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newton3003
Guest
Are obscene expressions immoral under God?
There was an actress named Mae West who was prominent in the early to mid-twentieth century and was known for expressions that were sexually expressive. For example, in 1937 she was in a radio skit with Don Ameche, with both portraying Adam and Eve. At one point she, as Eve of course, says, "…get me a big one... I feel like doin' a big apple!" In another radio skit the same year, she flirts with a ventriloquist’s wooden dummy, saying the dummy was “all wood and a yard long." She then says to the dummy, “I remember our last date, and have the splinters to prove it!" Because of her reputation as being risqué, religious groups wanted the skits banned from the radio because they were obscene. Presumably the perceived obscenity made the skits immoral as far as those religious groups went.
But is obscenity in that form really immoral? Does the Bible really tell us that it is immoral to make certain expressions that may be regarded as referring to immorality?
First, some definitions:
The Oxford Dictionary defines morality as “Principles concerning the distinction between right and wrong or good and bad behaviour.” It also defines obscene as “(of the portrayal or description of sexual matters) offensive or disgusting by accepted standards of morality and decency.”
Does the Bible consider obscenity to be immoral? Ephesians 5:4-5 says “Let there be no filthiness nor foolish talk nor crude joking, which are out of place…For you may be sure of this, that everyone who is sexually immoral or impure, or who is covetous (that is, an idolater), has no inheritance in the kingdom of Christ and God.” Does Ephesians 5:4-5 say that only people who are sexually immoral or impure would engage in that is referred to as “foolish talk” and “crude joking?” Does Ephesians 5:4-5 assert that foolish talk itself is immoral? If either were true, then perhaps those religious groups had a point in asserting the Mae West skits referred to above are obscene.
Ecclesiastes 10:12-13 implies that crude talk is immoral because it is a slippery slope to evil. That passage says, “The words of a wise man's mouth win him favor, but the lips of a fool consume him. The beginning of the words of his mouth is foolishness, AND THE END OF HIS TALK IS EVIL MADNESS.” But this passage implies that the slippery slope only refers to fools. Was, say, Mae West a fool per se? From what we know of her, she was a Presbyterian who was close to her family and provided for them, and her funeral was held at a Presbyterian church.
So, what if a person is not a “fool”, but uses language that fools use? Are they then immoral? I glanced at the Catechism to see what it had to say on the matter. The closest I came, is no. 1767 which says, “In themselves passions are neither good nor evil. They are morally qualified only to the extent that they effectively engage reason and will.”
If crude talk comes under passions, then no. 1767 implies that if crude talk becomes a temptation to anyone to act immorally, then the crude talk itself is immoral. But the Catechism, and the Bible, are directed at people who are God-fearing. To the extent that God-fearing people are not immoral, they could not be tempted by the crude talk. IF they would be, then perhaps their moral character needs a tune-up and they should perhaps look to passages in the Bible such as 2 Timothy 3:16-17.
To a certain extent, there is crude talk in the Bible. Consider Genesis 38:1-5 which says, “It happened at that time that Judah went down from his brothers and turned aside to a certain Adullamite, [a woman] whose name was Hirah. There Judah saw the daughter of a certain Canaanite [woman] whose name was Shua. He took her and WENT IN TO HER, and she conceived and bore a son and he called his name Er. SHE CONCEIVED AGAIN and bore a son, and she called his name Onan. YET AGAIN SHE BORE A SON, and she called his name Shelah. Judah was in Chezib when she bore him.” I guess if I wasn’t strong in faith, by the time the passage came to Chezib I would be sweating!
Is mere talk of anything that might suggest immorality immoral? Perhaps one could say that the Bible warns us that hearing such talk may lead one of weak moral stature to engage in immoral acts, which is why we must be strong in faith to avoid such temptations.
There was an actress named Mae West who was prominent in the early to mid-twentieth century and was known for expressions that were sexually expressive. For example, in 1937 she was in a radio skit with Don Ameche, with both portraying Adam and Eve. At one point she, as Eve of course, says, "…get me a big one... I feel like doin' a big apple!" In another radio skit the same year, she flirts with a ventriloquist’s wooden dummy, saying the dummy was “all wood and a yard long." She then says to the dummy, “I remember our last date, and have the splinters to prove it!" Because of her reputation as being risqué, religious groups wanted the skits banned from the radio because they were obscene. Presumably the perceived obscenity made the skits immoral as far as those religious groups went.
But is obscenity in that form really immoral? Does the Bible really tell us that it is immoral to make certain expressions that may be regarded as referring to immorality?
First, some definitions:
The Oxford Dictionary defines morality as “Principles concerning the distinction between right and wrong or good and bad behaviour.” It also defines obscene as “(of the portrayal or description of sexual matters) offensive or disgusting by accepted standards of morality and decency.”
Does the Bible consider obscenity to be immoral? Ephesians 5:4-5 says “Let there be no filthiness nor foolish talk nor crude joking, which are out of place…For you may be sure of this, that everyone who is sexually immoral or impure, or who is covetous (that is, an idolater), has no inheritance in the kingdom of Christ and God.” Does Ephesians 5:4-5 say that only people who are sexually immoral or impure would engage in that is referred to as “foolish talk” and “crude joking?” Does Ephesians 5:4-5 assert that foolish talk itself is immoral? If either were true, then perhaps those religious groups had a point in asserting the Mae West skits referred to above are obscene.
Ecclesiastes 10:12-13 implies that crude talk is immoral because it is a slippery slope to evil. That passage says, “The words of a wise man's mouth win him favor, but the lips of a fool consume him. The beginning of the words of his mouth is foolishness, AND THE END OF HIS TALK IS EVIL MADNESS.” But this passage implies that the slippery slope only refers to fools. Was, say, Mae West a fool per se? From what we know of her, she was a Presbyterian who was close to her family and provided for them, and her funeral was held at a Presbyterian church.
So, what if a person is not a “fool”, but uses language that fools use? Are they then immoral? I glanced at the Catechism to see what it had to say on the matter. The closest I came, is no. 1767 which says, “In themselves passions are neither good nor evil. They are morally qualified only to the extent that they effectively engage reason and will.”
If crude talk comes under passions, then no. 1767 implies that if crude talk becomes a temptation to anyone to act immorally, then the crude talk itself is immoral. But the Catechism, and the Bible, are directed at people who are God-fearing. To the extent that God-fearing people are not immoral, they could not be tempted by the crude talk. IF they would be, then perhaps their moral character needs a tune-up and they should perhaps look to passages in the Bible such as 2 Timothy 3:16-17.
To a certain extent, there is crude talk in the Bible. Consider Genesis 38:1-5 which says, “It happened at that time that Judah went down from his brothers and turned aside to a certain Adullamite, [a woman] whose name was Hirah. There Judah saw the daughter of a certain Canaanite [woman] whose name was Shua. He took her and WENT IN TO HER, and she conceived and bore a son and he called his name Er. SHE CONCEIVED AGAIN and bore a son, and she called his name Onan. YET AGAIN SHE BORE A SON, and she called his name Shelah. Judah was in Chezib when she bore him.” I guess if I wasn’t strong in faith, by the time the passage came to Chezib I would be sweating!
Is mere talk of anything that might suggest immorality immoral? Perhaps one could say that the Bible warns us that hearing such talk may lead one of weak moral stature to engage in immoral acts, which is why we must be strong in faith to avoid such temptations.
