Is this teaching still valid for the NT Christian?

[followjesus]

May we all be one in the Messiah! In Spirit and truth!

Hebrew 4:12 For the Word of Yah is living, and working, and sharper than any two-edged sword, cutting through even to the dividing of being and spirit, and of joints and marrow, and able to judge the thoughts and intentions of the heart.

1 Kings 3:9,11, "So give your servant a discerning heart to govern your people and to distinguish between right and wrong. For who is able to govern this great people of yours? And the Almighty said to him, “Because you have asked this, and have not asked for yourself long life or riches or the life of your enemies, but have asked for yourself understanding to discern what is right."

2 chronicles 1:7-12 "That night God appeared to Solomon and said to him, “Ask for whatever you want me to give you.”8Solomon answered God, “You have shown great kindness to David my father and have made me king in his place. 9Now, Lord God, let your promise to my father David be confirmed, for you have made me king over a people who are as numerous as the dust of the earth. 10Give me wisdom and knowledge, that I may lead this people, for who is able to govern this great people of yours?”11God said to Solomon, “Since this is your heart’s desire and you have not asked for wealth, possessions or honor, nor for the death of your enemies, and since you have not asked for a long life but for wisdom and knowledge to govern my people over whom I have made you king, 12therefore wisdom and knowledge will be given you. And I will also give you wealth, possessions and honor, such as no king who was before you ever had and none after you will have.”"


The wisest move of solomon the wises Life, was asking God for wisdom and discernment. when promised by God that He would give Him anything He asked for...thats a good example for the church, " seek first His kingdom and His righteousness and these things will be given to you." If only we would trust the Word of God as He gave it and provided it in writing for us....if only wisdom spoke louder than selfishness the world would be much better........God bless you child of God

 

[Atwood]

It is so obvious that the Greatest commandment trumps all the rest, that I wonder why this poll? I guess it is a rhetorical question.

My conviction is that Biblical ethics is hierarchical in that greater commandments trump lesser commandments. Thus when the High Priest gave David show bread to eat (lest he starve), that was correct even under the Law of Moses, since the greatest commandment (as the 2nd) is in Leviticus. So love for neighbor trumped the law against non-priests eating show bread. I also believe that we need to keep the hierarchical nature of ethics in mind today, and be asking whether or not something loves neighbor as self or loves YHWH supremely.

I think that many of us have suffered temptation to be legalists (much like Obsessive-Compulsive Personality Disorder) and forget that the Lord supremely cares that we act out of love. And I also think that we don't
understand any individual commandment properly until we see how it fits into loving God or neighbor. We care called not just to be like soldiers standing at attention & telling the Lord, "Yes Sir Lord, I obey your commandment." We need more focus on loving persons than on willy nilly obeying commandments, "doing right." As love is the ultimate "do right."

 

[PeterJens]

Do you know what happens when a loving person lives in an unloving family?
They die inside and they believe no one can love them.

Now what do we mean by unloving? When no one can say "I love you" and just
accept you as a child.

Now to someone in this situation the language of love Jesus is bringing is a
different world. I mean this most sincerely. As a teenager at the family meal
table I wondered if I was even noticed. Now partly this was depression, but also
it was because the family did not know how to safely share need, and appreciation,
along with all the other emotions and frustration etc.

So when people come to Christ, these commands are an alien place, something they
know very little about other than deep need. And when people talk about a perfect
spirit within, and the flesh without, are on a different planet.

It takes years to learn, to be healed, to grow, to have the Father become our dad,
to trust, to accept, to start to fill with love so it is no longer a well of need but an
overflowing of blessing and encouragement.

I sometimes wonder based on what some express have they read what Jesus said,
have they caught His heart, do they know what brings delight to His spirit?

Love is the strength that conquers and overcomes everything, it does not leave us
broken, enslaved, sinners. But reading how some express themselves, that is all
Jesus is to them, not an army marching to victory, but wounded soldiers still bleeding
and alone, not sure what to do next.

 

[JesusRules1]

Mat 22:36-40, "Teacher, what is the greatest commandment in the Law? Yahshua said to him: You must love YHWH your Father with all your heart, and with all your soul, and with all your might (Deuteronomy 6:5). This is the first and greatest commandment. And the second is like it: You shall love your neighbor as yourself (Leviticus 19:18). On these two commandments hang all the Law and the Prophets."

