It makes no sense…

[Seeker47]

When first opening the Bible, one will quickly come to the conclusion that God makes no sense. He places Adam and Eve in paradise and then tempts them with sin? He follows by punishing mankind for thousands of generations when they slip-up? Cain kills Abel and God, the giver of law, protects Cain from the consequences of his crime? God admits He made a mistake and drowns all humanity except Noah? (And all this all occurs in the first six chapters)!

We are forced to come away with one of two conclusions. Either this God of Creation is crazy, or He is beyond understanding. Many opt for the former and flee, a few choose the latter and seek revelation. Those who seek will arrive at a single conclusion, they will never be able to understand the mind of YHWH.

The best we can do is use human reasoning to catch hints of God’s character and intent. He gives us that option. One such glimpse can be found in John 11, the resurrection of Lazarus.

Jesus loves Lazarus. Yet, He was not concerned about his death. He made no rush to save him. Jesus ignored the plea for help from his sisters, not arriving until Lazarus had been dead four days.

Jesus still expressed no concern for the death. What He did instead, was to cry and grieve over the pain death had caused. He acutely felt Martha and Mary’s pain and moved to comfort them.

We cannot understand The Creator’s view of earthly death. The death of entire populations, of entire tribes, and especially the deaths of innocent people will never make earthly sense. We can only conclude that God must go well beyond our temporal considerations and embrace a plan we cannot see. The one who made us must believe there is something better waiting for us than we know, something worth the cost, something eternal. Yet we still react like Martha and Mary.

Like Lazarus, our deaths will cause earthly pain. We may not look forward to it, but can safely put our faith in a sane and loving creator to use life, and our inevitable death, for His purpose and glory. We can have faith even when it makes no sense to us.

Amen.

 

[GWH]

When first opening the Bible, one will quickly come to the conclusion that God makes no sense. He places Adam and Eve in paradise and then tempts them with sin? He follows by punishing mankind for thousands of generations when they slip-up? Cain kills Abel and God, the giver of law, protects Cain from the consequences of his crime? God admits He made a mistake and drowns all humanity except Noah? (And all this all occurs in the first six chapters)!

We are forced to come away with one of two conclusions. Either this God of Creation is crazy, or He is beyond understanding. Many opt for the former and flee, a few choose the latter and seek revelation. Those who seek will arrive at a single conclusion, they will never be able to understand the mind of YHWH.

The best we can do is use human reasoning to catch hints of God’s character and intent. He gives us that option. One such glimpse can be found in John 11, the resurrection of Lazarus.

Jesus loves Lazarus. Yet, He was not concerned about his death. He made no rush to save him. Jesus ignored the plea for help from his sisters, not arriving until Lazarus had been dead four days.

Jesus still expressed no concern for the death. What He did instead, was to cry and grieve over the pain death had caused. He acutely felt Martha and Mary’s pain and moved to comfort them.

We cannot understand The Creator’s view of earthly death. The death of entire populations, of entire tribes, and especially the deaths of innocent people will never make earthly sense. We can only conclude that God must go well beyond our temporal considerations and embrace a plan we cannot see. The one who made us must believe there is something better waiting for us than we know, something worth the cost, something eternal. Yet we still react like Martha and Mary.

Like Lazarus, our deaths will cause earthly pain. We may not look forward to it, but can safely put our faith in a sane and loving creator to use life, and our inevitable death, for His purpose and glory. We can have faith even when it makes no sense to us.

Amen.

Yes without the NT we might not view God as love.
However we do have the NT so we have good reason to believe life makes sense.

 

[tourist]

It helps to understand the reasoning of God if you keep in mind that God is love.

 

[tablet123]

When first opening the Bible, one will quickly come to the conclusion that God makes no sense. He places Adam and Eve in paradise and then tempts them with sin? He follows by punishing mankind for thousands of generations when they slip-up? Cain kills Abel and God, the giver of law, protects Cain from the consequences of his crime? God admits He made a mistake and drowns all humanity except Noah? (And all this all occurs in the first six chapters)!

