Man imputed Jesus with sin on the cross, not God.

[ATG]

Everlasting-Grace said:
Humans die. Jesus left his body.. willinglythey did not give up the ghost. they died.

give up the ghost​

phrase​

Synonyms of give up the ghost
: to cease to live or function : DIE

Yes E-G, people do give up the ghost. You seem to be in serious denial.

Gen 25:8
Then Abraham gave up the ghost, and died in a good old age, an old man, and full of years; and was gathered to his people.

Gen 49:33
And when Jacob had made an end of commanding his sons, he gathered up his feet into the bed, and yielded up the ghost, and was gathered unto his people.

Job 14:10
But man dieth, and wasteth away: yea, man giveth up the ghost, and where is he?

We know that some Christians only believe and teach what they want to, and not the Scriptures. But is someone now preaching Docetism, where Jesus was not a real man, and was not born and died with a man's body? But was only a spirit ghost borrowing a body?

While it's true that the Lord breathed out His last breath by personal will, which no other man can do, it's also certainly true that He was a man with man's body, that died the same as any body without the spirit:

Jas 2:26
For as the body without the spirit is dead, so faith without works is dead also.

 

[ATG]

I did not kill Christ.

Mat 23:29
Woe unto you, scribes and Pharisees, hypocrites! because ye build the tombs of the prophets, and garnish the sepulchres of the righteous, And say, If we had been in the days of our fathers, we would not have been partakers with them in the blood of the prophets. Wherefore ye be witnesses unto yourselves, that ye are the children of them which killed the prophets.

So it is today, that some sinful Christians garnish the cross with their lips, in order to justify their own sinning against Christ.

Some also preach, that they had no part in Jesus' sacrifice on the cross, which all men that sinned had our sinful part in:

If we had not sinned, Jesus had not need come and die for our sin. If we had not crucified Him on a cross with sinful hands, He had not died for our sin.

The sinful cause and means of Jesus' unlawful beating and death on a cross, is sinful man's alone.

God the father and spirit turned their back on him while he was still alive.

Jhn 8:29
And he that sent me is with me: the Father hath not left me alone; for I do always those things that please him.

Jhn 16:32
Behold, the hour cometh, yea, is now come, that ye shall be scattered, every man to his own, and shall leave me alone: and yet I am not alone, because the Father is with me.

The Father did not leave Jesus alone hanging on a cross by the hands of all sinful men.

He was angry with the wicked over all land.

Mat 27:45
Now from the sixth hour there was darkness over all the land unto the ninth hour.

That is where he took the full wrath of god on our behalf.

That was when he took the full wrath of sinful man, in obedience to the Father.

God the Father had no wrath for His own Son, who pleased Him always, even unto death on a cross.

And His wrath remains upon all that repent not of continuing to sin against Him and His dear Son.

Jhn 3:36
He that believeth on the Son hath everlasting life: and he that believeth not the Son shall not see life; but the wrath of God abideth on him.

Sinners that continue to not believe in the the Son's righteousness, nor repent to do His righteousness, abide still under the wrath of the Father, from the day His Son was unjustly crucified by all sinful men.

Stop taking credit for the work of God.

You can deny your own sinful cause and means of Jesus' death on the cross.

Mar 2:17
When Jesus heard it, he saith unto them, They that are whole have no need of the physician, but they that are sick: I came not to call the righteous, but sinners to repentance.

 

[ATG]

You and I are the sinners. we have no power.

You are a sinner with no power nor faith not to continue sinning.

You neither judge nor speak for the righteous sons of God in Christ Jesus:

Jhn 1:12
But as many as received him, to them gave he power to become the sons of God, even to them that believe on his name. Which were born, not of blood, nor of the will of the flesh, nor of the will of man, but of God.

1Jo 5:4
For whatsoever is born of God overcometh the world: and this is the victory that overcometh the world, even our faith.

3 John{1:11}
Beloved, follow not that which is evil, but that which is good. He that is doing good is of God: but he that is doing evil hath not seen God.

I reject your gospel for sinners without power. I only believe the gospel of Jesus Christ with power to overcome sin and temptation unto the end.

Rev 3:21
To him that overcomes will I grant to sit with me in my throne, even as I also overcame, and am set down with my Father in his throne.

