What do I disagree with you about that you are sharing that is backed up by HIS word?
How many times can those of dead faith choose to accept Jesus and be saved?
- Thread starter Solitude
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What do I disagree with you about that you are sharing that is backed up by HIS word?
Are you humble? It's easy to reed.
Acts 2:38 Then Peter said unto them, Repent, and be baptized every one of you in the name of Jesus Christ for the remission of sins, and ye shall receive the gift of the Holy Ghost.
Then Peter said unto them, Repent
and be baptized every one of you in the name of Jesus Christ for the remission of sins
and ye shall receive the gift of the Holy Ghost.
Repent.
Get baptized to get rid of our sins.
And we shall receive the Holy Ghost.
Breaking it into three parts makes it easier.
What do you think?
I was asking for somewhere where Jesus said that salvation is a single event? But you have merely added more details, namely, "salvation is a single event of trust and belief IN the saving act of Christ by which one is regenerated and receives the gift of salvation never to be revoked or undone." Is there somewhere I can read Jesus saying that in scripture?
"Born from above" comes from His discussion with Nicodemus.
Physical birth - a singular event in time
Spiritual regeneration - a singular event in time.
A person cannot be unborn once they have be born either physically or spiritually.
4 It is impossible for those who have once been enlightened, who have tasted the heavenly gift, who have shared in the Holy Spirit,
5 who have tasted the goodness of the word of God and the powers of the coming age—
6 and then have fallen away—to be restored to repentance, because they themselves are crucifying the Son of God all over again and subjecting Him to open shame.…
Hebrews 6:4-6
I will let HIS word do the talking.
Luke 3:3 And he came into all the country about Jordan, preaching the baptism of repentance for the remission of sins;
Mark 1,
1 The beginning of the gospel of Jesus Christ, the Son of God;
2 As it is written in the prophets, Behold, I send my messenger before thy face, which shall prepare thy way before thee.
3 The voice of one crying in the wilderness, Prepare ye the way of the Lord, make his paths straight.
4 John did baptize in the wilderness, and preach the baptism of repentance for the remission of sins.
5 And there went out unto him all the land of Judaea, and they of Jerusalem, and were all baptized of him in the river of Jordan, confessing their sins.
JESUS said this,
Luke 24:47 And that repentance and remission of sins should be preached in his name among all nations, beginning at Jerusalem.
This was the message,
Acts 2:38 Then Peter said unto them, Repent, and be baptized every one of you in the name of Jesus Christ for the remission of sins, and ye shall receive the gift of the Holy Ghost.
Acts 22:16 And now why tarriest thou? arise, and be baptized, and wash away thy sins, calling on the name of the Lord.
Romans 6:6 Knowing this, that our old man is crucified with him, that the body of sin might be destroyed, that henceforth we should not serve sin.
It is a good question. I didn't vote in the poll because you didn't have enough choices. From what I understand, A man can (sincerely) turn his heart back towards God as many times as he is sincere because His Love covers a multitude of sins. But at the same time, scripture says to work out our salvation with fear and trembling, and, that the Lord will say to some I never knew you. So I realize that I am not qualified to make the call.
I believe in OSAS. I was saved by the Lord!
I am being saved by the Lord.
I will be saved by the Lord. All those statements are true. So I would have to say if I am to err, then I would consciously err in faith and by that I mean, Jesus is the Lord and Master so the decision is His alone.
But at the same time I believe He will tell some people who do think they are saved I never knew you and cast them into outer darkness in separation from God. We also have examples of people who are saved, backsliding in scripture and King David is a good example. David was saved and walked with God and then backslid when he seen Bathsheba taking a bath. Then she got pregnant so King David had her husband sent to the front so he would get killed and kill the scandal of the King getting a man's wife pregnant! Psalm 51 is where David has realized that He can't run from God because he can not and he knows this. So David returned to God, repented of those sins and begged forgiveness from the Lord!
Did the Lord accept King David back and forgive him? Is David still saved? Scripture calls David a man after God's own heart now and the throne of David will rise again in Israel, so I would say yes, David is still saved.