We are forced to come away with one of two conclusions. Either this God of Creation is crazy, or He is beyond understanding. Many opt for the former and flee, a few choose the latter and seek revelation. Those who seek will arrive at a single conclusion, they will never be able to understand the mind of YHWH.

The best we can do is use human reasoning to catch hints of God’s character and intent. He gives us that option. One such glimpse can be found in John 11, the resurrection of Lazarus.

Jesus loves Lazarus. Yet, He was not concerned about his death. He made no rush to save him. Jesus ignored the plea for help from his sisters, not arriving until Lazarus had been dead four days.

Jesus still expressed no concern for the death. What He did instead, was to cry and grieve over the pain death had caused. He acutely felt Martha and Mary’s pain and moved to comfort them.

We cannot understand The Creator’s view of earthly death. The death of entire populations, of entire tribes, and especially the deaths of innocent people will never make earthly sense. We can only conclude that God must go well beyond our temporal considerations and embrace a plan we cannot see. The one who made us must believe there is something better waiting for us than we know, something worth the cost, something eternal. Yet we still react like Martha and Mary.

Like Lazarus, our deaths will cause earthly pain. We may not look forward to it, but can safely put our faith in a sane and loving creator to use life, and our inevitable death, for His purpose and glory. We can have faith even when it makes no sense to us.

Amen.

Rom 4:17 (As it is written, I have made thee a father of many nations,) before him whom he believed, even God, who quickeneth the dead, and calleth those things which be not as though they were.

God calls things that have not happened yet as though they already happened for if it is a plan of God to happen in the future it is the same as if it happened in the beginning for it will surely come to pass with you no hindrance.

Rev 3:14 And unto the angel of the church of the Laodiceans write; These things saith the Amen, the faithful and true witness, the beginning of the creation of God.

Rev 13:8 And all that dwell upon the earth shall worship him, whose names are not written in the book of life of the Lamb slain from the foundation of the world.

Joh 1:1 In the beginning was the Word, and the Word was with God, and the Word was God.
Joh 1:3 All things were made by him; and without him was not any thing made that was made.
Joh 1:14 And the Word was made flesh, and dwelt among us, (and we beheld his glory, the glory as of the only begotten of the Father,) full of grace and truth.

Jesus is the beginning of creation according to His humanity and He was slain from the foundation of the world.

And without that plan spiritual salvation God would of not created anything He created.

So God knew Adam and Eve would sin for only by their falling could Jesus become the Savior of the world.

But don't get in an uproar because it was for the best to have a spiritual relationship with God on His level.

God knew they would fall because of the flesh.

It would of never entered their mind to eat of the tree unless an outside source tempted them with an alternate reality.

God gave them a choice as He did the angels so God allowed Satan to tempt Eve which she said she could not eat of the tree for that is all she could think and know.

So Satan tempted her with an alternate reality that appealed to her flesh an elevated position which she ate and sinned.

And then Eve was the outside source that tempted Adam and he ate and sinned.

They then had a choice and gave choice to the world which then they could choose this salvation for God's kingdom is true love.

So without them falling there is no spiritual salvation and no complete relationship with God.

The Old Testament was a physical covenant with blessings but no spiritual relationship with God until Jesus came and people could have the Spirit to regenerate them, born again.

Deu 30:19 I call heaven and earth to record this day against you, that I have set before you life and death, blessing and cursing: therefore choose life, that both thou and thy seed may live.

Psa 53:1 To the chief Musician upon Mahalath, Maschil, A Psalm of David. The fool hath said in his heart, There is no God. Corrupt are they, and have done abominable iniquity: there is none that doeth good.

Rom 1:18 For the wrath of God is revealed from heaven against all ungodliness and unrighteousness of men, who hold the truth in unrighteousness;
Rom 1:19 Because that which may be known of God is manifest in them; for God hath shewed it unto them.
Rom 1:20 For the invisible things of him from the creation of the world are clearly seen, being understood by the things that are made, even his eternal power and Godhead; so that they are without excuse.

