Does anyone else perceive something radical Occurring with the Writings of Paul
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What tings are 'radical occurring' with the writing of Apostle Paul, we do not 'perceive'?
Thank you and may the Good GOD the FATHER of our LORD JESUS CHRIST bless all and you with HIS kindness and peace.
My thread, my question first, however I may say this, people are using Paul's writings for smething Paul never intended.......that should be more than sufficient. Oh, I refer to people posting. Were I referring to all who do this, it would be encyclopedic........
For this post it is referring to the use of Paul's writings to argue what is contrary to the teachings of our Master and Lord, Jesus Christ. Paul does not teach against Jesus Christ, but people are using what he has written as agains our Lord. I will not cite any examples lest a barrage of the same occur here.
What is this 'radical occurrence' of behavior in your 'writings'?
In the epistle of James 4; 1,2, the church is asked, "Why do you argue and fight?"
Apostle Paul whom you also honor as 'an instrument of CHRIST said in his, "Do not argue about words."
JESUS did not use 'harsh' or 'force' in order for people to 'believe' HIM or GOD.
It is not surprising about them, when it is written, Apostle Peter the 'Rock' himself in his second epistle 'testifies' about those who have 'twisted' the teaching of Apostle Paul (2 Peter 3; 14-18).
As the word/teaching of Apostle Peter 'exposes' the similar ones of today, his word/teaching therefore calls you to be 'wiser', and not 'carried away', but henceforth to 'move forward', as according to verse 17,18.
May GOD the FATHER of our LORD JESUS CHRIST keep you all from being tempted and protect you all from evil.
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It is not surprising about them, when it is written, Apostle Peter the 'Rock' himself in his second epistle 'testifies' about those who have 'twisted' the teaching of Apostle Paul (2 Peter 3; 14-18).
Jesus is the Rock Himself.......it was Peter's testimony of who Jesus was that He built His church on........sigh.......
(so much for not arguing words)
Jesus is the Rock Himself.......it was Peter's testimony of who Jesus was that He built His church on........sigh.......
(so much for not arguing words)
2 Peter 3:14-18
14Wherefore, beloved, seeing that ye look for such things, be diligent that ye may be found of him in peace, without spot, and blameless. 15And account that the longsuffering of our Lord is salvation; even as our beloved brother Paul also according to the wisdom given unto him hath written unto you; 16As also in all his epistles, speaking in them of these things; in which are some things hard to be understood, which they that are unlearned and unstable wrest, as they do also the other scriptures, unto their own destruction. 17Ye therefore, beloved, seeing ye know these things before, beware lest ye also, being led away with the error of the wicked, fall from your own stedfastness. 18But grow in grace, and in the knowledge of our Lord and Saviour Jesus Christ. To him be glory both now and for ever. Amen.
14Wherefore, beloved, seeing that ye look for such things, be diligent that ye may be found of him in peace, without spot, and blameless. 15And account that the longsuffering of our Lord is salvation; even as our beloved brother Paul also according to the wisdom given unto him hath written unto you; 16As also in all his epistles, speaking in them of these things; in which are some things hard to be understood, which they that are unlearned and unstable wrest, as they do also the other scriptures, unto their own destruction. 17Ye therefore, beloved, seeing ye know these things before, beware lest ye also, being led away with the error of the wicked, fall from your own stedfastness. 18But grow in grace, and in the knowledge of our Lord and Saviour Jesus Christ. To him be glory both now and for ever. Amen.
yes, Paul spoke against salvation by works, the law, self-rightiousness , and said good works are a result, not a cause of salvation. you law-lovers cannot stand that, so you try to set his teachings against that of THE LORD WHO HAND-PICKED HIM.
B
biblicaltruth15
Guest
You are right, my friend. For the same Paul said that there is one SPIRIT but with different GIFTS. The fact is, many of us Christians are going out of our divine boundaries of SPIRITUAL GIFT to teach things which might have not been assigned to our spirits and these i see as self edification, which Paul also pointed out.