ATG said:
The only means of foergiviness is by repenting of our sinnng against Him, through His resurrection from the dead.
lol. And here you again are taking credit for saving yourself.

2Pe 3:3
Knowing this first, that there shall come in the last days scoffers, walking after their own lusts,

Jde 1:18
How that they told you there should be mockers in the last time, who should walk after their own ungodly lusts.

I had forgotten that you mock doing righteousness of the Lord, while preaching your continued sinning to all men.

Rev 2:14
But I have a few things against thee, because thou hast there them that hold the doctrine of Balaam, who taught Balac to cast a stumblingblock before the children of Israel, to eat things sacrificed unto idols, and to commit fornication.

Rev 2:20
Notwithstanding I have a few things against thee, because thou sufferest that woman Jezebel, which calleth herself a prophetess, to teach and to seduce my servants to commit fornication, and to eat things sacrificed unto idols.

There's nothing more than can be said to anyone teaching continued sinning for others to do the same, and rejects the Sprit's grace to do good and not evil.

Mat 15:14
Let them alone: they be blind leaders of the blind. And if the blind lead the blind, both shall fall into the ditch.

 

[ATG]

How would Jesus have explained the baptism of the Holy Spirit to someone like that?

God can't explain the Holy Ghost baptism to sinners, but only promise Him to them that repent of their sinning against God.

Acts{3:19}
Repent ye therefore, and be converted, that your sins may be blotted out, when the times of refreshing shall come from the presence of the Lord; And he shall send Jesus Christ, which before was preached unto you:

 

[Burn1986]

God can't explain the Holy Ghost baptism to sinners, but only promise Him to them that repent of their sinning against God.

Acts{3:19}
Repent ye therefore, and be converted, that your sins may be blotted out, when the times of refreshing shall come from the presence of the Lord; And he shall send Jesus Christ, which before was preached unto you:

“”…of their sinning against God.” Sounds like a Hollywood movie line. Who else would they sin against, or repent towards? Lol

 

[ATG]

ATG said:
I'm not stuck. We killed Him, not God.
Read it again. and again and again and again

Acts 2:23
Him, being delivered by the determinate counsel and foreknowledge of God, ye have taken, and by wicked hands have crucified and slain:

1Co 2:8
Which none of the princes of this world knew: for had they known it, they would not have crucified the Lord of glory.

When Jesus rebukes people for teaching their own false traditions, He also tells the false teachers, that they reject the Scriptures and doctrine of God.

pinebeach said:
You are one confused dude and sorry, but it seems we all are going to leave you in your confusion as a good number of people who are not confused, have tried to help you out.

pinebeach said:
I will not involve myself in your other convoluted responses. It would be irresponsible for me to waste that much of my time.

And not believing the truth of Scripture, is also why false teachers can't be trusted to keep their own words, much less the truth of God.

Which is why I never bother responding to such false promises. My experience is that some people exposed to the truth, hate it, but continue to come back again and again and again, as the moth to the flame.

You basically just troll the forum threads with your petty little jabs

pinebeach said:
It does not matter whatever insipid and ridiculous comeback you provide in your haste to distort the truth. You are wrong and every time you deny what is plainly written, your heart becomes harder

They also degrade themselves into meaningless personal tirades, that have nothing to do with the Scriptures at hand.

When false teaching fails to convince or sustain itself against Scriptures of truth, then some default to unconvincing and hollow charges.

 

[ATG]

28 After this, Jesus, knowing that all was now finished, said (to fulfill the Scripture), “I thirst.” 29 A jar full of sour wine stood there, so they put a sponge full of the sour wine on a hyssop branch and held it to his mouth.

30 When Jesus had received the sour wine, he said, “It is finished,” and he bowed his head and gave up his spirit. John 19: 28-30

You are not in control of the hour of your death but Jesus was.

This is true. Only the righteous Son of God, that had no sin, could breathe out His last breath by power of His own will.

But that does not do away with the fact, that Jesus died on the cross, and that He was unjustly killed by wickled hands of sinful men. Not by God, nor the Father.

