do we or dont we follow the sabbath?

[JaumeJ]

Reviewing your recent posts I see someone who would rather cast doubts than read and find for himself what occurs in the Word. All of your intellectual and accusative questions are answered in the Word. If you have read prayed and meditated on the Word you would not be asking most of the questions, probably any of them. Also, I must warn you from the Word, do not trust in the arm of flesh, do not even trust yourself, rather trust in God only. He is the source of all that is, and this would include wisdom. It seems you are gifted with knowledge, but knowledge alone is not good. You must hone it with wisdom and wisdom must be received as a gift from the Father upon request.[QUOTE=Earlmayknowornot;953926]I will ask again, where did Abraham or Noah confirm the word. In what book did they confide. I am not belittling the bible I trust in it myself. But, where did they confirm it or did they just have faith and rely on their experience with God.[/QUOTE]

 

[haz]

Romans 6:15 KJV
(15) What then? shall we sin, because we are not under the law, but under grace? God forbid.
1 John 3:4 KJV
(4) Whosoever committeth sin transgresseth also the law: for sin is the transgression of the law.

Rom 6:16-17
Do you not know that to whom you present yourselves slaves to obey, you are that one’s slaves whom you obey, whether of sin leading to death, or of obedience leading to righteousness? But God be thanked that though you were slaves of sin, yet you obeyed from the heart that form of doctrine to which you were delivered. And having been set free from sin, you became slaves of righteousness.

How do we sin or make ourselves slaves to sin?
Gal 2:17-18
But if, while we seek to be justified by Christ, we ourselves also are found sinners, is therefore Christ the minister of sin? God forbid. For if I build again the things which I destroyed (righteousness by works of the law), I make myself a transgressor (Sinner).

As Gal 2:18 shows, following doctrines of obedience to the law for righteousness, is being a slave to "sin leading to death"


Gal 2 is like Rom 6:15, "God forbid" if, while we're under grace (and not the law), we are found sinners (under the law for righteousness).

Agreed, sin is transgression of the law, 1John 3:4.
Sin is also defined as unrighteousness, 1John 5:17.

How do we attain righteousness?

Is it by works of the law of righteousness (aka law of sin and death)?
OR
Is our faith is counted for righteousness, Rom 4:5

For Christians, our faith is counted for righteousness. Believing in Jesus is "obedience leading to righteousness". And that without the deeds of the law.
Rom 3:27-28
Where is boasting then? It is excluded. By what law? of works? Nay: but by the law of faith. Therefore we conclude that a man is justified by faith without the deeds of the law.



The sin the world is convicted of is unbelief in Jesus, John 16:9.

But those who determine righteousness by obedience to the law, they are in sin of unbelief.

do not frustrate the grace of God: for if righteousness come by the law, then Christ is dead in vain. Gal 2:21

And mixing grace with works of the law cannot work.
Rom 11:6
if by grace, then is it no more of works: otherwise grace is no more grace. But if it be of works, then it is no more grace: otherwise work is no more work.

It's grace OR works of the law. And a lukewarm mix of these 2 God does not accept either, Rev 3:16

 

[Laodicea]

Does grace give us a license to sin or does grace keep the Law?

 

[MidniteWelder]

Here it is:
Rev 3:16
So then because thou art lukewarm, and neither cold nor hot, I will spew thee out of my mouth.

Yall make me sick. Guess I should find scripture for that as well

 

[loveme1]

Why would you say that?

You believe that Keeping and teaching the commandments is a false gospel?

You say it is leading people astray.

Revelation 2

[SUP]26 [/SUP]And he that overcometh, and keepeth my works unto the end, to him will I give power over the nations:

The Messiah is not going to spew people out that do what He told them to do.

It is the Messiah that says we are to Keep and Teach the Commandments.

If you do not believe this then it is the Messiah you reject not anyone who relays the Message.

 

[MidniteWelder]

Does grace give us a license to sin or does grace keep the Law?