Concerning Spiritual Gifts
Now about the gifts of the Spirit, brothers and sisters, I do not want you to be uninformed. 2 You know that when you were pagans, somehow or other you were influenced and led astray to mute idols. 3 Therefore I want you to know that no one who is speaking by the Spirit of God says, “Jesus be cursed,” and no one can say, “Jesus is Lord,” except by the Holy Spirit. 4 There are different kinds of gifts, but the same Spirit distributes them. 5 There are different kinds of service, but the same Lord. 6 There are different kinds of working, but in all of them and in everyone it is the same God at work. 7 Now to each one the manifestation of the Spirit is given for the common good. 8 To one there is given through the Spirit a message of wisdom, to another a message of knowledge by means of the same Spirit, 9 to another faith by the same Spirit, to another gifts of healing by that one Spirit, 10 to another miraculous powers, to another prophecy, to another distinguishing between spirits, to another speaking in different kinds of tongues,[a] and to still another the interpretation of tongues.[b] 11 All these are the work of one and the same Spirit, and he distributes them to each one, just as he determines. 12 Just as a body, though one, has many parts, but all its many parts form one body, so it is with Christ. 13 For we were all baptized by[c] one Spirit so as to form one body—whether Jews or Gentiles, slave or free—and we were all given the one Spirit to drink.14 Even so the body is not made up of one part but of many. 15 Now if the foot should say, “Because I am not a hand, I do not belong to the body,” it would not for that reason stop being part of the body. 16 And if the ear should say, “Because I am not an eye, I do not belong to the body,” it would not for that reason stop being part of the body. 17 If the whole body were an eye, where would the sense of hearing be? If the whole body were an ear, where would the sense of smell be? 18 But in fact God has placed the parts in the body, every one of them, just as he wanted them to be. 19 If they were all one part, where would the body be? 20 As it is, there are many parts, but one body. 21 The eye cannot say to the hand, “I don’t need you!” And the head cannot say to the feet, “I don’t need you!” 22 On the contrary, those parts of the body that seem to be weaker are indispensable, 23 and the parts that we think are less honorable we treat with special honor. And the parts that are unpresentable are treated with special modesty, 24 while our presentable parts need no special treatment. But God has put the body together, giving greater honor to the parts that lacked it, 25 so that there should be no division in the body, but that its parts should have equal concern for each other.26 If one part suffers, every part suffers with it; if one part is honored, every part rejoices with it. 27 Now you are the body of Christ, and each one of you is a part of it. 28 And God has placed in the church first of all apostles, second prophets, third teachers, then miracles, then gifts of healing, of helping, of guidance, and of different kinds of tongues. 29 Are all apostles? Are all prophets? Are all teachers? Do all work miracles? 30 Do all have gifts of healing? Do all speak in tongues[d]? Do all interpret? 31 Now eagerly desire the greater gift-------------1 CORINTHIANS 12:1-31
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I post a question, and now you have me on trial. I will ask again. Do you notice a radical interpretation occurring in the posting in this bible discussio? Please do not make it personal attacking my integrety. My integrety is not an issue. Post to the OP, or start a thread on whatever it is you are trying to convey. God bless you with understanding always.
Now this is novel. You get "law-lover" from my post? Apparently there is an agenda in your understanding of teh question, and not an understanding of what is being asked.
So now, from my posst here, I, who has always passed on that salvation is not by any kind of works, yet works are a product of salvation, am accused ot what now I ask? Are yo saying we not be converts to being children of obedience? If so, Paul does not teach this.
You should answer the question. If you have not perceived anything, then answering is like ansower a question without having heard it.
So now, from my posst here, I, who has always passed on that salvation is not by any kind of works, yet works are a product of salvation, am accused ot what now I ask? Are yo saying we not be converts to being children of obedience? If so, Paul does not teach this.
You should answer the question. If you have not perceived anything, then answering is like ansower a question without having heard it.
Please post a less lengthy response with the same content if possible, if not I will try to get to it. God bless you always.
The Gospel already IS radical! No one knew this more in practical terms than the apostle Paul, whose religious progress was interrupted, not to say demolished by Jesus on the road to Damascus - and things could never be the same again. Isn't that what we all want? a powerful, life-changing encounter with the Lord Jesus Christ? Surely that is what the promise is, that through laying down our own life the Lord will take it up?
Paul thought he knew how it all was, until that day he met the Lord. Paul was so convinced in his mind that he had it right, that he was willing to consent to the murder of Christians in that day. But intellectual understanding of scripture is not the same as revelation from God. Anyone can have an intellectual knowledge of the Word of God but it is revelation that turns the dead letter into the sharp sword of the Spirit. Such revelation is radical because it comes directly from God, according to the truth He has...as opposed to the partial understanding that our minds are able to grasp. When the Word literally spoke to Paul, he was slain as with that mighty sword of Truth.
John 12:24:
Verily, verily, I say unto you, Except a corn of wheat fall into the ground and die, it abideth alone: but if it die, it bringeth forth much fruit.
Radical, or what?