Jesus did not give up the ghost, simply because He was tired or bored of living on earth as a man. He was driven from sinful men, that reject His good righteousness, and choose their own evil instead.

Isa 53:3
He is despised and rejected of men; a man of sorrows, and acquainted with grief: and we hid as it were our faces from him; he was despised, and we esteemed him not.

And every man that has sinned, is guilty of His evil handling, except we repent of sinning against Him ourselves.

And any man that continues to sin against Him, is also guilty of killing Him to themselves again and again and again.

Heb 10:26
For if we sin wilfully after that we have received the knowledge of the truth, there remaineth no more sacrifice for sins,... seeing they crucify to themselves the Son of God afresh, and put him to an open shame.

Only the hardened sinner can believe that his own sinning against Jesus is not so evil, so long as it is 'only' from time to time...especially if they also believe they are justified and uncodemned when doing so.

2Th 2:10
And for this cause God shall send them strong delusion, that they should believe a lie: That they all might be damned who believed not the truth, but had pleasure in unrighteousness.

 

[ATG]

Merriam-Webster defines "imputed" as such:

I only believe and teach God's use of words in Scripture. Which is why I quote Scripture, for God's use of words.

Men can trust to men's use of words for men's traditions. Which is why they ignore Scripture, for their own use of words.

Sinful men laid their wicked hands upon Jesus' body.

God and His Son's only part was being commanded and obediently submitted into the hands that unlawfully beat, smote, and slew Him on a tree.

For the sake of circumventing unnecessary debate, please give us YOUR definition of "impute," so that this topic makes more sense to everyone.

Thanks.

I've already given Scriptures for imputing vs laying on. Scripture only uses laying on for the body, not the soul and spirit of a man. And, there are no Scriptures of God imputing His Son with sin.

If you have any Scriptures showing that God uses 'laying on' the same as 'imputing', then quote them and prove they are used the same by God. How men uses the words is irrelavent to the revelation, porphecy, and doctrine of God and Jesus Christ.

God laying on Jesus our iniquities, is only by the Son obeying the Father and submitting to us laying our wicked hands on Him:

Isaiah{50:5}
The Lord GOD hath opened mine ear, and I was not rebellious, neither turned away back. I gave my back to the smiters, and my cheeks to them that plucked off the hair: I hid not my face from shame and spitting.

God did not lay His own hands on His son, nor stripe His Son's back, nor nailed His hands to a cross.

Laying hands on a person's body is not iomputing sins to their soul, especially not by the Father upon His Son, who had and knew no sin on His own soul, ever, even unto death on the cross.

The only ones imputing Jesus with sin and esteeming Him guilty and smitten of God, are the unbelieivng sinners at the cross.

Isa 53:3
He is despised and rejected of men; a man of sorrows, and acquainted with grief: and we hid as it were our faces from him; he was despised, and we esteemed him not. Surely he hath borne our griefs, and carried our sorrows: yet we did esteem him stricken, smitten of God, and afflicted.

 

[ATG]

Isa 53:3
He is despised and rejected of men; a man of sorrows, and acquainted with grief: and we hid as it were our faces from him; he was despised, and we esteemed him not. Surely he hath borne our griefs, and carried our sorrows: yet we did esteem him stricken, smitten of God, and afflicted.

Man's false imputation of sin, and unjust execution of the body, does not make the righteous to be a sinner lawfully smitten of God.

Any person still believing it was God that imputed Jesus with sin and esteemed Him guilty and worthy of death, is an unbelieving sinner, that rejects His resurrection from the dead, and is declared to be the Son of God, even as He said, when sinfful men imputed Him with the sin of blasphemy.

Romans{1:3}
Concerning his Son Jesus Christ our Lord, which was made of the seed of David according to the flesh; And declared to be the Son of God with power, according to the spirit of holiness, by the resurrection from the dead:

1Co 12:3
Wherefore I give you to understand, that no man speaking by the Spirit of God calleth Jesus accursed:

 

[ATG]

oh. were you there? Jesus did not die in the garden

??? You're apparently losing any sense of an argument.

Only Adam and Eve died to the Lord in the garden by transgression.

but God promised a way out of the horrible now fallen state of mankind

But some choose to remain in the fallen state of sinning, rather than repent and abide in the commandments and righteousness of the Lord.