Shall grace abound by sin?
or rather shall grace only abound by that which we live by, the very word of God

Mat 4:4
'Man shall not live on bread alone, but on every word that comes from the mouth of God.'"

 

[loveme1]

Galatians 3

Even as Abraham believed God, and it was accounted to him for righteousness. 7Know ye therefore that they which are of faith, the same are the children of Abraham. 8And the scripture, foreseeing that God would justify the heathen through faith, preached before the gospel unto Abraham, saying, In thee shall all nations be blessed. 9So then they which be of faith are blessed with faithful Abraham.

How did God know Abraham had faith?

Was it Abraham saying yes i believe you

Or was it when Abraham did what he had been told to do?

James 2

Yea, a man may say, Thou hast faith, and I have works: shew me thy faith without thy works, and I will shew thee my faith by my works. 19Thou believest that there is one God; thou doest well: the devils also believe, and tremble. 20But wilt thou know, O vain man, that faith without works is dead? 21Was not Abraham our father justified by works, when he had offered Isaac his son upon the altar?22Seest thou how faith wrought with his works, and by works was faith made perfect? 23And the scripture was fulfilled which saith, Abraham believed God, and it was imputed unto him for righteousness: and he was called the Friend of God. 24Ye see then how that by works a man is justified, and not by faith only. 25Likewise also was not Rahab the harlot justified by works, when she had received the messengers, and had sent them out another way? 26For as the body without the spirit is dead, so faith without works is dead also

An example can be found in James 2 of how Faith is in doing.

So telling the Messiah that you can not Keep the commandments after he told you to is having no Faith.

 

[MidniteWelder]

Galatians 3



How did God know Abraham had faith?

Was it Abraham saying yes i believe you

Or was it when Abraham did what he had been told to do?

James 2



An example can be found in James 2 of how Faith is in doing.

So telling the Messiah that you can not Keep the commandments after he told you to is having no Faith.

Very nice...and after all, Jesus did tell us if we love him we will Obey his commandments
Not just say we love him and then not follow

 

[loveme1]

It is the Messiah who is telling us these things, look how he will know you Love Him.

John 14

[SUP]23 [/SUP]Jesus answered and said unto him, If a man love me, he will keep my words: and my Father will love him, and we will come unto him, and make our abode with him.
[SUP]24 [/SUP]He that loveth me not keepeth not my sayings: and the word which ye hear is not mine, but the Father's which sent me.

 

[MidniteWelder]

It is the Messiah who is telling us these things, look how he will know you Love Him.

John 14
Jesus answered and said unto him, If a man love me, he will keep my words:

Do you know why Jesus said this
-If a man love me, he will keep my words

Then in the very next verse says this
-and the word which ye hear is not mine, but the Father's which sent me.

 

[loveme1]

Do you know why Jesus said this
-If a man love me, he will keep my words

Then in the very next verse says this
-and the word which ye hear is not mine, but the Father's which sent me.

Going back to the Commandments it is written:

6And shewing mercy unto thousands of them that love me, and keep my commandments.

 

[homwardbound]

Well the Almighty said those that love Him Keep His Commandments.

That is where my heart is.

Tell me i'm mixing law and grace and i'll tell you if it weren't for Grace i would not know the Law.

Loveme1, please no offense was ever meant, that reaction is possibly of the flesh, emotions hurt. I was not digging at you. I apologize if I hurt you. I have been under the curse of the Law, not the Love, I tried very hard to obey it to the "T" and failed. It was as if I put ten apples in a tub of water and I was determined to hold all ten under water at the same time. I could get nine down feeling pretty good about myself go for the tenth and the other nine would pop back up. I kept at it until I gave up and yelled I can't do this, and that is when I heard God say THANK YOU, I said what, God said thank you again, I started listening. And heard thisis what I have been waiting for is you to give up trying to obey Law because you can't and noone can. I am the onlyone that has since Adam and Eve. Now if you will start then you will stop. I siud well I did start. God said no you have not, you have been trying to stop so you can start. I said yes. God said Howard start loving your wife and there will be no time for Adultery, start working and there willbe no time for stealing, ultimately START the NEW LIFE in ME Christ, That iswhat I (CHrist) came to do first die for you once you see this being freed then Ican give you new life once you give up your efforts and so I did and no longer mix Law and Grace now trusting at rest in him, no more stressin the way and he does it well through me

