Has anyone found secret messages in the bible?
- Thread starter NTNT58
- Start date
-
Christian Chat is a moderated online Christian community allowing Christians around the world to fellowship with each other in real time chat via webcam, voice, and text, with the Christian Chat app. You can also start or participate in a Bible-based discussion here in the Christian Chat Forums, where members can also share with each other their own videos, pictures, or favorite Christian music.
If you are a Christian and need encouragement and fellowship, we're here for you! If you are not a Christian but interested in knowing more about Jesus our Lord, you're also welcome! Want to know what the Bible says, and how you can apply it to your life? Join us!
To make new Christian friends now around the world, click here to join Christian Chat.
I would be interested in learning more about this. If you have any good resources on this by some chance, let me know.
I have been reading the lengthy PDF titled, “For the Love of the Bible” from WayofLife.org. He goes deep in the history on the subject of early textual critics, etcetera.
I have been reading the lengthy PDF titled, “For the Love of the Bible” from WayofLife.org. He goes deep in the history on the subject of early textual critics, etcetera.
You're attributing motive where you have provided no evidence for that motive. That wouldn't hold up in court, and it doesn't hold up in logical debate.
Actually, considering that the TR contains so many "expansions of piety", it's not surprising.
The vast majority of Christians I've encountered don't care about this issue at all.
I don't disagree, but I also don't see any problems with that approach. It's an iterative process, and as such there will be changes in the results. I'm comfortable with that because I know that the changes are minor... despite the penchant of the KJV-only crowd to make mountains out of molehills.
Actually, considering that the TR contains so many "expansions of piety", it's not surprising.
The vast majority of Christians I've encountered don't care about this issue at all.
I don't disagree, but I also don't see any problems with that approach. It's an iterative process, and as such there will be changes in the results. I'm comfortable with that because I know that the changes are minor... despite the penchant of the KJV-only crowd to make mountains out of molehills.
Okay. You are quoting the very Modern Bible I showed you before that was false. I already pointed out to you before that Philippians 2:7 in the New Living Translation Paraphrase is a false teaching. The Modern Bibles falsely teach Jesus did not have power when this contradicts Scripture in numerous places. The NLT is the result of Modern Textual Criticism.
The King James Bible correctly says,
Philippians 2:7 (KJV)
”But made himself of no reputation, and took upon him the form of a servant, and was made in the likeness of men:”
How do we know it is false?
Here is my list of Bible verses that proves that…
Jesus had power as God:
(During His Earthly Ministry):
1. Jesus said He has power to raise the dead to life just as the Father had power to raise the dead (John 5:21).
2. Hebrews 1:3 talks about how Christ held all things together by the word of His power when He purged us of our sins.
3. Jesus said, He would raise up this Temple (His body) three days later (John 2:19).
4. Jesus had the power to forgive sins and give eternal life (Mark 2:7) (Luke 7:44-50) (John 14:6).
5 Jesus had power to take away the sins of the entire world (John 1:29).
6. Jesus Christ said wherever two or three are gathered in my name, there I am among them (Matthew 18:20). This was said to the people he was around and not to just us today.
7. Jesus can make His home or abode inside of us if we keep His commandments (John 14:15). This is a part of His divine power and or abilities as God. Humans born to two parents cannot make their homes inside other people.
8. “This beginning of miracles did Jesus in Cana of Galilee, and manifested forth his glory; and his disciples believed on him.” (John 2:11). This was a direct statement. Meaning, Christ’s miracle at the wedding of Cana manifested His glory. This was his first miracle done by Jesus, and it was a part of His showing forth His deity as God. The apostle John did not say that the Lord Jesus manifested the Holy Spirit’s glory, but His own glory.
9. ”And whatsoever ye shall ask in my name, that will I do, that the Father may be glorified in the Son. If ye shall ask any thing in my name, I will do it.” (John 14:13-14). This was said by Jesus before the cross, and answering prayers is definitely a divine act of God. Please pay close attention to what Jesus said. He said, “I will do it“ in reference to answering prayer. So if a person prays for a healing in His name, he will do it. He will be the One who will heal them and do it.
10. John 5:17 (NKJV) “But Jesus answered them, “My Father has been working until now, and I have been working.” If you were to read a little before verse 17, we learn that this is in context to the Jews being upset because of Christ healing a man on the Sabbath. So Jesus is taking ownership of this healing because He said He has been working (Just as the Father). John 5:19 says, “Then answered Jesus and said unto them, Verily, verily, I say unto you, The Son can do nothing of himself, but what he seeth the Father do: for what things soever he doeth, these also doeth the Son likewise.”
Incorrrect. Hebrews 2, and Hebrews 4 are both talking about EXTERNAL temptation only and not internal temptation.
A guy could run up to you and try to sell you a hot stolen cellphone, but you suspect it is stolen and you tell him, “No thanks.” Later, you go home and tell your family that you were tempted by some guy trying to sell you a cellphone. Yet, you had no interest in the part of the temptation put forth to you.