But at the same time, Scripture says Jesus will have to say to some people, sorry but you really are not saved I never knew you. So That's a huge warning there. That OSAS isn't across the board for everyone if any! Part of us, working out our own salvation (in our heart, with the Lord). So to err in faith as I said earlier would mean in this case to think, What if for whoever knows what reason, Jesus will say that to them, and looking at my track record in life, that would be me failing. So I was saved and baptized at around age 13-14? And I have committed a lot of sins since then. I totally backslid from Dating age thru divorce and it wasn't until (2009) I had a seizure on the highway and reached out to the Lord for His help and He saved my life that day so I returned to Him and got serious about, I owe Him my life! So you bet I was doing some asking forgiveness after that! What if I had died in my sins without asking forgiveness again? Without setting my heart towards the Lord?
I like believing in OSAS but now I know that it's all about relationship with Him. I realized that I wanted to make sure that He never says I never knew you, I took that to mean they never pray. And what if Jesus asked me if I ever read His Book to me? So I read the Bible yearly at around 3 chapters per day. It takes awhile to get through the OT each year! I finished Matthew 3-6 today. I just started the NT for this year. So I decided that instead of hardly ever praying, I could be the kid that never shuts up. You see developing a relationship with the Lord is all about spending time in His presence worshipping Him in Spirit and Truth. Or singing hymns is worship and brings you into His presence. One on one time with the Lord. Praying is worship. Even asking for things. We can't accidently die in our sins.
Reading the Word of God brings you into His presence. Best time is first thing in the morning because as we read the word of God, it is reading us. The Holy Spirit, which leads us into all truth is immediately there when you begin reading the Word. Giving you revelation, convicting you, showing you the state of your soul. Just like scripture says it will. Because it's true. But we must cooperate with God and do our part so there must be belief and there must be faith. His part was giving us a measure of faith. Our part is believing it, which means walking in it, in deed.
I gave you the definitive answer. But you reject it. Why do you refuse to believe the Bible?
You are still fighting the obvious. No one can forgive sins but God alone. And He doesn't need a ceremony to accomplish it.
That's how you see it. If that's how you see it, you're entitled to your view.
Where does Jesus equate "being born from above" with "salvation", and "salvation" with "being born from above"? Admittedly, being born from above is a part of the salvation process, but surely it does not encompass the entirety of salvation?
I'm sorry sure don't mean to push I just don't understand why HIS word is so hard to understand but we need to look at all of it.
JESUS LOVES US ALL THE SAME and none of us will ever know it all.
It's HIS rule book with HIS rules not mine.
WHO DO YOU FOLLOW?
Romans 6:16 Know ye not, that to whom ye yield yourselves servants to obey, his servants ye are to whom ye obey; whether of sin unto death, or of obedience unto righteousness?
Acts 5:29 Then Peter and the other apostles answered and said, We ought to obey God rather than men.
I would like you to think on past stories and events in HIS word.
Would GOD have blessed Abraham if he didn't obey GOD the way he did?
Would the walls of Jericho have fallen if they didn't obey what GOD said?
Look at what is called the HALL OF FATIH it's all about faith and obedience.
Hebrews 11
King James Version
11 Now faith is the substance of things hoped for, the evidence of things not seen.
2 For by it the elders obtained a good report.
3 Through faith we understand that the worlds were framed by the word of God, so that things which are seen were not made of things which do appear.
4 By faith Abel offered unto God a more excellent sacrifice than Cain, by which he obtained witness that he was righteous, God testifying of his gifts: and by it he being dead yet speaketh.
5 By faith Enoch was translated that he should not see death; and was not found, because God had translated him: for before his translation he had this testimony, that he pleased God.
6 But without faith it is impossible to please him: for he that cometh to God must believe that he is, and that he is a rewarder of them that diligently seek him.
7 By faith Noah, being warned of God of things not seen as yet, moved with fear, prepared an ark to the saving of his house; by the which he condemned the world, and became heir of the righteousness which is by faith.
8 By faith Abraham, when he was called to go out into a place which he should after receive for an inheritance, obeyed; and he went out, not knowing whither he went.