 

[loveme1]

Loveme1, please no offense was ever meant, that reaction is possibly of the flesh, emotions hurt. I was not digging at you. I apologize if I hurt you. I have been under the curse of the Law, not the Love, I tried very hard to obey it to the "T" and failed. It was as if I put ten apples in a tub of water and I was determined to hold all ten under water at the same time. I could get nine down feeling pretty good about myself go for the tenth and the other nine would pop back up. I kept at it until I gave up and yelled I can't do this, and that is when I heard God say THANK YOU, I said what, God said thank you again, I started listening. And heard thisis what I have been waiting for is you to give up trying to obey Law because you can't and noone can. I am the onlyone that has since Adam and Eve. Now if you will start then you will stop. I siud well I did start. God said no you have not, you have been trying to stop so you can start. I said yes. God said Howard start loving your wife and there will be no time for Adultery, start working and there willbe no time for stealing, ultimately START the NEW LIFE in ME Christ, That iswhat I (CHrist) came to do first die for you once you see this being freed then Ican give you new life once you give up your efforts and so I did and no longer mix Law and Grace now trusting at rest in him, no more stressin the way and he does it well through me

You are free to accuse me of all sorts and i will be content with what is in my heart is what i wanted you to know.

Please don't think i'm angry with you...

i was in my darkest hour when He came and i was set free and Love and obey my First love with joy.

May nothing or no one ever lead me to the left or to the right, but may i stay following the Good Shepherd on the path of Righteousness home to Heavenly Father.


i was cursed but through the Holy Spirit i'm free to serve and worship in Spirit and Truth.

 

[loveme1]

I assure each and all that it is the Good Shepherds Righteousness that counts.

Now to be a sheep of the Good Shepherd i must do what my Shepherd instructs then i will be lead home safely.

If you are to be part of the flock you must obey the Good Shepherd.

Otherwise you will not be guided Home to Heavenly Father.

 

[homwardbound]

Well the Almighty said those that love Him Keep His Commandments.

That is where my heart is.

Tell me i'm mixing law and grace and i'll tell you if it weren't for Grace i would not know the Law.

Romans 2:29No, a true Jew is one whose heart is right with God. And true circumcision is not merely obeying the letter of the law; rather, it is a change of heart produced by God’s Spirit. And a person with a changed heart seeks praise from God, not from people.
Romans 3:19Obviously, the law applies to those to whom it was given, for its purpose is to keep people from having excuses, and to show that the entire world is guilty before God.
Romans 3:20For no one can ever be made right with God by doing what the law commands. The law simply shows us how sinful we are.
Romans 3:21[ Christ Took Our Punishment ] But now God has shown us a way to be made right with him without keeping the requirements of the law, as was promised in the writings of Moses and the prophets long ago.
Romans 3:27Can we boast, then, that we have done anything to be accepted by God? No, because our acquittal is not based on obeying the law. It is based on faith.
Romans 3:28So we are made right with God through faith and not by obeying the law.
Romans 3:31Well then, if we emphasize faith, does this mean that we can forget about the law? Of course not! In fact, only when we have faith do we truly fulfill the law.
Romans 4:13Clearly, God’s promise to give the whole earth to Abraham and his descendants was based not on his obedience to God’s law, but on a right relationship with God that comes by faith.
Romans 4:14If God’s promise is only for those who obey the law, then faith is not necessary and the promise is pointless.
Romans 4:15For the law always brings punishment on those who try to obey it. (The only way to avoid breaking the law is to have no law to break!)
Romans 4:16So the promise is received by faith. It is given as a free gift. And we are all certain to receive it, whether or not we live according to the law of Moses, if we have faith like Abraham’s. For Abraham is the father of all who believe.