Is this teaching still valid for the NT Christian?

and

How does this apply to our walk?

It sure does apply in the New Testament,for how can we think we do not have to love God,for we have to love God,and love works no ill towards their neighbor;therefore love is the fulfilling of the law,and Jesus said a new commandment I give you,that you love one another as I have loved you,which is new in the New,for it was not possibly in the Old Testament because lack of having the Holy Spirit.

 

[followjesus]

The great teaching of Jesus on Love expressed through `good works` is found in the Sermon on the mount, that show how Love is applicable today.
　
The first verses are called the `Beatitudes,` which comes from the word, `Beatify,`which means `to make happy` or `blessed.` --- In the Amplified Bible it gives the expanded meaning of the Greek, and says:
3 "Blessed [spiritually prosperous, happy, to be admired] are the poor in spirit [those devoid of spiritual arrogance, those who regard themselves as insignificant], for theirs is the kingdom of heaven.

We could simply say, these should `Be (our) Attitudes,` to mold us into the mature believers that God wants us to be. --- Matthew 5:
1 And seeing the multitudes, He went up on a mountain, and when He was seated His disciples came to Him.
2 Then He opened His mouth and taught them, saying:
3 "Blessed are the poor in spirit, For theirs is the kingdom of heaven.
4 Blessed are those who mourn, For they shall be comforted.
5 Blessed are the meek, For they shall inherit the earth.
6 Blessed are those who hunger and thirst for righteousness, For they shall be filled.
7 Blessed are the merciful, For they shall obtain mercy.
8 Blessed are the pure in heart, For they shall see God.
9 Blessed are the peacemakers, For they shall be called sons of God.

10 Blessed are those who are persecuted for righteousness’ sake, For theirs is the kingdom of heaven.
11 "Blessed are you when they revile and persecute you, and say all kinds of evil against you falsely for My sake.
12 Rejoice and be exceedingly glad, for great is your reward in heaven, for so they persecuted the prophets who were before you.

13 "You are the salt of the earth; but if the salt loses its flavor, how shall it be seasoned? It is then good for nothing but to be thrown out and trampled underfoot by men.
14 "You are the light of the world. A city that is set on a hill cannot be hidden.
15 Nor do they light a lamp and put it under a basket, but on a lampstand, and it gives light to all who are in the house.
16 Let your light so shine before men, that they may see your good works and glorify your Father in heaven.``
　
--- We are called to serve the Lord, and whatever we do should be guided by the Holy Spirit, to bring glory to God.
　

Just wanted to say WONDERFULLY PUT TOGETHER and expressed. Gopd bless you as you press forward, in the new things Of Jesus Christ our LORD, who died for us, and Lives for us now and always

 

[followjesus]

Do you know what happens when a loving person lives in an unloving family?
They die inside and they believe no one can love them.

Now what do we mean by unloving? When no one can say "I love you" and just
accept you as a child.

Now to someone in this situation the language of love Jesus is bringing is a
different world. I mean this most sincerely. As a teenager at the family meal
table I wondered if I was even noticed. Now partly this was depression, but also
it was because the family did not know how to safely share need, and appreciation,
along with all the other emotions and frustration etc.

So when people come to Christ, these commands are an alien place, something they
know very little about other than deep need. And when people talk about a perfect
spirit within, and the flesh without, are on a different planet.

It takes years to learn, to be healed, to grow, to have the Father become our dad,
to trust, to accept, to start to fill with love so it is no longer a well of need but an
overflowing of blessing and encouragement.

I sometimes wonder based on what some express have they read what Jesus said,
have they caught His heart, do they know what brings delight to His spirit?

Love is the strength that conquers and overcomes everything, it does not leave us
broken, enslaved, sinners. But reading how some express themselves, that is all
Jesus is to them, not an army marching to victory, but wounded soldiers still bleeding
and alone, not sure what to do next.