Rom 2:14 For when the Gentiles, which have not the law, do by nature the things contained in the law, these, having not the law, are a law unto themselves:
Rom 2:15 Which shew the work of the law written in their hearts, their conscience also bearing witness, and their thoughts the mean while accusing or else excusing one another)
Rom 2:16 In the day when God shall judge the secrets of men by Jesus Christ according to my gospel.

Act 17:30 And the times of this ignorance God winked at; but now commandeth all men every where to repent.

All the terribleness of the world is caused by the bad decisions and lusts of people.

And would God not protect them.

God puts down 1000 to save 10,000 for He did it to protect people and to stop the hindering of the truth from spreading too much.

God would judge on earth back then and all people will be judged.

But people can come to God and the flesh does not matter and they can escape the world.

Which creation testifies of a higher power who is love for He provided food, and the means to make clothing, and shelter, and testifies of the 2 greatest laws love God and love people so the world is without excuse.

And their conscious so no matter the chaos on earth they can accept God and the truth to love people whether they heard the word of God or not.

God does not judge on earth like He did in the Old Testament being grace but will judge on earth when the wrath of God is poured upon the world.

God judged Sodom and Gomorrah by overthrowing them but He gave them a chance by testing them with the 2 angels in the form of men in which they failed for none appeared righteous.

God did not want their heathen ways to spread out especially homosexuality and they had no concern for the poor and needy which fails at love.

God caused some nations to fall because of their cruelty to those around them.

So everything God did was for the protection of people.

God would not put down a nation if they are not too severe in cruelty and sins having some goodness about them.

He told Abraham if He could find 5 righteous He would not overthrow them.

People think God is a war monger and cruel but people are cruel.

Concerning Cain the Old Testament law was not in to effect yet and God protected Cain because 2 wrongs don't make a right and He still cared about him.

Gen 6:5 And GOD saw that the wickedness of man was great in the earth, and that every imagination of the thoughts of his heart was only evil continually.

Gen 6:6 And it repented the LORD that he had made man on the earth, and it grieved him at his heart.

Gen 6:8 But Noah found grace in the eyes of the LORD.

Gen 6:12 And God looked upon the earth, and, behold, it was corrupt; for all flesh had corrupted his way upon the earth.

Gen 6:13 And God said unto Noah, The end of all flesh is come before me; for the earth is filled with violence through them; and, behold, I will destroy them with the earth.

Concerning Noah's flood there was no one right with God except Noah which his sons and wives were favored also.

The rest of the world every imagination of the thoughts of their heart was only evil continually.

And they corrupted God's ways on earth of love, mercy, and forgiveness, which how could the truth shine in an environment like that to cause people to turn to a God of love and to do the same.

Which they were violent towards each other devouring each other with no care for each other.

It was over and the plan of mankind could not go on with Noah not having influence over them being such a little factor.

God had to start over for His purpose to go on in the earth.

If God did not cause the flood more people would have died and violently than the people taken out by the flood.

God is not cruel but people are cruel.

 

[timf]

Here is a blog post from christianpioneer.com that may give some light on creation;

If You Were God

It has been an interesting thought experiment throughout the ages to ask oneself,”If I were king”,or “If I were president”... These thoughts are often a response to some egregious policy or law that one has to endure. These thoughts do not often go far as speculations as to how things might be made to work better are often abandoned in favor of more interesting thoughts. However, if one considers the broader scope of existence, one might gain a perspective that can shed some light on how we look at the universe in which we live

Speculation about what it would be like to be God does not even require one to believe in God at all. To consider the dynamics and mechanics of such a proposition is more an exercise in logic. However, it may also open the mind to possibilities not previously considered. Going beyond the idea that “I could get whatever I wanted”, one discovers possibilities and even limitations that can be intriguing.

If one had the ability to create an entire universe simply by speaking it into existence, one might discover there is a danger with such power. Those inclined to consumptive self-indulgence might soon discover that the desire to consume is a hunger that is never satisfied and that in chasing after such lusts, one tends to consume themselves. The bible can be a useful resource to shed some light on processes both celestial and terrestrial.