Rev 14:12
Here is the patience of the saints: here are they that keep the commandments of God, and the faith of Jesus.

btw, it was not an actual snake....but then you don't think the origninal languages can teach us anything

You've lost any sense of the argument at hand.

guess what...the tempting being was right....gods do know the difference...problem is, we are not and were not created to be gods, so we can't handle it!!!!

Psa 82:6
I have said, Ye are gods; and all of you are children of the most High. But ye shall die like men, and fall like one of the princes.

The devil didn't lie, when he promised we would be as gods by transgressing God's commandments, and choosing our own good and evil.

His lie was that we would live forever as gods on earth, and not go to the grave with the beasts of the field.

 

[ATG]

Where did the notion that the death of one person may benefit the relationship between another person and God arise from?

Certainly not by God imputing the dead person with sin and iniquity.

The death of sinners and evil doers does not bring any glory to God, anyone closer to God, nor has any pleasure with God.

Eze 33:11
Say unto them, As I live, saith the Lord GOD, I have no pleasure in the death of the wicked; but that the wicked turn from his way and live: turn ye, turn ye from your evil ways; for why will ye die, O house of Israel?

And so, we see that if God imputed Jesus with sin and guilt unto death, then He could not have any pleasure in His death on a cross.

God is not pleased with the death of sinners.

Without that concept already existing somewhere it is hard to understand how the concept that Jesus's death compensated for the sin of other people arose from.

That false 'concept' already did exist in the false traditions of men, never in Scripture of God.

A false tradition does not become any truer with age. And a lie does not become any truer with age-old repetition.

The righteous dying for the unrighteous, is not by the righteous being imputed with the sins of the unrighteous.

And the only way for the death of the righteous to bring anyone closer the righteous Lord, is if the unrighteous repent of their sinning against God and doing evil to the righteous.

God the Son laid down His life for us, and we did not lay any sin on His soul by wickedly hanging His body on a tree unto death. Nor did His Father impute any sin unto His Son hanging on a tree by unlawful wicked hands.

But if one knows 1st century context then the problem may vanish, or get more complex, depending on how one views certain points.

Historical knoweldge of 1st Century Rome and Greek world, has nothing to do with knowing the Scripture's prophecy of the Messiah's death by wicked hands, and His resurrection by the Spirit.

We can know that the Roman Governor Pilate also violated their own Roman law, by allowing Jesus to be crucified rather than the murderer Barrabas.

There was nothing legal about Jesus' death, neither by Jewish nor Roman law. Especially not by God's law of Moses.

 

[ScooterJackson]

I will believe what I am persuaded God is trying to show me is the case. That is not always what I want to believe.

Why would anyone not want to believe what the Lord is showing them?
We should be willing to be corrected by the Lord and change our thinking when He shows us we weren't thinking right.

 

[ATG]

Isaiah 53 does exactly that distinction for us.
The chapter first records the mistaken conclusion of the observers and then explains God's actual purpose.
Isaiah 53:4 says: "We esteemed him stricken, smitten of God, and afflicted."

They mistook the conclusion of their own purposes to accuse, condemn, and crucify Him.

They wrongly imputed it to God's will, as if by the law of blasphemy.

God's purpose was to submit into their hands, to do with Him what they would.

What they purposed for evil, God made for good by resurrection from the dead, and having mercy on any of His enemies at the cross, who repent of sinning against Him.

The verb is ḥāshab (חשב), "to reckon, regard, account, esteem."
The statement is explicitly about what we thought.
The error was in our estimation.

That's the whole simple point. Thank you.

The argument is only against the lie of God imputing His Son with sin, and esteeming Him guilty of death as by law. There is no argument against God the Father and Son having any part in their evil treatment of Him.

The greater lie, is that anyone is justified by unlawfully killing the Son of God, as if He was imputed with our sins, and we are imputed with His righteousness at the cross.

Psa 94:21
They gather themselves together against the soul of the righteous, and condemn the innocent blood. But the LORD is my defence; and my God is the rock of my refuge.

