Does the bible teach that Jesus is God?

[Jon4TheCross]

If a person/spirit/measure of faith can comprehend no beginning or ending...then that person can comprehend the not measurable Word of God completely.

Revelation 19:12-14King James Version (KJV)

12*His eyes were as a flame of fire, and on his head were many crowns; and he had a name written, that no man knew, but he himself.

13*And he was clothed with a vesture dipped in blood: and his name is called The Word of God.

14*And the armies which were in heaven followed him upon white horses, clothed in fine linen, white and clean.

 

[prove-all]

This does not explain how John shows that Jesus is not God.
.

I never argued said Jesus was God, I believe he was (with) God.

Two beings, not one not three but two

 

[oldhermit]

I never argued said Jesus was God, I believe he was (with) God.

Two beings, not one not three but two

That is only one aspect of the Word presented in chapter one. What do you understand about the other things John tells us about Jesus in verse one?

 

[Angela53510]

"13 waiting for our blessed hope, the appearing of the glory of our great God and Saviour Jesus Christ," Titus 2:13

The word "and" is a coordinate conjunction that joins two things of equal value. This is a very profound statement that Jesus is the "God and Saviour."

Further, in John in particular, there are the many "I AM" statements by Jesus. These are Ἐγώ εἰμι or "I AM" statements which in the Septuagint, is the same phrase used in Exodus when Moses asked the name of God, often referred to as Yahweh. Therefore, John is saying Jesus is God!

"God said to Moses, “I AM who I AM." And he said, “Say this to the people of Israel, ‘I AM has sent me to you.’” Exodus 3:14

Here are the I AM statements:

John 6: 35, 48 "I AM the bread of life"

John 8: 12, 9:5 "I AM the light of the World"

John 8: 58 "Before Abraham was, I AM"

John 10:9 "I AM the door"

John 10:11 "I AM the good shepherd"

John 11:25 "I AM the resurrection and the life."

John 14:6 "I AM the way, the truth and the life."

John 15:1 "I AM the true vine"


Of course, John 1:1 also completely points to Jesus as God, especially in the Greek, but also in English translations.

 

[oldhermit]

Got to run for now. Be back later this evening.

 

[oldhermit]

I never argued said Jesus was God, I believe he was (with) God.

Two beings, not one not three but two

Before I leave here is something about John 1 I would like you to consider.

In John’s prologue, it seems that the Holy Spirit is more interested in dealing with the function of the Word than with the question of his identity. Although his identity is well established in the first two verses, it does not seem to be the primary focus. When we consider the language of this text, it is imperative that we do not allow history to define terms for us. It is not important that we understand how Plato, Philo or any other historian or philosopher of antiquity used the word Λόγος so I will not be wasting anyone’s time by offering their perspectives of the term Λόγος nor should we concern ourselves with how this word was used in the culture of the time in which John penned this gospel. It is very important, that we allow the Holy Spirit to elevate the language to explain a concept beyond what the words alone can express. This is the nature of all revelation. Remember, the Holy Spirit is the author, not John.


The Logos of John’s prologue is not just some benign abstract of ideas or reason. It is the personification of an eternal function of deity. The Logos functions as part of a linguistic triad who links the will of God to the mind of man. Since man does not have the capacity to reach beyond the boundaries of the natural world and look into the unseen dimension of God he must rely upon God to supply him with information. The Logos connects man to an unseen world that transcends the scope of human observation by functioning as the conduit for divine communication. What man will learn about God will come only through the function of the Logos. This is true not just in the incarnation of the Word. It is true in every instance in scripture where God communicates directly with man. The Logos is the avenue of communication between two parties in two dimensions. That which will be communicated is of course the will of God. The incarnation collapses the distance between the two worlds and brings man into direct contact with God in a very personal way.

 

[Elin]

The bible teaches that God is not his creation. He is the creator, and we are the created. Big distinction. Big difference. Jesus was unique. He (being eternally God) took on a human body, entered into our dimensional reality, while simultaneously maintaining his divinity. He prayed to the Father, and performed the miracles he did in the power of the Holy Spirit. The trinity in action. But we are not God, neither are angels, demons, or any other of Gods creations. There is only one God.

". . .and the Word was God. . .The Word became flesh. . .(Jn 1:1, 14)

 

[williamjordan]

Actually the Bible teaches that Jesus is the only begotten of the Father, So then Jesus was created by that Father. The Father is Spirit, His first born, the very first thing the Father created was Jesus Christ. Jesus Christ created all things that were made.

John 1:3 All things were made by Him; and without Him was not any thing made that was made.

You assert Jesus is "created" by the Father, but then you cite John 1.3, a text that actually opposes that very assertion,

"All things were made through Him, and apart from Him nothing came into being that has come into being." (John 1.3)
​

Hone in on the second part of the passage, "apart from Him nothing has come into being that has come into being.” Christ is being described as the One through whom all things which have “come into being” have their place in existence. Everything that was created; everything that had a starting point in time; everything that has come into existence… all things that “came into being” did so through, or by means of the Word. These are not words that describe a created being, these are words that describe an active, and eternal agent of creation. The Logos is not here identified as one that “came into being,” but the One through whom all things that have “come into being” have their existence. Meaning, if Jesus is created, and Jesus is the One through whom all things that have “come into being” have their existence, then Jesus created Himself.