Ye ask, and receive not, because ye ask amiss, that ye may consume it upon your lusts.- James 4:3

In a way this admonition resonates with parents who recognize the wisdom in restricting the appetites of their children (wanting 100 ice cream cones is different than actually eating them). One would hope that upon reaching adulthood, one would see the benefit of self-restriction. It should therefore be also evident that upon godhood, consumptive lusts would be even that much more destructive.

We can get an additional insight into the nature of God from John;

This then is the message which we have heard of him, and declare unto you, that God is light, and in him is no darkness at all. - 1 John 1:5

If we consider “light” we observe something that flows outward, shows truth, gives and sustains life. There is no consumptive element at all. With all the power of God the first limitation one encounters is that it cannot be used for self. To do so would start a process of self consumption.

Another restrictive element would be truth. Just as self-indulgence would be destructive, deception including self-deception would inflict blindness and tend towards self-destruction as the foundation reality gives to existence would be lost.

One might see Godhood as other or outward orientation and limited to truth. Faced with these limitations one might ask what sort of activity options would be available. The ability to create would be an obvious choice. However, creating what and why are natural questions one would ask. One might create a world with creatures whose actions were predetermined and predictable. Like having an aquarium, the actions of such creatures can be distracting, but in the end one has to question the ultimate value of entertainment.

The ability to create worlds and creatures poses an interesting quandary. One could create creatures programmed to do exactly what was expected. Creatures could also be created to interact with their environment such that they were free to make choices, but acted on instincts. A third alternative would be to create thinking creatures who had the free will to act independently from the creator. The risk here would be that the creatures would follow the self-destructive path of self-indulgent consumption or disassociation from reality that deceptions create.

In addition to choosing whether to make creatures with free will or not, one would also have to chose whether to make the creatures self-replicating or with initial functionality. The angelic realm might be an example of creatures made with knowledge and powers as well as given free will. For such creatures the test would be if they could exercise their free will to choose to remain faithful and resist the attraction that rebellion might offer.

For self replicating creatures one would expect at some point their ignorance would cause them to be cut off from their creator and their descendants would each start life helpless, ignorant, and selfish. Here the test would be if any could find their way out of rebellion.

An additional complicating factor would exist if a rebelling angel came to have control or influence over the human realm such that in addition to trying to escape ignorance, one also had to fight through deceptions.

The fate of rebelling angles would be pretty clear, those who rebell will be destroyed. The fate of humans born in ignorance is a different matter. There would be two ways eternal life could be imparted to those who never had it. The first would be to select an individual from whom a nation would come and through that nation all the peoples of earth could be provided the knowledge of the creator and faith in him demonstrated by following his laws could lead to being raised from the dead unto eternal life. A second way would be to offer eternal life to those who had faith in an action by the creator to recover them.

If you are a creator and your creation is stuck in sin, the question arises as to how do you resolve this dilemma. The bible describes the creator entering his own creation and being put to death by his own creatures by which a payment was made that could allow some to be given eternal life.

For as in Adam all die, even so in Christ shall all be made alive. - 1 Corinthians 15:22

Which none of the princes of this world knew: for had they known it, they would not have crucified the Lord of glory. - 1 Corinthians 2:8

It is not exactly clear how this “payment” was made and to whom, but the result was the possibility that recovery of some could be made. The phrase “in Christ” suggests that in some way humans through faith are able to receive eternal life from the life of their creator.

A creator thus through his creation is able to produce “children” that could come out of creation and join him in a sort of familial relationship.

 

[Seeker47]

Here is a blog post from christianpioneer.com that may give some light on creation;

If You Were God

It has been an interesting thought experiment throughout the ages to ask oneself,”If I were king”,or “If I were president”... These thoughts are often a response to some egregious policy or law that one has to endure. These thoughts do not often go far as speculations as to how things might be made to work better are often abandoned in favor of more interesting thoughts. However, if one considers the broader scope of existence, one might gain a perspective that can shed some light on how we look at the universe in which we live

Speculation about what it would be like to be God does not even require one to believe in God at all. To consider the dynamics and mechanics of such a proposition is more an exercise in logic. However, it may also open the mind to possibilities not previously considered. Going beyond the idea that “I could get whatever I wanted”, one discovers possibilities and even limitations that can be intriguing.

