How do you understand 1 Corrinthians 5-4,5
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Hello @Ellie12, this passage speaks of the Corinthian Church's need to finally administer church discipline (to an impenitent congregant who was guilty of committing a very serious sin in their midst). Church discipline is always meant as a blessing to/protection for the congregation, and as a means of restoring an errant believer who (because of his/her failure to fight the good fight and remain faithful, and to be penitent whenever they sinned) suffered what Paul refers to as making shipwreck of their faith .. 1 Timothy 1:18-19).
That said, I understand "hand this man over to Satan" as the Apostle's way of telling the church at Corinth to excommunicate him forthwith, and by doing so then, give him back to the world (and thereby to Satan, who is the ruler and prince of this world .. e.g. 1 John 5:19). A harsh life was certainly in store for him outside of the (spiritual) protections that the church had been affording him, of course, but that was the point in this case, to teach him not to sin (just like it was in the case of Hymenaeus and Alexander who Paul also "turned over to Satan", see 1 Timothy 1:20, because of their impenitence, which apparently involved blasphemy).
God bless you!!
~Deuteronomy
p.s. - if you do not know about this place, www.gotquestions.org is a great place to get quick/basic answers to most of your theological questions (at least as a starting point anyway). This is true in the case of 1 Corinthians 5:5. If you'd like to check out what they have to say in their short article, go here:
That said, I understand "hand this man over to Satan" as the Apostle's way of telling the church at Corinth to excommunicate him forthwith, and by doing so then, give him back to the world (and thereby to Satan, who is the ruler and prince of this world .. e.g. 1 John 5:19). A harsh life was certainly in store for him outside of the (spiritual) protections that the church had been affording him, of course, but that was the point in this case, to teach him not to sin (just like it was in the case of Hymenaeus and Alexander who Paul also "turned over to Satan", see 1 Timothy 1:20, because of their impenitence, which apparently involved blasphemy).
God bless you!!
~Deuteronomy
p.s. - if you do not know about this place, www.gotquestions.org is a great place to get quick/basic answers to most of your theological questions (at least as a starting point anyway). This is true in the case of 1 Corinthians 5:5. If you'd like to check out what they have to say in their short article, go here:
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This passage is a perfect example of setting a boundary. 'Because of your heinous sin and unrepentant response, you are no longer welcome in this fellowship. We will consider you excluded until and unless you repent. You have no part in us.'
Our congregations and families might be healthier if we applied this more consistently.
Our congregations and families might be healthier if we applied this more consistently.
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This passage is a perfect example of setting a boundary. 'Because of your heinous sin and unrepentant response, you are no longer welcome in this fellowship. We will consider you excluded until and unless you repent. You have no part in us.'
Our congregations and families might be healthier if we applied this more consistently.
Our congregations and families might be healthier if we applied this more consistently.
I would like to put forward that "excommunication" should be done as a last resort, and with much thought and prayer.
There are many "steps" that a congregation can take first.
Some things would be to start off by figuring out if the person is Saved to begin with. Expecting an un-Saved person to follow the Spirit isn't wise, indeed they are unable to be mindful of things of the Spirit/spirit.
Finding out what their thinking is about... do they realize that they're in sin?
Why are they living in the manner that might be offensive?
Can they be persuaded to reason?
Can they be corrected?
Etcetera, etc.
So, if they are Saved; they understand Scripture as the congregation does; they choose to do it their own way and are unrepentant... then excommunication might be needed...? idk
But all this takes time, prayer, plenty of love as well as direction and coordination from God.
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1Co 5:1 It is reported commonly that there is fornication among you, and such fornication as is not so much as named among the Gentiles, that one should have his father's wife.
1Co 5:2 And ye are puffed up, and have not rather mourned, that he that hath done this deed might be taken away from among you.
1Co 5:3 For I verily, as absent in body, but present in spirit, have judged already, as though I were present, concerning him that hath so done this deed,
1Co 5:4 In the name of our Lord Jesus Christ, when ye are gathered together, and my spirit, with the power of our Lord Jesus Christ,
1Co 5:5 To deliver such an one unto Satan for the destruction of the flesh, that the spirit may be saved in the day of the Lord Jesus.
This passage is dealing with a certain sin an ugly one. Kicking some one out of fellowship is a big deal . I do not believe it to control likes or dislikes among fellow believers but heavy duty sin. The person being discussed here is a creep having sex with his fathers wife. Understanding communication is a huge deal and should be done via the steps Scripture offers. Not something to be toyed with.
1Co 5:2 And ye are puffed up, and have not rather mourned, that he that hath done this deed might be taken away from among you.