9 By faith he sojourned in the land of promise, as in a strange country, dwelling in tabernacles with Isaac and Jacob, the heirs with him of the same promise:
10 For he looked for a city which hath foundations, whose builder and maker is God.
11 Through faith also Sara herself received strength to conceive seed, and was delivered of a child when she was past age, because she judged him faithful who had promised.
12 Therefore sprang there even of one, and him as good as dead, so many as the stars of the sky in multitude, and as the sand which is by the sea shore innumerable.
13 These all died in faith, not having received the promises, but having seen them afar off, and were persuaded of them, and embraced them, and confessed that they were strangers and pilgrims on the earth.
14 For they that say such things declare plainly that they seek a country.
15 And truly, if they had been mindful of that country from whence they came out, they might have had opportunity to have returned.
16 But now they desire a better country, that is, an heavenly: wherefore God is not ashamed to be called their God: for he hath prepared for them a city.
17 By faith Abraham, when he was tried, offered up Isaac: and he that had received the promises offered up his only begotten son,
18 Of whom it was said, That in Isaac shall thy seed be called:
19 Accounting that God was able to raise him up, even from the dead; from whence also he received him in a figure.
20 By faith Isaac blessed Jacob and Esau concerning things to come.
21 By faith Jacob, when he was a dying, blessed both the sons of Joseph; and worshipped, leaning upon the top of his staff.
22 By faith Joseph, when he died, made mention of the departing of the children of Israel; and gave commandment concerning his bones.
23 By faith Moses, when he was born, was hid three months of his parents, because they saw he was a proper child; and they were not afraid of the king's commandment.
24 By faith Moses, when he was come to years, refused to be called the son of Pharaoh's daughter;
25 Choosing rather to suffer affliction with the people of God, than to enjoy the pleasures of sin for a season;
26 Esteeming the reproach of Christ greater riches than the treasures in Egypt: for he had respect unto the recompence of the reward.
27 By faith he forsook Egypt, not fearing the wrath of the king: for he endured, as seeing him who is invisible.
28 Through faith he kept the passover, and the sprinkling of blood, lest he that destroyed the firstborn should touch them.
29 By faith they passed through the Red sea as by dry land: which the Egyptians assaying to do were drowned.
30 By faith the walls of Jericho fell down, after they were compassed about seven days.
31 By faith the harlot Rahab perished not with them that believed not, when she had received the spies with peace.
32 And what shall I more say? for the time would fail me to tell of Gedeon, and of Barak, and of Samson, and of Jephthae; of David also, and Samuel, and of the prophets:
33 Who through faith subdued kingdoms, wrought righteousness, obtained promises, stopped the mouths of lions.
34 Quenched the violence of fire, escaped the edge of the sword, out of weakness were made strong, waxed valiant in fight, turned to flight the armies of the aliens.
35 Women received their dead raised to life again: and others were tortured, not accepting deliverance; that they might obtain a better resurrection:
36 And others had trial of cruel mockings and scourgings, yea, moreover of bonds and imprisonment:
37 They were stoned, they were sawn asunder, were tempted, were slain with the sword: they wandered about in sheepskins and goatskins; being destitute, afflicted, tormented;
38 (Of whom the world was not worthy
they wandered in deserts, and in mountains, and in dens and caves of the earth.39 And these all, having obtained a good report through faith, received not the promise:
40 God having provided some better thing for us, that they without us should not be made perfect.
John 8:31-32
31 Then said Jesus to those Jews which believed on him, If ye continue in my word, then are ye my disciples indeed;
32 And ye shall know the truth, and the truth shall make you free.
Hebrews 5:9 And being made perfect, he became the author of eternal salvation unto all them that obey him;
We all have a choice to make, please consider the scriptures I shared.
I DON'T NEED TO BE RIGHT, it's really not about me.
ALL IN LOVE, GOD BLESS YOU.
You are 100% right, we all have choices to make.
I'm not sure if you have been following but his view is GOD'S word is wrong.
Submitting to God''s command of water baptism is not about performing a "ceremony." it's about believing and obeying God regardless of whether it makes sense or not. The word reveals everyone is to be baptized in the name of Jesus in order to have their sins washed away. That's bible, not someone's opinion.