This prophecy is fulfilled by all sinners against Jesus the righteous at the cross. All that ever sinned against Him, were imputed with guilt of His unjust death, and shedding His innocent blood:

Deu 19:9
If thou shalt keep all these commandments to do them, which I command thee this day, to love the LORD thy God, and to walk ever in his ways;…That innocent blood be not shed in thy land, which the LORD thy God giveth thee for an inheritance, and so blood be upon thee.

By law of God, everyone on earth that sins against the Son of man, is guilty of innocent blood and worthy of death by crucifixion ourselves;

Deu 21:22
And if a man have committed a sin worthy of death, and he be to be put to death, and thou hang him on a tree: His body shall not remain all night upon the tree, but thou shalt in any wise bury him that day; (for he that is hanged is accursed of God) that thy land be not defiled, which the LORD thy God giveth thee for an inheritance.

But in rising from the dead, The Son is able to have mercy and forgive and recieve any of His enemies, that repent of sinning against Him.

But Isaiah does not stop there.

He certainly does with anyone imputing Jesus with sin, and esteeming Him guilty and smitten of God.

It's at the cross, where that prophecy is fulfilled by sinners not believing Jesus was the Son of God.

He immediately corrects that estimation: "But he was wounded for our transgressions, he was bruised for our iniquities" (v. 5).

Correct. He was not imputed with any sin and esteemed smitten of God, but only by sinful transgressors against the law of God.

The Hebrew begins with wəhuʾ ("but he"), creating a contrast.
Isaiah is moving from human perception to divine explanation.

Correct. From sinner's wicked belief, to God's correction.

Which was fulfilled with Jesus rising from the dead:

Romans{1:3}
Concerning his Son Jesus Christ our Lord, which was made of the seed of David according to the flesh; And declared to be the Son of God with power, according to the spirit of holiness, by the resurrection from the dead:
Any person that still believes after Jesus' resurrection, that He was imputed with sin and smitten of God by law, is an unbeliever in Jesus the Son of God in the flesh, nor risen from the dead.

And any person believing they themselves are imputed with righteousness by His unlawful death on the cross, remain fellow accusers, smiters, and crucifiers with the wicked that did it to Him:

1Co 12:3
Wherefore I give you to understand, that no man speaking by the Spirit of God calleth Jesus accursed:

The truth that God the Son submitted into their hands, does not take away nor nullify the fact, that their wicked hands beat, smote, and nailed Him to a cross.

The bigger problem for your argument is that Isaiah then uses entirely different verbs:
"The LORD hath laid on him the iniquity of us all" (v. 6).

No, it confirrms the argument, that imputing and laying on, are not at all the same thing.

Men can lay hands on a person, but only God can impute the soul with sin.

Men can also wrongly impute a person with sin, but the soul is not touched by the wicked hands upon their body.

Only sinful men falsely imputed Jesus with sin and laid wicked hands on His body. God only commanded Him to submit and endure their unlawful abuse without defence nor protest, and if necessary even unto death hanging on a tree.

Isa 53:7
He was oppressed, and he was afflicted, yet he opened not his mouth: he is brought as a lamb to the slaughter, and as a sheep before her shearers is dumb, so he openeth not his mouth.

1 Pe 2:22
Who did no sin, neither was guile found in his mouth. Who, when he was reviled, reviled not again; when he suffered, he threatened not; but committed himself to him that judgeth righteously:

No man imputed with sin by God, can commit himself to the righteous judgment of God without guilt. The soul God imputes with sin, is gullty of death.

The verb is pāgaʿ (פגע).
It means to cause something to meet, encounter, or fall upon someone.
Isaiah is not describing what men imagined.
He is describing what YHWH did.

False. You are doing ok, until you try to nullify what sinful men did to Jesus, and lay that charge to God Himself.

All God the Father and Son did was command and obediently submit into their hands.

Goin gback to the original challenge: Who imputed Jesus with sin and esteemed Him smitten of God? Men, not God. Who accused, beat, and hung Jesus on a tree? Man, not God.

God did not impute Jesus with any sin, nor esteem Him guilty of death, nor touch His body nor soul with iniquity.

That is the greatest lie and false accusation of the devil, since he accused the Lord of envying Adam and Eve in the garden, and forbidding them His own eternal life.