1Co 5:3 For I verily, as absent in body, but present in spirit, have judged already, as though I were present, concerning him that hath so done this deed,
1Co 5:4 In the name of our Lord Jesus Christ, when ye are gathered together, and my spirit, with the power of our Lord Jesus Christ,
1Co 5:5 To deliver such an one unto Satan for the destruction of the flesh, that the spirit may be saved in the day of the Lord Jesus.
This passage is dealing with a certain sin an ugly one. Kicking some one out of fellowship is a big deal . I do not believe it to control likes or dislikes among fellow believers but heavy duty sin. The person being discussed here is a creep having sex with his fathers wife. Understanding communication is a huge deal and should be done via the steps Scripture offers. Not something to be toyed with.
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The chapter ends by saying: “Expel the wicked person from among you.”
so you have the situation paul has addressed here
“It is reported commonly that there is fornication among you, and such fornication as is not so much as named among the Gentiles, that one should have his father's wife. ( the man’s sin ) And ye are puffed up, and have not rather mourned, that he that hath done this deed might be taken away from among you. ( the churches error excusing and accepting this behavior in the body of Christ )
For I verily, as absent in body, but present in spirit, have judged already, as though I were present, concerning him that hath so done this deed, in the name of our Lord Jesus Christ, when ye are gathered together, and my spirit( my doctrine you hears and believed when I was there with you ) , with the power of our Lord Jesus Christ, to deliver such an one unto Satan for the destruction of the flesh, that the spirit may be saved in the day of the Lord Jesus.
Your glorying is not good. Know ye not that a little leaven leaveneth the whole lump? Purge out therefore the old leaven, that ye may be a new lump, as ye are unleavened. ( sin corrupts more than just the person but also those who accept and normalize it in the church )
For even Christ our passover is sacrificed for us: therefore let us keep the feast, not with old leaven, neither with the leaven of malice and wickedness; but with the unleavened bread of sincerity and truth. ( we have to change our ways now we’re in the body of Christ the temple of God )
I wrote unto you in an epistle not to company with fornicators: yet not altogether with the fornicators of this world, or with the covetous, or extortioners, or with idolaters; for then must ye needs go out of the world. But now I have written unto you not to keep company, if any man that is called a brother be a fornicator, or covetous, or an idolater, or a railer, or a drunkard, or an extortioner; with such an one no not to eat.”
1 Corinthians 5:1-11 KJV
This seems to be a settled matter but it actually isn’t when we see his second letter to them regarding this later . Two short sections particularly in his follow up letter showing us a lot about Paul’s heart and how much he cared about the people he was talking to and the grace of God that was made manifest in our lord Jesus Christ that he was witnessing
“For out of much affliction and anguish of heart I wrote unto you with many tears; not that ye should be grieved, but that ye might know the love which I have more abundantly unto you.( Corinthians was Paul’s crown and joy of his works preaching Jesus )
But if any have caused grief, he hath not grieved me, but in part: that I may not overcharge you all. Sufficient to such a man is this punishment, which was inflicted of many. So that contrariwise ye ought rather to forgive him, and comfort him, lest perhaps such a one should be swallowed up with overmuch sorrow. ( the punishment lasted a time to teach them then came grace to restore )
Wherefore I beseech you that ye would confirm your love toward him. For to this end also did I write, that I might know the proof of you, whether ye be obedient in all things. To whom ye forgive any thing, I forgive also: for if I forgave any thing, to whom I forgave it, for your sakes forgave I it in the person of Christ; lest Satan should get an advantage of us: for we are not ignorant of his devices.”
2 Corinthians 2:4-11 KJV
Then also more of the reasoning in his first letters rebuke
“For though I made you sorry with a letter, I do not repent, though I did repent: ( it grieves Paul to write the foret letter ) for I perceive that the same epistle hath made you sorry, though it were but for a season. Now I rejoice, not that ye were made sorry, but that ye sorrowed to repentance: for ye were made sorry after a godly manner, that ye might receive damage by us in nothing.
For godly sorrow worketh repentance to salvation not to be repented of: but the sorrow of the world worketh death. For behold this selfsame thing, that ye sorrowed after a godly sort, what carefulness it wrought in you, yea, what clearing of yourselves, yea, what indignation, yea, what fear, yea, what vehement desire, yea, what zeal, yea, what revenge!
In all things ye have approved yourselves to be clear in this matter. ( it’s now a settled matter )
Wherefore, though I wrote unto you, I did it not for his cause that had done the wrong, nor for his cause that suffered wrong, but that our care for you in the sight of God might appear unto you.”
2 Corinthians 7:8-12 KJV
whenever God rebukes is nd makes us aware we’re sinning even speaks harshly to us it is because he cares for us and knows where it Will lead us . It doesn’t feel good but it makes us aware d brings us the right heart that feels sorrow and regret over what we have done and causes the right heart knowing Jesus to cause us to repent and do better the next time to reconcile our wrong to overcome what we have done to prove that’s not who we really are now a
to change us from dark to light is Gods constant Will from sin to repentance and faith
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2 Corinthians 7:10
The lord only rebukes harshly those he knows and cares for
“The Lord is not slack concerning his promise, as some men count slackness; but is longsuffering to us-ward, not willing that any should perish, but that all should come to repentance.”