Anyway, there is nothing on the inside of Jesus that was bad that could have ever made Him even sin. If there was, He could not be our spotless Lamb. Jesus said He is the light of the world. He could not be the Light if He had darkness within Him, like the capacity to sin.
No. If you noticed. The devil never came back to tempt Jesus. Why? Because by Jesus passing his tests, it proved He was the Son of God. The devil knowing that the Son of God cannot be tempted by sin because He is the Creator never bothered to come back to tempt Him. Jesus is GOD.
This is merely your false assumption. You assume I believe Jesus was in unbelief. Okay. Let me ask you. Can God the Father have faith? Yes, or no? If not, does that mean He has unbelief? No! Of course not. That would be silly. So your assumption is illogical. But you will be hard pressed to find anywhere in the Scriptures where Jesus was said to have faith or a belief of any kind. Try as you may, you will just not find it. Jesus obeyed the Father but He did not have faith because He is God just as God the Father is God.
There are those false assumptions. Again! Colossians 2:9! Please read this verse and believe it, my friend!
It says that the fulness of the Godhead (meaning the Trinity) was in the man Christ Jesus. Meaning, the full power of the Word who was made flesh was in the man known as Jesus. Jesus also abided in the Father and the Spirit too.
Jesus actually could live inside people even during His earthly ministry.
Jesus said He is life (John 14:6). How is that possible if He was just a man who was stripped of His power?
You want me to believe Jesus did the same thing Superman did back in Superman 2 when he gave up his powers to be with Lois Lane.
If such were the case, Superman can no longer claim the title Superman because he has no superpowers anymore. God who does not have power is not God. Think.
The King James Bible correctly says,
Philippians 2:7 (KJV)
”But made himself of no reputation, and took upon him the form of a servant, and was made in the likeness of men:”
How do we know it is false?
Here is my list of Bible verses that proves that…
Jesus had power as God:
(During His Earthly Ministry):
1. Jesus said He has power to raise the dead to life just as the Father had power to raise the dead (John 5:21).
2. Hebrews 1:3 talks about how Christ held all things together by the word of His power when He purged us of our sins.
3. Jesus said, He would raise up this Temple (His body) three days later (John 2:19).
4. Jesus had the power to forgive sins and give eternal life (Mark 2:7) (Luke 7:44-50) (John 14:6).
5 Jesus had power to take away the sins of the entire world (John 1:29).
6. Jesus Christ said wherever two or three are gathered in my name, there I am among them (Matthew 18:20). This was said to the people he was around and not to just us today.
7. Jesus can make His home or abode inside of us if we keep His commandments (John 14:15). This is a part of His divine power and or abilities as God. Humans born to two parents cannot make their homes inside other people.
8. “This beginning of miracles did Jesus in Cana of Galilee, and manifested forth his glory; and his disciples believed on him.” (John 2:11). This was a direct statement. Meaning, Christ’s miracle at the wedding of Cana manifested His glory. This was his first miracle done by Jesus, and it was a part of His showing forth His deity as God. The apostle John did not say that the Lord Jesus manifested the Holy Spirit’s glory, but His own glory.
9. ”And whatsoever ye shall ask in my name, that will I do, that the Father may be glorified in the Son. If ye shall ask any thing in my name, I will do it.” (John 14:13-14). This was said by Jesus before the cross, and answering prayers is definitely a divine act of God. Please pay close attention to what Jesus said. He said, “I will do it“ in reference to answering prayer. So if a person prays for a healing in His name, he will do it. He will be the One who will heal them and do it.
10. John 5:17 (NKJV) “But Jesus answered them, “My Father has been working until now, and I have been working.” If you were to read a little before verse 17, we learn that this is in context to the Jews being upset because of Christ healing a man on the Sabbath. So Jesus is taking ownership of this healing because He said He has been working (Just as the Father). John 5:19 says, “Then answered Jesus and said unto them, Verily, verily, I say unto you, The Son can do nothing of himself, but what he seeth the Father do: for what things soever he doeth, these also doeth the Son likewise.”
Incorrrect. Hebrews 2, and Hebrews 4 are both talking about EXTERNAL temptation only and not internal temptation.
A guy could run up to you and try to sell you a hot stolen cellphone, but you suspect it is stolen and you tell him, “No thanks.” Later, you go home and tell your family that you were tempted by some guy trying to sell you a cellphone. Yet, you had no interest in the part of the temptation put forth to you.
Anyway, there is nothing on the inside of Jesus that was bad that could have ever made Him even sin. If there was, He could not be our spotless Lamb. Jesus said He is the light of the world. He could not be the Light if He had darkness within Him, like the capacity to sin.
No. If you noticed. The devil never came back to tempt Jesus. Why? Because by Jesus passing his tests, it proved He was the Son of God. The devil knowing that the Son of God cannot be tempted by sin because He is the Creator never bothered to come back to tempt Him. Jesus is GOD.
