe all the lies of these deceivers, but prove all things.

Ya know, God will one day ask you why you did this. I hope he will buy your excuse.

 

[reneweddaybyday]

Ya know, God will one day ask you why you did this. I hope he will buy your excuse.

Sometimes we are faced with what is called "plausible deniability".

Plausible deniability refers to circumstances where a denial of responsibilty or knowledge of wrongdoing can not be proved as true or untrue due to a lack of evidence proving the allegation.

God's Word is a discerner of the thoughts and intents of our hearts. So, while ISIT has plausible deniability in this thread / forum, the Word of God has already discerned his thoughts and intents of his heart.

 

[Stunnedbygrace]

It is NOT "an unfortunate sentence". Because he did not just simply write that one, single, solitary sentence. That sentence or two was dishonestly extracted from a full paragraph, which was part of an even larger section. The absolutely dishonest thing that ISIT posted by this author was pulled out of the WHOLE text I have repeatedly asked people, in all fairness, to go and read.

Okay, we disagree. I think it was an unfortunate sentence. Believe me, I fully understood his intent when I read the surrounding sentences. His topic right there was what imputed means. And he was correct - I don't think anyone can disagree that our sin not being imputed to us does not mean we will never sin again. It simply means sin won't be counted against us.

But the sentence is unfortunate to me because he was saying that if Jesus died so that I could stop sinning and stop having wrong and unrenewed and sinful thoughts, then Jesus failed. The assumption is that he meant, since all have sinful thoughts, if Jesus died so we would be holy in thought and deed, then He failed. It becomes an unfortunate sentence when you play it out to the checkmate.

If you want to be succinct, you could say Jesus came and died for one purpose and one purpose only - so that we would not die for our sin. But that isn't complete. You have to play it out the rest of the way. His purpose for doing that was SO THAT...what?

 

[Stunnedbygrace]

And, in case you didn't catch my earlier post, Willie, I do not like what ISIT did in his op any more than you do. He didn't read the mans book. He read a quote that someone else printed FROM that book and let that man make up his mind for him by what he had to say about it. And in doing so, he did not convey Princes intent. He was talking about what imputed means.

But I still think it is an unfortunate sentence.

 

[InSpiritInTruth]

We still sin In our mortal bodies but It Is our spirit that GOD Is looking at.

But If GOD has made us perfect In our spirit,then be conscious of your right standing before GOD and not be too focus on sin consciousness.

More "hyper grace" brainwashing mumbo jumbo which I have heard all before, that teaches it's followers a "disassociated identity" saying what I do in my body (such as constant sin) does not touch my perfect spirit (which God only looks at.) You guys are under a strong delusion.

 

[InSpiritInTruth]

Even if you are correct in the free from Sin interpretation you are again adding to the word of God because your adding the word Now to it..

Where does it say in the scriptures that at the moment one accepts Jesus as LORD and Savior that they are instantly transformed into sinless beings because of the indwelling of the Holy Spirit ?

I added nothing to those verses, but showed the context of Jesus words concerning being set free from sin, but it goes against your belief so you try to misrepresent both my words and Jesus' words. And here is more proof you are wrong in the above statement by the words of God....

1 John 3:9
Whosoever is born of God doth not commit sin; for his seed remaineth in him: and he cannot sin, because he is born of God.


1 John 5:18

We know that whosoever is born of God sinneth not; but he that is begotten of God keepeth himself, and that wicked one toucheth him not.

 

[InSpiritInTruth]

Ya know, God will one day ask you why you did this. I hope he will buy your excuse.

God knows why I did this, because I am zealous for protecting his flock and His Word from being twisted, misrepresented and distorted beyond recognition by many false teachers and deceivers like Joseph Prince.

 

[Stephen63]

I printed it all out, right here, for any of us to read, and showed the shameful trickery that was being attempted.

Ok, apparently I missed it. Can U tell me what post it was?

 

[InSpiritInTruth]

God's Word is a discerner of the thoughts and intents of our hearts. So, while ISIT has plausible deniability in this thread / forum, the Word of God has already discerned his thoughts and intents of his heart.

Yes, and God has given me a mouth and wisdom, a Rod and His double edged Sword, and power over the enemy, even to tread upon a generation of serpents and scorpions who try to cast the Truth to ground and spread their deadly poison by false doctrine and lies. All these things I have received of my Father.

 

[Willie-T]

Ok, apparently I missed it. Can U tell me what post it was?

http://christianchat.com/bible-discussion-forum/142726-did-jesus-fail-4.html#post2824949

 

[FreeNChrist]

Yes, and God has given me a mouth and wisdom, a Rod and His double edged Sword, and power over the enemy, even to tread upon a generation of serpents and scorpions who try to cast the Truth to ground and spread their deadly poison by false doctrine and lies. All these things I have received of my Father.

And there is still no sin more offensive to God than the sin of pride.........