Only men took an active part in Jesus' sufferings and death. The Father and Son's part was only passive. The Father did not do anything to His Son, except command, and the Son did not do anything to Himself, except obey Him.

Sinful men did everything to Jesus to make Him to suffer unto death.

 

[rewriter]

Certainly not by God imputing the dead person with sin and iniquity.

The death of sinners and evil doers does not bring any glory to God, anyone closer to God, nor has any pleasure with God.

Eze 33:11
Say unto them, As I live, saith the Lord GOD, I have no pleasure in the death of the wicked; but that the wicked turn from his way and live: turn ye, turn ye from your evil ways; for why will ye die, O house of Israel?

And so, we see that if God imputed Jesus with sin and guilt unto death, then He could not have any pleasure in His death on a cross.

God is not pleased with the death of sinners.



That false 'concept' already did exist in the false traditions of men, never in Scripture of God.

A false tradition does not become any truer with age. And a lie does not become any truer with age-old repetition.

The righteous dying for the unrighteous, is not by the righteous being imputed with the sins of the unrighteous.

And the only way for the death of the righteous to bring anyone closer the righteous Lord, is if the unrighteous repent of their sinning against God and doing evil to the righteous.

God the Son laid down His life for us, and we did not lay any sin on His soul by wickedly hanging His body on a tree unto death. Nor did His Father impute any sin unto His Son hanging on a tree by unlawful wicked hands.




Historical knoweldge of 1st Century Rome and Greek world, has nothing to do with knowing the Scripture's prophecy of the Messiah's death by wicked hands, and His resurrection by the Spirit.

We can know that the Roman Governor Pilate also violated their own Roman law, by allowing Jesus to be crucified rather than the murderer Barrabas.

There was nothing legal about Jesus' death, neither by Jewish nor Roman law. Especially not by God's law of Moses.

Well at least you do a good job of showing your ignorance and willingness to toe the line that tradition pushes, even in the face of evidence that tradition is pushing a false narrative.

 

[OMC]

No, it confirrms the argument, that imputing and laying on, are not at all the same thing.

Men can lay hands on a person, but only God can impute the soul with sin.

Men can also wrongly impute a person with sin, but the soul is not touched by the wicked hands upon their body.

Only sinful men falsely imputed Jesus with sin and laid wicked hands on His body. God only commanded Him to submit and endure their unlawful abuse without defence nor protest, and if necessary even unto death hanging on a tree.

Isa 53:7
He was oppressed, and he was afflicted, yet he opened not his mouth: he is brought as a lamb to the slaughter, and as a sheep before her shearers is dumb, so he openeth not his mouth.

1 Pe 2:22
Who did no sin, neither was guile found in his mouth. Who, when he was reviled, reviled not again; when he suffered, he threatened not; but committed himself to him that judgeth righteously:

No man imputed with sin by God, can commit himself to the righteous judgment of God without guilt. The soul God imputes with sin, is gullty of death.

Your argument depends on defining "laid on him the iniquity of us all" as merely permitting wicked men to abuse Christ, but Isaiah 53 goes beyond that, because the subject of the action is the LORD Himself:
"The LORD hath laid on him the iniquity of us all" (v. 6),
"for the transgression of my people was he stricken" (v. 8), and
"he shall bear their iniquities" (v. 11).
I agree that Christ committed Himself to God's righteous judgment and that He personally remained sinless throughout His suffering (1 Pet. 2:22-23), but Isaiah's point is not that Christ became personally guilty of sin; rather, though innocent, He bore the consequences and judgment associated with the sins of others.
His innocence and His bearing of our iniquities are not contradictions in the text; Isaiah presents both as true at the same time.

 

[OMC]

False. You are doing ok, until you try to nullify what sinful men did to Jesus, and lay that charge to God Himself.

All God the Father and Son did was command and obediently submit into their hands.

Goin gback to the original challenge: Who imputed Jesus with sin and esteemed Him smitten of God? Men, not God. Who accused, beat, and hung Jesus on a tree? Man, not God.

God did not impute Jesus with any sin, nor esteem Him guilty of death, nor touch His body nor soul with iniquity.

That is the greatest lie and false accusation of the devil, since he accused the Lord of envying Adam and Eve in the garden, and forbidding them His own eternal life.