This is merely your false assumption. You assume I believe Jesus was in unbelief. Okay. Let me ask you. Can God the Father have faith? Yes, or no? If not, does that mean He has unbelief? No! Of course not. That would be silly. So your assumption is illogical. But you will be hard pressed to find anywhere in the Scriptures where Jesus was said to have faith or a belief of any kind. Try as you may, you will just not find it. Jesus obeyed the Father but He did not have faith because He is God just as God the Father is God.
There are those false assumptions. Again! Colossians 2:9! Please read this verse and believe it, my friend!
It says that the fulness of the Godhead (meaning the Trinity) was in the man Christ Jesus. Meaning, the full power of the Word who was made flesh was in the man known as Jesus. Jesus also abided in the Father and the Spirit too.
Jesus actually could live inside people even during His earthly ministry.
Jesus said He is life (John 14:6). How is that possible if He was just a man who was stripped of His power?
You want me to believe Jesus did the same thing Superman did back in Superman 2 when he gave up his powers to be with Lois Lane.
If such were the case, Superman can no longer claim the title Superman because he has no superpowers anymore. God who does not have power is not God. Think.
-
1
- Show all
Paul said there were MANY who corrupted the Word of God during his time.
156 AD. Irenaeus (says of the gnostics): “Wherefore they and their followers have betaken themselves to mutilating the Scriptures which they themselves have shortened.”
So there is a good chance that the shorter manuscripts you favor are in fact the corrupted ones. I believe this is the case because of the other evidences involved, as well. Like I said, heretics were involved in the formation of the Modern Bible movement like Catholics, Unitarians, liberals, etcetera. Then we have actual corrupted doctrines that we can see in Modern Bibles that favor Catholicism and Unitarianism, etcetera. Then there is God’s Word which is the biggest witness of all. The Bible speaks about how God would preserve His words and how they are perfect. The Bible loosely warns of Textual Criticism, as well. It’s the Science falsely so called.
In some cases I will admit that my fellow KJB Proponents will make some weak arguments like using Luke 4:4. But that does not mean there are not better points that defend the truth of God’s Word (the KJB). Direct references of the Trinity are removed, fornication is either removed altogether or watered down. The command on how you are not to fellowship with prosperity believers in 1 Timothy 6 is removed, etcetera. Involving the change of doctrine: There are 32 really strong points that is an alteration for the worse and not for the better between the Modern Bibles and the KJB.
156 AD. Irenaeus (says of the gnostics): “Wherefore they and their followers have betaken themselves to mutilating the Scriptures which they themselves have shortened.”
So there is a good chance that the shorter manuscripts you favor are in fact the corrupted ones. I believe this is the case because of the other evidences involved, as well. Like I said, heretics were involved in the formation of the Modern Bible movement like Catholics, Unitarians, liberals, etcetera. Then we have actual corrupted doctrines that we can see in Modern Bibles that favor Catholicism and Unitarianism, etcetera. Then there is God’s Word which is the biggest witness of all. The Bible speaks about how God would preserve His words and how they are perfect. The Bible loosely warns of Textual Criticism, as well. It’s the Science falsely so called.
In some cases I will admit that my fellow KJB Proponents will make some weak arguments like using Luke 4:4. But that does not mean there are not better points that defend the truth of God’s Word (the KJB). Direct references of the Trinity are removed, fornication is either removed altogether or watered down. The command on how you are not to fellowship with prosperity believers in 1 Timothy 6 is removed, etcetera. Involving the change of doctrine: There are 32 really strong points that is an alteration for the worse and not for the better between the Modern Bibles and the KJB.
-
1
-
1
- Show all
That's false... Jesus humbled Himself under death for our salvation
You obviously misunderstand the Gospel. Claiming verses you don't agree with were not authored by the Lord is an old trick of the devil who is continually claiming what God says is not true or He meant something different as he did with Adam and Eve. It's what the devil does!
Hang in their bud... maybe someday you'll get it!
I never said He did not have access to the power of God during His earthly ministry... He ministered as a man filled with the Holy Ghost during His ministry. (But, He went to the Cross as THE Lamb of God.)
Just like WE are supposed to be doing.
John 14:10
Believest thou not that I am in the Father, and the Father in me? the words that I speak unto you I speak not of myself: but the Father that dwelleth in me, he doeth the works.
John 5:19
Then answered Jesus and said unto them, Verily, verily, I say unto you, The Son can do nothing of himself, but what he seeth the Father do: for what things soever he doeth, these also doeth the Son likewise.
Jesus specifically said He was not doing things in His Own power... the Father was working thru Him.
This is because of Philippians 2:7 which is actually true and goes along with what Jesus said.
But, He COULD have sinned... which is why the Holy Spirit led Him to the wilderness to be tempted by the devil because ... Jesus, being the second Adam (later called the last Adam) had to succeed and be victorious where Adam had failed.
Adam could have resisted satan's temptation in the garden but he instead choose to be disobedient... part of Jesus being the representative for mankind in God's plan of salvation required Jesus to be in the same position... but he had to choose to NOT sin which He obviously did because He never sinned.
He overcame sin thru the Father working thru Him in the Person of the Holy Ghost.
We too should be over comers in this life thru the Father working thru US in the Person of the Holy Ghost.
