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Michelleks
Guest
If we believe in Jesus , then who should know, woman is made from man, and should be together, all issues could be solved. God can do!
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mystikmind
Guest
She is already gone, there is nothing in her that want's to save the marriage. I need to learn to let her go and move on with my life. I will still remain open to the possibilities, i still have hope, but at a level similar to a person who buys a lotto ticket hopes to win lotto. .... I would give up a winning lotto ticket to get my wife back!
The Bible doesn't directly teach the doctrine of 'free will'. Don't let something like that limit your faith when you pray.
Was there adultery involved? Why is she wanting a divorce? Because she claims she don't love you, or because you cheated on her in the past, or she cheated on you. You saying she wants a divorce but do not say what the cause of her wanting a divorce is.
True if she is Christian and you are Christian too, then you both should fight to make it work. But if she is wanting a divorce, then let her divorce you. You do not want a divorce, therefore do NOT seek one, but if she wants a divorce and files for a divorce, then sign the paperwork or whatever. Make it known to her that you are a Christian and do not want this divorce, and will not file for a divorce, if she wants one, then she needs to file for one. Your hands will be clean of this divorce.
When i say fight for the marriage, i mean to tell her you do not want one, that you think the marriage could work out, tell her Christians are not to seek a divorce, tell her that this is not going to be good for your daughter. Say you can, to try to make the marriage work. If as you say she might turn from God if you use the Christian card, Then i assure you she is ready already to turn from God, if she will turn from God for such a petty matter. She is already turning from God by seeking a divorce, So you playing the Christian card, is not going to change that. But if she is bound and determined to get a divorce, then don't deny her what she desires to have, but make it known to her that you will not divorce her, that she will have to divorce you.
Any other questions for me, just email.
^i^ Responding to OP
If he signs, he's going along with it. She can probably go through the courts. If he doesn't sign, he can tell her that he isn't going along with her sin. If she remarries, he didn't give her a writing of divorcement. So she's an adulteress, not only by New Testament standards, but also Old Testament standards. Why make her feel good and comfortable in her sin?
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kaylagrl
Guest
So here is a womans viewpoint. It takes two to have a marriage.The problem is we dont both mature in the relationship at the same time or have the same needs.A good Christian book is His Needs,Her Needs.Please look it up.I read it before I began to date my now husband.I need to read it again.The idea is that sometimes you think you are meeting her needs when in fact you are giving her what YOU need and want,not what she needs.When she told you she needed things to be tidy that was a need you could have easily met,right? She told you that was a connection to sex for her,but you brushed it off.See she was telling you "please meet this need" but your own need got in the way.And Im sure the reverse has happened to you.If you dont communicate your needs, no one gets their need met.In fact you may not even know your need.I was surprised when I read the book.Im not an affectionate person.I didnt grow up with it.I was loved but we weren't touchy feely people.We seldom hugged,I didnt like people hugging me.But know what my number one need was? You guessed it.Luckily my husband is very affectionate and so that need is being met for me.Now my job is to find his need and meet it.
You've both made mistakes.She reached out to you and you admit you pushed down your feelings of resentment and ignored her.Now she is giving you a taste of your own medicine.You say you are going to counseling and hopefully that will help.But however she has hurt you and done you wrong your job is to be the best husband you can be.Start meeting her needs right now as much as she will allow.Admit you drove it into the ditch.Pointing out her fault will push her further away.You work on changing you and left God work on her.If she still chooses to walk away you will know you tried your hardest and gave it your all to turn it around.Its no good to panic now and make demands.Do you best,be as open and honest as you can and ask her to let you know if you can do anything at all to change the situation.Dont lie to her and yourself that you can change overnight.All you can do is apologize and say you are willing to work hard to be a better husband.As Elvis so aptly put it "A little less talk and little more action".Women know when you are just saying what they want to hear.We ALWAYS know it! We know lip service when we hear it.Now Im not blaming you for it all,Im just saying since shes not here this is your best bet.If you can find that book it will be an eye opener.You may understand how you've both been working against each other all along.I hope something on here that others have said help you.I know how it feels to have a relationship break up and its beyond your control.But its not beyond God.Please keep us updated on how you are doing.We're hoping and believing for good news.
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mystikmind
Guest
Some more nice posts, thank you all, it helps allot.
A small update on the situation; Being in the house all alone it was hard to see all the pictures with my wife in them, so i moved them around so i could not see them. My wife came around to collect a few more things 2 days ago and noticed the pictures. She said to me, if i don't want them, i should take the pictures out and sell the frames in the garage sale. We are having a garage sale next weekend where we will be selling our lives away in all the little things we had collected over the years we were together. Anyway, that same day she told me to sell the picture frames, she kept asking me if i was ok, in between carrying things out of the house. I said i was ok and even helped her carry stuff out.