In that brokeneness, God is near. Knowing Jesus requires us to understand how Lost and without Hope we truly are without Him. But we are promised By the Lord Jesus, that the world will Not Love us as its own. i recall the o.t. times when david was often calling out to God asking why the righteous suffer and the wicked prosper. Really, to me i consider from the first 2 men ever born, the righteous was martyred By the wicked one, simply because abels actions were righteous in Gods sight, and cains werent. cain brought leftovers, abel nbrought the choicest of His flock.

The same pattern repeates itself in Gods word, almost exclusively. think of abel a shepherd, the son of adam or " the son of man" abel pleased God, Abel was Killed for His righteousness, he had no descendants, was " cut off from the land of the living...these are Just a few traits that pattern Jesus. again it is seen in isaac. isaac is the only true begotten of abraham, the one Given of promise, abraham sacrificed His only son at the beginning of the covenant ( though God spared Him abraham obeyed God to the point None of us think possible, isaac carried the wood for the offering up the mountain..ect. God is still speaking the same things He always Has and the core of OUR part.......is to hear and obey God. Just as you say here, Jesus does not leave us sinners with no power to be free of sin, He provides freedom in His word. when the word starts repeating the same message, and patterns of Jesus emerge clarity has broken forth and what seems complex, through prayer and whole hearted commitment to Jesus Christ...simplicity comes with power because the revelation comes that Whoever the Son sets free....is free indeed. perseverance brings victory, at first it is a fight that seems too hard, perseverance works and then one day we notice changes and the things that once pulled so hard at us, dont have the same appeal...the control of sin begons to fade, and we press forward. the more freedom becomes real, the more faith Grows, the more faith Grows the more we are spurred on By the Hope we are sure of, the evidence of the freedom Given By Jesus is known b y those experiencing it at whatever stage. it truly is a process of Life Long perseverance. God is gentle with us, patient, provides mercy, grace ect...But still it is about obeying what God says. The Lord Jesus and His spirit give us strength to walk in the ways He teaches and the Longer we persevere Our minds are changed from defeated sinners, comfortable living however we want ....to those who are growing in the Knowledge of God and that Knowledge IS the spirit of truth.


Some think the Bible is a book with words....they miss that those words hold and convey a clear and complete message of How much God Loves us, and the truth about eternal Life. it explains how man fell from Grace in the beginning. it tells of sin and its consequences, oit tells of Gods plan to redeem us from sin and its punishment, it tells us the true and eternal Story of Jesus and His ministry."Hearing" is the key. whether we a reading silently, or someone is preaching at a pulpit we hear the message of Jesus Christ. Not the message of His works alone, But Just as much the message of Light and truth, that is His ministry.

sorry to ramble your coment filled me with consideration, Good stuff and well presented.

 

[followjesus]

It sure does apply in the New Testament,for how can we think we do not have to love God,for we have to love God,and love works no ill towards their neighbor;therefore love is the fulfilling of the law,and Jesus said a new commandment I give you,that you love one another as I have loved you,which is new in the New,for it was not possibly in the Old Testament because lack of having the Holy Spirit.

in the Law there is a command to Love thy neighbor as yourself" But what Jesus said is different He said

"Love one another AS I HAVE LOVED YOU, Greater Love Has no one than this, that He should lay down His Life for His friends." Jesus is telling us to Love as He does, and He Loves Just as He teaches us to Love. By laying down ourselves, picking up the cross and following His lead. we lay down the sinner who doesnt Love others, and we walk in the way of the spirit of truth, the teachings of Jesus Christ. the fullness of Gods word to man is found in the word of Christ. the world wasnt prepared Before Jesus came, the Law had to do its work first in crushing mans pride and teaching our ignorance of " what sin is and what its consequences are" that is how it lead us to Christ, when mankind is honest the Law teaches us that no one is righteous. we can never Be truly Good" by obeying Laws, because sin isnt Just actions, it is the part inside of us that is weak toward sins decietful appeal to our corrupt hearts and motivates us to sin...we could never acchieve Life through the Law, because we are born corrupt in our minds. we have to accept Jesus truth to fix that part. The thing that motivates us to sin inside of us, is what the gospel is meant to put to death through the Knowledge Jesus spoke to us that He learned in the presence of His Father beforehand. its death to the sinner in us, and rebirth into Life as Children of God Jesus death healed sin in us and made us free from its infection.