Jesus is the model we are called to follow
Romans 8:29
For whom he did foreknow, he also did predestinate to be conformed to the image of his Son, that he might be the firstborn among many brethren.
2 Corinthians 5:17
Therefore if any man be in Christ, he is a new creature: old things are passed away; behold, all things are become new.
1 John 4:17
Herein is our love made perfect, that we may have boldness in the day of judgment: because as he is, so are we in this world.
Ephesians 5:1
Be ye therefore followers of God, as dear children *In context, read Ephesians 4:24 thru Ephesians 5:14
Correct... "and was made in the likeness of men"
He lived as a man filled with the Holy Spirit... He walked in what He has made available to us to walk in... and that is the anointing of the Holy Ghost within and upon.
What part of "in the likeness of men" did you have difficulties understanding?
-
1
- Show all
Brother Cloud has quite a few good articles on the Bible version issue, including a solid defense of 1 John 5:7. Check out all his articles and papers at WayofLife.org.
As to the deficiencies of the Septuagint, Alfred Edersheim was a 19th century pastor and scholar who was well versed in Hebrew and Greek. He wrote a critique of the Septuagint in his book The Life and Times of Jesus the Messiah. This book itself is worth acquiring and reading since he has some excellent insights. You can either download it or get it from Amazon. The only problem with Edersheim is that he "bought" the theory of Westcott and Hort (which to me was quite surprising and very disappointing). So he often goes to the critical text to "fix" what is in the Received Text. That spoils his book quite a bit.
Actually a lot of good Christian conservative scholars were also taken by the nonsense of Westcott and Hort. But that was not the case with Dean John William Burgon (also 19th century). You should invest in all his books and many are also available at Amazon. The Revision Revised gives a lengthy defense of 1 Timothy 3:16 (GOD was manifest in the flesh) but also shows exactly how the critical text of W&H is corrupt. And his book The Last Twelve Verses of Mark defends those 12 verses with actual manuscript evidence.
You can also get all of Dean Burgon's books from The Bible for Today (https://www.biblefortoday.org/). They include the above as well as The Traditional Text of the Holy Gospels, Causes of Corruption of the Traditional Text, Early Church Fathers' Witness to Antiquity of Traditional Text.
The Bible for Today has a huge number of books and articles regarding the Bible version issue, corrupt modern bibles, etc.
As to the deficiencies of the Septuagint, Alfred Edersheim was a 19th century pastor and scholar who was well versed in Hebrew and Greek. He wrote a critique of the Septuagint in his book The Life and Times of Jesus the Messiah. This book itself is worth acquiring and reading since he has some excellent insights. You can either download it or get it from Amazon. The only problem with Edersheim is that he "bought" the theory of Westcott and Hort (which to me was quite surprising and very disappointing). So he often goes to the critical text to "fix" what is in the Received Text. That spoils his book quite a bit.
Actually a lot of good Christian conservative scholars were also taken by the nonsense of Westcott and Hort. But that was not the case with Dean John William Burgon (also 19th century). You should invest in all his books and many are also available at Amazon. The Revision Revised gives a lengthy defense of 1 Timothy 3:16 (GOD was manifest in the flesh) but also shows exactly how the critical text of W&H is corrupt. And his book The Last Twelve Verses of Mark defends those 12 verses with actual manuscript evidence.
You can also get all of Dean Burgon's books from The Bible for Today (https://www.biblefortoday.org/). They include the above as well as The Traditional Text of the Holy Gospels, Causes of Corruption of the Traditional Text, Early Church Fathers' Witness to Antiquity of Traditional Text.
The Bible for Today has a huge number of books and articles regarding the Bible version issue, corrupt modern bibles, etc.
-
1
- Show all
Yes, Jesus humbled Himself by being a servant and obeying the Father’s commands instead of seeking to do His own will.
Jesus perfectly obeyed the Law and died in our place upon the cross. Jesus is the Lamb of God who takes away the sin of the world. Besides those who will worship the beast in the future (Revelation 13:8) (Revelation 17:8), everyone at one point had their names in the book of life because of what Christ has done (with His death, burial, and resurrection). Meaning, if a baby dies, they are saved by the sacrifice of Jesus Christ. But if one grows up and sins again, they need to access God’s grace through faith (Romans 5:2) in order for the atonement to be reapplied again to their life.
I don’t believe so.
The gospel is this…
1 Corinthians 15:1-4
In other words, the gospel is believing that Christ died for our sins, He was buried, and risen the third day for our salvation.
This belief in the gospel is integral to our Initial Salvation, and this belief in the gospel continues throughout our whole life as a Christian. Without this gospel, nobody could be saved. Granted, there are other requirements as a part of God’s plan of salvation. The gospel also CALLS us according to 2 Thessalonians 2:14. This call of the gospel (not that it is the gospel) is…. God has chosen you to Sanctification of the Spirit and a belief of the truth (See: 2 Thessalonians 2:13). Sanctification is living a holy life by the Spirit.
