Flesh (Old Man) VS Spirit (New Man): Difficult Scriptures explained by Pastor Ralph Arnold

[Dino246]

He was tempted, no one is denying that.

The difference between our doctrine is whether Jesus is Impeccable or peccable

I believe the former, you believe the latter

I believe your position is not solidly rooted in Scripture, diminishes the humanity of Jesus, undermines His accomplishment in conquering sin, and leaves us with neither example nor power to overcome sin in our own lives.

 

[Guojing]

I believe your position is not solidly rooted in Scripture, diminishes the humanity of Jesus, undermines His accomplishment in conquering sin, and leaves us with neither example nor power to overcome sin in our own lives.

You certainly have a right to your opinion

 

[oldethennew]

So His temptation was a sham, and the statements in Scripture that He was tempted are lies?

Interesting theory. I disagree wholeheartedly. One does not "overcome" something to which one is immune from the outset.

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Dino,
thank you so much for the correction, we appreciate it, we realized after you quoted our post that we had
'mis-typed' what we were meaning to say -
of course we KNOW what MATT. 4 and other scriptures say, and believe them!
...

just want to make this very clear; , IF we are understanding you correctly in that you are saying that
Jesus Christ could be a sinner?? (Tested & Tried) for sure, but a (Partaker)??? NEVER!!!
both of us in no way believe that God could sin or take-on a man's sin-nature...

a good way to analyze this question is, let us question ourselves, whether we think/believe
that Jesus Christ/God, could inherit His Mother Mary's sin-nature - or, did God's nature, nullify it???

 

[Dino246]

=============================================================
Dino,
thank you so much for the correction, we appreciate it, we realized after you quoted our post that we had
'mis-typed' what we were meaning to say -
of course we KNOW what MATT. 4 and other scriptures say, and believe them!
...

just want to make this very clear; , IF we are understanding you correctly in that you are saying that
Jesus Christ could be a sinner?? (Tested & Tried) for sure, but a (Partaker)??? NEVER!!!
both of us in no way believe that God could sin or take-on a man's sin-nature...

I believe we agree.

a good way to analyze this question is, let us question ourselves, whether we think/believe
that Jesus Christ/God, could inherit His Mother Mary's sin-nature - or, did God's nature, nullify it???

I don't think that Jesus did inherit the "sin nature" but to me, that is a different question than "Could Jesus have committed sin".

 

[ChosenbyHim]

Great Post.

Thank you.

 

[ChosenbyHim]

The way I understand it is that yes while we live in this fleshly vessel we are still capable of sinning however I do not believe it is because our old nature still exists in us I believe that in general the flesh is a vessel that is on this side of eternal and not in his. There is no sin in his kingdom because we are no longer of the flesh at all but on this side of eternal everything is flawed sin corruption aeverything that isn't of his kingdom resides here

Blain, Thank you for your comment and input, it is appreciated.


Well the thing to also keep in mind regarding this issue, is that we do have three enemies, the world, the flesh and the devil. And so even if our old fleshly sin nature were eradicated in this life, we would still have the world and the devil to contend with. But because our old sin nature is not eradicated in this life, it just means that we still naturally have a propensity toward sin, and toward sinning.

However the new nature heart mind and spirit we are given when we are born again resides inside us in our hearts and mind and spirit. If I may give a testimony of sorts when I was a new believer I was terrified of my sins because many on here at the time put great importance on the sinless doctrine it was one of those times when a certain topic kind of takes over the forum and I was so scared I would lose my salvation because there were certains I couldn't seem to stop doing no matter how hard I tried.

Indeed brother Blain, the New Nature resides within every born again believer and child of God. This is why we now have the capability of living holy and walking in the Spirit. If we yield to the Holy Spirit in our lives then we can live the victorious Christian life. But if we do not yield to the Spirit but yield to the flesh, then we will sin.


And the sinless perfection teaching that we can be sinlessly perfect in this life is indeed a heresy. Sinless perfection will only be attained when we receive our New Glorified body at the Rapture/Resurrection.

I had a dream one night that I was in a pitch black placed and I was being physically held down by a demon this demon wanted to rip me to shreds with it's huge sharp teeth it was so angry violent and thirsty for blood it really really hated me and it attempted to do just that when I put my hand up saying you can only do this if I have sin in my life the demon couldn't find any and it went away.

That dream you had is very interesting. Here is something to consider, Brother Blain. Regarding our Position in Christ, Our Standing, we have no sin, since all of our sin has been imputed unto Christ. However though, in our flesh, in regard to our State, we still do have sin. And of course we still do have the sin nature. Only our Standing (Position) and our New Man is completely perfect and without sin, since it is born of God (1 John 3:9) and born also of the Holy Scripture (1 Pet. 1:23). And God and His word, the Holy Scripture, do not have any sin. They are pure, perfect, holy and just and good.

I woke up wondering about this dream and thought it odd that I was found innocent in that dream especially by a demon but even to this day this topic tugs at me is our new nature and spirit the true us and not the earthly us? Why is it that there is sin in the flesh yet if we look inside our hearts we don't see any? I even look in the mirror and don't recognize my own face because I feel like the real me is not what I am here it's a little out there and confusing of course but I just like to think about stuff like this

Now concerning your question, regarding our new nature being the true us. I will say this, Blain. I believe that God only views us in regard to our New Man (New Nature). This is why all throughout the New Testament, Paul refers to every believer as a Saint. Have you ever head the big debate on whether we are Saints or Sinners saved by Grace???

Well in regard to our Old Sin Nature, Our Flesh, we are still sinners. But again, God does not view us in regard to our Old Man. God views us in regard to our Standing (New Man). And so since we are Saints, and this is how God views us, we should therefore live as Saints. In other words, our Practice Ought to Line up with our Position. Since we are Saints, we ought to walk and live as Saints and not live like Sinners.

But once again, regarding your question, Blain. Our New and True Identity in Jesus Christ is our New Man. For the Scripture saith, If any man be in Christ, he is a New Creature. Old Things are passed away, and behold, all things our become New. (2 Cor. 5:17). And so we should definitely live in accordance with our New Identity in Christ and how God sees us. We are New Creatures in Christ.


Regarding your last question, the reason why we still have Sin in our flesh, is because when we were born into this world, that was our first birth, and we were born with a Sin Nature. Hence, the first birth is a fleshly birth. And this first birth will one day die since that which is of the flesh is flesh.


But our Second Birth (New Birth) can never die. Since our New Birth doth not commit sin (see 1 John 3:9). And that which is born of the Spirit is Spirit. And our New Birth is of God and of His Holy word. I hope this post of mine helped, brother. And thanks again for your comment and questions.

 

[ChosenbyHim]

Its hard for most Christians to let go of the works based mind set . Unfortunately is ingrained in our minds before we are saved . Upon salvation, there is a realisation that they have been saved . But shortly after they get drawn back into the worlds way of' salvation' .Or worse still there not saved at all .

Indeed Throughfaith, it really is. I have seen how the works based salvation false doctrine and leaven has permeated much of the world of Christendom and many of the denominations, even the ones who profess that they believe that Salvation is by Grace through Faith.

It is sad when a Christian gets bewitched by the modern day Judaizers and those who say we must keep the Law to be saved or to stay justified.