 

[prove-all]

Before I leave here is something about John 1 I would like you to consider.

.

yes the Logos is the spokesman of God,even back in the bush,

and only Jesus came down and then returned to heaven.


God spoke and it was done by Jesus(the word)

but now refered as Father and Son

 

[oldhermit]

yes the Logos is the spokesman of God,even back in the bush,

and only Jesus came down and then returned to heaven.


God spoke and it was done by Jesus

So, tell me What do you think John is telling us about Jesus in verse one. How is he described there?

 

[prove-all]

So, tell me What do you think John is telling us about Jesus in verse one. How is he described there?

Being with God before time began, preceeds gen.

being in one accord as like me and my wife, or the current true church should be.

no start of days



gen. shows there was more than one

 

[oldhermit]

Being with God before time began, preceeds gen.

being in one accord as like me and my wife, or the current true church should be.

no start of days



gen. shows there was more than one

Let us begin in verse one and look at the grammar of this verse and see what it has to show us.

Critical Linguistic Analysis of Verse One

εν αρχη ην ο λογος και ο λογος ην προς τον θεον και θεος ην ο λογος . This is the most concise theological statement ever made and it is the way in which John arranges this given set of words in verse one that makes it so.

The use of the article in verse one.
(The following was given by a professor of New Testament Greek whose name I do not know. I have rewritten some of the arguments and added some of my own comments and observations but the basic arguments of each point are his).

NT Greek normally drops the article in a prepositional phrase so the absence of the article in a prepositional phrase is normal and doesn't mean anything. It is when we find examples such as John 1:1 were the article is included in a prepositional phrase that is unusual and should therefore grab our attention. It is the inclusion of the article that is significant. For example, the prepositional phrase "εν αρχη" (in the beginning) doesn't contain an article in the Greek, but is still properly translated "in the beginning." The prepositional phrase "προς τον θεον," (with God) however, does include the definite article (τον). Since it was proper NOT to include it, the inclusion here means something. Generally speaking, the inclusion of an article when one is not expected means you are being specific, in this case a particular individual who is God. In order to fully understand how that affects this verse, we need to go to the last clause. To understand the implications of the last clause, one needs to understand Greek syntax. Greek distinguishes the role a noun plays in a sentence by changing the case. Generally, if the noun is the subject, it is in the nominative spelling. If it is the direct object, it is in the accusative spelling. However, there is a strange class of verbs that do not take a direct object, they take a predicate. There are three verbs that do this in NT Greek. This means that you have two nouns that are in the nominative case, where one is the subject, and one is the predicate nominative. So if both are in the same case, how do you know which is the subject, and which is the predicate?

 

[prove-all]

if the spirit given as a gift is in you ,

why is jesus called the mediater between God and men instead of the spirt within us.

 

[ChristInUs]

John chapter one enough said.

 

[Jon4TheCross]

if the spirit given as a gift is in you ,

why is jesus called the mediater between God and men instead of the spirt within us.

Because He is the perfect appearance and example of what we should be as children...He interceeds for us by the fact that His flow was both water and blood...and because He made it possible for us to recieve the gift of The Holy Spirit...giving us access like Aaron and his sons...only continually and not once a year.

The Son of God is approachable for even a leper crying out...unclean! Unclean!

 

[MarcR]

The bible teaches that God is not his creation. He is the creator, and we are the created. Big distinction. Big difference. Jesus was unique. He (being eternally God) took on a human body, entered into our dimensional reality, while simultaneously maintaining his divinity. He prayed to the Father, and performed the miracles he did in the power of the Holy Spirit. The trinity in action. But we are not God, neither are angels, demons, or any other of Gods creations. There is only one God.

Jn 1:1-14
JOHN 1 In the beginning was the Word, and the Word was with God, and the Word was God.
2 The same was in the beginning with God.
3 All things were made by him; and without him was not any thing made that was made.
4 In him was life; and the life was the light of men.
5 And the light shineth in darkness; and the darkness comprehended it not.
6 There was a man sent from God, whose name was John.
7 The same came for a witness, to bear witness of the Light, that all men through him might believe.
8 He was not that Light, but was sent to bear witness of that Light.
9 That was the true Light, which lighteth every man that cometh into the world.
10 He was in the world, and the world was made by him, and the world knew him not.
11 He came unto his own, and his own received him not.
12 But as many as received him, to them gave he power to become the sons of God, even to them that believe on his name:
13 Which were born, not of blood, nor of the will of the flesh, nor of the will of man, but of God.
14 And the Word was made flesh, and dwelt among us, (and we beheld his glory, the glory as of the only begotten of the Father,) full of grace and truth.
KJV


From verse 14 we see clearly that the Word is Jesus.
From verse 1 we see clearly that the Word was is and will always be God

From verse 2 we see that He was NOT created.