A small update on the situation; Being in the house all alone it was hard to see all the pictures with my wife in them, so i moved them around so i could not see them. My wife came around to collect a few more things 2 days ago and noticed the pictures. She said to me, if i don't want them, i should take the pictures out and sell the frames in the garage sale. We are having a garage sale next weekend where we will be selling our lives away in all the little things we had collected over the years we were together. Anyway, that same day she told me to sell the picture frames, she kept asking me if i was ok, in between carrying things out of the house. I said i was ok and even helped her carry stuff out.
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mystikmind
Guest
There is this song, it came on the radio in the car one day before my wife told me it's over. I took a quick trip up the shop, it was the only song i had time to hear. I wondered if i was like that guy in the song, and i even considered buying my wife some flowers, but then i dismissed the thought. Later when i told my wife about the song and i asked her if i had bought flowers would it have made any difference? She cried and said, mebe!
This song tells my story just perfectly, the song is called 'when i was your man' by Bruno Mars. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jJT0Suanqhg
This song tells my story just perfectly, the song is called 'when i was your man' by Bruno Mars. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jJT0Suanqhg
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kaylagrl
Guest
I know the song.If flowers might have helped she seems to be at least leaving the door open for you to try and prove yourself to her.When people are deeply hurt its hard to trust.And its harder to trust when you've been intimate with that person.So try kindness and helpfulness and be as open and honest as you can be and see where it goes from there.People have even divorced and gotten back together.Treat her like you did when you were courting,with the same respect and consideration.
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mystikmind
Guest
After the first week when she told me it was over, i was on the internet doing all the research. I followed the good advice, similar to what you say and it pissed her off. She told me how angry it makes her to see me doing those things now when i should have done them when it mattered. So i backed right off, but I'm still being quietly helpful whenever i get the chance.
The trust issue as it turns out, works both ways. I have to struggle with my own trust issues for her as well, because, even though i do understand why she wants a divorce, emotionally, i just cannot help feeling betrayed. And on a logical level i have many doubts to struggle with as well. You see, all my live i have viewed people who treat marriage as 'disposable' as despicable and i have no respect for them. Now my wife has joined that mob, how can i respect her? And she has denied me to such an extent in the bedroom that i cannot even remember what it feels like to be desired by a woman, i am scared if we got back together it would be more of the same? She thinks her lack of desire is all my fault, partly yes, but she never allows herself to get enough sleep, how can a woman expect to feel sexy when she never gets enough sleep?
In the back of my mind i wonder if it is not so bad for her be with another man for a while, it might be a good lesson for her to learn, she will be much less likely to succeed in another relationship if she starts doing that all over again, because allot of men are not as patient as i was. Then when she learns those lessons, i will be waiting..... or i might not!
Trust cuts deep both ways.
I don't know how you treated your wife, but from what you have shared it sounds like you have been given a raw deal. Did you ever tell her how bad she is acting. I think you should tell her what you wrote right here. If you are always apologizing for not being the best husband for some vague list of offensive that you can't quite understand, then you are helping her feel justified in her sin. If you rebuke her for being an unfaithful, treacherous wife, then at least it makes it hard for her to feel justified in divorcing you.
If you have basically given her permission to divorce you and apologized all along the way, then you've been helping her make this decision.
The Bible says to love your neighbor. Do not despise your neighbor in your heart. But rebuke your neighbor frankly lest you share in his sins. Let your wife know about your lack of respect for her for treating marriage so lightly. Let her know you think she's being a bad mother by breaking up her daughter's family and not sleeping with her husband. If you hold it in, you may end up despising her in your heart. It's better to let her be wrestling with these feelings. It could help lead her to repent. On some level, she probably knows she hasn't been treating you right by not sleeping with you and leaving you for no good reason. If apologize and don't confront, it helps her with deceiving herself into thinking she has been a good wife and it's your fault (or you just couldn't work it out.) If you point out her sin, then on some level, she knows she's wrong anyway. your pointing it out makes it harder for her to realize it.
She's out the door now, anyway. Being a nice guy and apologizing didn't seem to work. If rebuking her for her sin doesn't reconcile the marriage, at least it might contribute toward her repentance at some point, and you'll have done your part in this regard. It could be that if you don't let her go on deceiving herself so easily, she might take a look in the mirror, realize she's been a bad wife and she's being a bad mother, break down and cry about it, and realize she needs to repent. At least, it could help. You need to do it with the right attitude though. Don't do it in a fit of rage. That's another problem with holding this stuff in and not telling her.
If she did repent and want to reconcile, at that point, you tell her things have to change in the bedroom (sex and sleep) and other areas where she's been a bad wife.