Ananias told the Apostle Paul to be baptized and wash away his sins calling on the name of the Lord. He did not tell Paul to get baptized because his sins had already been washed away:
"...the God of our fathers hath chosen thee, that thou shouldest know his will, and see that Just One, and shouldest hear the voice of his mouth. For thou shalt be his witness unto all men of what thou hast seen and heard.
And now why tarriest thou? arise, and be baptized, and wash away thy sins, calling on the name of the Lord." Acts 22:14-16
Also, please consider a few other things:
1. Satan has not changed, he's still using the same tactic, "Hath God Said?" or That's what God's word says, but are you sure that's what it means? It makes no sense that water remits sin, etc.
2. "... pharisees and lawyers rejected the counsel of God against themselves, being not baptized of him." Luke 7:30
3. Jesus said there was no greater prophet than John the Baptist. Yet, people rejected his message then and still do today:
"For I say unto you, Among those that are born of women there is not a greater prophet than John the Baptist: but he that is least in the kingdom of God is greater than he.
And all the people that heard him, and the publicans, justified God, being baptized with the baptism of John.
But the Pharisees and lawyers rejected the counsel of God against themselves, being not baptized of him." Luke 7:28-30
4. Jesus said, he that believes and is baptized shall be saved. Mark 16:16
5. Seven is the number of completeness/wholeness, consider how it applies to the following: Naaman thought it was foolishness to immerse in water and almost lost the opportunity to be healed of leprosy. Leprosy is a picture of sin. Thank goodness God had servantS encourage Naaman to obey His instruction:
"But Naaman was wroth, and went away, and said, Behold, I thought, He will surely come out to me, and stand, and call on the name of the Lord his God, and strike his hand over the place, and recover the leper.
Are not Abana and Pharpar, rivers of Damascus, better than all the waters of Israel? may I not wash in them, and be clean? So he turned and went away in a rage.
And his servants came near, and spake unto him, and said, My father, if the prophet had bid thee do some great thing, wouldest thou not have done it? how much rather then, when he saith to thee, Wash, and be clean?
Then went he down, and dipped himself SEVEN times in Jordan, according to the saying of the man of God: and his flesh came again like unto the flesh of a little child, and he was clean." 2 Kings 5:11-14
Jesus' statement concerning Naaman speaks volumes. It reveals what happens when people believe and obey God rather than man:
And many lepers were in Israel in the time of Eliseus the prophet; and none of them was cleansed, saving Naaman the Syrian." Luke 4:25
Seems to me regeneration which encompasses justification is in view. Eternal life, better understood as Quality Life is a present possession here in this life and the next.
3 Jesus replied, “Very truly I tell you, no one can see the kingdom of God unless they are born again.
and
14 Just as Moses lifted up the snake in the wilderness, so the Son of Man must be lifted up,
15 that everyone who believes may have eternal life in him.
You guys like to say sins need to be washed away. But that is just a picture of the reality. If our sins are not to be counted against us, they must be forgiven. Sins earn us death. And God is the Judge, Jury, and Executioner. He decides who gets punished for their sins and who He saves from His wrath. Scripture is clear that there is only one way to avoid the eternal damnation that we earn by sinning. And that way is by trusting Jesus for the forgiveness that He earned for us on the cross...
- For since, in the wisdom of God, the world through wisdom did not know God, it pleased God through the foolishness of the message preached to save those who believe. (1 Co 1:21)
- 14 And as Moses lifted up the serpent in the wilderness, even so must the Son of Man be lifted up, 15 that whoever believes in Him should not perish but have eternal life. 16 For God so loved the world that He gave His only begotten Son, that whoever believes in Him should not perish but have everlasting life. 17 For God did not send His Son into the world to condemn the world, but that the world through Him might be saved. 18 “He who believes in Him is not condemned; but he who does not believe is condemned already, because he has not believed in the name of the only begotten Son of God. (Jn 3:14–18)
- 28 Then they said to Him, “What shall we do, that we may work the works of God?” 29 Jesus answered and said to them, “This is the work of God, that you believe in Him whom He sent.” (Jn 6:28–29)
- 39 You search the Scriptures, for in them you think you have eternal life; and these are they which testify of Me. 40 But you are not willing to come to Me that you may have life. (Jn 5:39–40)
You guys like to say sins need to be washed away?