Only men took an active part in Jesus' sufferings and death. The Father and Son's part was only passive. The Father did not do anything to His Son, except command, and the Son did not do anything to Himself, except obey Him.

Sinful men did everything to Jesus to make Him to suffer unto death.

You're creating a choice that Isaiah itself does not make, because the chapter explicitly affirms both human responsibility and divine purpose: wicked men oppressed, afflicted, condemned, and killed the Servant (Isa. 53:7-9), yet the same chapter also says,
"the LORD hath laid on him the iniquity of us all" (v. 6),
"for the transgression of my people was he stricken" (v. 8), and
"it pleased the LORD to bruise him" (v. 10).
I am not attributing the sins of men to God; Scripture plainly attributes them to men.
The question is whether God merely stood by while men acted, or whether God was accomplishing redemption through those events.
Acts 2:23 answers that directly: Christ was delivered by the determinate counsel and foreknowledge of God, yet was crucified by wicked hands. The biblical text does not force us to choose one or the other.
Men intended evil and are guilty; God intended redemption and is righteous.
That is why Isaiah can simultaneously describe the actions of sinful men and the saving purpose of God without confusing the two.

 

[ATG]

Notice that Isaiah never uses nāśāʾ to mean "falsely accused."
He uses ḥāshab for mistaken human estimation and nāśāʾ for actual burden-bearing.

Neither does the NT, but they did falsely accuse and impute Jesus with the sin of blasphemy,a nd esteemed Him worthy of death as smitten by law of God:

Mar 14:64
Ye have heard the blasphemy: what think ye? And they all condemned him to be guilty of death.

Isolating prophecy of Scripture from fulfillment of the prophecy, leads to false teaching of the prophecy of Scripture.

And also, the prophecy was not only of Jesus' being falsely accused, imputed, and smitten as by God, but preaches the truth that 'we' all who have sinned against Christ, are likewise guilty of His unlawful death at His cross; And not only the wicked hands that slew Him.

And so, when Scripture says that He died for 'our' sins also, it's not to justify us, but to also impute the guilt of His death to us all, who have sinned against God and His Christ, so that He must needs come and die for all, and not only for those sinners at the cross.

The gospel begins with the Lamb of God dying for 'us' all and 'our' sins, is not a commendation for us from the cross, but only a condemnation against us all at the cross. This is also why Jesus Christ's resurrection gospel begins with repent, and not with believe only:

Mark{1:15}
The time is fulfilled, and the kingdom of God is at hand: repent ye, and believe the gospel.

Acts{3:19}
Repent ye therefore, and be converted, that your sins may be blotted out, when the times of refreshing shall come from the presence of the Lord; And he shall send Jesus Christ, which before was preached unto you:

Cor {7:10}
For godly sorrow worketh repentance to salvation not to be repented of:

And finally, this truth of all us that have sinned, are the guilty cause and means of Jesus death on a cross; is why the cross and preaching of the cross is offensive to all that have sinned on earth. And especially to them, that say (as some offendedly do here), that they themselves had no part in Jesus' false accusation and death on a cross.

Everlasting-Grace said:
I did not kill Christ.

This of course, is literally true of all us that have sinned after Jesus' death on the cross, but is a lie against the Scripture and Spirit of truth, that declares we all that have sinned, are likewise guilty of His innocent shed blood and hanging on a tree. Not just the sinners that literally did so, before we ever sinned on earth.

 

[OMC]

Neither does the NT, but they did falsely accuse and impute Jesus with the sin of blasphemy,a nd esteemed Him worthy of death as smitten by law of God:

Mar 14:64
Ye have heard the blasphemy: what think ye? And they all condemned him to be guilty of death.

Isolating prophecy of Scripture from fulfillment of the prophecy, leads to false teaching of the prophecy of Scripture.

And also, the prophecy was not only of Jesus' being falsely accused, imputed, and smitten as by God, but preaches the truth that 'we' all who have sinned against Christ, are likewise guilty of His unlawful death at His cross; And not only the wicked hands that slew Him.

And so, when Scripture says that He died for 'our' sins also, it's not to justify us, but to also impute the guilt of His death to us all, who have sinned against God and His Christ, so that He must needs come and die for all, and not only for those sinners at the cross.