1 peter 2:24 " He himself bore our sin in His body on the cross, SO THAT we might die to sins, and live for righteousness; by His wounds you have been healed"

some use this for physical Healing but its about healing Our Life, from sinner to saint all because of Jesus and His Word.

 

[PeterJens]

Dude, You can act all religious with your Hebrew idioms. It does not help.
You stated when asked that the law gave mercy and it gave you Jesus. It did not. No amount of Hebrew idioms will change that.
The law did not give you Jesus, My statement stands

The claim EG has is no man can walk without sin.

Jesus was a man, and Jesus walked without sin.

The reason Jesus was fully man was to demonstrate the problem is with our
relationships not our flesh.

The law points out to us where we should be, and we find ourselves failures.

And what was different about Jesus? He had communion with the Father, His heart
was walking in love, righteousness and truth.

Jesus did not absolve us of needing to be righteous, he showed us how we can
walk this way. But the relationship is the first issue, is getting right with God and letting
the relationship flow. Repentance, confession and the cross, up close and personal
is the beginning.

In this place is a lot of humbleness, brokenness, mourning, tears, loss, regret, pain,
emptiness, failure. Pride becomes empty, nothing is worthy, because it is all flawed,
for without love it is a clanging symbol.

This is the lows of where we often need to return, to get perspective on life.

Then Jesus lifts us up, hugs us, accepts us, and encourages us to walk in His love.

The law is why we come to this place, and also expresses our framework of where
we are in things. We are a servant and friend to the King, to honour His name and
walk in His ways.

If you have lived in a place without love, this is like walking into an oasis.

When people say the sermon on the mount condemns them, they are on the wrong side
of this valley, and have not understood and walked into emptying themselves.

This is about entering the sheep fold by the gate and not another way.

 

[OneFaith]

Mat 22:36-40, "Teacher, what is the greatest commandment in the Law? Yahshua said to him: You must love YHWH your Father with all your heart, and with all your soul, and with all your might (Deuteronomy 6:5). This is the first and greatest commandment. And the second is like it: You shall love your neighbor as yourself (Leviticus 19:18). On these two commandments hang all the Law and the Prophets."

Is this teaching still valid for the NT Christian?

and

How does this apply to our walk?

Yes, everything that Christ reinstated is to be obeyed because He is our only authority today. (Matthew 28:18)

 

[Placid]

Hi Hizikyah,
　
Thank you for your response in Post 115:
Quote: "I would say by following Yahshua/Jesus - reading the word so we may remember and understand it and apply it - to be honest, kind, not slanderous, patient, caring, but also not to comprimise with wrong/wrongdoing, not to be worldly, etc. SO much more but just to sum it up, these are some of it... Mercy, Righteous Judgement, Faithfulness."

Response: --- Yes, these are the qualities and actions that we would like to live by. And once we accept Jesus as our Savior and follow His teaching, and memorize some of our favourite Scripture verses, we are ready to talk to others, --- but often we are stuck at this point, so we might become a sort of 'contained Christian.'
--- We are doing what we know to do, but if we are being, honest, kind and loving, --- it might be by our own discipline, rather than the guidance of the Holy Spirit. --- So we might be following our own 'rules of righteousness,' and still running our own lives, rather than have submitted ourselves to God.
　
As Evangelicals we memorize certain verses that give us assurance of Salvation and we promote them among others, which is good, but we might be ignoring our own responsibility to God. --- We often use the verses from Ephesians 2:
8 For by grace you have been saved through faith, and that not of yourselves; it is the gift of God,
9 not of works, lest anyone should boast.

--- Someone said, "When a verse starts with 'for' or 'therefore,' you have to look back and see what it is 'there for' --- because it is dependant on what has gone before it."
　
And so verse 10 starts with 'for,' which makes it dependant on what was written before it.
10 For we are His workmanship, created in Christ Jesus for good works, which God prepared beforehand that we should walk in them.