I believe Philippians 2:7 in the King James Bible just fine because it is saying that Jesus did not make Himself of any reputation and took on the form of a servant and made in the likeness of men. Philippians 2:7 in the New Living Translation Paraphrase says something ENTIRELY different. The NLT talks about how He gave up His divine privileges or powers. So the NLT and the KJV are not saying the same thing!!!!! This is the point I was making before on how Modern Bibles teach false doctrines. You cannot say all Modern Bibles teach the same thing. 1 John 5:7 is MISSING in Modern Bibles!!!!! So you cannot claim they are all saying the same thing. They are not.
So what does Philippians 2:7 mean in the King James Bible?
It means Jesus was not seeking to uplift Himself as the Son of God while on Earth, but He had a mission to accomplish. It means that Jesus obeyed God the Father’s commands. Jesus spoke by commandment of the Father. Jesus obeyed the Father by going to the cross. Jesus served in love of His disciples by washing their feet. He served and loved others who were suffering. He preached the gospel and helped the poor. Jesus loved and preached against sin in how it can destroy our souls, and He told men to repent. Jesus being made in the LIKENESS of men should be read in context of Hebrews 7:26 that says, this.
Hebrews 7:26
”For such an high priest became us, who is holy, harmless, undefiled, separate from sinners, and made higher than the heavens;”
Jesus is said to be separate from sinners and that He is holy, UNDEFILED, and made HIGHER than the heavens. Jesus was harmless. Again, how can Jesus potentially sin? If that was the case, there would be darkness within Jesus. Thats not possible because He is HOLY, SEPARATE FROM SINNERS. Jesus is the perfect and spotless Lamb. You cannot have any gospel of Jesus dying in our place if He was not our spotless Lamb. Lamb’s had to be spotless.
Jesus was born of a Virgin Mary. Why? Did you ever wonder why?
Because according to Romans 5, sin entered the world through one man (Adam).
Romans 5:12 says,
”Wherefore, as by one man sin entered into the world, and death by sin; and so death passed upon all men, for that all have sinned:"
This verse above says that sin entered the world by one man.
But wait a minute. Did not Eve commit the first sin in this world back in Genesis 3?
She did, but sin did not enter this world but by one man which was Adam.
This is why the chapter talks about how the Messiah would come through the seed of the woman in Genesis 3.
Meaning, sin is passed down by the male seed. All have sinned due to Adam’s one time sin.
This is why Jesus could not have a human father.
Jesus had to be holy and separate from sinners according to Hebrews 7:26.
Well, that is if you believe Hebrews 7:26.
Anyway, Philippians 2:3-8 is about how we should be humble to obey God and consider others better than ourselves by serving them.
Jesus came to serve us by obeying in our place and dying on the cross. But this was not at the expense of His deity or the use of His divine power entirely. Yes, Jesus operated miracles by the Father and the Holy Spirit.
I can say the same for you, friend.
But you don’t believe He used that power?
I think my next post to you will be to go down the list of verses that show Jesus had and used His own power during His earthly ministry.
Yes, Jesus had the body of a man and yes, Jesus operated by the Holy Spirit. That is no more conflict that Jesus operating by the power of the Father at other times, anymore than He would operate by His own power as God.
John the baptist said, Behold the Lamb of God who takes away the sin of the world. So Jesus was called the Lamb of God before even going to the cross.
Right, I am not in disagreement with you that we are to obey God and be humble and serve others like Jesus did. We are not to boast in ourselves and live our best life now. We are to deny ourselves and pick up our cross and follow Jesus, just as Jesus denied Himself and obeyed God the Father and His commands. No doubt about it.
Right, this verse is true. Jesus operated miracles by the Father. But Jesus also operated by the Holy Spirit at times, too. So if that is the case, then Jesus could also operate by His own power, as well. Then again, I will have to show you this in my next post (seeing this post is getting really long).
Sorry, brother. Your not reading the verse correctly here. Read the latter half of John 5:19 you just quoted to me. It says what he sees the Father do, the Son does likewise. Meaning, Jesus does things that He sees His Father do. Meaning, the statement that says “the Son cando nothing of himself” is saying that Jesus is not doing something that He does not see His Father doing. If He sees His Father heal, Jesus can do likewise.
I highlighted the words in blue for you to read it more closely.
Jesus perfectly obeyed the Law and died in our place upon the cross. Jesus is the Lamb of God who takes away the sin of the world. Besides those who will worship the beast in the future (Revelation 13:8) (Revelation 17:8), everyone at one point had their names in the book of life because of what Christ has done (with His death, burial, and resurrection). Meaning, if a baby dies, they are saved by the sacrifice of Jesus Christ. But if one grows up and sins again, they need to access God’s grace through faith (Romans 5:2) in order for the atonement to be reapplied again to their life.
I don’t believe so.
The gospel is this…
1 Corinthians 15:1-4
1 "Moreover, brethren, I declare unto you the gospel which I preached unto you, which also ye have received, and wherein ye stand;
2 By which also ye are saved, if ye keep in memory what I preached unto you, unless ye have believed in vain.
3 For I delivered unto you first of all that which I also received, how that Christ died for our sins according to the scriptures;
4 And that he was buried, and that he rose again the third day according to the scriptures:”
In other words, the gospel is believing that Christ died for our sins, He was buried, and risen the third day for our salvation.