Every man could have been more attentive, could have bought flowers, etc. If a man never buys his wife flowers, that doesn't give her the right to desert him.
The idea of my wife being with another man would be repulsive and hurtful to me. I can't relate to what you are saying.
One who refuses to sign, is only causing strife, causing the other to be offended, being difficult. All these things are not of God. We are to live peaceable with ALL men if in our power to do so. You can't make someone LOVE You. if she wants the divorce, she files for the divorce, and you have made it known to her that you are against it, do not want it, then sign the papers, your hands are clean.
^i^ Responding to Post# 165
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mystikmind
Guest
Thanks Presidente, i did write down a rebuke on paper ready to tell her, but when the moment came, it just didn't feel right or i was scared or it's not the right thing to say, or.... Some things are better left unsaid, on the other hand i do not want the marriage to end in such a way that i will always wonder if i could have done more? if i could have saved it? But i will probably think that regardless, i think most divorced people do?
I still have allot of conflicting thoughts and emotions, i cannot seem to resolve what i want and how i feel.
I suppose i am not so bothered if my wife sleeps with another man because she has done a very good job, over a long period of time to break the intimate connection i have with her. Remember in my story, i did not care much about our anniversary, with that same feeling, i also do not care much if she sleeps with someone else. Given that this is a feeling involved with the marriage falling apart, it is something i need to pray forgiveness for.
I still have allot of conflicting thoughts and emotions, i cannot seem to resolve what i want and how i feel.
I suppose i am not so bothered if my wife sleeps with another man because she has done a very good job, over a long period of time to break the intimate connection i have with her. Remember in my story, i did not care much about our anniversary, with that same feeling, i also do not care much if she sleeps with someone else. Given that this is a feeling involved with the marriage falling apart, it is something i need to pray forgiveness for.
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kaylagrl
Guest
There is no easy answer.You both did things to hurt and push the other away.You were both wrong.When she reached out you you weren't ready and now you're reaching out to her and shes not ready. You did say you had these sexual issues before you married? Did I understand that right? And at the time you didnt think that wouldn't be a big deal? Its kind of unfair now to expect a passionate wife if that was not her nature to begin with.I think that is what you were saying.
You say that you cant respect her because she is wanting a divorce but you do admit that you helped drive this into the ditch and only woke up when she said the D word.Do you think maybe she was doing just that? Trying to wake you up? I cant judge you,only what you have told us. Im not saying she's all right but she does have a right to feel the same way about you maybe.That maybe she lost respect for you also.If sex was important that was something you should have talked out before marriage.On the other side you kind of got what you accepted.You see? Its not really a right or wrong thing,it just is what it is. You both see your own hurt,you both feel justified. But until you can get past your own hurt and need you will both never move forward. It took two to drive it in the ditch,it takes two to get it out.If she is unwilling forcing her will only make her resent you more. Trust is earned and you both have a lot to do to earn it back again.There is no intimacy without trust.
One last question that may be too private but I'll throw it out there.Did you intimacy only take place in bed,during the good times,or where you affectionate outside the bedroom? Sometimes couples put way too much pressure on the bedroom.
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sunburn
Guest
Hi Mystik.
Not once I heard you worrying about your daughter.
Something tells me, you are not willing to grow up. I am sorry, it is not meant to offend you but there is no other way to point it out.
It is hard to realise that you have failed at the marriage. It must be a tough time for you. As much I notice how much you contributed to it, I feel sorry it has ended like that but trust me and take it from a woman, all hope is not lost providing you wake up from that self pity state.
Sirk gave you some good pointers. You need as a matter of urgency to snap out of that childish putting feeling that wants to make your wife feel sorry for it all
Your issues are the 21st century plague on modern "christian" marriages. Nowadays, people marry in the church and call their marriage "christian".
It's not all who say Lord Lord who will enter into the kingdom, how is it so surprising that it's not all who say I do in the church, have actually understood the covenant.
Being married is NOT about having sex with a woman. The role of a husband and a wife have been lost in translation throughout centuries and unfortunately, so our relationship with God concerning marriage. Then we are surprised when there are divorces in the church. Why being so hypocrite as to quote scriptures, thou shall not divorce when refusing to address the sin that lead to it?
Why being resentful to a wife you refuse to be a husband to yourself?
You want sex with a woman and you refuse to be a man? Being a man simply mean owning to your own shit and refusing to try to make her feel guilty. She knows what you are trying to do underneath all the trying to solve the problems. she knows it's because you only think about yourself. How you don't want to be alone and face the music no wants to dance on.
She doesn't need you to feel guilty I am sure she had prepared herself and tried her best to stop feeling the guilt because she wants to get away from you.