Let's look at the context this way:
8 For by (God's) grace you have been saved through (your) faith, and that not of yourselves; it is the gift of God,
9 not of works, lest anyone should boast. (A gift cannot be worked for or paid for, because then it is not a gift. --- This 'gift of salvation' is not of one's own merit, so no one can boast.)
10 For we (believers) are His workmanship (His workforce in the field), (re)created in Christ Jesus for (His) good works --- (we are saved to serve, in doing God's 'good works'), which God prepared beforehand (when we submitted our lives to Him, He led us individually in the 'good works' that He prepared for us), that we should walk in them. --- (Our new lifestyle.)

--- This is where the Light of the Lord shines through our lives and glorifies God and not ourselves, --- in Matthew 5:
[SUP]16 "[/SUP]Let your light so shine before men, that they may see your good works and glorify your Father in heaven."

Our live of service does not start until we submit our will to God and let Him guide our lives by the Holy Spirit that He has given to us.
--- And very simply put, "God's salvation comes with a work schedule."
　

 

[oldethennew]

true, but it is out of this, that the "love" of God flows through us and out to others, and we obey those two commands. So I would say both are right,, They both are a basis to Christian living, for you can not become christlike apart from either. Take one away, and our lives fall apart

===============================================

I hear you eg,

I broke the Holy Commandment that instructs us not to STEAL, and spent some time
in jail for breaking it...lesson learned...

 

[Grandpa]

LOL what" I gove up? What? or did you just ignore what is written?

There are two ditches on the road, legalism and hyper grace, between those 2 ditches is a MOUNTAIN:

Revelation 14:12 - Parallel Verses

The Scriptures - Here is the endurance of the set-apart ones, here are those guarding the commands of Yah and the belief of יהושע.

New American Standard Bible - Here is the perseverance of the saints who keep the commandments of God and their faith in Jesus.

New International Version - This calls for patient endurance on the part of the people of God who keep his commands and remain faithful to Jesus.

New Living Translation - This means that God's holy people must endure persecution patiently, obeying his commands and maintaining their faith in Jesus.

You are isoloating Paul, as his own writings call for obedience...

2 peter 3:15-17, "And count the patience of our Lord as salvation, just as our beloved brother Paul also wrote to you according to the wisdom given him, as he does in all his letters when he speaks in them of these matters. There are some things in them that are hard to understand, which the ignorant and unstable twist to their own destruction, as they do the other Scriptures. You therefore, beloved, knowing this beforehand, take care that you are not carried away with the error of lawless people and lose your own stability."


I believe It is those that think Paul taught not to follow the Law of the Creator is what is causing the error...


1 Corinthians 7:19, "For neither circumcision counts for anything nor uncircumcision, but keeping the commandments of God?"


Romans 3:28, "For we maintain that a person is justified by faith apart from the works of the Law."


Romans 3:31, "Are we then doing away with the Law through the faith? By no means! Rather, we establish the Law!"


Romans 6:1-2, "What shall we say then? Are we to continue in sin that grace may abound? By no means!How can we who died to sin still live in it?"


Romans 7:7, Shall we therefore say that the Law is sin? No! By no means! But to the contrary, I did not know sin; transgression of the Law, except through the Law, for I did not know lust, unless the Law had said: Do not covet."


Acts 24:14, "But I confess this to you, that after the way which they call heresy--so I worship the Father of my fathers, believing all things which are written in the Law and in the Prophets."


Romans 7:25, "Thanks be to YHWH, I have deliverance through Yahshua Messiah our King! So then, with this same mind, I myself serve the Law of YHWH, while in the flesh that is yet subject to the law of sin."


Acts 21:24, "Take them, and be purified with them, and pay their expenses so that they may shave their heads. Then everyone will know that those things they were informed about you (forsaking the Law), were lies, and that you, yourself, walk orderly, and keep the Law."


Romans 7:12, "Therefore the Law is holy, and the commandments are holy, and just, and righteous."


Ephesians 6:2-3, "Honor your father and mother; which is the first commandment with a promise: That it may be well with you, and you may live long on the earth."


Galatians 3:13,(KJV) "Christ hath redeemed us from the curse of the Law, being made a curse for us, for it is written, Cursed is everyone who hangeth on a tree."