This belief in the gospel is integral to our Initial Salvation, and this belief in the gospel continues throughout our whole life as a Christian. Without this gospel, nobody could be saved. Granted, there are other requirements as a part of God’s plan of salvation. The gospel also CALLS us according to 2 Thessalonians 2:14. This call of the gospel (not that it is the gospel) is…. God has chosen you to Sanctification of the Spirit and a belief of the truth (See: 2 Thessalonians 2:13). Sanctification is living a holy life by the Spirit.
I believe Philippians 2:7 in the King James Bible just fine because it is saying that Jesus did not make Himself of any reputation and took on the form of a servant and made in the likeness of men. Philippians 2:7 in the New Living Translation Paraphrase says something ENTIRELY different. The NLT talks about how He gave up His divine privileges or powers. So the NLT and the KJV are not saying the same thing!!!!! This is the point I was making before on how Modern Bibles teach false doctrines. You cannot say all Modern Bibles teach the same thing. 1 John 5:7 is MISSING in Modern Bibles!!!!! So you cannot claim they are all saying the same thing. They are not.
So what does Philippians 2:7 mean in the King James Bible?
It means Jesus was not seeking to uplift Himself as the Son of God while on Earth, but He had a mission to accomplish. It means that Jesus obeyed God the Father’s commands. Jesus spoke by commandment of the Father. Jesus obeyed the Father by going to the cross. Jesus served in love of His disciples by washing their feet. He served and loved others who were suffering. He preached the gospel and helped the poor. Jesus loved and preached against sin in how it can destroy our souls, and He told men to repent. Jesus being made in the LIKENESS of men should be read in context of Hebrews 7:26 that says, this.
Hebrews 7:26
”For such an high priest became us, who is holy, harmless, undefiled, separate from sinners, and made higher than the heavens;”
Jesus is said to be separate from sinners and that He is holy, UNDEFILED, and made HIGHER than the heavens. Jesus was harmless. Again, how can Jesus potentially sin? If that was the case, there would be darkness within Jesus. Thats not possible because He is HOLY, SEPARATE FROM SINNERS. Jesus is the perfect and spotless Lamb. You cannot have any gospel of Jesus dying in our place if He was not our spotless Lamb. Lamb’s had to be spotless.
Jesus was born of a Virgin Mary. Why? Did you ever wonder why?
Because according to Romans 5, sin entered the world through one man (Adam).
Romans 5:12 says,
”Wherefore, as by one man sin entered into the world, and death by sin; and so death passed upon all men, for that all have sinned:"
This verse above says that sin entered the world by one man.
But wait a minute. Did not Eve commit the first sin in this world back in Genesis 3?
She did, but sin did not enter this world but by one man which was Adam.
This is why the chapter talks about how the Messiah would come through the seed of the woman in Genesis 3.
Meaning, sin is passed down by the male seed. All have sinned due to Adam’s one time sin.
This is why Jesus could not have a human father.
Jesus had to be holy and separate from sinners according to Hebrews 7:26.
Well, that is if you believe Hebrews 7:26.
Anyway, Philippians 2:3-8 is about how we should be humble to obey God and consider others better than ourselves by serving them.
Jesus came to serve us by obeying in our place and dying on the cross. But this was not at the expense of His deity or the use of His divine power entirely. Yes, Jesus operated miracles by the Father and the Holy Spirit.
I can say the same for you, friend.
But you don’t believe He used that power?
I think my next post to you will be to go down the list of verses that show Jesus had and used His own power during His earthly ministry.
Yes, Jesus had the body of a man and yes, Jesus operated by the Holy Spirit. That is no more conflict that Jesus operating by the power of the Father at other times, anymore than He would operate by His own power as God.
John the baptist said, Behold the Lamb of God who takes away the sin of the world. So Jesus was called the Lamb of God before even going to the cross.
Right, I am not in disagreement with you that we are to obey God and be humble and serve others like Jesus did. We are not to boast in ourselves and live our best life now. We are to deny ourselves and pick up our cross and follow Jesus, just as Jesus denied Himself and obeyed God the Father and His commands. No doubt about it.
Right, this verse is true. Jesus operated miracles by the Father. But Jesus also operated by the Holy Spirit at times, too. So if that is the case, then Jesus could also operate by His own power, as well. Then again, I will have to show you this in my next post (seeing this post is getting really long).
Sorry, brother. Your not reading the verse correctly here. Read the latter half of John 5:19 you just quoted to me. It says what he sees the Father do, the Son does likewise. Meaning, Jesus does things that He sees His Father do. Meaning, the statement that says “the Son cando nothing of himself” is saying that Jesus is not doing something that He does not see His Father doing. If He sees His Father heal, Jesus can do likewise.
I highlighted the words in blue for you to read it more closely.
-
1
-
1
- Show all
Thanks a bunch. I will have to check them out when I have the time.