Ge 1:1
GENESIS 1 In the beginning God created the Heaven and the earth.
KJV
From verse 3 we see that Jesus created the heaven and the earth

Therefore Jesus is indeed God

Indeed There is only 1 God! Dt 6:4
4 Hear, O Israel: The Lord our God is one Lord:
KJV

IN Deu 6:4 the word translated as one is אֶחָֽד ,which signifies composite unity as in אֶחָֽד אֶשׁכֹּ֗ל a cluster of grapes (Nu 13:23).

The word yacheed signifies absolute unity but is NOT used.

 

[senzi]

At that time Jesus, full of joy through the Holy Spirit, said, “I praise you, Father, Lord of heaven and earth, because you have hidden these things from the wise and learned, and revealed them to little children. Yes, Father, for this is what you were pleased to do Luke10:21

 

[senzi]

Actually the Bible teaches that Jesus is the only begotten of the Father, So then Jesus was created by that Father. The Father is Spirit, His first born, the very first thing the Father created was Jesus Christ. Jesus Christ created all things that were made.

John 1:3 All things were made by Him; and without Him was not any thing made that was made.

The Father is not a THING, the Father is spirit, not made of anything at all, no physical matter. The Father made Jesus Christ, He took an essence of Himself and created Jesus Christ, physical matter. The Father then took of His essence and created the Holy Ghost. The Holy Ghost is not the first born, because the Holy Ghost was not created by the Father first, she was created second. Jesus was created first, hence the title Beloved Son. Jesus after the Father created Him and the Holy Ghost, created the entire Kingdom of Heaven, which we today call the Universe, created all things THAT WERE MADE. Jesus did not create the Father, The Father did not come out from Jesus. Jesus came out from the Father, the Father existed before anything that was made was made. The Father created Jesus, Jesus created all things that were made.



Jesus existed prior to becoming human 2000 years ago. Jesus created the Kingdom of Heaven, which existed prior to humans ever being created. Jesus had His own flesh (man looking) prior to becoming human 2000 years ago. Jesus walked in the Garden of Eden with Adam and Eve, as a MAN (non-earthly-human MAN). In the Old Testament, all the statement that said "The Lord thy God" was referring to Jesus Christ, who created them. This same Jesus Christ which was in Heaven with His Father, came down to the Earth with the Holy Ghost and created the Earth.

Genesis 1:1 In the beginning God (Jesus Christ) created the heaven (Atmosphere) and the earth. 2 And the earth was without form, and void (no solid matter, a ball of water); and darkness was upon the face of the deep. And the Spirit of God (Holy Ghost) moved upon the face of the waters. 3. .4. .5 .7..8...20. ..26 And God said, Let us (Jesus and Holy Ghost) make man in our (Jesus and Holy Ghost) image (look like man/ head, arms, legs, body, hands, feet, eyes, ears, hair, etc). .. . . . .

This same Jesus Christ, left His Father in Heaven, in spirit form, and entered into the woman Mary, and was in the fetus that Mary born and became a human baby Boy, which this Boy was called Jesus. Lived perfect, was crucified, and after that human flesh was killed, Jesus became Himself again (The way He was prior to being a human being) And that is who they saw afterwards. He is even now in the same body that He has always had, prior to the Earth ever being created.



John 10:34 Jesus answered them, Is it not written in your law, I said, Ye are gods?

Jesus plainly teaches we are gods. Is it not written we are children of God, if you are a child of God, how are you not God?
Know you not that the spirit that is within you, is immortal, it can not die, or be killed? Even satan is a fallen child of God. Jesus created Lucifer perfect in every way, immortal, can't die or be killed. That is why all spirits will either go to one of two places for all eternity, either in Heaven for all eternity or in the Lake of Fire for all eternity.
Jesus is one with the Father.
We are one with Jesus
We are one with Jesus and His Father
We and the Father are ONE
We are all ONE FAMILY, ONE GOD.
Each one of us has a spirit that has come out from the Father, we are a part of HIM, we are His offspring, we came out from Him. The spirit that is in you, is immortal and cannot die or be killed, it is not A God, it is a part of God. Jesus explained this same principle by describing us as a part of a body, that body being the Church. Some are hands, some are feet, some are eyes, some or ears, some are teachers, some are prophets, some speak with tongues, ALL are a part of the same body, the same ONE GOD.

^i^ responding to OP

Don't worry, when you are attacked, as Jesus said:

Blessed are you when people insult you, persecute you and falsely say all kinds of evil against you because of me. [SUP]12 [/SUP]Rejoice and be glad, because great is your reward in heaven, for in the same way they persecuted the prophets who were before you. Matt5:11&12

God Bless

 

[oldhermit]

if the spirit given as a gift is in you ,

why is jesus called the mediater between God and men instead of the spirt within us.

Are you asking for clarification of the roles of the members of the Triadic Unity?
Do you understand the previous post?
Do you want to continue to look at John 1 with me. If not I will not continue the material unless someone else wishes it.

 

[Richie_2uk]

". . .and the Word was God. . .The Word became flesh. . .(Jn 1:1, 14)

Yes the word became flesh when Jesus was born on earth. All relates back to Jesus. Amen!