2 Peter 3:9 KJV
“Or despisest thou the riches of his goodness and forbearance and longsuffering; not knowing that the goodness of God leadeth thee to repentance?”
Romans 2:4 KJV
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I've administrated this twice. One never returned (she's currently "dating" a married man) and one returned in tears, broken (he and I are close friends today).
We must always remember that for this administration the object to gain is the one who has fallen away. Instead of handling the unrepentant brother in this manner, much of the church accommodates his or her sin. They've moved the standard down to such a level it is nearly non-existent.
We must always remember that for this administration the object to gain is the one who has fallen away. Instead of handling the unrepentant brother in this manner, much of the church accommodates his or her sin. They've moved the standard down to such a level it is nearly non-existent.
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“And I beheld another beast coming up out of the earth; and he had two horns like a lamb,( appearance of the church )
and he spake as a dragon.”( speaks lies)
Revelation 13:11 KJV
“I charge thee therefore before God, and the Lord Jesus Christ, who shall judge the quick and the dead at his appearing and his kingdom; preach the word; ( of the lamb not the dragon )be instant in season, out of season; reprove, rebuke, exhort with all longsuffering and doctrine.
For the time will come when they will not endure sound doctrine; but after their own lusts shall they heap to themselves teachers, having itching ears; and they shall turn away their ears from the truth, and shall be turned unto fables.”
2 Timothy 4:1-4 KJV
they will speak lies like thier father of all lies but claim to be of the lamb false doctrines and prophets create this
“Jesus answered, My kingdom is not of this world: if my kingdom were of this world, then would my servants fight, that I should not be delivered to the Jews: but now is my kingdom not from hence.
Pilate therefore said unto him, Art thou a king then? Jesus answered, Thou sayest that I am a king. To this end was I born, and for this cause came I into the world, that I should bear witness unto the truth. Every one that is of the truth heareth my voice.”
John 18:36-37 KJV
We can’t let new doctrine change what Jesus said he’s the truth and spoke e truth .Even though a group claims to be the church and body of the lamb , it’s the word that identifies the counterfeit and there is a counterfeit
and he spake as a dragon.”( speaks lies)
Revelation 13:11 KJV
“I charge thee therefore before God, and the Lord Jesus Christ, who shall judge the quick and the dead at his appearing and his kingdom; preach the word; ( of the lamb not the dragon )be instant in season, out of season; reprove, rebuke, exhort with all longsuffering and doctrine.
For the time will come when they will not endure sound doctrine; but after their own lusts shall they heap to themselves teachers, having itching ears; and they shall turn away their ears from the truth, and shall be turned unto fables.”
2 Timothy 4:1-4 KJV
they will speak lies like thier father of all lies but claim to be of the lamb false doctrines and prophets create this
“Jesus answered, My kingdom is not of this world: if my kingdom were of this world, then would my servants fight, that I should not be delivered to the Jews: but now is my kingdom not from hence.
Pilate therefore said unto him, Art thou a king then? Jesus answered, Thou sayest that I am a king. To this end was I born, and for this cause came I into the world, that I should bear witness unto the truth. Every one that is of the truth heareth my voice.”
John 18:36-37 KJV
We can’t let new doctrine change what Jesus said he’s the truth and spoke e truth .Even though a group claims to be the church and body of the lamb , it’s the word that identifies the counterfeit and there is a counterfeit
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The answer lies primarily at the end of the chapter as you must continue to read the entire text to its end, wherein it says in 1 Cor 5:13
"13But them that are without God judgeth. Therefore put away from among yourselves that wicked person."
It's the process of no longer fellowshipping with such a person.
Also, note what the text says says in verse 5
"that the spirit may be saved in the day of the Lord Jesus"
Note it says "MAY be", not will be. This infers that he won't for certain be saved, but that he hopefully may come to his senses, repent, and return to enjoy the saving grace of the Lord once again.
"13But them that are without God judgeth. Therefore put away from among yourselves that wicked person."
It's the process of no longer fellowshipping with such a person.
Also, note what the text says says in verse 5
"that the spirit may be saved in the day of the Lord Jesus"
Note it says "MAY be", not will be. This infers that he won't for certain be saved, but that he hopefully may come to his senses, repent, and return to enjoy the saving grace of the Lord once again.