My favorite videos defending the Comma (i.e., 1 John 5:7) are these three vids:
Discussion on Fulgentes and others in defense of the Comma. Really cool.
(Note: I am not Calvinist, even though author of the video is. The author of the video goes into talking about the Greek Grammarian brought up by Nick Sayers from one of his KJV debates involving the Comma here).
Good overall quick evidences given for the Comma.
My favorite videos defending the Comma (i.e., 1 John 5:7) are these three vids:
-
1
- Show all
When you seriously think about it , that is sad. And sadly a lot of evangelists, pastors, teachers, professors, theologians, etc. have not carefully looked into this issue either. They simply went along with the pro-modern version propaganda and the anti-KJV propaganda.
But after all if one does not have an uncorrupted Bible in his hands, he will be misled by many verses and words. However, for a Bible-believing Christian (and for Christ) every word in Scripture is a word from God and a word by God (Mt 4:4). Even whether a word is singular or plural can make a difference to doctrine: Now to Abraham and his seed were the promises made. He saith not, And to seeds, as of many; but as of one, And to thy seed, which is Christ. (Gal 3:16)
The King James Bible (among translations being used currently) adheres exclusively to the traditional Hebrew Masoretic Text and the Greek Received Text (Textus Receptus). And that is why the Trinitarian Bible Society will publish only this translation.
But after all if one does not have an uncorrupted Bible in his hands, he will be misled by many verses and words. However, for a Bible-believing Christian (and for Christ) every word in Scripture is a word from God and a word by God (Mt 4:4). Even whether a word is singular or plural can make a difference to doctrine: Now to Abraham and his seed were the promises made. He saith not, And to seeds, as of many; but as of one, And to thy seed, which is Christ. (Gal 3:16)
The King James Bible (among translations being used currently) adheres exclusively to the traditional Hebrew Masoretic Text and the Greek Received Text (Textus Receptus). And that is why the Trinitarian Bible Society will publish only this translation.
@JimmyTheLock
Okay. So you are saying Jesus had power as God, but He did not use that power.
First, the NLT does not say that. It says he gave up His divine privileges.
Meaning, the NLT is wrongfully saying that Jesus was like Superman who gave up his superpowers to be with Lois Lane.
This is incorrect and it is not what the KJV says (Which was the trusted Bible for hundreds of years long before the Modern Bibles showed up).
Second, I am not sure you understand or not, but the Modern Bibles are based on an entirely different Hebrew and Greek texts than those of the King James Bible. The texts that underly the Modern Bibles come from Westcott and Hort who were heavily into Catholic practices, and they sympathetic to Unitarianism, Evolution, and Liberalism.
Anyway, lets discuss these verses below that show how Jesus had power as God during His earthly ministry, and how He would have used such power.
Jesus had power as God:
(During His Earthly Ministry and He used that Power):
1. Jesus said He has power to raise the dead to life just as the Father had power to raise the dead (John 5:21).
Please take note that this was said just after Jesus healed the man at the pool of Bethesda. Meaning, Jesus laying claim to ownership to the miracle He just did involving the Pharisees. Yes, he did not bring him back to life physically. But he did make his legs that were dead to come back alive and He also no doubt had led this man to trust in Him (Which is spiritual life). So this is an example of Jesus acting on behalf of his own power.
2. Jesus had the power to forgive sins and give eternal life (Mark 2:7) (Luke 7:44-50) (John 14:6).
This is clearly an act of God here. Only God can truly absolve sin in regards to our salvation and give us eternal life. No man could ever do this. So clearly Jesus is exercising His divine power as God here to do so.
3 Jesus had power to take away the sins of the entire world (John 1:29).
Jesus took away the sins of the world by His death. Only God could do this. Jesus took on our sins in the Garden of Gethsemane in His body. He sweat great drops of blood in this process. No human could do this. Only God could. God is our Savior and not some mere man. Yes, Jesus had a flesh and blood body. No doubt about it. But no mere man has any power for such a task. Only God could truly have the power and strength to carry and take away our sin. In other words, man cannot resist his own sin, and yet for a man to take on the whole sins of the world? Not possible by the strength or power of some mere man alone.
4. Jesus Christ said wherever two or three are gathered in my name, there I am among them (Matthew 18:20). This was said to the people he was around and not to just us today. Meaning, Jesus can be in His spirit among other believers who went away to some other location. Remember, God is Omnipresent. Jesus can be anywhere in His spirit as He desires because He is God. No man has such a power or ability. Only God has this ability. This power must have been exercised because if believers were gathered in His name when Jesus was not around before the cross, He was there with them (just as He said).
5. Jesus can make His home or abode inside of us if we keep His commandments (John 14:15). This is a part of His divine power and or abilities as God. Humans born to two parents cannot make their homes inside other people. Jesus did not say he would only do this after His resurrection, either. He said it to those around Him and therefore Jesus would have exercised this power because some follower of His would have strived to keep His commands.