I wanted to post this because we can get wanting so much that we forget it is all about Faith that fulfill what Christ wants in us, hope I said that right

 

[MidniteWelder]

And where do we keep his word and his commandments except for written upon our heart.

So was it "Jesus the man" who saves, or his word?

Going back to the Commandments it is written:
And shewing mercy unto thousands of them that love me, and keep my commandments.

 

[loveme1]

Midnite, let Scripture answer:

John 17

17 These words spake Jesus, and lifted up his eyes to heaven, and said, Father, the hour is come; glorify thy Son, that thy Son also may glorify thee:
[SUP]2 [/SUP]As thou hast given him power over all flesh, that he should give eternal life to as many as thou hast given him.
[SUP]3 [/SUP]And this is life eternal, that they might know thee the only true God, and Jesus Christ, whom thou hast sent.
[SUP]4 [/SUP]I have glorified thee on the earth: I have finished the work which thou gavest me to do.
[SUP]5 [/SUP]And now, O Father, glorify thou me with thine own self with the glory which I had with thee before the world was.
[SUP]6 [/SUP]I have manifested thy name unto the men which thou gavest me out of the world: thine they were, and thou gavest them me; and they have kept thy word.
[SUP]7 [/SUP]Now they have known that all things whatsoever thou hast given me are of thee.
[SUP]8 [/SUP]For I have given unto them the words which thou gavest me; and they have received them, and have known surely that I came out from thee, and they have believed that thou didst send me.
[SUP]9 [/SUP]I pray for them: I pray not for the world, but for them which thou hast given me; for they are thine.
[SUP]10 [/SUP]And all mine are thine, and thine are mine; and I am glorified in them.
[SUP]11 [/SUP]And now I am no more in the world, but these are in the world, and I come to thee. Holy Father, keep through thine own name those whom thou hast given me, that they may be one, as we are.
[SUP]12 [/SUP]While I was with them in the world, I kept them in thy name: those that thou gavest me I have kept, and none of them is lost, but the son of perdition; that the scripture might be fulfilled.
[SUP]13 [/SUP]And now come I to thee; and these things I speak in the world, that they might have my joy fulfilled in themselves.
[SUP]14 [/SUP]I have given them thy word; and the world hath hated them, because they are not of the world, even as I am not of the world.
[SUP]15 [/SUP]I pray not that thou shouldest take them out of the world, but that thou shouldest keep them from the evil.
[SUP]16 [/SUP]They are not of the world, even as I am not of the world.
[SUP]17 [/SUP]Sanctify them through thy truth: thy word is truth.
[SUP]18 [/SUP]As thou hast sent me into the world, even so have I also sent them into the world.
[SUP]19 [/SUP]And for their sakes I sanctify myself, that they also might be sanctified through the truth.
[SUP]20 [/SUP]Neither pray I for these alone, but for them also which shall believe on me through their word;
[SUP]21 [/SUP]That they all may be one; as thou, Father, art in me, and I in thee, that they also may be one in us: that the world may believe that thou hast sent me.
[SUP]22 [/SUP]And the glory which thou gavest me I have given them; that they may be one, even as we are one:
[SUP]23 [/SUP]I in them, and thou in me, that they may be made perfect in one; and that the world may know that thou hast sent me, and hast loved them, as thou hast loved me.
[SUP]24 [/SUP]Father, I will that they also, whom thou hast given me, be with me where I am; that they may behold my glory, which thou hast given me: for thou lovedst me before the foundation of the world.
[SUP]25 [/SUP]O righteous Father, the world hath not known thee: but I have known thee, and these have known that thou hast sent me.
[SUP]26 [/SUP]And I have declared unto them thy name, and will declare it: that the love wherewith thou hast loved me may be in them, and I in them.