NO woman is TURNED ON by a resentful nice guy. there is zero sexual attraction. it's natural chemistry that is embedded in human functions. Most Animals attracts their female by being brave. You want her, you say I want you. Not by sitting around scheming , hoping, wishing to get laid just because you are married while all the while running away from your duty as a husband. This is recipe for disaster. Somebody should stop christians guys to turn "nice guys" with no willpowers.
Enough of my rant and let's get back to it. Mystic, you should ignore your wife and start working on yourself. Seriously, you could turn bitter, or a stalker, either way, if you don't stop acting up like a defeated poor guy, you will drive her away further and trust me, any women who ends up in your life, could potentiality run away too if you don't get a grip on yourself and your strength as man God gave you. It's not the time to be worrying whether she will be sleeping with someone else or not.
By reading you, she definitely needs to sort herself out too. Because you cannot make her happy. she has to make herself happy. Both of you were looking on the other to dump your emotional stuff. Only God can fill her, and only God can fill you.
But you both need to let God lead you.
and that's where the real problem is: too many " christian"- marriages, looks good on the outside but rotten inside; when neither of the married couples are following God's rules but hoping to hook the other with some bible principles just to get by and take advantage of the promised deal. It doesn't work like that.
Galatians 6:7 Be not deceived; God is not mocked: for whatsoever a man soweth, that shall he also reap.
God can help you if your let him. there is hope. Get yourself some good help and start praying, working on yourself. People have gone through much worse and got back together.
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kaylagrl
Guest
I dont know your real name but please do not follow presidentes advice.You are in no place to be rebuking her.Again,it took two to come to this place. If you mistreated her,as you admit you have,and now turn around and rebuke her for her faults I'm warning you now,she will not take it well! Because to her it will look like you are using her behavior as a scapegoat for your own.Please do not do something so foolish.Ordering her around now like you are her parent will only send her out the door faster.Trust a woman on this.It will not work.
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sunburn
Guest
Nb: Yes You did mention at the beginning it was sad you had a beautiful daughter in the midst and then....
And I am sure you feel sorry for your daughter but I do not get the father's love for his daughter's vibe from reading your posts.
And I am sure you feel sorry for your daughter but I do not get the father's love for his daughter's vibe from reading your posts.
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mystikmind
Guest
The answer to the fist question is yes. Right before we got married it was down to about once a week, we had been together 4 years by then. After we got married for the first 3 years it continued to decline but we were both very happy.... the problem starts very small and grows very slowly, but grow it does! With hindsight, i think we both had enough 'information' before we got married to know it would not work out, what we lacked was the wisdom and experience to *understand* that information.
The second question, sometimes i did wonder if she was just doing this to wake me up. But since then, several things occurred which means that cannot be the case. The most obvious one being her desire to sell the house, she has already had the real estate agent draw up the contract and she wanted me to sign it. Then my parents offered to sell their house, move in with me and buy my wife out of her share of the house. My wife said it was a good idea.... no women who was not absolutely certain about a divorce would ever think that was a good idea! So with the exception of a miracle of God, this is the one thing that finally convinced me this marriage is definitely over.
Yes our feelings toward each other do seem to have a certain similarity, the one big difference is i am open to examining and challenging my emotions, but she is not.
Now that i think about it, on many occasions we did talk about sex, she would always say she does not know why she feels that way. Exactly like me, she was trying to deny her real emotions.
in answer to the last question, i am a very affectionate person in my own ways, but not the ways she was looking for. I am a hugger, a kisser, tckler, a joker and even a random singer, kindof schoolboy juvenile ways of showing affection, that kind of thing. Even our friends would joke, "hey you two, cut that out in public". Somehow all that affection was invisible to her. Later when things started getting bad, any time i would try to show affection, she would spurn me, that went on for 2 years until she said it's over.
What did he do wrong, based on what he's posted? Sure, he could be leaving out some pertinent details. We don't know that. But not buying her flowers or paying her enough attention? What man couldn't admit to something like that? Even the best husbands.
Don't you agree that her leaving her like this is sinning? Biblically, he is obligated to correct her. I'm encouraging him to do what the Bible teaches.
I know you want him to be kind to her. I agree. If he corrects her, he shouldn't do it in a harsh manner. No yelling. But he should tell her. She may not have anyone offering her correction. As her husband, it is especially his obligation to do so. It's negligent as a husband not to.
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sunburn
Guest
Clearly Presidente, he needs to be in a position to be blameless himself to be able to rebuke someone else; surely someone has to remove the dirt in his own eyes before attempting to do so for the other. that's the situation our friend is in.
Quoting scripture and calling sin what is actually a consequence of sin is a little of a useless exercise.