6 “This beginning of miracles did Jesus in Cana of Galilee, and manifested forth his glory; and his disciples believed on him.” (John 2:11). This was a direct statement. Meaning, Christ’s miracle at the wedding of Cana manifested His glory. This was his first miracle done by Jesus, and it was a part of His showing forth His deity as God. The apostle John did not say that the Lord Jesus manifested the Holy Spirit’s glory, but His own glory. So when Jesus turned water into wine, it was an act that manifested His own power as the Son of God.
7. ”And whatsoever ye shall ask in my name, that will I do, that the Father may be glorified in the Son. If ye shall ask any thing in my name, I will do it.” (John 14:13-14). This was said by Jesus before the cross, and answering prayers is definitely a divine act of God. Please pay close attention to what Jesus said. He said, “I will do it“ in reference to answering prayer. So if a person prays for a healing in His name, he will do it. He will be the One who will heal them and do it.
Please address each of these points. Well, I know it is a lot of verses. So take 2-3 of them at a time and please show me how you think that these are not saying Jesus was operating by His own power as God.
Okay. So you are saying Jesus had power as God, but He did not use that power.
First, the NLT does not say that. It says he gave up His divine privileges.
Meaning, the NLT is wrongfully saying that Jesus was like Superman who gave up his superpowers to be with Lois Lane.
This is incorrect and it is not what the KJV says (Which was the trusted Bible for hundreds of years long before the Modern Bibles showed up).
Second, I am not sure you understand or not, but the Modern Bibles are based on an entirely different Hebrew and Greek texts than those of the King James Bible. The texts that underly the Modern Bibles come from Westcott and Hort who were heavily into Catholic practices, and they sympathetic to Unitarianism, Evolution, and Liberalism.
Anyway, lets discuss these verses below that show how Jesus had power as God during His earthly ministry, and how He would have used such power.
Jesus had power as God:
(During His Earthly Ministry and He used that Power):
1. Jesus said He has power to raise the dead to life just as the Father had power to raise the dead (John 5:21).
Please take note that this was said just after Jesus healed the man at the pool of Bethesda. Meaning, Jesus laying claim to ownership to the miracle He just did involving the Pharisees. Yes, he did not bring him back to life physically. But he did make his legs that were dead to come back alive and He also no doubt had led this man to trust in Him (Which is spiritual life). So this is an example of Jesus acting on behalf of his own power.
2. Jesus had the power to forgive sins and give eternal life (Mark 2:7) (Luke 7:44-50) (John 14:6).
This is clearly an act of God here. Only God can truly absolve sin in regards to our salvation and give us eternal life. No man could ever do this. So clearly Jesus is exercising His divine power as God here to do so.
3 Jesus had power to take away the sins of the entire world (John 1:29).
Jesus took away the sins of the world by His death. Only God could do this. Jesus took on our sins in the Garden of Gethsemane in His body. He sweat great drops of blood in this process. No human could do this. Only God could. God is our Savior and not some mere man. Yes, Jesus had a flesh and blood body. No doubt about it. But no mere man has any power for such a task. Only God could truly have the power and strength to carry and take away our sin. In other words, man cannot resist his own sin, and yet for a man to take on the whole sins of the world? Not possible by the strength or power of some mere man alone.
4. Jesus Christ said wherever two or three are gathered in my name, there I am among them (Matthew 18:20). This was said to the people he was around and not to just us today. Meaning, Jesus can be in His spirit among other believers who went away to some other location. Remember, God is Omnipresent. Jesus can be anywhere in His spirit as He desires because He is God. No man has such a power or ability. Only God has this ability. This power must have been exercised because if believers were gathered in His name when Jesus was not around before the cross, He was there with them (just as He said).
5. Jesus can make His home or abode inside of us if we keep His commandments (John 14:15). This is a part of His divine power and or abilities as God. Humans born to two parents cannot make their homes inside other people. Jesus did not say he would only do this after His resurrection, either. He said it to those around Him and therefore Jesus would have exercised this power because some follower of His would have strived to keep His commands.
6 “This beginning of miracles did Jesus in Cana of Galilee, and manifested forth his glory; and his disciples believed on him.” (John 2:11). This was a direct statement. Meaning, Christ’s miracle at the wedding of Cana manifested His glory. This was his first miracle done by Jesus, and it was a part of His showing forth His deity as God. The apostle John did not say that the Lord Jesus manifested the Holy Spirit’s glory, but His own glory. So when Jesus turned water into wine, it was an act that manifested His own power as the Son of God.
7. ”And whatsoever ye shall ask in my name, that will I do, that the Father may be glorified in the Son. If ye shall ask any thing in my name, I will do it.” (John 14:13-14). This was said by Jesus before the cross, and answering prayers is definitely a divine act of God. Please pay close attention to what Jesus said. He said, “I will do it“ in reference to answering prayer. So if a person prays for a healing in His name, he will do it. He will be the One who will heal them and do it.
Please address each of these points. Well, I know it is a lot of verses. So take 2-3 of them at a time and please show me how you think that these are not saying Jesus was operating by His own power as God.
Last edited:
-
1
- Show all