 

[loveme1]

Romans 2:29No, a true Jew is one whose heart is right with God. And true circumcision is not merely obeying the letter of the law; rather, it is a change of heart produced by God’s Spirit. And a person with a changed heart seeks praise from God, not from people.
Romans 3:19Obviously, the law applies to those to whom it was given, for its purpose is to keep people from having excuses, and to show that the entire world is guilty before God.
Romans 3:20For no one can ever be made right with God by doing what the law commands. The law simply shows us how sinful we are.
Romans 3:21[ Christ Took Our Punishment ] But now God has shown us a way to be made right with him without keeping the requirements of the law, as was promised in the writings of Moses and the prophets long ago.
Romans 3:27Can we boast, then, that we have done anything to be accepted by God? No, because our acquittal is not based on obeying the law. It is based on faith.
Romans 3:28So we are made right with God through faith and not by obeying the law.
Romans 3:31Well then, if we emphasize faith, does this mean that we can forget about the law? Of course not! In fact, only when we have faith do we truly fulfill the law.
Romans 4:13Clearly, God’s promise to give the whole earth to Abraham and his descendants was based not on his obedience to God’s law, but on a right relationship with God that comes by faith.
Romans 4:14If God’s promise is only for those who obey the law, then faith is not necessary and the promise is pointless.
Romans 4:15For the law always brings punishment on those who try to obey it. (The only way to avoid breaking the law is to have no law to break!)
Romans 4:16So the promise is received by faith. It is given as a free gift. And we are all certain to receive it, whether or not we live according to the law of Moses, if we have faith like Abraham’s. For Abraham is the father of all who believe.

I wanted to post this because we can get wanting so much that we forget it is all about Faith that fulfill what Christ wants in us, hope I said that right

i believe before this post i may of answered your concerns.

Let me share this again:

Luke 17

And the apostles said unto the Lord, Increase our faith. 6And the Lord said, If ye had faith as a grain of mustard seed, ye might say unto this sycamine tree, Be thou plucked up by the root, and be thou planted in the sea; and it should obey you.7But which of you, having a servant plowing or feeding cattle, will say unto him by and by, when he is come from the field, Go and sit down to meat? 8And will not rather say unto him, Make ready wherewith I may sup, and gird thyself, and serve me, till I have eaten and drunken; and afterward thou shalt eat and drink? 9Doth he thank that servant because he did the things that were commanded him? I trow not. 10So likewise ye, when ye shall have done all those things which are commanded you, say, We are unprofitable servants: we have done that which was our duty to do.

 

[haz]

Does grace give us a license to sin or does grace keep the Law?

If your referring to wrong physical behavior then no, grace is not a license to do wrong. And Christians will not profit by doing wrong. God disciplines us. Consider King David with his adultery/murder.

But, in regards to "sin", people "sin" when they rebel against God by seeking to establish righteousness under the law, Gal 2:18. This is unbelief in Jesus, which is the sin the world is convicted of, John 16:9. Even mixing grace with works is unbelief.

But under grace Christians have "ceased from sin" (1Pet 4:1), "cannot sin" (1John 3:9).
This is not based on our physical behavior. That will never be perfect. And that physical body is dead (by faith) anyway, Rom 8:10
Instead our sinless state is based purely upon our position in Christ. I no longer live but Christ lives in me, Gal 2:20. Christians abide in Christ and in him there is no sin, 1John 3:5,6. This is why Satan, the accuser, can no longer charge us with sin.
Rom 8:33
Who shall lay any thing to the charge of God's elect? It is God that justifieth.

If Satan, the accuser, cannot charge Christians with sin, then how could anyone do so?

 

[MidniteWelder]

Midnite, let Scripture answer:

John 17
[SUP]17 [/SUP]Sanctify them through thy truth: thy word is truth

[SUP]17 [/SUP]Sanctify them through thy truth: thy word is truth