The gospel begins with the Lamb of God dying for 'us' all and 'our' sins, is not a commendation for us from the cross, but only a condemnation against us all at the cross. This is also why Jesus Christ's resurrection gospel begins with repent, and not with believe only:

Mark{1:15}
The time is fulfilled, and the kingdom of God is at hand: repent ye, and believe the gospel.

Acts{3:19}
Repent ye therefore, and be converted, that your sins may be blotted out, when the times of refreshing shall come from the presence of the Lord; And he shall send Jesus Christ, which before was preached unto you:

Cor {7:10}
For godly sorrow worketh repentance to salvation not to be repented of:

And finally, this truth of all us that have sinned, are the guilty cause and means of Jesus death on a cross; is why the cross and preaching of the cross is offensive to all that have sinned on earth. And especially to them, that say (as some offendedly do here), that they themselves had no part in Jesus' false accusation and death on a cross.

Everlasting-Grace said:
I did not kill Christ.

This of course, is literally true of all us that have sinned after Jesus' death on the cross, but is a lie against the Scripture and Spirit of truth, that declares we all that have sinned, are likewise guilty of His innocent shed blood and hanging on a tree. Not just the sinners that literally did so, before we ever sinned on earth.

You're correct that the men who condemned Jesus falsely accused Him of blasphemy and declared Him worthy of death (Mark 14:64), and I agree that our sins place us among those whose rebellion made the cross necessary.

Where I disagree is that Isaiah 53 presents the cross as only a condemnation of sinners and not also God's provision for their salvation.
The same chapter that says "we esteemed him stricken" also says "he was wounded for our transgressions," "the LORD hath laid on him the iniquity of us all," and "he shall bear their iniquities" (Isa. 53:5-6,11).
The text moves from man's mistaken estimation to God's actual explanation of what the Servant was accomplishing.
So I fully agree that the gospel begins with our guilt and the call to repent, but Isaiah does not stop there; it presents Christ not merely as the innocent victim of human injustice, but as the Servant through whom God deals with the sin of His people.
Repentance and faith are therefore not competing messages, because the same gospel that exposes our guilt also announces the provision God made for guilty sinners through the death and resurrection of Christ.

 

[ATG]

So the text contains three distinct ideas:
Human estimation: "We esteemed him..." (ḥāshab).
Divine action: "The LORD laid on him..." (pāgaʿ).
Servant action: "He bore..." (nāśāʾ).

It reveals two separate truths: That only men imputed Jesus with sin and laid wicked hands on Him, as though by law smitten by God.

And that Father and Son worked as one by command and obedience, to submit into our wicked hands, without defence nor protest.

The truth that sinners wrongly believed He was smitten of God, is corrected by the truth, that He was wrongly smitten by men in the name of God.

Your interpretation collapses all three into the first category.

False.

The interpretation of prophecy by fulfillment, rightly separates the prophecy of evil works men did against Jesus, from the good works the Son did in not resisting their evil belief and will.

That which was intended for evil by men, was made for the good by God: Jesus' submission was so perfect as a lamb to the slaughter, that all men at the cross wrongly believed and imputed Him with sin of blasphemy, so that by His resurrection sinful men could repent of their sins, and believe the risen Son's gospel of deliverance from all sinning against the Father and the Son.

Mark{1:15}
The time is fulfilled, and the kingdom of God is at hand: repent ye, and believe the gospel.

Acts{3:19}
Repent ye therefore, and be converted, that your sins may be blotted out, when the times of refreshing shall come from the presence of the Lord; And he shall send Jesus Christ, which before was preached unto you:

Rom 4:25
Who was delivered for our offences, and was raised again for our justification.

 

[rewriter]

Neither does the NT, but they did falsely accuse and impute Jesus with the sin of blasphemy,a nd esteemed Him worthy of death as smitten Tby law of God:

This is true, as long as one ignores the non-scriptural, but also not tampered with by human hands, evidence that indicates that the Jews (including Joseph Caiaphas the high priest from the town of Arimathea and his father-in-law Annas, aka "defender of the people"), sought to keep Jesus from Roman punishment.