 

[InSpiritInTruth]

And, in case you didn't catch my earlier post, Willie, I do not like what ISIT did in his op any more than you do. He didn't read the mans book. He read a quote that someone else printed FROM that book and let that man make up his mind for him by what he had to say about it.

Please don't lie and speak of things you do not know. I knew Mr. Prince was a phony long ago, as I have watched him on t.v, seen his videos, read many of his words and sayings, and have heard his doctrine being repeated over and over again for years by many of his followers, even in these forums. So no, no single quote or man made up my mind. Anyone who has the Holy Spirit would never think of saying what Joseph Prince said, or even follow his false teachings. If the blind lead the blind, both shall fall into the pit.

 

[Willie-T]

I added nothing to those verses, but showed the context of Jesus words concerning being set free from sin, but it goes against your belief so you try to misrepresent both my words and Jesus' words. And here is more proof you are wrong in the above statement by the words of God....

1 John 3:9
Whosoever is born of God doth not commit sin; for his seed remaineth in him: and he cannot sin, because he is born of God.


1 John 5:18

We know that whosoever is born of God sinneth not; but he that is begotten of God keepeth himself, and that wicked one toucheth him not.

You seem to be playing into the same foolishness as the WOF people. They will do just like you, and give a verse a supposed "meaning" that was never intended. And if they are standing right in front of you with shattered bones protruding from a bloody arm, they will swear they do not have a broken arm. I guess you can't see if you refuse to look.

You have left many written evidences of your own sin right here on this forum... yet you stubbornly and blindly claim you do not sin.

 

[Stephen63]

Since 2009, I've read & posted against Word of Faith doctrine, & back then most were against it. Even today, Nobody backs Kenneth Copeland, Kenneth Hagin, Creflo Dollar, & others like them, & rightly so, because WOF is a damnable doctrine.

Now, that said, this fella Prince has been proven without a shadow of a doubt, the evidence written in his books, that he is also WOF. Why is he allowed, when others aren't? People know Joel Osteen is a fraud, & Prince's first meeting in the US was at his "church". Prince has also been a guest on heretical TBN. All of this would have been good if he denounced their heresy & proclaimed the truth, but he didn't. Instead, he's been in full agreement.

We can pull the videos of Prince on these shows. They're on the internet for all to see. What then makes him so different? I can tell you of one difference..... He preaches what they preach, & adds hypergrace.

One simply cannot bear both good & bad fruit. A little leaven leavens the whole lump.

 

[Willie-T]

Since 2009, I've read & posted against Word of Faith doctrine, & back then most were against it. Even today, Nobody backs Kenneth Copeland, Kenneth Hagin, Creflo Dollar, & others like them, & rightly so, because WOF is a damnable doctrine.

Now, that said, this fella Prince has been proven without a shadow of a doubt, the evidence written in his books, that he is also WOF. Why is he allowed, when others aren't? People know Joel Osteen is a fraud, & Prince's first meeting in the US was at his "church". Prince has also been a guest on heretical TBN. All of this would have been good if he denounced their heresy & proclaimed the truth, but he didn't. Instead, he's been in full agreement.

We can pull the videos of Prince on these shows. They're on the internet for all to see. What then makes him so different? I can tell you of one difference..... He preaches what they preach, & adds hypergrace.

One simply cannot bear both good & bad fruit. A little leaven leavens the whole lump.

You are aware, are you not, that this is precisely the same "guilt by association" the Pharisees tried to use against our Savior? Look at Jesus, He actually sits down and eats with (Joel Osteen.)" ........ AND he didn't go there to admonish them.... just to eat with them.

 

[heavenly_bound]

Yes, and God has given me a mouth and wisdom, a Rod and His double edged Sword, and power over the enemy, even to tread upon a generation of serpents and scorpions who try to cast the Truth to ground and spread their deadly poison by false doctrine and lies. All these things I have received of my Father.

my dear bro, permit me to shock you!! God has given you nothing! As long as you continue to see yourself apart of Christ, you have received nothing from the Father!!

The Father has given us all things in CHRIST and Him ALONE!
we who have this knowledge do not boast in ourselves; rather we boast in Him and our boasting is this; that we are so WEAK in Him; that His grace may super abound in us!

That's why His power( which is the gospel) is evident in our lives!! That power that shuts up the mouths of every false Christ, teacher or prophet!!!

 

[heavenly_bound]

More "hyper grace" brainwashing mumbo jumbo which I have heard all before, that teaches it's followers a "disassociated identity" saying what I do in my body (such as constant sin) does not touch my perfect spirit (which God only looks at.) You guys are under a strong delusion.

no no no! On the contrary you are the one who is deluded here,: to think that the spirit of man which is one with the Lord's can be contaminated!! wake up to the TRUTH bro!!! Wake up from your stupor and let the light shine in your heart!!
mans spirit is saved(perfect), his soul is being saved and his body shall be saved!!!!