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Understanding the seriousness of this Whole Chapter 5 is very important in my view -----this shows how Pride and relying on self can lead to serious problems within God's Church ------each member of the Church is responsible to keep the believing church free from any corruption that may infiltrate their domain which damages the purity of the Church ---
This member of God's church committed a serious sexual offense and the Corinthian Church was acting like it didn't matter they were unaccountable for knowing about this corruption and doing nothing about it ---this sex act was so bad that even the pagans thought this sexual act was a serious offense in their world -----
So Paul confronts the Church for ignoring this act of incest -----so Paul puts his foot down and Commands the Church to have the man removed from among them ------treat him like an unbeliever because this person feels no shame in his actions ------Paul says for them to deliver this man to Satan in hopes he comes to his senses and repents so he can be spared from God's judgment in his end -----so delivering this person over is for the sake of the sinner and also is good for the Church to get corruption out --
By keeping sin in the Church it is like allowing bad leaven in good dough ----
I wonder how many Churches today allow bad Leaven in good dough -----
Paul took a stand and called out the Corinthian Church for ignoring the contamination they were allowing to taint what is suppose to be a pure and holy church -----
I wonder today how many of God's Church allow bad leaven in good dough in their midst and ignore it ----
HELPS Word-studies
2219 zýmē – leaven (yeast); (figuratively) Leaven is generally a symbol of the spreading nature of evil
This member of God's church committed a serious sexual offense and the Corinthian Church was acting like it didn't matter they were unaccountable for knowing about this corruption and doing nothing about it ---this sex act was so bad that even the pagans thought this sexual act was a serious offense in their world -----
So Paul confronts the Church for ignoring this act of incest -----so Paul puts his foot down and Commands the Church to have the man removed from among them ------treat him like an unbeliever because this person feels no shame in his actions ------Paul says for them to deliver this man to Satan in hopes he comes to his senses and repents so he can be spared from God's judgment in his end -----so delivering this person over is for the sake of the sinner and also is good for the Church to get corruption out --
By keeping sin in the Church it is like allowing bad leaven in good dough ----
I wonder how many Churches today allow bad Leaven in good dough -----
Paul took a stand and called out the Corinthian Church for ignoring the contamination they were allowing to taint what is suppose to be a pure and holy church -----
I wonder today how many of God's Church allow bad leaven in good dough in their midst and ignore it ----
HELPS Word-studies
2219 zýmē – leaven (yeast); (figuratively) Leaven is generally a symbol of the spreading nature of evil
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Understanding the seriousness of this Whole Chapter 5 is very important in my view -----this shows how Pride and relying on self can lead to serious problems within God's Church ------each member of the Church is responsible to keep the believing church free from any corruption that may infiltrate their domain which damages the purity of the Church ---
This member of God's church committed a serious sexual offense and the Corinthian Church was acting like it didn't matter they were unaccountable for knowing about this corruption and doing nothing about it ---this sex act was so bad that even the pagans thought this sexual act was a serious offense in their world -----
So Paul confronts the Church for ignoring this act of incest -----so Paul puts his foot down and Commands the Church to have the man removed from among them ------treat him like an unbeliever because this person feels no shame in his actions ------Paul says for them to deliver this man to Satan in hopes he comes to his senses and repents so he can be spared from God's judgment in his end -----so delivering this person over is for the sake of the sinner and also is good for the Church to get corruption out --
By keeping sin in the Church it is like allowing bad leaven in good dough ----
I wonder how many Churches today allow bad Leaven in good dough -----
Paul took a stand and called out the Corinthian Church for ignoring the contamination they were allowing to taint what is suppose to be a pure and holy church -----
I wonder today how many of God's Church allow bad leaven in good dough in their midst and ignore it ----
HELPS Word-studies
2219 zýmē – leaven (yeast); (figuratively) Leaven is generally a symbol of the spreading nature of evil
This member of God's church committed a serious sexual offense and the Corinthian Church was acting like it didn't matter they were unaccountable for knowing about this corruption and doing nothing about it ---this sex act was so bad that even the pagans thought this sexual act was a serious offense in their world -----
So Paul confronts the Church for ignoring this act of incest -----so Paul puts his foot down and Commands the Church to have the man removed from among them ------treat him like an unbeliever because this person feels no shame in his actions ------Paul says for them to deliver this man to Satan in hopes he comes to his senses and repents so he can be spared from God's judgment in his end -----so delivering this person over is for the sake of the sinner and also is good for the Church to get corruption out --
By keeping sin in the Church it is like allowing bad leaven in good dough ----
I wonder how many Churches today allow bad Leaven in good dough -----
Paul took a stand and called out the Corinthian Church for ignoring the contamination they were allowing to taint what is suppose to be a pure and holy church -----
I wonder today how many of God's Church allow bad leaven in good dough in their midst and ignore it ----
HELPS Word-studies
2219 zýmē – leaven (yeast); (figuratively) Leaven is generally a symbol of the spreading nature of evil