If one had the ability to create an entire universe simply by speaking it into existence, one might discover there is a danger with such power. Those inclined to consumptive self-indulgence might soon discover that the desire to consume is a hunger that is never satisfied and that in chasing after such lusts, one tends to consume themselves. The bible can be a useful resource to shed some light on processes both celestial and terrestrial.

Ye ask, and receive not, because ye ask amiss, that ye may consume it upon your lusts.- James 4:3

In a way this admonition resonates with parents who recognize the wisdom in restricting the appetites of their children (wanting 100 ice cream cones is different than actually eating them). One would hope that upon reaching adulthood, one would see the benefit of self-restriction. It should therefore be also evident that upon godhood, consumptive lusts would be even that much more destructive.

We can get an additional insight into the nature of God from John;

This then is the message which we have heard of him, and declare unto you, that God is light, and in him is no darkness at all. - 1 John 1:5

If we consider “light” we observe something that flows outward, shows truth, gives and sustains life. There is no consumptive element at all. With all the power of God the first limitation one encounters is that it cannot be used for self. To do so would start a process of self consumption.

Another restrictive element would be truth. Just as self-indulgence would be destructive, deception including self-deception would inflict blindness and tend towards self-destruction as the foundation reality gives to existence would be lost.

One might see Godhood as other or outward orientation and limited to truth. Faced with these limitations one might ask what sort of activity options would be available. The ability to create would be an obvious choice. However, creating what and why are natural questions one would ask. One might create a world with creatures whose actions were predetermined and predictable. Like having an aquarium, the actions of such creatures can be distracting, but in the end one has to question the ultimate value of entertainment.

The ability to create worlds and creatures poses an interesting quandary. One could create creatures programmed to do exactly what was expected. Creatures could also be created to interact with their environment such that they were free to make choices, but acted on instincts. A third alternative would be to create thinking creatures who had the free will to act independently from the creator. The risk here would be that the creatures would follow the self-destructive path of self-indulgent consumption or disassociation from reality that deceptions create.

In addition to choosing whether to make creatures with free will or not, one would also have to chose whether to make the creatures self-replicating or with initial functionality. The angelic realm might be an example of creatures made with knowledge and powers as well as given free will. For such creatures the test would be if they could exercise their free will to choose to remain faithful and resist the attraction that rebellion might offer.

For self replicating creatures one would expect at some point their ignorance would cause them to be cut off from their creator and their descendants would each start life helpless, ignorant, and selfish. Here the test would be if any could find their way out of rebellion.

An additional complicating factor would exist if a rebelling angel came to have control or influence over the human realm such that in addition to trying to escape ignorance, one also had to fight through deceptions.

The fate of rebelling angles would be pretty clear, those who rebell will be destroyed. The fate of humans born in ignorance is a different matter. There would be two ways eternal life could be imparted to those who never had it. The first would be to select an individual from whom a nation would come and through that nation all the peoples of earth could be provided the knowledge of the creator and faith in him demonstrated by following his laws could lead to being raised from the dead unto eternal life. A second way would be to offer eternal life to those who had faith in an action by the creator to recover them.

If you are a creator and your creation is stuck in sin, the question arises as to how do you resolve this dilemma. The bible describes the creator entering his own creation and being put to death by his own creatures by which a payment was made that could allow some to be given eternal life.

For as in Adam all die, even so in Christ shall all be made alive. - 1 Corinthians 15:22

Which none of the princes of this world knew: for had they known it, they would not have crucified the Lord of glory. - 1 Corinthians 2:8

It is not exactly clear how this “payment” was made and to whom, but the result was the possibility that recovery of some could be made. The phrase “in Christ” suggests that in some way humans through faith are able to receive eternal life from the life of their creator.

A creator thus through his creation is able to produce “children” that could come out of creation and join him in a sort of familial relationship.

Very thoghtful article. This one will take some time and effort to digest. I love it! Thanks!