Paul thought he knew how it all was, until that day he met the Lord. Paul was so convinced in his mind that he had it right, that he was willing to consent to the murder of Christians in that day. But intellectual understanding of scripture is not the same as revelation from God. Anyone can have an intellectual knowledge of the Word of God but it is revelation that turns the dead letter into the sharp sword of the Spirit. Such revelation is radical because it comes directly from God, according to the truth He has...as opposed to the partial understanding that our minds are able to grasp. When the Word literally spoke to Paul, he was slain as with that mighty sword of Truth.
John 12:24:
Verily, verily, I say unto you, Except a corn of wheat fall into the ground and die, it abideth alone: but if it die, it bringeth forth much fruit.
Radical, or what?
K
KennethC
Guest
This is what people need to understand and that is Apostle Paul actually confirmed everything that the Lord said and commanded, and even preached and taught on the upholding of the 10 commandments by walking in love.
Why people have been misusing what Paul has said is because one of 3 things;
1) They are unlearned in the word and misread what is being said.............
2) Been taught by a false teacher in the word from such doctrines as the Paulinian................
3) Do not test the spirits and just believe every whim or word spoken by another person............
There also is a number 4 also and that is just also they try and say they are not taught by man's doctrines and are lead by the Holy Spirit, but when they speak and say what doctrine they believe in you can see they are by man. Such as eternal security started by Augustine in the 4th century, osas coined by Calvin in the 1500's, and so on......
Also Jesus said in John 16:12;
"I have yet many things to say unto you, but ye cannot bear them now."
The Holy Spirit through the Apostle Paul gave the rest of what the Lord was needing to tell the Apostles that they could not handle at the time He walked in His earthly ministry. This is because the Apostles were still struggling with the milk of the gospel that Jesus gave them, and Paul was charged by the Holy Spirit to give the meat.
Why people have been misusing what Paul has said is because one of 3 things;
1) They are unlearned in the word and misread what is being said.............
2) Been taught by a false teacher in the word from such doctrines as the Paulinian................
3) Do not test the spirits and just believe every whim or word spoken by another person............
There also is a number 4 also and that is just also they try and say they are not taught by man's doctrines and are lead by the Holy Spirit, but when they speak and say what doctrine they believe in you can see they are by man. Such as eternal security started by Augustine in the 4th century, osas coined by Calvin in the 1500's, and so on......
Also Jesus said in John 16:12;
"I have yet many things to say unto you, but ye cannot bear them now."
The Holy Spirit through the Apostle Paul gave the rest of what the Lord was needing to tell the Apostles that they could not handle at the time He walked in His earthly ministry. This is because the Apostles were still struggling with the milk of the gospel that Jesus gave them, and Paul was charged by the Holy Spirit to give the meat.
What's wrong with loving the law as King David did?
"Keep me as the apple of the eye, hide me under the shadow of thy wings," Psalm 17:8
"Their heart cried unto the Lord, O wall of the daughter of Zion, let tears run down like a river day and night: give thyself no rest; let not the apple of thine eye cease." Lamentations 2:18
"I hate vain thoughts: but thy law do I love." Psalms 119:113
Your comment tells me that you hate God's law. It also tells me that you wanted to start a controversy. Read what Paul wrote in my signature and know that Paul also worshiped God believing all things that were written in the law. Your response is sickening to the truth. Paul wouldn't agree with you. It's not heresy to love God's law.
"But this I confess unto thee, that after the way which they call heresy, so worship I the God of my fathers, believing all things which are written in the law and in the prophets:" Acts 24:14
V
Viligant_Warrior
Guest
In answer to your question, Jaume, yes, I see Paul misused here. I also see the writings of Peter, Jude, John, whoever penned Hebrews, and even the very words of Jesus misused here.
Unfortunately, that is nothing new. People believe men before they believe and understand the words of God through these authors and His only begotten Son. Men teach false doctrines, and then teach others how to justify false doctrines by misusing the words of men who wrote for God. Fortunately, we don't have to rely on men who teach falsely, lie, twist, and invent new doctrines.
We have the Word. We have the Holy Spirit. We have a "roadmap" of the original languages. With those, it matter not what others claim. We can see for ourselves what God has said.
Perhaps the oP is a bit ambiguous. My reference is to the radical misusage of Paul's writings. I learn from Paul like anyone ele, but I am seeing certain arguments here that are contrary to what our Lord teaches, and tehy are not from Paul, rather from his writings being misuinderstood and passed on such. The lates is that forgiving others is not always what we should do. I have seen others, ut I am asking if you who read this P have seen it also? I am not asking how radical or no Paul's writings are, though it is interesting what some are postin..........thank you ...God bless all in Jesus chist.
Paul reveals some mysteries given to him by Jesus that had not been revealed by Jesus during His earthly ministry.
People abuse Paul by ignoring those mysteries.