2 peter 3:15-17, "And count the patience of our Lord as salvation, just as our beloved brother Paul also wrote to you according to the wisdom given him, as he does in all his letters when he speaks in them of these matters. There are some things in them that are hard to understand, which the ignorant and unstable twist to their own destruction, as they do the other Scriptures. You therefore, beloved, knowing this beforehand, take care that you are not carried away with the error of lawless people and lose your own stability."


I want to point out that the words that are in italics are ADDED:


Ephesians 2:15-16, (NKJV), "having abolished in His flesh the enmity, that is, the law of commandments contained in ordinances, so as to create in Himself one new man from the two, thus making peace, and that He might reconcile them both to God in one body through the cross, thereby putting to death the enmity. "


Not only odes the next verse tell us what was abolished, but when you remove the ADDED words the meaning changes.


Ephesians 2:15-16, "Abolishing the enmity Law, the Commandments, and the Ordinances, through His own flesh, in order to create in Himself one new man from the two; making peace, That would reconcile both in one body to YHWH through the sacrifice--having killed the enmity through Himself."


“enmity” is word # G2190
Thayer's (New Testament Greek-English Lexicon) Feminine of G2190; hostility; by implication a reason for opposition:—enmity, hatred.


He abolished the hatred of the Law...


Romans 8:5-8, "For those who live according to the flesh, set their minds on the things of the flesh; but those who live according to the Spirit, set their minds on the things of the Spirit. For to be carnally minded is death; but to be spiritually minded is life and peace. Because the carnal mind is enmity against; (bitterly opposed to), YHWH; for it his not subject to the Law of YHWH, nor indeed can be. So then, those who are of the flesh cannot please YHWH."


Mattithyah 22:37-40, "Yahshua said to him: You must love YHWH your Father with all your heart, and with all your soul, and with all your might. This is the first and greatest commandment. And the second is like it: You shall love your neighbor as yourself. On these two commandments hang all the Law and the Prophets."

Romans 13:9-10, "For the commandments: You shall not commit adultery, You shall not murder, You shall not steal, You shall not bring false testimony, You shall not covet, and all other commandments are summed up in these Laws; namely: You must love your neighbor as yourself. Love does no wrong to a neighbor; therefore love is the fulfilling of the Law."

Yaaqob 2:26, "For just as the body without the spirit is dead, so the faith without works is dead also."

Faith + no works = dead

Works + no faith = dead

We need faith and works, AND OUR FAITH AND OUR WORKS HAS TO BE POINTED IN THE RIGHT DIRECTION

Titus 1:16, "They profess that they know YHWH, but by their works they deny Him – being abominable, disobedient, and to every righteous work, reprobate."

2 Timothy 2:19, "Nevertheless, the Foundation of YHWH stands sure, having this seal: YHWH knows those who are His, because everyone who reverences the Name of YHWH departs from iniquity."


“iniquity” is word # G458 - anomia Strong's Concordance, lawlessness, Short Definition: lawlessness, iniquity, Definition: lawlessness, iniquity, disobedience, sin
"iniquity" is: #0458 anomia {an-om-ee'-ah} from G0459
Greek Word Study (Transliteration-Pronunciation Etymology & Grammar)
1) the condition of without law 1a) because ignorant of it1b) because of violating it, 2) contempt and violation of law, iniquity, wickedness


Mattithyah 24:12, "And because iniquity will abound, the love of the many will grow cold."

You must have given up because you keep showing the same thing over and over. Which doesn't show that the law has mercy written into it.

The Law leads you to Christ. Christ is Mercy. But if you don't come to Christ does the Law have mercy?

 

[Placid]

Hi followjesus,

Quote from Post 125:
Just wanted to say WONDERFULLY PUT TOGETHER and expressed. Gopd bless you as you press forward, in the new things Of Jesus Christ our LORD, who died for us, and Lives for us now and always

Thanks, --- I believe these are the Scriptures we should dwell on more than we do.
--- I especially like this statement, because Jesus Christ was called 'the Prince of Peace.'
9 Blessed are the peacemakers, For they shall be called sons of God.

--- And another statement says this in Romans 8:
14 For as many as are led by the Spirit of God, these are sons of God.

--- And other verses tell us in Romans 12:
17 Repay no one evil for evil. Have regard for good things in the sight of all men.
18 If it is possible, as much as depends on you, live peaceably with all men.
Blessings