Show me any other way to remove our sins, specifically removes sins other that Acts 2:38, 22:16.
We need to use ALL of HIS word, thank you for the ones you shared.
To be reborn, believe, repent, get baptized in JESUS name to remove our sins and JESUS needs to fill us with HIS Spirit.
During the same conversation,
John 3:5 Jesus answered, Verily, verily, I say unto thee, Except a man be born of water and of the Spirit, he cannot enter into the kingdom of God.
JESUS is clear, born of water and of spirit. JUST like Acts 2:38-39
Why didn't he say just believe???
Let's look at John 3:16
John 3:16 For God so loved the world, that he gave his only begotten Son, that whosoever believeth in him should not perish, but have everlasting life.
Do you notice the word "SHOULD" not perish?
It does not say WILL NOT.
So are we to believe just in JESUS or EVERYTHING HE SAYS?
James 2:19 Thou believest that there is one God; thou doest well: the devils also believe, and tremble.
We know devils will not be saved and they believe.
So there has to be more than just believe!!!
If it was just believe why did JESUS say what HE said in John 3:5?
Is JESUS to faced or did HE lie?
The word "SHOULD" is because if you believe in HIM you will OBEY HIM and you should not perish. If you don't OBEY HIM you will.
Which line up with Mark 16:16 He that believeth and is baptized shall be saved; but he that believeth not shall be damned.
If you believe AND ARE BAPTIZED YOU SHALL BE SAVED, if you don't believe, why would you get baptized so you will be damned due to both.
Think of this, all of the verse I share and you share lines up with ALL of HIS word, but just the ones you share doesn't line up with ALL OF HIS WORD.
22 And according to the law almost all things are purified with blood, and without shedding of blood there is no remission. 23 Therefore it was necessary that the copies of the things in the heavens should be purified with these, but the heavenly things themselves with better sacrifices than these. (Heb 9:22–23)
It is not water that is necessary for sins to be forgiven. It is blood. That's why the law prescribed animal sacrifices for sins, because without the shedding of blood there is no remission of sins (Heb 9:22). Even though it was not possible for those sacrifices to take away sins (Heb 10:4), they were perscribed to foreshadow what Christ would do on the cross (Heb 9:23).
12 Not with the blood of goats and calves, but with His own blood He entered the Most Holy Place once for all, having obtained eternal redemption. 13 For if the blood of bulls and goats and the ashes of a heifer, sprinkling the unclean, sanctifies for the purifying of the flesh, 14 how much more shall the blood of Christ, who through the eternal Spirit offered Himself without spot to God, cleanse your conscience from dead works to serve the living God? (Heb 9:12–14)
Through the eternal Spirit, carrying His own blood, He offered Himself without spot to God for our sins. The blood of His sacrifice can cleanse our consciences of sin so that we may serve the living God (Heb 9:12-14).
AMEN, love it.
Did you like the verses I shared?
Can't find any verses showing any other way to remove our sins, specifically removes sins other that Acts 2:38, 22:16.
You stand strong on SOME of HIS word but just will not accept other verses, why?
JESUS died for us, HE is our lamb.
That is what HE did, and he left us instructions just like HE gave the Jews specific instructions on how to get rid of their sins.
So OT HIS RULES, they had to bring animals to be slain ones a year to have their sins removed.
If they didn't would their sins been removed?
When we get baptized in JESUS name it's a one time thing, after that happens when we sin all we need to do is repent and confess them to HIM and HE will forgive us. 1 John 8:9
Do you agree with these verse?
Isaiah 59:2 But your iniquities have separated between you and your God, and your sins have hid his face from you, that he will not hear.
John 9:31 Now we know that God heareth not sinners: but if any man be a worshipper of God, and doeth his will, him he heareth.
Sin separates us AND HE DON'T EVEN HEAR sinners.
Do you think we need to get rid of our sins?
Do you think we can enter Heaven with sins?
If you do, can you tell me EXACTLY how we get rid of our sins?